In wake of Conn. shooting, chief want...

In wake of Conn. shooting, chief wants to place armed officer inside elementary school

There are 68 comments on the WPXI story from Jan 16, 2013, titled In wake of Conn. shooting, chief wants to place armed officer inside elementary school. In it, WPXI reports that:

Latrobe's police chief is promoting a plan to place one of his officers in Latrobe Elementary School, a reaction to the shootings of 20 students and six staff in a Connecticut elementary school in December.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at WPXI.

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Bumar wants LES Officer

Carlisle, PA

#1 Jan 17, 2013
Latrobe Chief of Police Jim Bumar wants a Police Officer at LES.
Good or bad idea?

Bad idea: Why?

We don't need a Police State and an armed Officer in a small rural school, the same way that Newtown, CN didn't need an armed Officer.
Sometimes people, crazy happens.

Why not just have a security company install cameras to monitor every inch of the building, at once, like, I dunno...

A modern office building!

Then, 24-hours a day, the security company can monitor the cameras in all the halls, pointed at all points of entry, and be able to film, report, call for help, and lock down the school FAR MORE QUICKLY and EFFICIENTLY in REAL TIME than a single Police Officer sitting around in a basement office.

I'd like to see new Police Officer assigned to all the landlords who rent to drug dealers and to the drug dealers in Latrobe, themselves, most of whom are renters.

If ya wanna clear out the town of trouble, assign a new Officer to sit outside of certain addresses all the time, to visit landlords, to walk through drug invested properties on a daily basis (with landlord's invitation).

Schools don't need Police Officers, kids don't need a gun staring them down when they go to school, but the people who are ruining Latrobe and creating the 50 over-doses a year in the Latrobe area, well, they need the new Officer.

Since: Jan 11

.

#2 Jan 17, 2013
It's just not financially feasible. Greater Latrobe School District has three elementary schools, plus the middle and senior high schools with their dozen or so entrances. If the city of Latrobe feels that it can afford to assign an officer to the one school in town, then I would suggest that the police force has one too many officers.

If the school district is going to have armed security guards at every school, then they're going to have to be of the rent-a-cop variety. At which point I'd be worried about having a bunch of those law-enforcement-wannabes in schools with loaded weapons.

I think that high(er) quality video systems will eventually be installed to monitor every square inch of every building in the school district, but frankly, it will do little to prevent these events.
Sense

Buffalo, NY

#3 Jan 18, 2013
Hire retired state police. They're already properly trained. Also, they're already collecting pensions and wouldn't be nearly as costly. As far as finances, you mean to tell me they can't let go the assistant to the assistant to the assistant to the assistant Vice Principal or the to the assistant to the assistant to the assistant Vice Principal?
Redneck

Latrobe, PA

#4 Jan 18, 2013
Sense wrote:
Hire retired state police. They're already properly trained. Also, they're already collecting pensions and wouldn't be nearly as costly. As far as finances, you mean to tell me they can't let go the assistant to the assistant to the assistant to the assistant Vice Principal or the to the assistant to the assistant to the assistant Vice Principal?
Maybe the ASS V Ps could be armed and stationed at the doors. They can sit there and do nothing much like they're doing now.
The Unseemly Underbelly

Carlisle, PA

#5 Jan 18, 2013
Redneck wrote:
Maybe the ASS V Ps could be armed and stationed at the doors. They can sit there and do nothing much like they're doing now.
Latrobe is a small, rural town. I marvel at the waste of money and resources.

There are kids in Latrobe, whose parents can drive them to programs or pick them up from sports (if the kids had an interest)-- yet no one cares about these kids.

It's like Latrobe lives in a dream world where no one wants to admit to its needs and unseemly underbelly.
lat

Punxsutawney, PA

#6 Jan 18, 2013
First quesiton should be is who will pay for this. Certainly not the school district since the chief only wants LES taken care of. Which means he thinks the city has money to burn for this.

