PATRIC McCARTHY: THE REAL EVIDENCE
nakasuejen

Buzzards Bay, MA

#1261 Apr 24, 2013
"What is to be gained by a change in the cause of death"

the truth will be gained.

Patric's cause of death is hypothermia. there is a clause on the reports "with the facts currently known". since those reports were finalized, many more "facts" have come to light.

his cause of death: that may not change.

It is really the manner of death they want changed.

Patric did not run off to take a shortcut home. Neither the mother or father believe that. If you still believe that story, you haven't been paying attention on here or to the media. If the truth had been told at the beginning, perhaps the outcome would not have changed. We will never know. Pat is gone and nothing will ever bring him back. But he deserves to have the whole truth known, and so does his mother. She deserves to know how exactly her son died and why.

while the FBI has stated publicly certain things, internal emails released to the mother under the Freedom of Information Act show a vastly different opinion held by various law enforcement officers/ agents. But they were over ruled by superiors. Not every law enforcement officer involved in this case believes that Patric died by accident or ran off and got lost. Some actually believe the mother.

there are three different files out there on this case. NH's , the FBI's and the mothers. Hers is a combination of both NH's and the FBI's. When you put both those files together and examine them, certain things have come to light. NH did not fully share with the FBI. FBI did not share fully with NH. Why? who knows?

Why this forum? Why not? there are a few people on here who could actually help.
Historian

Osterville, MA

#1262 Apr 25, 2013
Let me clear up somethings. Attorneys were hired paid both in Ma. and NH. Properly means exactly what the word indicates. People involved will have to be deposed and investigated and what they have said to authorities over the years and have changed those stories many time as to "where, when and How" for the record, all people. Statements and alibis and time lines made by suspects have to be proven as to "True or False" but they have to be proven. Never done. The report that I have seen from the Attorney's to accomplish this could be a year or more, that does not come cheap when hiring the best, the 100K was to begin it was not the final estimate. The FBI & New Hampshire have not closed this case. P.S. Nakasuejen thanks for all you have done and continue to do. Still waiting on Boston.
nakasuejen

Buzzards Bay, MA

#1263 Apr 25, 2013
Historian: your welcome :)
Concerned citizen

Franklin, NC

#1264 May 5, 2013
BillNH wrote:
Forgive me if this comes off as sounding too harsh, it is not my intention.
Suppose it is all true, that Gabe and Noah had an altercation with Patric and as a result Patric died. What is to be gained by a change in the cause of death? Is a jury going to find a 12 year old boy guilty of murder, 10 years after the fact? Is a 12 year old's mind mature enough to be capable of premeditation? Would any possible punishment last beyond the age of majority for a crime committed at 12? Who wins in this scenario? What is the prize? Bragging rights at the family reunion? I see nothing but more heartache for this entire family. If this was an adult killer being sought I can understand the effort but these are little boys that may have committed this crime and will be treated as little boys even if tried when they are 30. None of it will bring Patric back and this whole exercise does nothing more than keep this boys mother from moving on. This already horribly dysfunctional family will never heal.
Again I am sorry for the harshness of this post but I have been reading the back and forth on here for quite some time without comment and I see no good coming of this and had to speak up. I have had my say and I will wander back into silence.
Deanne, you have my deepest condolences and I hope you find peace in your life soon.
. Bill , or whomever you are , you need to get a life . You have no clue what you would do until you have lost a child yourself under questionable circumstances. His father is a big time Loser , and would bring anyone around him , Patric was bullied along time before his death by his stepbrother. I have no clue how his Patric's father sleeps at night , if he would put his kids before his booze , drugs and womanizing this may not have never happen .

Since: Mar 13

Woodsville, NH

#1265 May 6, 2013
Concerned citizen wrote:
<quoted text>. Bill , or whomever you are , you need to get a life . You have no clue what you would do until you have lost a child yourself under questionable circumstances. His father is a big time Loser , and would bring anyone around him , Patric was bullied along time before his death by his stepbrother. I have no clue how his Patric's father sleeps at night , if he would put his kids before his booze , drugs and womanizing this may not have never happen .
I posted a rational statement from the outside looking in. I stand by what I said, I am not sure why that entitles you to a personal attack on me. You have no idea what I have been through in my life but anyone can see what this is doing to the poor boys mother. You obviously have some issues with the Father, take it up with him. If this whole process is to just stick it to him because he is a loser, then you all should be ashamed of yourselves.
Historian

