(NM) Bills aim to ban gay marriage

Feb 17, 2011 Full story: www.krqe.com 17

Two House bills propose to amend the constitution to read that marriage is defined as between one man and one woman, while another measure would void civil unions performed out of New Mexico.

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rdg1234

Watseka, IL

#1 Feb 17, 2011
Woo hoo! WTG New Mexico, you rock!!
Lyle

Chicago, IL

#2 Feb 17, 2011
rdg1234 wrote:
Woo hoo! WTG New Mexico, you rock!!
1. It is a cruel lie with no real basis in homosexual life. No significant percent of homosexuals have 'married' in any country that allows it. Why add to the disillusionment with life that so often causes suicides among homosexuals?
2. Americans overwhelmingly oppose it. A growing majority of states have gone to the extreme step of enacting constitutional amendments to prevent rogue judges from forcing it into law.
3. No homosexual relationship shares the reasons for government involvement in real marriage. In some states, government didn't even register marriage until the latter part of the 19th Century, and then it was largely because divorce rates were rising economically and legally inferior women were left with their children for the state to support. Despite the fact that much has changed for women, they still remain on average paid much less than men and still are often left with children to support when a marriage ends.
4. No homosexual relationship produced children as a natural an usual result. When children are present in a homosexual relationship they are usually the result of a prior relationship. Even real marriage would not make pre-existing children the child of a new partner. In rare cases when courts allow adoption of a child by a homosexual 'couple', that relationship is specifically dictated by the court. A court may also allow dual parenting of an inseminated child if it deems it appropriate.
5. Most adults still marry and enter into a traditional marriage relationship. US Census data confirms that few same sex adults live in any sort of domestic partnership, much less a homosexual one. Data presented by Topix confirms that most homosexual 'marriages' are not even exclusive relationship, much less like a real marriage. One of the reasons that homosexual 'marriage' has failed to attract a significant percent of the homosexual population where legal is that it is extremely unwise for a homosexual 'couple' to get entangled in a huge body of law generated for very different relationships.
6. The traditional family remains the basic building block of American Society, so government has a legitimate interest is supporting it. It has no legitimate interest in being involved in any legal homosexual relationship.
7. As demonstrated with statistics from numerous countries and un-refuted by any poster in these fora, this all has precious little to do with anyone 'marrying.' The homosexual 'marriage' movement was concocted as a way of attacking the common morals of Americans in order to force acceptance of a lifestyle choice that most find damaging and immoral. The homosexual marriage movement has in fact done the opposite, generating increased hostility toward homosexuals, as a result of anti-democratic attacks on voters rights to dictate the legal definition of marriage.
8. Radical homosexuals have no more right to undemocratically force their philosophy of homosexual 'marriage' into law that Seventh Day Adventists would have a right to have their beliefs declared our national religion.
mainelygay

Biddeford, ME

#3 Feb 17, 2011
Luckily the bills have been tabled for now and hopefully forever. It's never good to demonstrate your bigotry and ignorance but attempting to put it into law (which would likely eventually be ruled unconstitutional anyways!). Shame on the leaders of New Mexico. Once again so much for working on jobs and the economy!
killthegayhaters

Atlanta, GA

#4 Feb 17, 2011
if it passes bomb the capital
rdg1234

Watseka, IL

#5 Feb 17, 2011
mainelygay wrote:
Luckily the bills have been tabled for now and hopefully forever. It's never good to demonstrate your bigotry and ignorance but attempting to put it into law (which would likely eventually be ruled unconstitutional anyways!). Shame on the leaders of New Mexico. Once again so much for working on jobs and the economy!
Woo hoo voters of Maine!! Boo effin hoo queers of Maine! lol
gaymarriedwithki ds

Phoenix, AZ

#6 Feb 17, 2011
I love the claim that Americans are "overwhelmingly" opposed to same sex marriage. When banning interracial marriage became illegal, changing the law was opposed 9 to 1. Now that's overwhelming discrimination. Gay marriage is opposed more like 55% to 45% and shrinking daily. It will be interesting to see if the religous zealots stick by their "this is a democracy" argument when its not in their favor.

