Kindafunny

Clifty, KY

#23 Mar 1, 2012
There are federal and state inspectors that regularly visit coal mine sites. Its their job to make sure the operation runs safely. Not the union, not a union steward, and not some guy that thinks their pension cant be touched.
Remember Pyro? Those guys lost every bit of retirement they worked for. Loadstar Energy screwed those guys.
haha

Madisonville, KY

#24 Mar 1, 2012
My husband works for Alliance right now and I must say they have taken very good care of us. Unions or not, we do not have a single problem with Alliance Coal. And if you think they are a SCAB HOLE take your ass to another company then and see how well you do. He has also worked for a Peabody too, by the way and it was a union mine and the worker's attitude was TERRIBLE because they felt like they didn't have to do anything. I witnessed it myself several times. You have to do your job and do it right, if you can be that person Alliance will take care of you. Period. I will never believe anything less. And if you say Alliance fired you for a good reason well nobody ever thinks THEY are bad workers!
Miner

United States

#25 Mar 1, 2012
UMWA said it perfectly, u must have worked at alliance as I did to! And as for "HAHA" if you havent noticed we did leave the scab hole and go somewhere else and that really made us see the difference. Why dint you tell us why alliance gave the big raise when They started losing men in big quantities to the union mines still in the area? And the current employees are seeing how happy the union workers are since they left and are wanting a little taste of what is so good theirself. U can say what u want but watch what happens in the near future! Men want to hbe a say so and be able to work a shift and go home without having to worry about getting written up for a job that didn't get done that wasn't even there job to begin with! Alliance will try to screw u in any way if they can do it and get away with it! Every mines has a chosen few that get respect and it doesn't take a genius to figure out why, hope ur husband isn't inthat category because at the end if the day if worse comes to worse, they will it his throat to save theirself!
old miners wife

United States

#26 Mar 1, 2012
Kindafunny wrote:
There are federal and state inspectors that regularly visit coal mine sites. Its their job to make sure the operation runs safely. Not the union, not a union steward, and not some guy that thinks their pension cant be touched.
Remember Pyro? Those guys lost every bit of retirement they worked for. Loadstar Energy screwed those guys.
I completely agree. My stepdad worked for Pyro for more than 30 years, and was taken under with that mine when it went down. Now, he is 62 and trying to rebuild his retirement at a non-union mine. When the union pushed for the votes there to go union, they told the men that they would be picking up their original hire date so that they would be eligible for union retirement.... Guess What??? Didn't happen. So, until you have been burned by union reps, as my stepdad and many others were, think twice before you diehard back them. And as for the one that claims Alliance has "crappy insurance" and no real retirement, I would like to know how long you were there. My husband has a vested retirement account with the company and his 401K, and we have 100% insurance. If you are happy away from Alliance, good for you, but please don't continually bash Alliance as my husband and other miners are proud of the job that they do. I choose to be thankful to God for what we have, and that for 11 years my husband has come home safe. My dad was killed at an underground mine that was a complete nightmare compared to anything you all have seen in the last 20 years. I know bad and I know when to appreciate being blessed in a bad economy, and I feel blessed.
junejune

Eddyville, KY

#27 Mar 1, 2012
My dad also worked at pyro and my husband works at advent and I agree with pretty much everything you have said. Im very thankful for the job my husband has.
haha

Madisonville, KY

#28 Mar 1, 2012
Miner wrote:
UMWA said it perfectly, u must have worked at alliance as I did to! And as for "HAHA" if you havent noticed we did leave the scab hole and go somewhere else and that really made us see the difference. Why dint you tell us why alliance gave the big raise when They started losing men in big quantities to the union mines still in the area? And the current employees are seeing how happy the union workers are since they left and are wanting a little taste of what is so good theirself. U can say what u want but watch what happens in the near future! Men want to hbe a say so and be able to work a shift and go home without having to worry about getting written up for a job that didn't get done that wasn't even there job to begin with! Alliance will try to screw u in any way if they can do it and get away with it! Every mines has a chosen few that get respect and it doesn't take a genius to figure out why, hope ur husband isn't inthat category because at the end if the day if worse comes to worse, they will it his throat to save theirself!
They lost men because the idea of a "union" sounds good, but people get screwed over by unions all the time!! They are just an organization like anything else! I know PLENTY of people that left Alliance and would do anything to get back! If you found a better job elsewhere then good for you, but you can't speak for everybody when you call Alliance a scab hole or whatever else negative you want to say about it. Everybody has a different opinion and a different experience...ours has been wonderful and I personally do not know anybody that doesn't love and feel thankful for Alliance. IF you do then Im sorry, I wish nothing but good on your family. ALliance is a great blessing in our lives and thats about all you can ask out of company as far as we're concerned.
haha

