Bible study rules for public schools proposed

Feb 10, 2010 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: The Courier-Journal

FRANKFORT, Ky. - The state would create rules for teaching about the Bible in public high schools under a bill filed Monday by three Democratic senators.

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#107650
Jun 29, 2013
 

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KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>Conclusive evidence is simply a matter of acknowledging all we know about genetics. The reproduction method of the species is determined by the genes, therefore, sexuality must also be determined by genes as well, lest when a new reproductive system evolves it does not propagate the species.
How is it that sexuality must be determined by genes?

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#107651
Jun 29, 2013
 
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
Not as much as your pride stands in your way.
Do whut?

I'm not sure what you mean. Pride in what? And what is it standing in the way of? Kolob? A new set of undies with runes on them? Membership to an overtly racist and homophobic organization that will demand 10% of my money as well as my intellectual integrity?

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#107652
Jun 29, 2013
 

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KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>You have demonstrated that you know less about the Mormon religion than I do on this thread, of course, I was raised in that religion and didn't just wake up one morning and decide to choose it. It's amazing how much you will learn about something you are forced to learn but cannot justify the belief.
Try me

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#107653
Jun 29, 2013
 

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Quantummist wrote:
<quoted text>
Time tells the tale... As I said the slippery slope tilts a bit with each slip.... And it starts already...
Polygamists consider the SCOTUS ruling a trail blazing ruling for consideration of Marriage being between several consenting adults... And when that is found valid then comes net slip followed shortly by the Animal Rights groups to give animals standing in the marital status....
http://www.mrc.org/articles/polygamy-advocate...
So? Where does your slippery slope fallacy stop slipping?

I assume you are old. Were you concerned when it became universally legal for blacks to marry whites? Oh, next thing you know Mexicans will want to marry Kentuckians!

If polygamists, of which there probably aren't that many, want to pursue their case then let them pursue it. If their case is compelling then guess what? We'll allow polygamy at some point. If their case fails the test then we won't.

You can't freeze-frame society at the moment when Ward Cleaver walks in the door and supper is on the table. It doesn't work that way.

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#107654
Jun 29, 2013
 

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Khubala wrote:
<quoted text>
Of course ,the fact that this report was based on a Scientific Study conducted by the American Journal of Psychiatry is rendered meaningless by the simple fact that the report concludes that,because of their unbelief,Suicide and other mental problems are much more prevalent among those non affiliated than those affiliated with religion.
Now,how does an Atheist deal with that issue?
He/She is unable to accept the results and has to go into denial.
Any excuse will be used to attempt to negate the Scientific findings of this report.
These are the same individuals who claim that nothing created something from nothing,which eventually gave birth to the stars ,planets and life as we know it.
They can not explain how it happened......
It was an accident,who knows.
Most certainly could not have been created by a superior intelligence,but,noninteiligen ce is quite capable of creating such a miracle.
You need to understand a couple of things:

1) NEVER link to sources that are universally considered to be completely stupid, such as conservapedia. If you find an article on that site that links to a real source then post a link to the *real* source. If I see a link to conservapedia I do not click it and I assume the poster is a full-blown nuthut.

2) One study proves nothing. This is true of ANY study. For example, there was a study from a few years ago that showed homophobia correlates with homosexual arousal. In other words, the more anti-gay you act the more likely you are to have homosexual desires. But one study proves nothing. So it would be foolish to go around claiming that homophobes are closeted gays (though it is a fun way to rib a**holes).

3) Studies do not always tell us enough information. As was already pointed out, your suicide article does not demonstrate that belief in god reduces suicide rates. The actual factors involved are more complex than that and have more to do with social concerns that personal beliefs.

Have a nice day. I'm going to go wallow in my nihilism, read some Sartre, and take a bunch of pills to fill the baby Jesus-shaped hole in my heart. lol

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#107655
Jun 29, 2013
 
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
Humans do as well, however other animals do only kill for food or self defense of a threat, we kill for no valid reason.
Many Animals kill for Sport....

