Playbill for the Council Meeting Tonight

Playbill for the Council Meeting Tonight

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Just the Facts Jack

Syracuse, NY

#1 Dec 17, 2009
Are you going to the Council Meeting tonight? Just the Facts Jack thinks this might be the most entertaining event in Little Falls all year long! Jack suspects it will be cornier than Insects in the City, and have more horn-blowing than a Benton Hall band recital. Be there or be square!

Jack wonders if the eveningís entertainment will include:

* A chance for our worthy Mayor to yell at even more citizens of our fair community. Little old ladies, be forewarned!

* An explanation for last nightís secret, closed door meeting of the Common Council with the salesmen from Sphere Development. Maybe Ed R. can do a little tap dance routine for the citizens of Little Falls, and explain why this is not a violation of the NY State open meeting laws?

* A price tag on how much money in the form of grants and tax breaks it will cost to build the strip mall at the quarry?

* An explanation of how this expensive mall will really create new jobs and not just move existing jobs from Shoppers Square to the quarry.

* A lesson in grocery store management from Bob, who has pretty much called Jim C. a liar for saying that Big M will fail, and thus Shoppers Square pretty much go dark, if the Price Chopper mall is built.

* A plan for what the city will do¨−and how much it will cost, and who will pay for it−to deal with the problem of a boarded-up Shoppers Square in downtown LF once this mall gets built.

* A plausible reason that this expensive retail mall project will create new jobs, whereas the last two expensive retail mall projects in Little Falls (Shoppers Square and Canal Place) didnít create new jobs but only lined the pockets of rich developers and mall owners.

* An explanation of how this strip mall possibly fits with the principals of smart growth (yes, Jack read that insert in the paper the other day)?

Seriously, this is our city, our future. Get involved. Whether you are for the strip mall or for lower taxes or for smart growth, this issue is too important to let it be resolved in the sneaky, underhanded way that the administration has undertaken thus far.
LFGaloot

West Leyden, NY

#2 Dec 17, 2009
Jack : You have spent a lot of your time on line explaining your (and MSF's) reasoning for not getting a new shopping center. Tonight we will see a meeting to clear the air. I will be there and I hope you will be too. I am bringing a crow that I found dead on the road. One of us may have to eat it.I am bringing Worcestershire sauce. Will you bring the mustard?
saw it

United States

#3 Dec 17, 2009
I have a feeling Jack is Mike Lapino. Mikes house/porch is such a fricking pig sty on the outside, why would the butcher shop be any cleaner. If your a slob at home, your probably one at work, that would explain the green meat.
Mike

Long Eddy, NY

#4 Dec 17, 2009
what time does the entertainment begin?
Just the Facts Jack

Cicero, NY

#5 Dec 17, 2009
The Council Meeting is over, and thus Jack's purpose in life is completed. Jack must now fade back into the lulz from whence he emerged. So sad ...

But Jack has two farewell messages; one for Bob Peters and the Common Council, and one for the Chablis-sippers of Main Street 1st.

* For the Council: that was a very clever ruse to try and dodge the open meetings law at your secret, non-public pre-Council meeting. Very clever indeed! I do hope MSF has the fortitude to sue you for it. But, nonetheless, think about this: did the Sphere shysters suggest the idea of "break-out groups" to avoid a quorum? If so, do you think you should really TRUST people who counsel you on HOW to BREAK THE LAW and GET AWAY WITH IT? Think about it.

* For Main Street 1st: You face a neat conundrum. The mayor has taken an extra $400,000 in MY tax money and offered it to you as a bribe ... to shut up and go away. Do you take the money and run? Or do you bravely fight on ... against impossible odds ... for what you believe? It is Jack's guess that Sphere thought this would be clever way to divide and conquer you. Jack is betting that they were right.

