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Since: Nov 12

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#12789
May 22, 2013
 

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Oh my wrote:
<quoted text>
"It is just what the bitter atheistic clingers hold on to in order to try and support their disbelief in a Creator."
Unfortunately for you this is entirely irrelevant, Evolution does not concern itself with a Creator, but does concern itself with the method for genetic change. Belief or disbelief in a Creator is not a requirement to support Evolution over ID.
Actually, it is quite relevant given the reception Darwin's theories was given within the atheistic communities and their immediate embrace of his theory to "prove" there was no longer need for a Creator. But again, I have no problem with the theory being taught, it is perfectly reasonable as we try to explain the history of life on this planet - my problem, and the problem that most who are intellectually honest about the debate have, is that it is taught as FACT without any information being given to students about the MANY questions that the theory of evolution still cannot explain - the Cambrian explosion, the relatively short amount of time life on this planet has had to somehow achieve the complexity and diversity that the fossil record shows, the absence still of any TRUE transitional species - a hole that Darwin recognized and warned could be a fatal flaw to his theory , the problem with irreducible complexity, etc. I would still contend Intelligent Design should be taught as well, but at minimum the theory of evolution should be taught as just that - THEORY still, with MANY unanswered questions.
Oh my

Blairsville, GA

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#12790
May 22, 2013
 

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Bored wrote:
http://www.topix.com/forum/city/blairsville-g...

To the conservatives on topix, stand fast and live by your principles.
To the liberals, good riddance.

Conservative principles::
Web link:
http://www.kirkcenter.org/index.php/detail/te ...

First, the conservative believes that there exists an enduring moral order.
Second, the conservative adheres to custom, convention, and continuity.
Third, conservatives believe in what may be called the principle of prescription.
Fourth, conservatives are guided by their principle of prudence.
Fifth, conservatives pay attention to the principle of variety.
Sixth, conservatives are chastened by their principle of imperfectability.
Seventh, conservatives are persuaded that freedom and property are closely linked.
Eighth, conservatives uphold voluntary community, quite as they oppose involuntary collectivism.
Ninth, the conservative perceives the need for prudent restraints upon power and upon human passions.
Tenth, the thinking conservative understands that permanence and change must be recognized and reconciled in a vigorous society.
Perhaps part of the problem is the self-defined glorious light that shines brightest on the self-deluded, as exemplified by the First, Nineth, and Tenth Order of Conservative Wisdom.

Then the Second Order of Conservative Wisdom calls for...

continuity
- The unbroken and consistent existence or operation of something over a period of time.
- A state of stability and the absence of disruption.

Which, naturally, is exemplified by the Fifth Order of Conservative Wisdom...

variety
- The quality or state of being different or diverse; the absence of uniformity, sameness, or monotony.
- A number or range of things of the same general class that are different or distinct in character or quality.

Now the Sixth Order of Conservative Wisdom claims the superiority of mediocrity, yet they revere the liberals who fashioned...

We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.

And of course the Seventh Order of Conservative Wisdom is not shared by Liberals, except for the Liberals who founded this country.

With the Eighth Order of Conservative Wisdom collectivism is seen as purely a Liberal trait, which is true as the Founding Fathers clearly stated in the Preamble to the US Constitution, the people consent to collectively act thru government to resolve issues, promote the general welfare, and protect liberties and property.

Perhaps it would be best if Bored did retire from posting here, and concentrate his efforts on like-minded forums that will relieve his excessive-compulsive disorder.

Since: Nov 12

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#12791
May 22, 2013
 

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I should acknowledge, that yes, I do realize there are believers in God who also accept evolution.
Oh my

Blairsville, GA

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#12792
May 22, 2013
 

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Aggie23 wrote:
<quoted text>
http://www.topix.com/forum/city/blairsville-g...
Your comparison would therefore logically imply we should run "back ground" checks before allowing people to order a drink at the bar (they might become a drunk driver) and should limit all patrons to one drink (why should anyone need more than one drink in an evening). You are therefore "punishing" the majority of people who drink responsibly for the actions of a few. A few who can cause great harm, but still the few.
Nope, background checks are not predictive of future behavior, they only reveal aspects of a person's past. Besides, it's just so punishing every time I'm carded to purchase alcohol.
Oh my