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#107656
Jun 29, 2013
 

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Seek Saving Faith wrote:
<quoted text>Faith comes by hearing and hearing comes by the word of God. I will be praying for your soul.
May God show you his saving grace mixed with HIS saving faith soon.
How he Jesus died JUST for YOU. How he was buried just for YOU. How he arose just for YOU.
Why did he do this for you?
Are you that special to God.........YES......you are!!!
Pick up a bible and begin to examine your self to see where you stand with God today.
Seek salvation while you are able and still alive to call upon him for eternal salvation.
Hearing comes from god? I thought it was to do with ears.

I've read large portions of the Bible and I've studied it via lectures and such. It's a fascinating topic.

But it is not relevant to me personally, beyond being a book that was influential in the development of the world I live in.

It's cute and sweet that you feel like you are trying to help people. I appreciate that. Good job. But remember that other people do not see things like you do. What you feel in your heart is not necessarily the truth about how the world is.

Reason and evidence are required before I'll give any god claims a second thought.

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#107657
Jun 29, 2013
 
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
So should those that wish to practice incest be allowed those rights?
I don't know. It's a good question. I think we need to maximize liberties while minimizing harm. I'm not sure where incest fits into that picture. I haven't given it a lot of thought.

But surely that has nothing to do with the gay issue. Please don't do the whole "next they'll be having sex with sheep" bit. It's old and boring.

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#107658
Jun 29, 2013
 
do whut wrote:
<quoted text>
At one time "the world is flat" was a mainstream idea
That was before science and evidence demonstrated otherwise.

Also, it is not really true that most people thought the world was flat. I mean, I guess you average bumpkin assumed something like that. I don't know. But as early as 600 BCE the Greeks were hypothesizing that the earth was a sphere. If this was 600 BCE and there were public schools then it might be the mainstream view that the earth is probably flat. If that's the case then that's what would be taught.

Science is self-correcting. It does not need to be 100% accurate all the time. It changes. The best you can possibly do as a layperson is go with the current best consensus on a subject and give it your *conditional* trust.

More study, more time, and more criticism create more or less certainty.

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#107659
Jun 29, 2013
 

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Khubala wrote:
<quoted text>
I fully understand that all Atheists will attempt to destroy the credibility of the report published by The American Journal of Psychiatry.
According to it's findings,not believing in God is very detrimental to your mental health.
The solution to the problem appears to be to seek God.
Obviously that is a subject Atheists do not want to discuss.
To clear the air,I will post the entire report
So believing in the boogie man is good mental health?
I have yet to see this supposed report, did you post a link?
Does it have logical reasoning behind the claim? If so, just what is the logic here?

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Khubala wrote:
Suicide rates are lower in religious countries than in secular ones (1, 2). Some of this difference may be due to underreporting in religious countries because of concerns over stigma (3). Yet, some of the difference may be real, although it is not known whether the negative association between religion and suicide is due to its integrative benefits (such as social cohesion, as proposed by Durkheim in 1951 [4]) or to the moral imperatives of religious belief, given its prohibitions against suicidal behavior (1, 5–7). Most previous studies have been epidemiologic and have investigated the association between completed suicide and religion. An inverse relationship between religious commitment and suicidal ideation has also been reported (5, 8–10). However, reports regarding religious affiliation and suicide attempt are sparse. Morphew (11) compared 50 suicide attempters hospitalized after self-poisoning with respect to their religious beliefs and practices. He found no significant differences in terms of Catholic versus Protestant affiliation. Similarly, Malone et al.(12) reported that religious persuasion, defined as Catholic and non-Catholic, did not differ between suicide attempters and nonattempters. Kok (13) compared suicide attempt rates in Chinese, Malay, and Indian women in Singapore and concluded that the comparatively low rate of attempted suicide in Malay women was due to their religion, since Islam strictly forbids suicide.
Studies of religious commitment in general suggest a protective effect as well. In a sample of institutionalized chronically ill elderly, Nelson (14) showed that intensity of religious commitment was negatively associated with suicide gestures. In a cross-national study of 25 countries, Stack (1) concluded that protective effects were not due to any specific religious denomination per se but rather to a strong religious commitment to basic life-preserving values, beliefs, and practices that reduce rates of suicide.
Therefore, we examined factors associated with religious affiliation and nonaffiliation in depressed inpatients, generally considered to be at highest risk for a suicide attempt. We hypothesized that the religious subjects would report more moral objections to suicide as measured with the Reasons for Living Inventory (15). This instrument includes questions that reflect traditional religious beliefs: "I believe only God has the right to end a life," "My religious beliefs forbid it," "I am afraid of going to Hell," and "I consider it morally wrong." We examined the relationship between religious affiliation and social cohesion by examining the amount of time spent with relatives in religiously affiliated versus unaffiliated patients. To our knowledge, this is the first study investigating the relationship between religious affiliation status and suicide attempts in a clinical sample.
Method
I get that the religious might feel suicide is morally wrong and atheists might not, but that does not equate to good mental health overall. It only speaks to one subject of a worldview.
I believe suicide affects those close to us that are left to feel guilty for the reasons of suicide. This makes it immoral in my book.
I feel these logical reasons for morality are not looked at or taught often due to all the focus being upon the superstitious ideas.
My best friends father killed himself and he was very religious. I see the effects it left upon his children and wife. I have no doubt it affected many people adversely. It was a selfish act.