Osterville, MA

#1266 May 6, 2013
The main concern was and is to bring the Stepbrother into court and charge him with Patric's death. The rest will take care of it's self. Stepbrother admitted to the FBI 2008, that on 13 October 2003, he did in fact knock Patric down, sit on his back with his face in the ground. After 5 years of lying to NHSP, NH AG's Office and FBI investigators that their was no fight or altercation, he now admits that their was one. I guess are justice system as it pertains to lying to Federal agents in a death investigation is OK when it came to PAtric. The 3 students that the FBI arrested are being charged for lying to FBI, and Obstruction. What changed. Lying is lying to cover your crime.
FrmLE

Vero Beach, FL

#1267 May 11, 2013
Historian wrote:
The main concern was and is to bring the Stepbrother into court and charge him with Patric's death. The rest will take care of it's self. Stepbrother admitted to the FBI 2008, that on 13 October 2003, he did in fact knock Patric down, sit on his back with his face in the ground. After 5 years of lying to NHSP, NH AG's Office and FBI investigators that their was no fight or altercation, he now admits that their was one. I guess are justice system as it pertains to lying to Federal agents in a death investigation is OK when it came to PAtric. The 3 students that the FBI arrested are being charged for lying to FBI, and Obstruction. What changed. Lying is lying to cover your crime.
So, can you clarify?

Do you contend that the stepbrother sat on Patric and that was what caused him to run away into the woods frightened, getting lost and ultimately causing his death?

or

Do you contend that the stepbrother sat on Patric, KILLING HIM and according to your earlier theory, he hid his body under leaves and then he enlisted the help of other people and they moved his body several times over several days and ultimately they carried him to the spot where he was found?

One theory I believe, the other is pretty ridiculous.

Which of these is your position?
Historian

Osterville, MA

#1268 May 13, 2013
According to the youngest stepbrother's comment made early on and dismissed by authorities: Patric said something that pissed my brother off, he knocked him down, sat on his back until he stopped breathing.

As to where they found Patric. I have suggested that they start where they actually found him, and then make their way down or over to the old Osseo trail, or maybe use the back side. This has never been done.

Also all the research has been done as to the temps over the years, to be 95 percent sure that a group of entomology students guided by their professor place a dead pig at the site on 13 October 20XX, this would confirm or deny if activity takes place, this also has never been done due to the cost. The study of the temps, over the past 9 years shows that on average the temps the week of 13 Oct 03 - thru the same time period over the past nine years at the crime scene only very by 5 degrees. Why didn't the FBI with all their resources and expertise do this? I believe that had they, it would have shown that their would be plenty of activity on the Pig, thus proving that Patric was not their for 4 1/2 days.

Their is more to the above as to what else transpired but this is not the time or place for it.
As stated by me their has been so much come forward in the past 2 years, and still hundreds of documents being withheld. Gabe's Polygraph, Noah's audio interview, pre-test interview questions given to Stepmother and Stepbrother all very important but not released.

Since: Nov 08

Location hidden

#1269 May 13, 2013
Historian wrote:
As to where they found Patric. I have suggested that they start where they actually found him, and then make their way down or over to the old Osseo trail, or maybe use the back side. This has never been done.
What is the "back side"? The north or the east? I suggest you do it, give it a try. You keep talking about these absurd routes, why not try them? My first thought is because you are clueless. You have no idea of the terrain or the distances or difficulty involved.

Here is an idea. Go over to one of the hiking websites and lay out your route on a map for people who actually hike, to view. See what they say. Tell them what you are trying to do and why. So the laughing will be muted. But, I warn you. Some of the people over there were in the searches for Patric. They will find your suggestions likely offensive because they know what happened to him. There is little doubt in the searchers minds.

Or better yet, GET OUT THERE AND TRY HIKING SOME OF THESE TRAILS. THESE "ROUTES FROM THE NORTH", THEN WHEN YOU ARE EXHAUSTED TRY HIKING CROSS COUNTRY, OFF TRAIL. You have no idea what you are talking about. But clueless appears to the the state you enjoy most.
Historian wrote:
Also all the research has been done as to the temps over the years, to be 95 percent sure that a group of entomology students guided by their professor place a dead pig at the site on 13 October 20XX, this would confirm or deny if activity takes place, this also has never been done due to the cost. The study of the temps, over the past 9 years shows that on average the temps the week of 13 Oct 03 - thru the same time period over the past nine years at the crime scene only very by 5 degrees. Why didn't the FBI with all their resources and expertise do this? I believe that had they, it would have shown that their would be plenty of activity on the Pig, thus proving that Patric was not their for 4 1/2 days.
And I am fairly certain you are wrong. And of the two of us, I trust myself much, much, more. I have never heard of the body farm or anyone else placing pigs at that elevation, and in particular in that area and doing experiments like that. I am fairly certain what they would find at those temperatures, winds and rain conditions. I also don't know why the FBI would pursue such a study when the results in this case are clear from the evidence. BUT! I don't know why you and your little group couldn't do a study under similar conditions getting the necessary permits and people with the expertise to do this. I would think your entomologist would be on board with this. He likely would be breaking new ground. Of course one study usually isn't considered proof of anything, but it would be a start.