I'm all for security measures being taken in the school. As far as cameras, locked doors and buzzers go, didn't they have that at Conncecticut? Our schools are already locked from the outside and you must ring a buzzer and be let in. Not really sure what the answer is for this all i know is its a sad time that we even have to consider security in schools,
Thinking like a madman

Carlisle, PA

#7 Jan 18, 2013
lat wrote:
First quesiton should be is who will pay for this. Certainly not the school district since the chief only wants LES taken care of. Which means he thinks the city has money to burn for this.
I'm all for security measures being taken in the school. As far as cameras, locked doors and buzzers go, didn't they have that at Conncecticut? Our schools are already locked from the outside and you must ring a buzzer and be let in. Not really sure what the answer is for this all i know is its a sad time that we even have to consider security in schools,
Let's think like a Madman...

LES is a big square with classrooms facing all four sides, and an offshoot to an addition at one of the corners.

In the center of the square are the auditorium and cafeteria and maybe windows on the 3rd floor open to a courtyard, I'm too old to remember.

The front of the school at ground level meets the 2nd floor.

The back of the school at the ground level meets the 1st floor.

Hence, a Madman will break the glass and make entry into a locked down LES at either the front 2nd floor or the rear 1st floor.

Where will the $70,000/year officer sit? on the first floor in the rear or the 2nd floor in the front?

Maybe the officer will walk and walk and walk all day long with his gun showing to the children to make sure they know, "The world is not a safe place."

So, the Officer is on the lower level in the rear when the Madman breaks a grond floor window in the front of the building, crawls into the gradde school room and opens fire, killing 20 students, 1 teacher, and then walks into the hallway, heads to the Principal's Offices and shoots 5 more adults.

By now, the $70,000 / year officer has arrived upstairs, and meets the carnage, sees the suicide, and radios for assistance.

-----Doesn't sound like a sensible solution to me, does it sound that way to you?

Oh, I forgot to say that the rapid fire magazine and its rifle were purchased in Westmoreland County at any one of the gun sales stores...the shooter practiced at local shooting ranges...and even bought bullets at a Pittsburgh convention center gun show.
Redneck

Latrobe, PA

#8 Jan 18, 2013
Let’s take a look at the other madmen…the victim’s families/loved ones, et al.

In the cases where the shooter commits suicide, there is no one to punish, no one to exact some sense of justice or retribution. One is left with a deep loss, a burning rage, and no one to take it out on…except the gun. Someone, something has to pay. Some sense of purpose must be made from so great a loss. Something more has to say…my loved one was killed and there’s nothing to show for it but my grief. Something more has to come of this…but what, from whom, from where. The only guilty party left is the weapon, the gun, the high-capacity magazine…something/anything that was a partly responsible for my grief has to pay.

And so comes the inevitable knee-jerk reaction that equates to kicking the stool that you stubbed your toe on. Something has to pay for my pain and since it wasn’t a person who did it, and I didn’t do it…the stool/gun has to pay.

And like sharks swimming in bloody water, the politicians come to feed from the carnage as do the special interest groups that can smell an opportunity from great distances. Like a fox coming to the sound of an injured rabbit, they arrive not to help…but to prey on the already victimized.

The entire furor over assault weapons and need for background checks will not prevent the next suicidal madman from carrying out the same type of deed. Whether it is one large magazine or several smaller ones that he practices changing out…the new restrictions will not abate the carnage of a madman bent on killing as many as possible until he ends his own life. Is the logical endpoint for the gun-control advocates to allow only muzzle-loaded rifles, if any firearms at all?