You see, their are logical reasons for morality other than those of some vague superstition about how a god feels about it. I say vague because the bible does not directly mention suicide.

Atheism is growing and is not yet the norm. The atheist society needs to focus on the godless way to good morality. Learn philosophy and develop good worldviews.

Their is no magic bullet. We see both atheists and the devout commit suicide.

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#107661
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Khubala wrote:
Suicide rates are lower in religious countries than in secular ones (1, 2). Some of this difference may be due to underreporting in religious countries because of concerns over stigma (3). Yet, some of the difference may be real, although it is not known whether the negative association between religion and suicide is due to its integrative benefits (such as social cohesion, as proposed by Durkheim in 1951 [4]) or to the moral imperatives of religious belief, given its prohibitions against suicidal behavior (1, 5–7). Most previous studies have been epidemiologic and have investigated the association between completed suicide and religion. An inverse relationship between religious commitment and suicidal ideation has also been reported (5, 8–10). However, reports regarding religious affiliation and suicide attempt are sparse. Morphew (11) compared 50 suicide attempters hospitalized after self-poisoning with respect to their religious beliefs and practices. He found no significant differences in terms of Catholic versus Protestant affiliation. Similarly, Malone et al.(12) reported that religious persuasion, defined as Catholic and non-Catholic, did not differ between suicide attempters and nonattempters. Kok (13) compared suicide attempt rates in Chinese, Malay, and Indian women in Singapore and concluded that the comparatively low rate of attempted suicide in Malay women was due to their religion, since Islam strictly forbids suicide.
Studies of religious commitment in general suggest a protective effect as well. In a sample of institutionalized chronically ill elderly, Nelson (14) showed that intensity of religious commitment was negatively associated with suicide gestures. In a cross-national study of 25 countries, Stack (1) concluded that protective effects were not due to any specific religious denomination per se but rather to a strong religious commitment to basic life-preserving values, beliefs, and practices that reduce rates of suicide.
Therefore, we examined factors associated with religious affiliation and nonaffiliation in depressed inpatients, generally considered to be at highest risk for a suicide attempt. We hypothesized that the religious subjects would report more moral objections to suicide as measured with the Reasons for Living Inventory (15). This instrument includes questions that reflect traditional religious beliefs: "I believe only God has the right to end a life," "My religious beliefs forbid it," "I am afraid of going to Hell," and "I consider it morally wrong." We examined the relationship between religious affiliation and social cohesion by examining the amount of time spent with relatives in religiously affiliated versus unaffiliated patients. To our knowledge, this is the first study investigating the relationship between religious affiliation status and suicide attempts in a clinical sample.
Method
According to your post, you should accept Islam as the one true religion, because it directly prohibits suicide.

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#107662
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Khubala wrote:
Studies of religious commitment in general suggest a protective effect as well. In a sample of institutionalized chronically ill elderly, Nelson (14) showed that intensity of religious commitment was negatively associated with suicide gestures. In a cross-national study of 25 countries, Stack (1) concluded that protective effects were not due to any specific religious denomination per se but rather to a strong religious commitment to basic life-preserving values, beliefs, and practices that reduce rates of suicide.
The elderly, chronically ill atheists might just be in the realization that their time has come.
Trying to prolong what nature does by modern medical means at some point becomes a senseless act. Many of these people are in severe pain. Pushing them to live in the pain is an immoral act in my opinion. At this point, religion might be impeding upon allowing nature to take its course.

