Ramsey County's first case of elder abuse ends with plea

A St. Paul man pleaded guilty Friday to theft by swindle - the first prosecution by the Ramsey County attorney's elder abuse unit.

[Labratt]

I see more of this stuff coming with the hard times. She obviously wasn't wealthy, and her money was destined for the nursing home anyway. This guy obviously couldn't handle the responsibility of managing a lump of money that looked large to him, but is really small when compared to the amount of money that has to go to the nursing home. The system is broken somehow. Maybe Power of Attorney should be tied to some sort of management control. I know that it would require another layer of government on an already overburdened populace, but when times are hard, I don't think that the average "Joe" is capable of avoiding temptation.

[Get a clue]

Give me a break Labratt? The average Joe and average Jane can avoid the temptation to steal from their mother. Yes, the government has enough to do without protecting parents from their loser greedy children. It's simple. It was not his money. He stole it. He gave it to his son and nephew. Thief. And it is worse when you steal from your aging mother. He deserves jail. Good job Ramsey County for going after these cases.

[Cindy Stainker]

Not a whole lot of justice if it will only be 30 days. Ramsey Co has to do much better than this. I'm glad though that elder abuse is being investigated and people will be charged, hopefully the penalties will be much stiffer in the future.

[Labratt]

Get a clue wrote:

Give me a break Labratt? The average Joe and average Jane can avoid the temptation to steal from their mother. Yes, the government has enough to do without protecting parents from their loser greedy children. It's simple. It was not his money. He stole it. He gave it to his son and nephew. Thief. And it is worse when you steal from your aging mother. He deserves jail. Good job Ramsey County for going after these cases.

Obviously you have never been in the position to send monthly checks to a nursing home. When you are immersed in the monthly spend down process it becomes a "us against the system" relationship. None of the money goes to the mother, it ALL goes to the nursing home. Mom's hard earned money is flushed away in a fraction of the time it took her to amass it. Often the parents sanction the action, because they grow to resent the whole spend down process. I admit this guy never even submitted the first check, and deserves to "swing" for his crime. I am sorry if you got the impression that I was suggesting that he be let off.

The spend down is a three year, monthly grind for the average POA, and when you write a check every month, and sell off assets that Mom wanted to leave to loved ones, in order to bouy up the checking account, it gets hard. I wrote over $250,000 in monthly checks and when the money was gone, Mom went on Medicaid. Some financial arrangements were made, paperwork was filled out, but basically things remained the same. The monthly checks are just smaller because the money was gone. To a family, as the spend down draws to an end, it seems like maybe some of that money could have been spared.

My suggestion is to get a good elder lawyer involved early enough in the nursing home stay to see if the parent can leave some sort on inheritance, because if you short circuit that process you will be caught.

[Get a clue]

Labratt wrote:

<quoted text>
Obviously you have never been in the position to send monthly checks to a nursing home. When you are immersed in the monthly spend down process it becomes a "us against the system" relationship. None of the money goes to the mother, it ALL goes to the nursing home. Mom's hard earned money is flushed away in a fraction of the time it took her to amass it. Often the parents sanction the action, because they grow to resent the whole spend down process. I admit this guy never even submitted the first check, and deserves to "swing" for his crime. I am sorry if you got the impression that I was suggesting that he be let off.
The spend down is a three year, monthly grind for the average POA, and when you write a check every month, and sell off assets that Mom wanted to leave to loved ones, in order to bouy up the checking account, it gets hard. I wrote over $250,000 in monthly checks and when the money was gone, Mom went on Medicaid. Some financial arrangements were made, paperwork was filled out, but basically things remained the same. The monthly checks are just smaller because the money was gone. To a family, as the spend down draws to an end, it seems like maybe some of that money could have been spared.
My suggestion is to get a good elder lawyer involved early enough in the nursing home stay to see if the parent can leave some sort on inheritance, because if you short circuit that process you will be caught.

I totally disagree. Why shouldn't mom's money be used for her care? Why should others pay for her care so that her children can have her money? Sorry. Lost me there. If it is her money, and she needs care, she has to pay for it. It may be expensive, but someone has to pay for it. And then we are back to why it should be someone elses burden? Don't misunderstand me. It is horrible to see someone's life savings dwindle to nothing. But care costs money.

[Labratt]

Get a clue wrote:

<quoted text>
I totally disagree. Why shouldn't mom's money be used for her care? Why should others pay for her care so that her children can have her money? Sorry. Lost me there. If it is her money, and she needs care, she has to pay for it. It may be expensive, but someone has to pay for it. And then we are back to why it should be someone elses burden? Don't misunderstand me. It is horrible to see someone's life savings dwindle to nothing. But care costs money.

I'll grant you that point, and thanks for your opinion. My point was that it is difficult for a son or daughter to manage during these hard financial times, and Mom or Dads nest egg could overwhelm their ability to resist temptation. It is real money, and could look like a solution to financial problems.

[Get a clue]

Yes, I hear you. And there is the sky high prices for what seems like minimal care.

[Pim]

Labratt wrote:

<quoted text>
Obviously you have never been in the position to send monthly checks to a nursing home. When you are immersed in the monthly spend down process it becomes a "us against the system" relationship. None of the money goes to the mother, it ALL goes to the nursing home. Mom's hard earned money is flushed away in a fraction of the time it took her to amass it. Often the parents sanction the action, because they grow to resent the whole spend down process. I admit this guy never even submitted the first check, and deserves to "swing" for his crime. I am sorry if you got the impression that I was suggesting that he be let off.
The spend down is a three year, monthly grind for the average POA, and when you write a check every month, and sell off assets that Mom wanted to leave to loved ones, in order to bouy up the checking account, it gets hard. I wrote over $250,000 in monthly checks and when the money was gone, Mom went on Medicaid. Some financial arrangements were made, paperwork was filled out, but basically things remained the same. The monthly checks are just smaller because the money was gone. To a family, as the spend down draws to an end, it seems like maybe some of that money could have been spared.
My suggestion is to get a good elder lawyer involved early enough in the nursing home stay to see if the parent can leave some sort on inheritance, because if you short circuit that process you will be caught.

If your loved one needs care from a nursing home, he/she must pay for it. Why wouldn't the person requiring care be required to pay for it before the government program (Medical Assistance)does? Care is not free, and how ethical is it to even legally try to shelter money so that taxpayers' bear the burden of care costs so an adult kid can get an inheritance?

[Pim]

Now, the quality of the care purchased by individuals and Medical Assistance is a whole different issue...

[I worry]

Pim wrote:

Now, the quality of the care purchased by individuals and Medical Assistance is a whole different issue...

elaborate please.

I see a few problems here.. tons.. just about the cost of nursing care.

Why is it that if you have money the nursing home costs 5,000 a month. If you don't have money and they charge the state, they charge the state 2500.

how is that fair?

Same with dental and medical. If you have insurance and need a root canal, it cost your insurance 800 bux. if you don't have insurance they charge you 1200.

medicine in all it's forms in the USA is corrupt.

[Labratt]

Pim wrote:

<quoted text>
If your loved one needs care from a nursing home, he/she must pay for it. Why wouldn't the person requiring care be required to pay for it before the government program (Medical Assistance)does? Care is not free, and how ethical is it to even legally try to shelter money so that taxpayers' bear the burden of care costs so an adult kid can get an inheritance?

Some day you will think differently. One particulary painful thing to watch is when a spouse is forced to live a life of poverty because their loved one has to enter a nursing home. This is America, but the aged are deprived of their rights the moment they begin to show signs of infimity. They deserve better.