Blairsville, GA

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#12793
May 22, 2013
 
Aggie23 wrote:
<quoted text>
http://www.topix.com/forum/city/blairsville-g...
Actually, it is quite relevant given the reception Darwin's theories was given within the atheistic communities and their immediate embrace of his theory to "prove" there was no longer need for a Creator.
And the relevance of who embraced or opposed Evolution 150 years ago has what bearing on today. And if you find it significant that atheists embrace Evolution, then it would be equally significant that Christians also embrace Evolution, as do people from many different religions, professions, and socio/economic positions.
Oh my

Blairsville, GA

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#12794
May 22, 2013
 
Aggie23 wrote:
<quoted text>
http://www.topix.com/forum/city/blairsville-g...
...I have no problem with the theory being taught, it is perfectly reasonable as we try to explain the history of life on this planet - my problem, and the problem that most who are intellectually honest about the debate have, is that it is taught as FACT without any information being given to students about the MANY questions that the theory of evolution still cannot explain -

the Cambrian explosion
http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CC/CC300.h...

- The Cambrian explosion was the seemingly sudden appearance of a variety of complex animals about 540 million years ago (Mya), but it was not the origin of complex life. Evidence of multicellular life from about 590 and 560 Mya appears in the Doushantuo Formation in China (Chen et al. 2000, 2004), and diverse fossil forms occurred before 555 Mya (Martin et al. 2000).(The Cambrian began 543 Mya., and the Cambrian explosion is considered by many to start with the first trilobites, about 530 Mya.) Testate amoebae are known from about 750 Mya (Porter and Knoll 2000). There are tracelike fossils more than 1,200 Mya in the Stirling Range Formation of Australia (Rasmussen et al. 2002). Eukaryotes (which have relatively complex cells) may have arisen 2,700 Mya, according to fossil chemical evidence (Brocks et al. 1999). Stromatolites show evidence of microbial life 3,430 Mya (Allwood et al. 2006). Fossil microorganisms may have been found from 3,465 Mya (Schopf 1993). There is isotopic evidence of sulfur-reducing bacteria from 3,470 Mya (Shen et al. 2001) and possible evidence of microbial etching of volcanic glass from 3,480 Mya (Furnes et al. 2004).

- There are transitional fossils within the Cambrian explosion fossils. For example, there are lobopods (basically worms with legs) which are intermediate between arthropods and worms (Conway Morris 1998).

- The length of the Cambrian explosion is ambiguous and uncertain, but five to ten million years is a reasonable estimate; some say the explosion spans forty million years or more, starting about 553 million years ago. Even the shortest estimate of five million years is hardly sudden.

http://www.talkorigins.org/indexcc/CC/CC301.h...
- The Precambrian fossils that have been found are consistent with a branching pattern and inconsistent with a sudden Cambrian origin. For example, bacteria appear well before multicellular organisms, and there are fossils giving evidence of transitionals leading to halkierids and arthropods.

- Genetic evidence also shows a branching pattern in the Precambrian, indicating, for example, that plants diverged from a common ancestor before fungi diverged from animals.

Since: May 13

Ellijay, GA

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#12795
May 22, 2013
 

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Oh my wrote:
<quoted text>
Yeah, kinda like the Germ Theory, or Immunology, it just doesn't effect me, until it does.
Evolution..Creationism....Big Bang ...monkeys.. Adam/Eve...you reckon this subject is on a par with germs? Is it a matter of life or death?

I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume you have not been following this sideshow.
Oh my

Blairsville, GA

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#12796
May 22, 2013
 
Aggie23 wrote:
<quoted text>
http://www.topix.com/forum/city/blairsville-g...
...I have no problem with the theory being taught, it is perfectly reasonable as we try to explain the history of life on this planet - my problem, and the problem that most who are intellectually honest about the debate have, is that it is taught as FACT without any information being given to students about the MANY questions that the theory of evolution still cannot explain -

the relatively short amount of time life on this planet has had to somehow achieve the complexity and diversity that the fossil record shows
Perhaps you could tell us how much time is required...