So, my dearest friends and sock-puppets, Jack now bids you adieu. But fear not, for like Douglas MacArthur and Jesus Christ, Jack will return, perhaps in another persona, when the tax-and-spend liberals begin to get out the check books to buy this new mall (and now also MSF's consolation-prize for playing the game so well). A merry Christmas to all, even to Bob and his jolly band of sock-puppets!
williesson

Cicero, NY

#6 Dec 17, 2009
Just the Facts Jack wrote:
The Council Meeting is over, and thus Jack's purpose in life is completed. Jack must now fade back into the lulz from whence he emerged. So sad ...
But Jack has two farewell messages; one for Bob Peters and the Common Council, and one for the Chablis-sippers of Main Street 1st.
* For the Council: that was a very clever ruse to try and dodge the open meetings law at your secret, non-public pre-Council meeting. Very clever indeed! I do hope MSF has the fortitude to sue you for it. But, nonetheless, think about this: did the Sphere shysters suggest the idea of "break-out groups" to avoid a quorum? If so, do you think you should really TRUST people who counsel you on HOW to BREAK THE LAW and GET AWAY WITH IT? Think about it.
* For Main Street 1st: You face a neat conundrum. The mayor has taken an extra $400,000 in MY tax money and offered it to you as a bribe ... to shut up and go away. Do you take the money and run? Or do you bravely fight on ... against impossible odds ... for what you believe? It is Jack's guess that Sphere thought this would be clever way to divide and conquer you. Jack is betting that they were right.
So, my dearest friends and sock-puppets, Jack now bids you adieu. But fear not, for like Douglas MacArthur and Jesus Christ, Jack will return, perhaps in another persona, when the tax-and-spend liberals begin to get out the check books to buy this new mall (and now also MSF's consolation-prize for playing the game so well). A merry Christmas to all, even to Bob and his jolly band of sock-puppets!
Thank God that's over!

Since: Dec 09

Mohawk

#7 Dec 17, 2009
You will be missed Jack. My hat is off to you for your consistent on point message. May we meet in another forum. My opinion of Bob Peters and the Common Council has gone right into the toilet. So Bob can be coached. Interesting. Let's see when he loses his cool again. It will happen don't you think?
Chief Michael Masi

United States

#8 Dec 17, 2009
SilverRAV4 wrote:
You will be missed Jack. My hat is off to you for your consistent on point message. May we meet in another forum. My opinion of Bob Peters and the Common Council has gone right into the toilet. So Bob can be coached. Interesting. Let's see when he loses his cool again. It will happen don't you think?
I made a career out of losing my cool.
curious

West Leyden, NY

#9 Dec 17, 2009
dam it masi get back in your hole! good boy....sit....
Ishmael

United States

#10 Dec 18, 2009
Just the Facts Jack wrote:
* For Main Street 1st: You face a neat conundrum. The mayor has taken an extra $400,000 in MY tax money and offered it to you as a bribe ... to shut up and go away. Do you take the money and run?
Ya, take the money (door #2). Real funds are always better than promised funds.
Ishmael

United States

#11 Dec 18, 2009
Use it to visit Portsmouth NH, where they have a glorious Main St! Have fun. Get some Ideas!
There is a world famous hot dog stand (Gillys).
There's a lady who sews stuff while you wait, like dresses and handbags, and a lot of Gift shops.
Notice the parks, and gardens. Look at their waterfront.
Their streets are inhabited, not just occupied.
Their streets are alive.
Fact of Jack

West Leyden, NY

#12 Dec 18, 2009
SilverRAV4 wrote:
You will be missed Jack. My hat is off to you for your consistent on point message. May we meet in another forum. My opinion of Bob Peters and the Common Council has gone right into the toilet. So Bob can be coached. Interesting. Let's see when he loses his cool again. It will happen don't you think?
Put your hat back on,Get in that car of yours,pick up Pez(or his likeness) and listen while he tells you the rest of the bulls___t he has to give.He sucked you right in!
ETP