Bill
Concerned citizen

United States

#1270 May 13, 2013
So many mistakes where made in this case , along with other cases in this country. When mistakes are made there is no way on gods greens earth the people involved in this case will ever admit it . If this young boy's family was very weathly or was a politician the case would have been re-opened , what a shame. The one thing I do know is god seen it all , if there was foul play , the person that did it will live with it the rest of their lives , no matter what age the person was that committed the crime. One day the truth will be revealed if someone took the life of this little boy , God will do it in his time , and the way he sees fit . Our justice system needs to be revamped, also some people in the justice system needs to learn to do their job much better . If this was the presidents kid or politicians kid the case would have been reopened along time along , what a shame . Remember god says we are all created equal , but in today's society it is all about your " ranking " and what people have as far as assets .
Historian

Osterville, MA

#1271 May 14, 2013
WTH-the-original wrote:
<quoted text>
What is the "back side"? The north or the east? I suggest you do it, give it a try. You keep talking about these absurd routes, why not try them? My first thought is because you are clueless. You have no idea of the terrain or the distances or difficulty involved.
Here is an idea. Go over to one of the hiking websites and lay out your route on a map for people who actually hike, to view. See what they say. Tell them what you are trying to do and why. So the laughing will be muted. But, I warn you. Some of the people over there were in the searches for Patric. They will find your suggestions likely offensive because they know what happened to him. There is little doubt in the searchers minds.
Or better yet, GET OUT THERE AND TRY HIKING SOME OF THESE TRAILS. THESE "ROUTES FROM THE NORTH", THEN WHEN YOU ARE EXHAUSTED TRY HIKING CROSS COUNTRY, OFF TRAIL. You have no idea what you are talking about. But clueless appears to the the state you enjoy most.
<quoted text>
And I am fairly certain you are wrong. And of the two of us, I trust myself much, much, more. I have never heard of the body farm or anyone else placing pigs at that elevation, and in particular in that area and doing experiments like that. I am fairly certain what they would find at those temperatures, winds and rain conditions. I also don't know why the FBI would pursue such a study when the results in this case are clear from the evidence. BUT! I don't know why you and your little group couldn't do a study under similar conditions getting the necessary permits and people with the expertise to do this. I would think your entomologist would be on board with this. He likely would be breaking new ground. Of course one study usually isn't considered proof of anything, but it would be a start.
Bill
Been there done that. Both groups were able to reached the sight in 2 hours or less. No one was hurt. All 32 returned to the Water Tank carrying the stretcher in 1 hour 30 minutes. Now how tough is that? Take the Osseo Trail Whaleback, Fish & Game did the first NIGHT according to their report. They went to the summit (which is well over 3000 ft.) and returned, no one hurt. As for your knowledge of entomology, it's lacking like everything else you claim to have done. It's done all the time.

Since: Nov 08

Location hidden

#1272 May 14, 2013
Historian wrote:
<quoted text>Been there done that.
You keep using that over-worn dated phrase with no indication that you have actually been there and done that. And then you talk about the "groups" that did. Were you anywhere near the "groups" when they did this? Please tell us. And were they carrying 60 pounds at the time? You keep using this as some type of benchmark without knowing anything about the effort required to make the trip. And if you think that is "easy", try coming in from the north or the "back side" as you absurdly put it.

So tell us. Have you made the hike to the site in less than 2 hours? Don't bother answering. You write like someone who has read but has never done this. There is no question in my mind. You repeatedly parrot the accomplishments of others, in the times you list. Not that I did that.
Historian wrote:
<quoted text>As for your knowledge of entomology, it's lacking like everything else you claim to have done. It's done all the time.
I have some knowledge of the woods and getting bite and seeing insects at all elevations in the Whites. WHAT is done all the time? Another statement that makes no sense.