This isn’t a gun problem. Restricting gun owners isn’t going to solve a mistakenly identified problem. And unfortunately, even the mental illness aspect is untenable if it is used to try to predict who will do what, when. This entire mass-murder/suicide phenomenon is a product of our society today. There are multiple causes and even more interacting reasons/events for what sets off such a person. The diagnosing and treatment are more obscure than creation itself…but the overwhelming and worrisome reaction is that somebody has to do something even though it might be wrong. Could that something actually become counterproductive because it takes attention away from the real cause and might even enhance the likelihood of it happening again and taking it to a greater level?
Sense

Delmont, PA

#9 Jan 18, 2013
Hey Thinking, what you're failing to realize is that if you get retired state police, it won't cost $70,000 a year. If they make over a certain amount, they're pension gets cut. And most important of all? Why bother with a school that even has a guard and chance not accomplishing what you set out to do if you can go somewhere else that doesn't have one of your "$70,000 a year officers". You apparently don't have kids. Hopefully your not an anyone's school board either.
Thinking like a madman

Carlisle, PA

#10 Jan 18, 2013
Sense wrote:
Hey Thinking, what you're failing to realize is that if you get retired state police, it won't cost $70,000 a year. If they make over a certain amount, they're pension gets cut. And most important of all? Why bother with a school that even has a guard and chance not accomplishing what you set out to do if you can go somewhere else that doesn't have one of your "$70,000 a year officers". You apparently don't have kids. Hopefully your not an anyone's school board either.
Write out a plan of defense against an attacker at LES.

Counter what I wrote, with your own likely scenario, because of course, you know the school so well.

I went to school there once, years ago. And, that is a large building. LES doesn't need Police at every entrance, because as in CN, the Madman broke glass to enter.

So one has to devise a defense system against that type of entry.

Do you want a retired old goat on every floor?

And a retired old goat in the gymnasium wing?

That's 4 old goats for the price of 2 Officers at $70,000/year each; so now we're at double the wage of Chief Bumar's original idea.

OK, so are you saying that the old goat, retired State Officers will work for less than $35,000/year?

Really?

C'mon, 40-hours a week in playland for less than $35,000/year? I doubt. They can have mind-numbing encounters at home with their wives and grandchildren for far less hassle.
Sense

Delmont, PA

#11 Jan 18, 2013
Dude, you sound bitter. You still don't get it. No, I haven't been to LES but I went to Hempfield and Central. I've been in a lot of schools. They're all different. You act as though each individual school can come up with its own perfect scenario, train for it, and protect against exactly that. It doesn't work that way. Sounds like you've been stuck on the same video game board for a while. Each and every situation that has happened and will happen as long as the human race is around will be different. Putting a trained "your choice of words" in schools is just something called "deterrent". I bet you don't own a gun.
window washer

Latrobe, PA

#12 Jan 18, 2013
Thinking like a madman wrote:
<quoted text>
Let's think like a Madman...
LES is a big square with classrooms facing all four sides, and an offshoot to an addition at one of the corners.
In the center of the square are the auditorium and cafeteria and maybe windows on the 3rd floor open to a courtyard, I'm too old to remember.
The front of the school at ground level meets the 2nd floor.
The back of the school at the ground level meets the 1st floor.
Hence, a Madman will break the glass and make entry into a locked down LES at either the front 2nd floor or the rear 1st floor.
Where will the $70,000/year officer sit? on the first floor in the rear or the 2nd floor in the front?
Maybe the officer will walk and walk and walk all day long with his gun showing to the children to make sure they know, "The world is not a safe place."
So, the Officer is on the lower level in the rear when the Madman breaks a grond floor window in the front of the building, crawls into the gradde school room and opens fire, killing 20 students, 1 teacher, and then walks into the hallway, heads to the Principal's Offices and shoots 5 more adults.
By now, the $70,000 / year officer has arrived upstairs, and meets the carnage, sees the suicide, and radios for assistance.
-----Doesn't sound like a sensible solution to me, does it sound that way to you?
Oh, I forgot to say that the rapid fire magazine and its rifle were purchased in Westmoreland County at any one of the gun sales stores...the shooter practiced at local shooting ranges...and even bought bullets at a Pittsburgh convention center gun show.
Spoken like a true liberal. You've been sampling some of Obama's purple cool-aide again haven't you. I have a better idea. How about we make all the school districts use the soon to be shutter state prison. It's already secure.
MountainMan