New York, NY

#13 Dec 18, 2009
Just the Facts Jack wrote:
The Council Meeting is over, and thus Jack's purpose in life is completed. Jack must now fade back into the lulz from whence he emerged. So sad ...
But Jack has two farewell messages; one for Bob Peters and the Common Council, and one for the Chablis-sippers of Main Street 1st.
* For the Council: that was a very clever ruse to try and dodge the open meetings law at your secret, non-public pre-Council meeting. Very clever indeed! I do hope MSF has the fortitude to sue you for it. But, nonetheless, think about this: did the Sphere shysters suggest the idea of "break-out groups" to avoid a quorum? If so, do you think you should really TRUST people who counsel you on HOW to BREAK THE LAW and GET AWAY WITH IT? Think about it.
* For Main Street 1st: You face a neat conundrum. The mayor has taken an extra $400,000 in MY tax money and offered it to you as a bribe ... to shut up and go away. Do you take the money and run? Or do you bravely fight on ... against impossible odds ... for what you believe? It is Jack's guess that Sphere thought this would be clever way to divide and conquer you. Jack is betting that they were right.
So, my dearest friends and sock-puppets, Jack now bids you adieu. But fear not, for like Douglas MacArthur and Jesus Christ, Jack will return, perhaps in another persona, when the tax-and-spend liberals begin to get out the check books to buy this new mall (and now also MSF's consolation-prize for playing the game so well). A merry Christmas to all, even to Bob and his jolly band of sock-puppets!
I'm going to miss them 'sock puppets' and 'kool-aid' comments. But, after you have heard them a couple hundred times it might be hard to forget.. My God.
upset

West Leyden, NY

#15 Dec 18, 2009
portsmith NH also has a navel base,and is on the road to Me, the Atlantic Ocean and not far from Dover NH or Kittery outlet stores. Also there is no sales tax in NH . a mall or 3-4 individual stores is not going to effect main st or Big M, in fact it could help by getting people to explore the LF area. The damage was done when shoppers sqaure was built and the rest given to Billy Burrows to build a bank. There aren't that many empty store fronts even now just bars, Pizza resturants and chineese resturants. What's left is junk with owners that don't care. Big M is trying to hold us hostage to expansion.
Observation

West Leyden, NY

#16 Dec 18, 2009
upset wrote:
portsmith NH also has a navel base,and is on the road to Me, the Atlantic Ocean and not far from Dover NH or Kittery outlet stores. Also there is no sales tax in NH . a mall or 3-4 individual stores is not going to effect main st or Big M, in fact it could help by getting people to explore the LF area. The damage was done when shoppers sqaure was built and the rest given to Billy Burrows to build a bank. There aren't that many empty store fronts even now just bars, Pizza resturants and chineese resturants. What's left is junk with owners that don't care. Big M is trying to hold us hostage to expansion.
Please be careful when using Mr. Burrows name.I'm sure he could find another facility to make his products.One that has lower taxes,cheaper utilities,and cheaper labor(though not as productive).He has kept many a family able to live comfortably around here.It takes money to make money and know how to use it.We may all be envious at times but let's be grateful for what we have.Your post is mostly correct in the other areas.Some people don't want to work at their business,just open the door,boss everyone around and have them do the work for them.When your on marginal ground you chip in and get your hands dirty,cut where you can,not sit on your _ss.In this town you must do that at the very least,and smile while you are doing it so you don't look so arrogant.Otherwise it eventually catches up with you.
Ishmael

United States

#17 Dec 18, 2009
upset wrote:
portsmith NH also has a navel base,and is on the road to Me, the Atlantic Ocean and not far from Dover NH or Kittery outlet stores. Also there is no sales tax in NH . a mall or 3-4 individual stores is not going to effect main st or Big M, in fact it could help by getting people to explore the LF area. The damage was done when shoppers sqaure was built and the rest given to Billy Burrows to build a bank. There aren't that many empty store fronts even now just bars, Pizza resturants and chineese resturants. What's left is junk with owners that don't care. Big M is trying to hold us hostage to expansion.
Portsmouth has stores because portsmouth has people and Portsmouth has people because it has nice spaces. People arn't there to shop. The stores are there to help the people inhabit the town. The stores are not the town. The people and the spaces are. Their streets are "inhabited", not occupied like Little Falls'. Portsmouths streets and parks are a habitat for people.
It has nothing to do with a naval base or outlet stores.
Go look again.
I'm all for a Price Chopper, and I'm all for a Price Chopper putting Shoppers Square out of its misery. As soon that building comes down we can put in a nice park. That's what was supposed to happen the first time that lot was vacant. I will be suggesting to my councilperson that this happen as part of the Sphere agreement.
LF rock

