Rather than raise minimum wage

Posted in the Lynn Grove Forum

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Since: Aug 11

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#1 Feb 15, 2013
Raising minimum wage is stupid.

Yes, in theory it helps the poorest workers afford more, the reality is that businesses simply raise prices to offset the cost. What happens is those making above minimum wage see their income worth less due to the price raise. Even worse, some employers will lay off or hire fewer.

It would be nice to think business would just absorb this extra cost, but get real, businesses exist to make a profit, not to subsidize anyone's life.

So, the reality is, raising minimum wages hurts more than it helps.

So I have a simple idea....

All workers making less than 133% of poverty line are exempt from the FICA taxes. The cost of this is offset by raising the income ceiling on FICA.

Suddenly, anyone actually WORKING, but struggling gets a 7.65% pay increase.

This does what the lame idea of raising minimum wage is meant to do, help out the poorest of WORKERS. But even better, it does so without putting any extra burden on the businesses, aka JOB CREATORS.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#2 Feb 15, 2013
Even better, it is my opinion that this would stimulate the economy.

Those making that extra 7.65% will spend every bit of it. Those at the top affected by the increase in the ceiling would save or invest.

While it would be nice to think that this economy is driven by savings and investment, it is time to be real once more. Our economic models are Keysnesian, not classical.

Consumption is what what this drives this economy.
D.C.

Duluth, GA

#3 Feb 15, 2013
Where did you get your economics degree?

Since: Aug 11

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#4 Feb 15, 2013
[QUOTE who="D.C."]Where did you get your economics degree?[/QUOTE]

No matter the answer I give it will not be satisfactory, but I shall answer.

I do not have an economics degree, I do, however have an accounting degree from MSU from 1988, of which 18 hours was economics, including micro and macroeconomic theory.

What is interesting is that at the time, we were only taught Keynesian theory, the classical model was brushed over. This is even more interesting since the classical model is what the Reagan administration was using(the last administration to do so).

As my political beliefs migrated to the right, I desired to learn more of the classical model, so learned a bit more on my own about the subject.

The balance was learned simply by observing the economy and politics and their strange interaction over the last 30+ years.

Since: Oct 09

Location hidden

#5 Feb 15, 2013
SpiritoftheHawk wrote:
<quoted text>
No matter the answer I give it will not be satisfactory, but I shall answer.
I do not have an economics degree, I do, however have an accounting degree from MSU from 1988, of which 18 hours was economics, including micro and macroeconomic theory.
What is interesting is that at the time, we were only taught Keynesian theory, the classical model was brushed over. This is even more interesting since the classical model is what the Reagan administration was using(the last administration to do so).
As my political beliefs migrated to the right, I desired to learn more of the classical model, so learned a bit more on my own about the subject.
The balance was learned simply by observing the economy and politics and their strange interaction over the last 30+ years.
Here's something to add to your balance, if you like epic rap battles:
Hayek vs. Keynes
Someone

Murray, KY

#6 Feb 15, 2013
What a dumbass.
You aren't very bright.
History shows again and again inflation does not Accompany wage increases.
Bishop

Murray, KY

#7 Feb 15, 2013
Productivity has gone way up over the last decade yet wages have remained flat. Workers deserve to be compensated for their extra output but they are not getting it because companies can get away with pocketing it all. People always say a higher minimum wage will lead to higher prices but companies will raise prices as high as they can get away with anyway. It's not like they are keeping prices low to be nice guys and will only raise them because they have to due to the minimum wage.
Independent

Owensboro, KY

#8 Feb 15, 2013
Republicans believe in Keynesian theory. If you don't believe it, just ask them if it's OK to eliminate unneeded military expenditures.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#9 Feb 15, 2013
I would like for a genuine small business owner to chime in on this subject.

Will the small business owner, when faced with increasing minimum pay by $1.75 per hour:
a) pass on the added costs through higher prices
b) lay off workers and push productivity even higher if possible
c) smile and absorb the extra cost, happily accepting lower profits?

Keep in mind that it is not just payroll that will go up, but all of the payroll associated taxes such as employer FICA, FUTA, SUTA, Workers Comp.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#10 Feb 15, 2013
Independent wrote:
Republicans believe in Keynesian theory. If you don't believe it, just ask them if it's OK to eliminate unneeded military expenditures.
Agreed.

But the portion of Keynesian theory I w as referring to was that it is consumption rather than labor(mfg) that drives the economy.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#11 Feb 15, 2013
Ok, do you all honestly think that minimum wage laws have no effect on jobs or prices?

Then I ask, why are Chinese made good so much cheaper than American made goods (other than regulation)

And I ask if minimum wages have nothing to do with employment levels, why have so many of our jobs gone to India and Mexico?

Ideals are great. I would love it if raising the minimum wage had zero effect on prices and employment levels, but ideals and reality do not always see eye to eye.

I am surprised more liberals do not like my idea, considering not only does the take home pay of the poor go up, but the "rich" get higher taxes at the same time.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#12 Feb 15, 2013
Here is another problem of raising minimum wage to $9 an hour.