Since: Sep 09

Location hidden

#7 Feb 17, 2011
mainelygay wrote:
Luckily the bills have been tabled for now and hopefully forever. It's never good to demonstrate your bigotry and ignorance but attempting to put it into law (which would likely eventually be ruled unconstitutional anyways!). Shame on the leaders of New Mexico. Once again so much for working on jobs and the economy!
The Reps are a bible thumping hypocrite disaster who are owned by christian conservatives but I will add this . The voting rate/percentage of much of the gay community,Dems in some states like Florida is another disaster and those who do not vote in EVERY election not only once every 4 yrs are enablers.

Since: Sep 09

Location hidden

#8 Feb 17, 2011
killthegayhaters wrote:
if it passes bomb the capital
No and things like this only make us look foolish.

To become a political fist just like right wing is how we defeat them .
MANY in our ranks are apathetic and that is our problem.
hi hi

Philadelphia, PA

#9 Feb 18, 2011
Jose - in Miami wrote:
<quoted text>
No and things like this only make us look foolish.
To become a political fist just like right wing is how we defeat them .
MANY in our ranks are apathetic and that is our problem.
It is an enormous, horrifying problem which has had numerous ramifications. Note that in HAWAII, DELAWARE and ILLINOIS, there's not even any *talk* of marriage equality! People don't even want to *fight* for it and so they settle for civil unions, and why? Because if they do that, THE GROUPS LIKE NOM WON'T COME AFTER THEM. That's pure fear, and pure laziness. NOM is winning, and have won in many cases. They have *cowed* people into being too exhausted and too fearful to fight for marriage equality.

The reason I am not blatantly outspoken is that NOTHING will budge the apathetic pro-gay *in just the same way* that NOTHING will budge the virulent anti-gay! If you coddle the pro-gay, nothing changes. If you savagely criticize them, they react like squalling, nasty-spirited babies and I don't give a shit what they have to say about it. They can go choke on it, for sure. In the current state of things,*nothing* is going to change except by virtue of changing demographics, and it is going to take *decades* to achieve.

I never thought I'd see the day, but I predicted it months and months and months ago. NOM is winning, for sure. My god, New Hampshire should have been a settled issue and you alllll have to go back and you alllllll have to sit around defending yourselves *yet again*. This is not the way to run a railroad. But ya know what? Ya make suggestions about how this could be gone about differently, and they get ignored or shot down. I don't have sympathy anymore. It seems a small core of activists are simply clawing their way through the fights day after day, and that's about it.

Once the pro-gay realize that the anti-gay have a GOD-GIVEN MANDATE that they are NEVER GOING TO GIVE UP and must be fought savagely and daily in ways *DIF-FER-ENT* from how they're being fought now, things might improve.

The momentum is a good thing. I will absolutely applaud that. It seems marriage equality is being discussed *everywhere* now, and that something is being done about it *everywhere*.

But unless the *attitude* changes and unless people SEE the psychology of the anti-gay people they're up against, you'll see what I mean: These changes will only go so far and will come to a dead standstill with gay people *CLEARLY*,*CLEARLY* still second-class citizens ... and all while the anti-gay savagely, daily, ceaselessly work to undermine *even what you have*.

It's all very sad, indeed. But when I saw how impossible it was to get the pro-gay to listen, I *knew* the anti-gay would start winning, KNEW it.
mainelygay

Biddeford, ME

#10 Feb 18, 2011
hi hi, I agree with most of what you say but let's not forget how far we've come in a relatively short time. 10 years ago we had no states that guaranteed marriage equality now we have 5 with the possibility of 1 - 3 more this year. You can now get married in the capital cities of all three countries in North America. Repeal of DADT is a huge victory for equality and can't do anything but bolster the push for marriage equality. We have many states with civil unions(not equal to marriage but one step closer to the goal).