- The Cambrian explosion was the seemingly sudden appearance of a variety of complex animals about 540 million years ago (Mya), but it was not the origin of complex life. Evidence of multicellular life from about 590 and 560 Mya appears in the Doushantuo Formation in China (Chen et al. 2000, 2004), and diverse fossil forms occurred before 555 Mya (Martin et al. 2000).(The Cambrian began 543 Mya., and the Cambrian explosion is considered by many to start with the first trilobites, about 530 Mya.) Testate amoebae are known from about 750 Mya (Porter and Knoll 2000). There are tracelike fossils more than 1,200 Mya in the Stirling Range Formation of Australia (Rasmussen et al. 2002). Eukaryotes (which have relatively complex cells) may have arisen 2,700 Mya, according to fossil chemical evidence (Brocks et al. 1999). Stromatolites show evidence of microbial life 3,430 Mya (Allwood et al. 2006). Fossil microorganisms may have been found from 3,465 Mya (Schopf 1993). There is isotopic evidence of sulfur-reducing bacteria from 3,470 Mya (Shen et al. 2001) and possible evidence of microbial etching of volcanic glass from 3,480 Mya (Furnes et al. 2004).

Since: May 13

Ellijay, GA

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#12797
May 22, 2013
 

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I'm not going back over pages and pages of bullcrap name calling.
However I see from skimming this last page, that Evolution still seems to be a matter of life and death .

It's that deep?

Well, Lerner took the Fifth.

Thousands of your American brothers and sisters are claiming that as donors to organizations such as the Tea Party and other freedom groups, they were investigated.
This means our govt has access and is abusing absolutely everything. No stone unturned in this country anymore.

Did you know that if you are served a warrant from DHS, you will go to jail if you tell anyone? Even your LAWYER? Do you care?

Do you know that DHS was out yesterday all over the country, intimidating old ladies and moms and grandfathers who were protesting IRS agencies?
A well armed DHS. This is intimidation and thuggery.

But the big question burning here is, how freaking old is the Earth??????
Oh my

Blairsville, GA

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#12798
May 22, 2013
 
Aggie23 wrote:
<quoted text>
http://www.topix.com/forum/city/blairsville-g...
...I have no problem with the theory being taught, it is perfectly reasonable as we try to explain the history of life on this planet - my problem, and the problem that most who are intellectually honest about the debate have, is that it is taught as FACT without any information being given to students about the MANY questions that the theory of evolution still cannot explain -

the absence still of any TRUE transitional species - a hole that Darwin recognized and warned could be a fatal flaw to his theory
- There are transitional fossils within the Cambrian explosion fossils. For example, there are lobopods (basically worms with legs) which are intermediate between arthropods and worms (Conway Morris 1998).

http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/faq-transitio...
Transition from primitive jawless fish to sharks, skates, and rays

Transition from from primitive jawless fish to bony fish

Transition from primitive bony fish to amphibians

Transitions among amphibians

Transition from amphibians to amniotes (first reptiles)

Some transitions among reptiles

Transition from synapsid reptiles to mammals

Transition from diapsid reptiles to birds

and continues for many more pages.....

Since: May 13

Ellijay, GA

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#12799
May 22, 2013
 

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IRS failed to comply with Congress for all Communications with the White House.

DOJ seized records of 5 Fox news reporters. And counting..Including PARENTS

Anthony "See My Pee Pee" Weiner is running for Mayor of NY.

U.S. attorney investigating FOX donated to (yep) Obama.