Lets say Polly has been with Walmart 6 years and is finally making $9.00 an hour. For 6 years she busted her a$s and earned higher pay.

Suddenly minimum wage goes up to $9.00 an hour. Suddenly Polly sees new hires making the same amount she busted her buns to get. Of course, Walmart is not going to raise all wages across the board, so tell me, what effect will this have?
Teddy

Murray, KY

#13 Feb 15, 2013
SpiritoftheHawk wrote:
Here is another problem of raising minimum wage to $9 an hour.
Lets say Polly has been with Walmart 6 years and is finally making $9.00 an hour. For 6 years she busted her a$s and earned higher pay.
Suddenly minimum wage goes up to $9.00 an hour. Suddenly Polly sees new hires making the same amount she busted her buns to get. Of course, Walmart is not going to raise all wages across the board, so tell me, what effect will this have?
People that bust their butts should make more than $9 an hour anyway. If that's all she is getting after six years of that then she needs to go to a company that will properly compensate her for it.
Polly

Benton, KY

#14 Feb 15, 2013
SpiritoftheHawk wrote:
Here is another problem of raising minimum wage to $9 an hour.
Lets say Polly has been with Walmart 6 years and is finally making $9.00 an hour. For 6 years she busted her a$s and earned higher pay.
Suddenly minimum wage goes up to $9.00 an hour. Suddenly Polly sees new hires making the same amount she busted her buns to get. Of course, Walmart is not going to raise all wages across the board, so tell me, what effect will this have?
I will be pissed off!!!!!
Christ died of AIDs

Duluth, GA

#15 Feb 15, 2013
Polly wrote:
<quoted text>I will be pissed off!!!!!
If you are upset that poor people are not even poorer then you should be angry at yourself.
Cooked Dorner

Paducah, KY

#16 Feb 16, 2013
SpiritoftheHawk wrote:
Here is another problem of raising minimum wage to $9 an hour.
Lets say Polly has been with Walmart 6 years and is finally making $9.00 an hour. For 6 years she busted her a$s and earned higher pay.
Suddenly minimum wage goes up to $9.00 an hour. Suddenly Polly sees new hires making the same amount she busted her buns to get. Of course, Walmart is not going to raise all wages across the board, so tell me, what effect will this have?
Minimum wage is nothing other than a tool dimocrat politicians use to get votes from the low information voter.
tom

Madisonville, KY

#17 Feb 16, 2013
If small businesses can't afford to pay someone a living wage they shouldn't be hiring employees. Same goes for large billion dollar companies. The large companies like Walmart and McDonald's are donating millions of dollars to politicians that favor not raisin g the wage. That money could be spent on their employees so that they could make a living wage and not have to depend on food stamps and medical insurance from tax payers. People complain all the time about the number of people on food stamps. Most of the people are working full time jobs that do not provide them a living wage to provide for their own family. When I was growing up my mother worked 2 jobs and still qualified for food stamps, until she was able to get on at a local factory and make a decent wage. She was working 6 days a week 3 days she worked from 6 am till 1230 am. No parent should have to work all day and all night and still not be able to afford food for their family. 9 an hour is hardly a living wage, and yet people are still opposed to it. Don't complain about your tax dollars being spent on families food stamps when you don't support raising their pay so they can be self sufficient.
Bub

Murray, KY

#18 Feb 16, 2013
tom wrote:
If small businesses can't afford to pay someone a living wage they shouldn't be hiring employees. Same goes for large billion dollar companies. The large companies like Walmart and McDonald's are donating millions of dollars to politicians that favor not raisin g the wage. That money could be spent on their employees so that they could make a living wage and not have to depend on food stamps and medical insurance from tax payers. People complain all the time about the number of people on food stamps. Most of the people are working full time jobs that do not provide them a living wage to provide for their own family. When I was growing up my mother worked 2 jobs and still qualified for food stamps, until she was able to get on at a local factory and make a decent wage. She was working 6 days a week 3 days she worked from 6 am till 1230 am. No parent should have to work all day and all night and still not be able to afford food for their family. 9 an hour is hardly a living wage, and yet people are still opposed to it. Don't complain about your tax dollars being spent on families food stamps when you don't support raising their pay so they can be self sufficient.
tl;dr
Polly

Benton, KY

#19 Feb 16, 2013
Christ died of AIDs wrote:
<quoted text>
If you are upset that poor people are not even poorer then you should be angry at yourself.
That was in reference to the post above me about Walmart. I was just saying if someone has worked there 10 years and only making 9 dollars an hour, they would be pissed if someone walks in and makes 9 dollars an hour. To be fair, they should all get the increase, however Walmart crooks will never do it! I agree, nobody can live on minimum wage!
Retired teacher

United States

#20 Feb 16, 2013
Bub wrote:
<quoted text>
tl;dr
Maybe that's why you are probably a dumbass - all attitude and no knowledge. Your "tl;dr" attitude is a big part of what is wrong with American society today. Everybody has to get their information in a 90 second news flash on TV or a one liner on the internet.

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