West Leyden, NY

#18 Dec 19, 2009
Yeah, leave places like Burrows and Feldmeier out of this. If those two places ever left LF would be a ghost town. Now is when Big M should be busy cleaning up and getting better so they can get aloyal customer base and stay viable when Price Chopper arrives. If i could get a consistent selection at a clean store, i would stay shopping the Big M
And to the other poster: what city money went into Canal Place? The money it cost to tear down Allegro when Frank Mendl abandoned it? The money that went into the Crews building after Crews let it get so bad the roof was going to fall in was mostly recovered when it was sold to LOCAL investors. Then those LOCAL investors sold it to dave and richard. Antique center was NO city money. Canal Side is NO city money. Thesevare hard working people willing to risk their own money to make LF better AND try to make a living.
Stop hating people because they have been more successful than you.
Ishmael

United States

#19 Dec 19, 2009
LF rock wrote:
Yeah, leave places like Burrows and Feldmeier out of this. If those two places ever left LF would be a ghost town. Now is when Big M should be busy cleaning up and getting better so they can get aloyal customer base and stay viable when Price Chopper arrives. If i could get a consistent selection at a clean store, i would stay shopping the Big M
And to the other poster: what city money went into Canal Place? The money it cost to tear down Allegro when Frank Mendl abandoned it? The money that went into the Crews building after Crews let it get so bad the roof was going to fall in was mostly recovered when it was sold to LOCAL investors. Then those LOCAL investors sold it to dave and richard. Antique center was NO city money. Canal Side is NO city money. Thesevare hard working people willing to risk their own money to make LF better AND try to make a living.
Stop hating people because they have been more successful than you.
Good post.
We do need a little market downtown -like Kellys. Shoppers square needs to be torn down. Main St can not survive without a park and a fountain. Shoppers square is a filthy eyesore. Even the bums would rather live under the bridge than hang out there. Over the last 30 years no store has been able to survive there. It has nothing to do with selection. A Walmart and Hannafords would fail there as well. Stores can not make it there. Look at the history. How many stores have failed there? Start with Loblaws and the Donut shop. 20? 30? There is no reason at all to believe any store will ever make it there. CVS will surely be the next to leave. I heard they are already in talks with Sphere to relocate at the quarry.
Shoppers square was originally concieved as a series of storefronts to be at street-level, with lots of shops and windows ON MAIN STREET, not, in the middle of a lumpy slanted parking lot.
Political shinnigans at the Legislature produced what you see there today.
Hopefully it gets razed. The cheapest way to have it razed (after the city takes it for back taxes) is to have Sphere do it as a concession while they are in the area.
Main St Needs some space.
Ishmael

United States

#20 Dec 19, 2009
Shoppers Square Saturday, 19 December 2009

http://images.google.com/imgres...
Yossarian

Syracuse, NY

#21 Dec 19, 2009
Ishmael wrote:
<quoted text>
It has nothing to do with a naval base ...
It's a Catch-22. The navy base and shipyards give jobs, jobs, jobs. Without jobs, you don't have people to inhabit your streets, like you say.

Right now LF is pretty much all old people. We don't need more grocery stores, we need nursing homes and funeral parlors. We need to change that situation. Either new industries, or stuff that attracts people based on lifestyle.
Ishmael wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm all for a Price Chopper, and I'm all for a Price Chopper putting Shoppers Square out of its misery. As soon that building comes down we can put in a nice park. That's what was supposed to happen the first time that lot was vacant. I will be suggesting to my councilperson that this happen as part of the Sphere agreement.
Agreed. But again it's a Catch-22. Most of us in LF want the new Price Chopper, but we don't want Shoppers Square turning into a boarded-up eye-sore in downtown attracting arsonists and lowering our property values.

City Hall is giving up waaaaay too much to get this shopping plaza. The Evening Times article said we're going to give up city taxes to help the builder pay his note down. That's just stupid. We should make the builder pay his taxes like the rest of us AND demolish Shoppers Square and make it into a nice park, since this new shopping plaza is going to put Big M out of business.

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