Madisonville, KY

#29 Mar 1, 2012
And besides that, when most people leave something bad they just say good riddance and move on...if your life is so much better at your new company then just leave the past where it is and stop getting on topix to bash a great company that so many people are PROUD to say they work for around here. Not all miners have the heart and endurance to keep it up, but those of them that do take great pride in the job as Im sure you know. If they go union then they do, and if not then everybody is happy there anyways. And if not it IS just a job and everybody knows where the shaft is and the road home.
UMWA ALL THE WAY

Madisonville, KY

#30 Mar 1, 2012
haha wrote:
My husband works for Alliance right now and I must say they have taken very good care of us. Unions or not, we do not have a single problem with Alliance Coal. And if you think they are a SCAB HOLE take your ass to another company then and see how well you do. He has also worked for a Peabody too, by the way and it was a union mine and the worker's attitude was TERRIBLE because they felt like they didn't have to do anything. I witnessed it myself several times. You have to do your job and do it right, if you can be that person Alliance will take care of you. Period. I will never believe anything less. And if you say Alliance fired you for a good reason well nobody ever thinks THEY are bad workers!
.

Thanks miner....."Haha" READ THESE WORDS AND PROCESS....WE DID GO SOMEWHERE ELSE BY CHOICE AND MORE ARE WALKING OUT THE DOORS DAILY, FOLLOWING OUR LEAD!! As to your last sentence no one has said they got fired. I quit with a 2 week notice, and then they tried to bargain. Not that its any of your business just thought I would clarify. Hell if I have to turn in a notice to get them to promise things they can't carry forward then who needs that? I didn't turn the notice in to get my ass kissed. I turned it in bc, I came to the realization that alliance will never change and Joe craft will keep getting his pocket padded by your husband thinking he is making "top dollar". Funny there were no big raises until experienced workers were walking out for something better. They are having to offer competitive wages to try and keep what's left and are trying to buy more mines, so in turn workers will think they have no option but to work for them. Also just so I have addressed all of your assumptions, union miners not wanting to have to work. I have ran more coal tonage at my Union mine than ever ran at alliance, reason being enough workers to do the job equals good production. Your husbands wages equal-27.00/hr(est) Joe crafts profit off your husbands one hour of work 500 dollars the look on your face when you processed this PRICELESS!!! P.S - YOU CAN TELL YOUR HUSBAND HE IS WELCOME FOR THE RAISE!!!
old miners wife

United States

#31 Mar 1, 2012
Does it seem to everyone else that someone is bitter?? Kinda reminds you of those people who leave a marriage and claiming how happy they are, and then spend the rest of their lives complaining about it. Our husbands owe you no "Thank You". I wasn't angry at all about this until now, but to say that my husband who has spent 20+ years in the mines that he owes you, who I would be surprised from your comments has more than a few years, is ridiculous. FYI, there have been raises in the mines, Alliance mines at that, before Highland came along. Have you ever heard of a cost of living raise? My husband sees one pretty much every year. It is ridiculous to kick on some miners and miners wives for being thankful for their husbands and proud of the job that they do. Oh yea, and for all the thing you have addressed about the union, I heard nothing concerning the explanation for why my stepdad and many other good men were left out in the cold by the union mines without their retirement.
old miners wife

United States

#32 Mar 1, 2012
AND, unless your making $500 an hour these days, what do you think your company is making off of your man hours???
UMWA ALL THE WAY

Madisonville, KY

#33 Mar 2, 2012
I am sorry old miners wife I didn't mean to let you go unnoticed! So demanding I guess Alliance is instilling these qualites in the spouses now. That was a joke, because I wouldn't want you to think I was all "bitter". In all seriousness, I would like to say I am glad your husband has a job. Do I wish he had the opportunity to understand the benefits of working for a Union as I do,YES. I also want to state that I did not start this forum someone else did, so unless it is a crime to voice your opinion on the topic I see nothing wrong with stating my opinion. After all, I do not work for Alliance anymore, remember I have a voice that can be heard. I am extremly happy with my transfer, unlike the so called "relationship in denial" you tried to compare my so called "bitterness" to. I just thought I would ruffle a few feathers, frankly could care less about alliance.On the other hand, I do care about being informative and thats the reasoning for the post, not a malicious attack against Alliance. As for the "thank you" that got you so upset, I will just ,chalk it up, as alliance gave it to him for his hard worked 20+ years because they usually do that.Hence the slight sarcasm in the previous sentence. I wish I had more time to talk with you about this subject matter, but I really need to be thinking of ways I am going to use my 10 paid sick days 4 paid float days and my 2 weeks of paid vacation a year and how much more money I will have on these days to spend with my negotiated contract of raises per month. If you had read my previous post on the raise issue it says"a raise this BIG" in terms implicating there have been raises just not this significant and conveniently timed. As for your stepdad, that was left out in the cold I am sure Alliance would have provided him with a jacket, and their 401K that is so called "VESTED". Thats just it I have a Pension that I put nothing into but days worked, and I also have a 401k that the company matches. See as an american Laborer you have this choice.So let me put in lamens terms:
Comparison:
Alliance= 401k= your own Money+companies match if vested=not promised=OUT IN THE COLD!!
No retired benefits for you or your family, but you do get a gold star.
UNION MINES=Pension, that you say can leave me out in the cold, but if I were to catch a cold I will have my retired benefits to go to the doctor and if my family member catches it, you guessed it, they can go to the doctor and not pay out of pocket.You also have the right to a 401k that they will match. As for the Pension, this is something that I have never put a dime into, and my UNION has set aside for me, because they care about me as an employee.Last and foremost, IF and I stress the emphasis on "IF" what have I lost if its not there when I retire? Alliance never offered it to begin with.
P.S. In reference to the comment about my experience, I have many years invested I just refrain from using the descriptive word,"old" in my screen name, so I won't give it away.
Miner