But more important=
I've descended into the Grand Canyon into raw earth estimated millions+ of years old. It's incredible when you think of it.
I still believe in God. Nothings changed.
guest

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#12801
May 22, 2013
 

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Creationists stubbornly cling to the ridiculous argument that "it's only a theory". They refuse to acknowledge what science has been saying for decades. Evolution is, in fact, both Theory and fact. The Theory does not negate the fact. To deny this is just plain old stubbornness. Talk about "intellectual dishonesty". And ID is not science. Discuss it in comparative religion. It doesn't belong anywhere near a science classroom. Well maybe in an anthropology class.
It's sad that this kind of information has to be shown over and over and over again to folks who can read and write, but here it is.
http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/evolution-fac...
>"When non-biologists talk about biological evolution they often confuse two different aspects of the definition. On the one hand there is the question of whether or not modern organisms have evolved from older ancestral organisms or whether modern species are continuing to change over time. On the other hand there are questions about the mechanism of the observed changes... how did evolution occur? Biologists consider the existence of biological evolution to be a fact. It can be demonstrated today and the historical evidence for its occurrence in the past is overwhelming. However, biologists readily admit that they are less certain of the exact mechanism of evolution; there are several theories of the mechanism of evolution. Stephen J. Gould has put this as well as anyone else:
In the American vernacular, "theory" often means "imperfect fact"--part of a hierarchy of confidence running downhill from fact to theory to hypothesis to guess. Thus the power of the creationist argument: evolution is "only" a theory and intense debate now rages about many aspects of the theory. If evolution is worse than a fact, and scientists can't even make up their minds about the theory, then what confidence can we have in it? Indeed, President Reagan echoed this argument before an evangelical group in Dallas when he said (in what I devoutly hope was campaign rhetoric): "Well, it is a theory. It is a scientific theory only, and it has in recent years been challenged in the world of science--that is, not believed in the scientific community to be as infallible as it once was."
Well evolution is a theory. It is also a fact. And facts and theories are different things, not rungs in a hierarchy of increasing certainty. Facts are the world's data. Theories are structures of ideas that explain and interpret facts. Facts don't go away when scientists debate rival theories to explain them. Einstein's theory of gravitation replaced Newton's in this century, but apples didn't suspend themselves in midair, pending the outcome. And humans evolved from ape-like ancestors whether they did so by Darwin's proposed mechanism or by some other yet to be discovered.
Moreover, "fact" doesn't mean "absolute certainty"; there ain't no such animal in an exciting and complex world. The final proofs of logic and mathematics flow deductively from stated premises and achieve certainty only because they are not about the empirical world. Evolutionists make no claim for perpetual truth, though creationists often do (and then attack us falsely for a style of argument that they themselves favor). In science "fact" can only mean "confirmed to such a degree that it would be perverse to withhold provisional consent." I suppose that apples might start to rise tomorrow, but the possibility does not merit equal time in physics classrooms.
Evolutionists have been very clear about this distinction of fact and theory from the very beginning, if only because we have always acknowledged how far we are from completely understanding the mechanisms (theory) by which evolution (fact) occurred. Darwin continually emphasized the difference between his two great and separate accomplishments: establishing the fact of evolution, and proposing a theory--natural selection--to explain the mechanism of evolution."<
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#12802
May 22, 2013
 

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Death Panel wrote:
I'm not going back over pages and pages of bullcrap name calling.
However I see from skimming this last page, that Evolution still seems to be a matter of life and death .
It's that deep?
Well, Lerner took the Fifth.
Thousands of your American brothers and sisters are claiming that as donors to organizations such as the Tea Party and other freedom groups, they were investigated.
This means our govt has access and is abusing absolutely everything. No stone unturned in this country anymore.
Did you know that if you are served a warrant from DHS, you will go to jail if you tell anyone? Even your LAWYER? Do you care?
Do you know that DHS was out yesterday all over the country, intimidating old ladies and moms and grandfathers who were protesting IRS agencies?
A well armed DHS. This is intimidation and thuggery.
But the big question burning here is, how freaking old is the Earth??????
You funny again. Can you chew gum and walk at the same time? Relax you might blow a gasket.

Since: Nov 08

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#12803
May 22, 2013
 

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ChicknButt wrote:
<quoted text>
The local crack dealer has a loyal following of junkie clients as well. It doesn't mean they're worth a crap or we want them in our town.
Just because you don't want to see and hear fair and balanced reporting doesn't mean that no one else does.

Well, you can always listen to Air America. Oh! Wait!

Since: May 13

Ellijay, GA

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#12804
May 22, 2013
 

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Glad I can entertain you.