Take the study for what it finds, but the conclusions might not be so black and white. Learn to use science properly.

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Khubala wrote:
Suicide rates are lower in religious countries than in secular ones (1, 2). Some of this difference may be due to underreporting in religious countries because of concerns over stigma (3). Yet, some of the difference may be real, although it is not known whether the negative association between religion and suicide is due to its integrative benefits (such as social cohesion, as proposed by Durkheim in 1951 [4]) or to the moral imperatives of religious belief, given its prohibitions against suicidal behavior (1, 5–7). Most previous studies have been epidemiologic and have investigated the association between completed suicide and religion. An inverse relationship between religious commitment and suicidal ideation has also been reported (5, 8–10). However, reports regarding religious affiliation and suicide attempt are sparse. Morphew (11) compared 50 suicide attempters hospitalized after self-poisoning with respect to their religious beliefs and practices. He found no significant differences in terms of Catholic versus Protestant affiliation. Similarly, Malone et al.(12) reported that religious persuasion, defined as Catholic and non-Catholic, did not differ between suicide attempters and nonattempters. Kok (13) compared suicide attempt rates in Chinese, Malay, and Indian women in Singapore and concluded that the comparatively low rate of attempted suicide in Malay women was due to their religion, since Islam strictly forbids suicide.
Studies of religious commitment in general suggest a protective effect as well. In a sample of institutionalized chronically ill elderly, Nelson (14) showed that intensity of religious commitment was negatively associated with suicide gestures. In a cross-national study of 25 countries, Stack (1) concluded that protective effects were not due to any specific religious denomination per se but rather to a strong religious commitment to basic life-preserving values, beliefs, and practices that reduce rates of suicide.
Therefore, we examined factors associated with religious affiliation and nonaffiliation in depressed inpatients, generally considered to be at highest risk for a suicide attempt. We hypothesized that the religious subjects would report more moral objections to suicide as measured with the Reasons for Living Inventory (15). This instrument includes questions that reflect traditional religious beliefs: "I believe only God has the right to end a life," "My religious beliefs forbid it," "I am afraid of going to Hell," and "I consider it morally wrong." We examined the relationship between religious affiliation and social cohesion by examining the amount of time spent with relatives in religiously affiliated versus unaffiliated patients. To our knowledge, this is the first study investigating the relationship between religious affiliation status and suicide attempts in a clinical sample.
Method
Just noted this study does not mention atheists at all.
Again, according to your logic, Islam is the best for mental health.

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#107664
Jun 29, 2013
 

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Khubala wrote:
Religious commitment promotes social ties and reduces alienation (33). We found weaker family ties in religiously unaffiliated subjects, and family members are reported to be more likely to provide reliable emotional support, nurturance, and reassurance of worth (37). Our finding is consistent with reports about less dense social networks among atheists (38), although whether distancing from one’s family facilitates disaffiliation from the family’s religion or vice versa is not known.
T
I see that four pages into the study, it finally speaks directly of atheists. The religiously non affiliated does not mean atheist, as this should demonstrate. The religiously non affiliated just means the person is not active in a religious community.
As this shows, the community ties is key for support systems. Not that atheists cannot have these, but in our very religious society, atheists are often outcast solely due to their beliefs, thus less total numbers of humans in their society in which to have a relating social tie.

I think as atheism grows, their will be more groups formed for the ideologies that bring atheists together in good healthy support groups.

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#107665
Jun 29, 2013
 
Khubala wrote:
<quoted text>
If there is a God,but there are those who do not believe there is then what Bacon says is very relevant and accurate.
Those who deny God may well be suffering from Cotard's syndrome
The Cotard delusion or Cotard's syndrome, also known as nihilistic or negation delusion, is a rare neuropsychiatric disorder in which a person holds a delusional belief that he or she is dead,and that God does not exist
Read more: http://www.monstropedia.org/index.php...
In this lecture, Cotard described a patient with the pseudonym of Mademoiselle X, who denied the existence of God, the Devil, several parts of her body and denied she needed to eat.
And it may be that you should concern yourself with the detrimental
effect on your mental health caused by your foolish bellief that there is no God.
That problem is self inflicted.
Don't blame Christianity or God....
So you cite some rare disorder to point to why atheism is foolish, or do you call us foolish for some other reason?