Fredonia, KY

#34 Mar 2, 2012
I don't think they can process what were saying. They have tunnel vision for alliance just liketwy want them to.... And that's ok because it's ur decision but before long you'll see what were talking about! U wanna act Like u know all this ecause ur a wife of a miner and I can promise ya he doesn't tell you everything cause you wouldn't want him going to work if he did! And or whoever said the inspectors keep a mine safe..... Maybe to a certain extent but what do they do when an inspector isn't underground??????? How about you tell us that since u have it all figured out! We are down there where the rubber meets The road and we had to follow orders of what we were told to do if we wanted our job being safe or unsafe! Everytime an inspector came on site they called the units and told us we had "company" on the way and to make sure everything was right! If they know hey are doing things right why worry about who's coming down! We don't have that issue where I work now! Just keep rambling on if you want to but as for you wifes, you have no idea of what the ones who actually go underground do on a daily basis but if you'd like to learn more and get some education about what ur talking about they have a class every month to get your miners card and alliance will probably hire a woman if you think it's suh a great company to work for, go on out and get you a job and fond out for yourself about this blindfold your wearing
old miners wife

United States

#35 Mar 2, 2012
I have attempted to post twice this morning, but I guess my answers were lengthy, so let's try this again. No, I am not blindfolded, and I am more aware than most about what can happen underground. I did lose my dad in the mines 27 years ago. I don't need your gold star either because my husband does have a retirement not linked to his 401k that Alliance did offer when he was hired with them. Maybe next time you should check the information when you say retirement was never offered. Yes, he paid into it as did the company, but you do pay union dues, so ther really isn't any difference. My husband worked for the same union mine that my stepdad worked for, but he left before they closed and took the mens retirement down with them. The union reps made promises that they didn't keep to get the men to vote the union in, like promising to back up to their original hire date to ensure that the 10+ year employees qualified for a union retirement. They lied. I will not say that all union reps lie, because I do not have tunnel vision to believe that all union reps are the same at every mine just like all management is different at every Alliance mine. Bragging is not becoming, and I don't feel the need to get on here and let you know how great we have it as, apparently, you do. I have just said that I appreciate the years of employment and the benefits that have taken care of my family brought home to us by a hardworking man, and I feel that you are both being very demeaning because he works for Alliance. I have very little contact with anyone else from Alliance besides my husband, so it would be very hard to blindfold me. As for going underground and seeing what goes on there, I really have no desire to go underground, really didn't want my husband to when he did more than 20 years ago, but he is a coal miner. It is what he chose just like his freedom of choice to work for a nonunion mine. You chose differently, and you believe in that and I can respect your opinion about your situation, but please, unless you have worked for every Alliance mine, don't assume that you know every operation. Alot men have stayed with the company, by choice, not to say that every Alliance mine is perfect. There is no perfect mine, union or nonunion. As for taking up for the other miners wife, some things don't need a union to band people together. Coal miners wives don't need to pay dues to back each other. I just think she is the proud wife of a hardworking miner too, and doesn't want to see them bashed for being nonunion. Have a great day, and be safe in all seriousness no matter where you work. God bless.

“You Need A”

Since: Jan 12

Government Program

#36 Mar 2, 2012
We need them to unite, we need to hear more complaining, we need to listen to their whining, we need them to tell their sob stories, we need a tissue, we need a shoulder to cry on, we need a government program...
I'm union and I know it

Washington, DC

#37 Mar 2, 2012
I've witnessed it time, and time, again. In every industry, there are those who are willing to sacrifice, to step outside their comfort zone in an attempt to secure those things which only collective bargaining can attain. Meanwhile, you have those individuals working in these same industries who choose not to participate in the efforts to obtain better working conditions, better wages, benefits, not to mention achieving dignity in that same work place.