I agree that Creationism -v- Evolution is a legitimate and _can be_ great conversation. But what usually happens is Evolutionists almost always fall back on ridicule, mockery and disgust.
So what are you trying to glean from the topic? Enlightenment? Is it possible to respect the opinions and deep beliefs of others?

I cry foul.

Now. I'm wondering if I am audited by the IRS, can I plead the Fifth? I know, I know..I'm rolling of floor laughing my behind off, too!
Oh my

Blairsville, GA

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#12805
May 22, 2013
 
Death Panel wrote:
http://www.topix.com/forum/city/blairsville-g...
Anthony "See My Pee Pee" Weiner is running for Mayor of NY.

U.S. attorney investigating FOX donated to (yep) Obama.

But more important=
Athony Weiner sent pictures to another consenting adult, and resigned from office when it became public. Mark Sanford ran off to another country to have a tryst with a consenting adult, and resigned when it became public. SC votes have decided to return Mark Sanford to public service, even after he trespassed in his ex-wife's home.

Regardless of what cases a US Attorney is working on, are you suggesting that they cannot separate their personal and professional lives. Or perhaps you are suggesting that there is only a certain type of person that can investigate Fox News.

And how is the importance of either of these issues any less than any other issue discussion in this forum.

Since: Nov 08

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#12806
May 22, 2013
 
Informed Opinion wrote:
<quoted text>
Please, oh please, explain to us all how the playing field is level when:
in this corner -
Jim,
a 52 year old maintenance man,
with three kids and a wife,
making $38,627.00 a year,
vs.
in this corner -
Exxon Mobil,
valued at $512,000,000,000.00,
with an annual profit of $46,000,000,000.00,
a profit ration of 25%,
on revenue well over $1,000,000,000,000.00
and 82,000 employees.
Please, explain to us all how night shuft maintenance employee Jim will bring Exxon Mobil to its knees.
Tell us how the CEO,
who just received a 20% raise,
making $25,000,000.00 a year,
leaves one of the six corporate jets assigned to his office,
to engage in negotiations with Jim, after Jim finishes his shift.
First maybe you can explain why, absent a union, Jim isn't just fired and replaces by Bob, a 19 year old kid who'll do Jim's job for minimum wage.
Wait.. Maybe you first out to explain why, absent unions, Bob is entitled to a minimum wage.
Could it be the natural desire of companies to "share the profits generously with their employees?
No, that can't be it. That record is crystal clear.
Employee and profits are both higher than ever in history, and the wages paid employees have consistently fallen in real dollars.
Labor is a commodity, employers buy as cheap as they can to increase profit- that's their job.
Well - let's await the answer - This ought to be good.
Please, oh, please tell me your comprehension isn't THAT nonexistent. We were posting about the working class man. Union workers as opposed to non unions workers. I explained in enough detail that a cat could understand it. I asked you what someone who can't get into(connections) a union was supposed to do to support a family. Are you going to answer that? You call all of them scabs. How NOBLE of you. I know two steamfitters. They BOTH had to have help getting into local #72. They had to have MAJOR connections in order to get accepted.
You know, people go into jobs knowing what to expect most of the time. If someone doesn't like the scenario, they don't have to take that job. It's so simple. What can't you figure that out?

Since: Nov 08

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#12807
May 22, 2013
 

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Informed Opinion wrote:
<quoted text>
Typical Right Wing Wacko tactic.
Lie, lie, and lie some more.
Don't like the facts ?
Just lie.
I complimented those giving, I even commented that I myself donated.
So the claim I "criticized" is just another bald faced, easily disproved, lie.
I simply stated the obvious that in a multi-billion dollar disaster, we should fool ourselves by thinking our donations will even come close to making a debt in the need.
That is a helpful statement of fact - not a criticism.
That's why FEMA, under the grown ups, is funded at the multi-billion dollar level it is.
Nice try.
Hey, next time accuse me of being anti-union.
Disproving that will be fun, too.
Your negativity is only surpassed by your ill will and hatred of those who have more than you.