Bill
Historian

Osterville, MA

#1273 May 15, 2013
WTH-the-original wrote:
<quoted text>
You keep using that over-worn dated phrase with no indication that you have actually been there and done that. And then you talk about the "groups" that did. Were you anywhere near the "groups" when they did this? Please tell us. And were they carrying 60 pounds at the time? You keep using this as some type of benchmark without knowing anything about the effort required to make the trip. And if you think that is "easy", try coming in from the north or the "back side" as you absurdly put it.
So tell us. Have you made the hike to the site in less than 2 hours? Don't bother answering. You write like someone who has read but has never done this. There is no question in my mind. You repeatedly parrot the accomplishments of others, in the times you list. Not that I did that.
<quoted text>
I have some knowledge of the woods and getting bite and seeing insects at all elevations in the Whites. WHAT is done all the time? Another statement that makes no sense.
Bill
Been there done that. What part of "Been There done that" don't you understand. As for activity on someone that is deceased, again all it takes is a Temp of 50 degrees or above and Blow flies will immediately arrive. Ask Dr. Andrew's I did.
Historian

Osterville, MA

#1274 May 16, 2013
WTH-the-original wrote:
<quoted text>
You keep using that over-worn dated phrase with no indication that you have actually been there and done that. And then you talk about the "groups" that did. Were you anywhere near the "groups" when they did this? Please tell us. And were they carrying 60 pounds at the time? You keep using this as some type of benchmark without knowing anything about the effort required to make the trip. And if you think that is "easy", try coming in from the north or the "back side" as you absurdly put it.
So tell us. Have you made the hike to the site in less than 2 hours? Don't bother answering. You write like someone who has read but has never done this. There is no question in my mind. You repeatedly parrot the accomplishments of others, in the times you list. Not that I did that.
<quoted text>
I have some knowledge of the woods and getting bite and seeing insects at all elevations in the Whites. WHAT is done all the time? Another statement that makes no sense.
Bill
Bill, I believe that you are not stupid, I just think you have bad luck when thinking.
nakasuejen

Buzzards Bay, MA

#1275 May 16, 2013
@FMLE your question... which scenerio? that is the unanswered question in this case. I have my opinion, which is different than historians.

@ Bill.. if anything dies in the woods, what happens next if the remains are not found in a timely manner? I am not just talking about people, but animals in general? Decomposition begins. There is a time frame to decompostion. Certain things happen depending on the conditions. According to the ME Patric died on Monday and was found on Friday. The conditions of that week were known.(temp., weather, soil type, etc). That is where the entomologist (who is a crime scene entomologist) came into this case.

as for the trails traveled by historian.. he has done them. if you all think.. you will figure out who historian is. and then you may just stop calling him names. But I can't reveal him here. that's not my place.

we have been over and over all of this. Patric did not run off of his own accord, get lost and succumb to the elements. Something happened to him. Its been so long.. 10 years! Please don't every forget, someone died that day. a child. I think that time has dulled that fact for some people on this forum.
Deanne Murray

Wareham, MA

#1276 Jul 13, 2013
WOW !!! I cannot beleive that 3 months from today will be 10yrs since the untimely death of my son Patric. I can't beleive he would of been 20yrs old. Seriously, to this day, I still have an unsettled feeling in my stomach that something bad happened up there in NH. I respect everyones opinion on this Forum but a Mother knows when something isnt right. THIS IS NOT RIGHT !!!! I hope the new Governor of NH will take a closer look at Patric's case and not throw it in the fire like NH has done for the past ten years. I am a Mother without her only child. The truth is all I am asking for. Bits and pieces of this puzzle are coming together. Maybe not on this Forum but in alot of peoples hand now. Love you Patric.
Required Reading

Ithaca, NY

#1277 Aug 23, 2013


New Hampshire better wake up or roll over.
Deanne Murray

Wareham, MA

#1278 Aug 30, 2013
Seriously, PLease stop posting you tube videos on this site-- Thanks
Required Reading

Ithaca, NY

#1279 Aug 30, 2013
With all due respect, my youtube does not stop anyone else or you from speaking. I've said it before; this is my freedom of speech. I empathize with your loss, but you need to understand that Patric's murder was one of many. Serry, Liko, Maura, Brianna. the list goes on and on. Their freedom of speech was curtailed, and I'll be damned if mine will end without struggle. Andy's death should give everyone pause. No gov't gives a damn about what happened to your son. I DO. if it is not vindicated, another will be victimized like clockwork. If you know what your up against, you'll understand.

but it can stop. I've found your son's murderer. There is 100k reward available, and I'd like to claim it, If resolution is what you seek. Justice is a matter of the law, I will yield the intelligence you need.

the you tube is just a matter of speaking, your sons murderer is here at this forum. His presence is what I'm fighting. NH's inability to do justice endangers the public of every other state. I intend to raise the bar until justice is performed under the law.
Required Reading

Ithaca, NY

#1280 Aug 30, 2013
I use a youtube clip to keep your son's memory in the present consciousness. Be honest, we are talking about a 10 year old murdered 10 years ago. If you know the murderer, press charges. if not, cut me some slack because I found your bogey, and this coward is worth 100k. He's stalking the public here every day. You wouldn't be here if you didn't need my help.

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