Those opposed are beginning to see the writing on the wall. Their biggest support is from older people and conservatives. As the population ages their ranks diminish and younger people in much larger numbers support equality. I disagree that NOM is winning. They are active right now because the ultra conservatives (in many places) are in power at the moment and this maybe their last chance. If you look closely at each place they're attacking many already have laws against Marriage Equality so what they're doing is redundant and in other places their bills don't stand a chance of getting through. A waste of time probably to appeal to the extreme fringe. In New Hampshire the sponsors of the bill could pass it but are now saying they want to table it to work on jobs and the economy. The real truth here may be that something like 60% of the population doesn't favor repeal of marriage equality! It's a big advantage that people can see that states that have had Marriage Equality for awhile haven't experienced even one of the dire things predicted. Also many of the organizations opposing equality are being exposed for repeating their lies and misinformation over and over. Some even find themselves listed as hate groups!

If you need proof that those opposed are worried all you have to do is look at how much the hate and ignorance spewed on these sites has ramped up.

It was recently pointed out that as people learn more about the issue some who oppose will change their mind and move to the support side seldom do they move from acceptance to intolerance.

I agree it can be very frustrating but we are winning and don't give up the fight!

“Headed toward the cliff”

Since: Nov 07

Tawas City, Michigan

#13 Feb 18, 2011
gaymarriedwithkids wrote:
I love the claim that Americans are "overwhelmingly" opposed to same sex marriage. When banning interracial marriage became illegal, changing the law was opposed 9 to 1. Now that's overwhelming discrimination. Gay marriage is opposed more like 55% to 45% and shrinking daily. It will be interesting to see if the religous zealots stick by their "this is a democracy" argument when its not in their favor.
The religious anti-gays will be the first to try to find an "activist" judge to prevent same-sex couples from marrying.
TheIggy

Avon, CO

#14 Feb 18, 2011
gaymarriedwithkids wrote:
I love the claim that Americans are "overwhelmingly" opposed to same sex marriage. When banning interracial marriage became illegal, changing the law was opposed 9 to 1. Now that's overwhelming discrimination. Gay marriage is opposed more like 55% to 45% and shrinking daily. It will be interesting to see if the religous zealots stick by their "this is a democracy" argument when its not in their favor.
Gov Martinez is a B*&%! Why the residents of my former state continue to elect these ASSHATS from down south I'll never know! Seriously!

Oh & by the way, this country is a "Republic" not a "democracy" FYI

Since: Sep 09

Location hidden

#15 Feb 19, 2011
hi hi wrote:
<quoted text>
It is an enormous, horrifying problem which has had numerous ramifications. Note that in HAWAII, DELAWARE and ILLINOIS, there's not even any *talk* of marriage equality! People don't even want to *fight* for it and so they settle for civil unions, and why? Because if they do that, THE GROUPS LIKE NOM WON'T COME AFTER THEM. That's pure fear, and pure laziness. NOM is winning, and have won in many cases. They have *cowed* people into being too exhausted and too fearful to fight for marriage equality.
The reason I am not blatantly outspoken is that NOTHING will budge the apathetic pro-gay *in just the same way* that NOTHING will budge the virulent anti-gay! If you coddle the pro-gay, nothing changes. If you savagely criticize them, they react like squalling, nasty-spirited babies and I don't give a shit what they have to say about it. They can go choke on it, for sure. In the current state of things,*nothing* is going to change except by virtue of changing demographics, and it is going to take *decades* to achieve.
I never thought I'd see the day, but I predicted it months and months and months ago. NOM is winning, for sure. My god, New Hampshire should have been a settled issue and you alllll have to go back and you alllllll have to sit around defending yourselves *yet again*. This is not the way to run a railroad. But ya know what? Ya make suggestions about how this could be gone about differently, and they get ignored or shot down. I don't have sympathy anymore. It seems a small core of activists are simply clawing their way through the fights day after day, and that's about it.
Once the pro-gay realize that the anti-gay have a GOD-GIVEN MANDATE that they are NEVER GOING TO GIVE UP and must be fought savagely and daily in ways *DIF-FER-ENT* from how they're being fought now, things might improve.
The momentum is a good thing. I will absolutely applaud that. It seems marriage equality is being discussed *everywhere* now, and that something is being done about it *everywhere*.
But unless the *attitude* changes and unless people SEE the psychology of the anti-gay people they're up against, you'll see what I mean: These changes will only go so far and will come to a dead standstill with gay people *CLEARLY*,*CLEARLY* still second-class citizens ... and all while the anti-gay savagely, daily, ceaselessly work to undermine *even what you have*.
It's all very sad, indeed. But when I saw how impossible it was to get the pro-gay to listen, I *knew* the anti-gay would start winning, KNEW it.
I no longer waste time trying to get other adults to vote .
In Florida registered Dems out number registered Reps and that is only the registered count as countless who would vote Dem "refuse" to even register.