They choose to wait for someone else to set the standard and then reap what others have sewn. You know who you are. You know what you're doing. It's okay though. Through all of my years as a union representative, union organizer, and just all around good guy, I've come to know one thing....inside every scab, there's a union man trying to get out. Stop having someone else work to secure your prevailing wage and benefit package. Grow a pair, sign a GD UMWA card. Stop the suckling of the Alliance tit,'cause if the UMWA goes away, that Alliance tit will surely dry up. Willing to bet your future on it? That's exactly what your doing.

Since: Jan 12

Washington, DC

#38 Mar 2, 2012
What we need is for everybody to quit worrying about what is happening everywhere else. If you quit alliance then who gives a damn about them or why they do. Are you happy where you are at? If so then quit worrying about why others decide to work at alliance. I think everybody should just be happy they have a job that pays so damn well no
Matter which mines it is. Different mines have different benefits that are unique to each place. So once again if your happy at a union mines then be happy and quit worrying about alliance. If your happy at an alliance mines then be happy and don't worry about any other just be grateful than you are each employed.
nosey rosie

Providence, KY

#39 Mar 2, 2012
This is so stupid!!! Instead of hating on each other you need to be doing everything you can to promote the resource we all mine each day, without it , this area will be in big trouble. Whether you like patriot, Armstrong , Murray or alliance they are providing high paying jobs that allows someone with a high school education to make what a lot of college degreed earners don't make.
GHT

Owensboro, KY

#40 Mar 2, 2012
Union leaders are just as corrupt or more coal company executives. Most all mines today have inspectors all over the place writing fines for small items like not having your parking break on for a pick up truck on the surface. The feds and state keep mines safe today not unions.

As for a Living wage.. once you deduct out your union dues from a Highland union miners check and cross compare his wages to same position across the road at Riverview once this miner adds in his production royalty and bonuses - non union in making same and many months more. As far as pension, like with Pyro, I would much rather control all my money in a matching 401k. IT IS MINE. UMWA finances for its pension is in bad bad shape, kind of like govt social security - not enough working paying in and and too many drawing. UMWA reps likely mismanaged the money in to someone others pockets and the miners will soon suffer. UMWA asked the govt to help bail the pension out a few years ago and govt refused.

What I do not understand, Obama on tape in San Francisco said, he wanted to killed the coal industry - green energy is the future. Obama could not get Cap in Trade passed so he just uses the EPA and mine inspectors to do the work in trying to kill coal and is having success. Sierra club sues TVA, Obama puts pressure on TVA to settle since it is a govt. entity like the post office. As part of settlement, TVA will be closing 18 coal fired plants and paid the sierra club 6 million for their legal fees in suing them. See how many UMWA jobs this kills when these TVA coal plants start going off line in a few years. Why does the UMWA union support Obama? As long as the union reps up high keep the money coming in or perhaps they can shift over to a public service union for a job. Today, umwa reps care for the miners no more than the coal mine executives.

As a young miner, I would rather work for Riverview over Highland. Have you seen Patroits qtr report of IL basin? They make money off and a good return off their Eastern App operations and have a taxable loss many qtrs for Highland and IL Basin. When TVA coal plants start closing, Cline floods the market with the cheap longwall IL coal, market will fall, and efficient places like Riverview stay in business and places like Highland/Freedom go out of business. Good luck getting your UMWA Pension in your a young miner that you continue to pay into......
Wondering

Chicago, IL

#41 Mar 2, 2012
I really do not know what to say, it is evident that you union supporters don't have enough brains between you to make one good brain. I am no doubt older than most all of you and my experience with unions has not been good. Listening to you is like listening to the talking points of the democratic party. None of them can think for themselves.
Mlner

Cadiz, KY

#42 Mar 2, 2012
GHT---- u have no clue! Highland downst have any contracts with TVA. They have smaller contacts with multiple companies bribing kor per ton than TVA paid! Oboma will never be sucessful pushing coal out of the future as we depend on it for the majority of our electricity and is the cheapest source to provide! Union dues are $70 a month and I don't miss that out of a paycheck. Highland pays a guaranteed hourly wage that doesn't depend on production bonuses (royalty) that can be taken and adjusted weekly! As the post stated we need union to protect..... When Alliance buys everyone out and the workers have no voice without the union they can take royalty away and pay whatever they want if there isn't a third party to step in! Your outlook and statements sound good but have bo truth or proof of anything that's happened or will happen in our lifetime! As for now, I'll stock with union where I have a voice and have a guaranteed wage without depending on royalty to make my check!

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