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#107666
Jun 29, 2013
 

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ProvenScience wrote:
<quoted text>
Only if anyone insists on being mired in and harping at stone age mentality level...kind of like not acknowledging the FACT that eating shellfish during a yellow or red tide might not be such a good idea, and wearing wool in 90 degree weather is not too bright either.
All these social whining non issues-wastes of time-not gonna change a thing on HOW or WHAT people think, or how anything operates now anyway.
Just MORE wastes of tax payer dollars that SHOULD spent on things like REAL immigration reform, welfare reform, jobs in a floundering economy, building and maintaining crumbling infrastructures and affordable (not FWEE) healthcare for everyone-NOT just some.
Hail the WHINIEST adminsitration ever-wahwahwah, where duh fwee everthing lines...wahwahwah.
Biggest Buncha backwards, whiney, duhmazz, commie-leaning slackerTics ever. Wahwahwah....
You claim it is a non issue, but if a government did not allow you to marry the adult you loved, it would suddenly be the only issue that seems important.
It is clearly not important to you because it does not affect your life. This shows you are only concerned about yourself.

I see you just avoid the issue at hand and whine about other things to create a diversion.

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#107667
Jun 29, 2013
 
Quantummist wrote:
<quoted text>
Time tells the tale... As I said the slippery slope tilts a bit with each slip.... And it starts already...
Polygamists consider the SCOTUS ruling a trail blazing ruling for consideration of Marriage being between several consenting adults... And when that is found valid then comes net slip followed shortly by the Animal Rights groups to give animals standing in the marital status....
http://www.mrc.org/articles/polygamy-advocate...
The people like yourself said the same thing when black persons were allowed to marry white people.
The slippery slope fears is no reason to deny persons freedoms.
If you cannot find adequate reasons to deny homosexuals to marry, then move on and deal with it.

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#107668
Jun 29, 2013
 

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Khubala wrote:
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Of course ,the fact that this report was based on a Scientific Study conducted by the American Journal of Psychiatry is rendered meaningless by the simple fact that the report concludes that,because of their unbelief,Suicide and other mental problems are much more prevalent among those non affiliated than those affiliated with religion.
Now,how does an Atheist deal with that issue?
He/She is unable to accept the results and has to go into denial.
Any excuse will be used to attempt to negate the Scientific findings of this report.
These are the same individuals who claim that nothing created something from nothing,which eventually gave birth to the stars ,planets and life as we know it.
They can not explain how it happened......
It was an accident,who knows.
Most certainly could not have been created by a superior intelligence,but,noninteiligen ce is quite capable of creating such a miracle.
Start by showing evidence of a creator and then we will talk about what that creator might be capable of doing.
And claiming nothing created the creator makes no sense.
If no creator was needed to create the creator, then why does it take a creator to create the universe?

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#107669
Jun 29, 2013
 

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Khubala wrote:
<quoted text>
Of course ,the fact that this report was based on a Scientific Study conducted by the American Journal of Psychiatry is rendered meaningless by the simple fact that the report concludes that,because of their unbelief,Suicide and other mental problems are much more prevalent among those non affiliated than those affiliated with religion.
Now,how does an Atheist deal with that issue?
He/She is unable to accept the results and has to go into denial.
Any excuse will be used to attempt to negate the Scientific findings of this report.
These are the same individuals who claim that nothing created something from nothing,which eventually gave birth to the stars ,planets and life as we know it.
They can not explain how it happened......
It was an accident,who knows.
Most certainly could not have been created by a superior intelligence,but,noninteiligen ce is quite capable of creating such a miracle.
Many atheists are affiliated with religious organizations. In fact the Unitarian church welcomes them and they often go religiously.
Again, you keep pointing to atheists when the study is not pointing to atheists in particular.
Again, the study shows Islam has Christianity beat in the suicide department. So when are you going to drop that foolish religion of yours and convert to Islam?

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