Yet every state election goes further right and last state went full tea party for state attorney general, Senate and governor and assorted other offices.

I have no actual data but from my experience living here close to 3 yrs .
I would guess 3 out of 10 gay men under 40yrs old will vote in state election and on a good day 5 out of 10 for president election.
The women much to their credit vote in much higher numbers.

The Dem vote overall in Florida is a disgrace OTHER than the Jewish American vote who vote in every single election but they can't carry the whole state .

"I don't have sympathy anymore."

Me neither I say hell with "them" even though that "them" includes me lol but I vote but sick of those that don't.
There is nothing as repuslive as someone who complains but does not vote.

Since: Sep 09

Location hidden

#16 Feb 19, 2011
mainelygay wrote:
hi hi, I agree with most of what you say but let's not forget how far we've come in a relatively short time. 10 years ago we had no states that guaranteed marriage equality now we have 5 with the possibility of 1 - 3 more this year. You can now get married in the capital cities of all three countries in North America. Repeal of DADT is a huge victory for equality and can't do anything but bolster the push for marriage equality. We have many states with civil unions(not equal to marriage but one step closer to the goal).
Those opposed are beginning to see the writing on the wall. Their biggest support is from older people and conservatives. As the population ages their ranks diminish and younger people in much larger numbers support equality. I disagree that NOM is winning. They are active right now because the ultra conservatives (in many places) are in power at the moment and this maybe their last chance. If you look closely at each place they're attacking many already have laws against Marriage Equality so what they're doing is redundant and in other places their bills don't stand a chance of getting through. A waste of time probably to appeal to the extreme fringe. In New Hampshire the sponsors of the bill could pass it but are now saying they want to table it to work on jobs and the economy. The real truth here may be that something like 60% of the population doesn't favor repeal of marriage equality! It's a big advantage that people can see that states that have had Marriage Equality for awhile haven't experienced even one of the dire things predicted. Also many of the organizations opposing equality are being exposed for repeating their lies and misinformation over and over. Some even find themselves listed as hate groups!
If you need proof that those opposed are worried all you have to do is look at how much the hate and ignorance spewed on these sites has ramped up.
It was recently pointed out that as people learn more about the issue some who oppose will change their mind and move to the support side seldom do they move from acceptance to intolerance.
I agree it can be very frustrating but we are winning and don't give up the fight!
Good post.

"I agree it can be very frustrating but we are winning and don't give up the fight!"

Frustrating is an under statement lol. You have to admit it pisses you off.

There is a "joke" that I came up with which I told at a party in Key west .

How can you clear out a party of gay men in Florida ?

Ask us if we want to vote.

I am from NY and the voting mentality there is very different than here .