Since: May 13

Ellijay, GA

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#12808
May 22, 2013
 

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Oh my wrote:
<quoted text>
Athony Weiner sent pictures to another consenting adult, and resigned from office when it became public. Mark Sanford ran off to another country to have a tryst with a consenting adult, and resigned when it became public. SC votes have decided to return Mark Sanford to public service, even after he trespassed in his ex-wife's home.
Regardless of what cases a US Attorney is working on, are you suggesting that they cannot separate their personal and professional lives. Or perhaps you are suggesting that there is only a certain type of person that can investigate Fox News.
And how is the importance of either of these issues any less than any other issue discussion in this forum.
You guys try very hard, I'll grant you that.

Sanford is all kinds of idiot. Weiner also.
Could we have some ethics and morals in our elected government? Does anyone care? We pay them, they work for us. The children of this country are watching.

You only care if it's your guy. I hold them all accountable.

Since: Nov 08

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#12809
May 22, 2013
 

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Bored wrote:
@ Conservatives.
After posting in this thread for months, itís obvious the gap between Conservatives and Liberals is so huge it will never be bridged. We here on topix are just a micronism of what we see on the national level and in our elected officials.
I have also found by being involved on topix, I have become more or less obsessive/compulsive in posting so I have decided to take a hiatus from topix for the moral good of my soul. When one becomes so absorbed in politics where it affects oneís moral compass, the effort is not worth it. My life does NOT revolve around politics; I just get sucked into it occasionally.
I have great faith in conservative principles as they have stood the test of time, not so the liberal principles.
Iím giving a top ten list of conservative principles along with a top ten list of liberal principles.
And finally Iím giving a top ten list of philosophical principles.
Maybe some of you can discern some similarity in these principles, maybe not.
Conservative principles::
Web link:
http://www.kirkcenter.org/index.php/detail/te...
First, the conservative believes that there exists an enduring moral order.
Second, the conservative adheres to custom, convention, and continuity.
Third, conservatives believe in what may be called the principle of prescription.
Fourth, conservatives are guided by their principle of prudence.
Fifth, conservatives pay attention to the principle of variety.
Sixth, conservatives are chastened by their principle of imperfectability.
Seventh, conservatives are persuaded that freedom and property are closely linked.
Eighth, conservatives uphold voluntary community, quite as they oppose involuntary collectivism.
Ninth, the conservative perceives the need for prudent restraints upon power and upon human passions.
Tenth, the thinking conservative understands that permanence and change must be recognized and reconciled in a vigorous society.
Liberal principles, note some of these principles have changed to day due to socialist influence::
Web link;;
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/geoffrey-r-ston...
1. Liberals believe individuals should doubt their own truths and consider fairly and open-mindedly the truths of others.
2. Liberals believe individuals should be tolerant and respectful of difference.
3. Liberals believe individuals have both a right and a responsibility to participate in public debate.
4. Liberals believe "we the people" are the governors and not the subjects of government, and that government must treat each person with that in mind.
5. Liberals believe government must respect and affirmatively safeguard the liberty, equality and dignity of each individual.
6. Liberals believe government has a fundamental responsibility to help those who are less fortunate.
7. Liberals believe government should never act on the basis of sectarian faith.
8. Liberals believe courts have a special responsibility to protect individual liberties.
9. Liberals believe government must protect the safety and security of the people, for without such protection liberalism is impossible.
10. Liberals believe government must protect the safety and security of the people, without unnecessarily sacrificing constitutional values.
Philosophical principles::
Web link;;
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/moslive/artic...
1. THE HARM PRINCIPLE
2. THE PRINCIPLE OF SUFFICIENT REASON
3. THE MEAN
4. THE FALSIFICATION PRINCIPLE
5. OUGHT IMPLIES CAN
6. THE PRINCIPLE OF EVIDENCE
7. THE PRINCIPLE OF CHARITY
8. THE DIFFERENCE PRINCIPLE
9. JUST WAR
10. OCCAM'S RAZOR
To the conservatives on topix, stand fast and live by your principles.
To the liberals, good riddance.
I totally agree with Aggie. We all get tired of slamming our heads against a wall. Don't stay away for long. As BillinDville said, check your private messages under your registered name. You'll be hearing from me.

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