Since: Sep 09

Location hidden

#17 Feb 19, 2011
hi hi wrote:
<quoted text>
It is an enormous, horrifying problem which has had numerous ramifications. Note that in HAWAII, DELAWARE and ILLINOIS, there's not even any *talk* of marriage equality! People don't even want to *fight* for it and so they settle for civil unions, and why? Because if they do that, THE GROUPS LIKE NOM WON'T COME AFTER THEM. That's pure fear, and pure laziness. NOM is winning, and have won in many cases. They have *cowed* people into being too exhausted and too fearful to fight for marriage equality.
The reason I am not blatantly outspoken is that NOTHING will budge the apathetic pro-gay *in just the same way* that NOTHING will budge the virulent anti-gay! If you coddle the pro-gay, nothing changes. If you savagely criticize them, they react like squalling, nasty-spirited babies and I don't give a shit what they have to say about it. They can go choke on it, for sure. In the current state of things,*nothing* is going to change except by virtue of changing demographics, and it is going to take *decades* to achieve.
I never thought I'd see the day, but I predicted it months and months and months ago. NOM is winning, for sure. My god, New Hampshire should have been a settled issue and you alllll have to go back and you alllllll have to sit around defending yourselves *yet again*. This is not the way to run a railroad. But ya know what? Ya make suggestions about how this could be gone about differently, and they get ignored or shot down. I don't have sympathy anymore. It seems a small core of activists are simply clawing their way through the fights day after day, and that's about it.
Once the pro-gay realize that the anti-gay have a GOD-GIVEN MANDATE that they are NEVER GOING TO GIVE UP and must be fought savagely and daily in ways *DIF-FER-ENT* from how they're being fought now, things might improve.
The momentum is a good thing. I will absolutely applaud that. It seems marriage equality is being discussed *everywhere* now, and that something is being done about it *everywhere*.
But unless the *attitude* changes and unless people SEE the psychology of the anti-gay people they're up against, you'll see what I mean: These changes will only go so far and will come to a dead standstill with gay people *CLEARLY*,*CLEARLY* still second-class citizens ... and all while the anti-gay savagely, daily, ceaselessly work to undermine *even what you have*.
It's all very sad, indeed. But when I saw how impossible it was to get the pro-gay to listen, I *knew* the anti-gay would start winning, KNEW it.
In PA I think most Dems do vote?. I am from NY but have gone to PA several times.
Love PA but just to cold in winter and long winter which is why I came here.

The country side in PA is incredible .Spring/summer there is the best.
gaymarriedwithki ds

Mesa, AZ

#18 Feb 19, 2011
TheIggy wrote:
<quoted text>
Gov Martinez is a B*&%! Why the residents of my former state continue to elect these ASSHATS from down south I'll never know! Seriously!
Oh & by the way, this country is a "Republic" not a "democracy" FYI
Its not really a republic considering the referendum system, and its not a pure democracy either. Its a hybrid, but my point was the conservative battle cry, "this is a democracy." I have not heard them cry, "This is a republic!"
TheIggy

Avon, CO

#19 Feb 21, 2011
gaymarriedwithkids wrote:
<quoted text>
Its not really a republic considering the referendum system, and its not a pure democracy either. Its a hybrid, but my point was the conservative battle cry, "this is a democracy." I have not heard them cry, "This is a republic!"
I hear you, I was just noting the "fact" of the republic. Stating we live in a democracy isn't quite true. A democratic republic yes, but not a true democracy. BUT That was more of an aside.

My main point was Martinez is a B(*&$! I do not like that woman, and I still do not understand why NM keeps voting in these governors that do NOT have their state's best interests at heart. I also just don't understand the "anti samesex marriage" crowd either. They exasperate me to no end! They scream "freedom of speech" yet try to deny equal rights to homosexuals. I thought this country was better than that *note sarcasm. The stupidity of the American public & the rhetoric spewed by the hate mongering bigots dumbfounds me to no end.(& it isn't even affecting my life, I'm heterosexual!) But it still pisses me off to no end the level of hypocracy, hate and down right nastiness the anti GLBT folks have. Sometimes I just like to throw it back at them, others I just shake my head from side to side. Sorry GLBT New Mexican's you all have a shitty gov. Better luck next election!

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