Palm Desert, CA

#13 Jan 18, 2013
The Unseemly Underbelly wrote:
<quoted text>
Latrobe is a small, rural town. I marvel at the waste of money and resources.
There are kids in Latrobe, whose parents can drive them to programs or pick them up from sports (if the kids had an interest)-- yet no one cares about these kids.
It's like Latrobe lives in a dream world where no one wants to admit to its needs and unseemly underbelly.
I take issue with the "rural" comment. Latrobe is the Manhattan of Western PA. Are you the only one who does not realize this yet???
I am balled over

Carlisle, PA

#14 Jan 18, 2013
Oh god what was I thinking. I have people on another page blasting me for suggesting that a lean-to hut/trailer in Latrobe be torn down, since it's an eyesore, not built to any codes, except the code of crazy, and condemn the property to raze it and build something that fits with the neighborhood.

Yes, I know that Manhattan is a hideously ugly place...
Sense

Delmont, PA

#15 Jan 18, 2013
Hey Balled,...stick to the subject, Buddy. You're "Thinking" but using no common sense you tool. Looks like your living in the WRONG part of the state. Soon as you got a good dose of common sense you looked elsewhere but got the same. You stand out like an infected thumb.
Sense

Delmont, PA

#16 Jan 18, 2013
Balled, Thinking, Bumar, whatever you want to call yourself, either move into to Pittsburgh or better yet, move closer to Philly. They'd LOVE you there. This state has a line through the middle. It could be two different states...should be. And seriously. If you comment on two entirely different subjects no matter how widely diverse and you still get your libby butt skewered, go home, sit on the couch, and please don't bother us simple folk. Sorry, you went to Latrobe...haha...hick...(can you smell the sarcasm?...)
Sense

Delmont, PA

#17 Jan 18, 2013
By the way, we do actually have neighborhoods around here that have rules...wait...is that a demolition car getting readied in the next door yard?...call the "me, me, me" police...I can feel my property value plummeting...wait...tear down the neighbors' kids clubhouse...it clashes with my goddy lawn ornaments and stock "I bought it at a garage sale wood lawn ornaments....Looossserrr...not hing you've said you can back up with facts...other than "you don't agree"...TooooooooL.
window washer

Latrobe, PA

#18 Jan 19, 2013
Thinking like a madman wrote:
<quoted text>
Let's think like a Madman...
LES is a big square with classrooms facing all four sides, and an offshoot to an addition at one of the corners.
In the center of the square are the auditorium and cafeteria and maybe windows on the 3rd floor open to a courtyard, I'm too old to remember.
The front of the school at ground level meets the 2nd floor.
The back of the school at the ground level meets the 1st floor.
Hence, a Madman will break the glass and make entry into a locked down LES at either the front 2nd floor or the rear 1st floor.
Where will the $70,000/year officer sit? on the first floor in the rear or the 2nd floor in the front?
Maybe the officer will walk and walk and walk all day long with his gun showing to the children to make sure they know, "The world is not a safe place."
So, the Officer is on the lower level in the rear when the Madman breaks a grond floor window in the front of the building, crawls into the gradde school room and opens fire, killing 20 students, 1 teacher, and then walks into the hallway, heads to the Principal's Offices and shoots 5 more adults.
By now, the $70,000 / year officer has arrived upstairs, and meets the carnage, sees the suicide, and radios for assistance.
-----Doesn't sound like a sensible solution to me, does it sound that way to you?
Oh, I forgot to say that the rapid fire magazine and its rifle were purchased in Westmoreland County at any one of the gun sales stores...the shooter practiced at local shooting ranges...and even bought bullets at a Pittsburgh convention center gun show.
Looks like somebody has put to much thought into this. I think I hear the BATFE knocking on someobdy's door.
Thinking like a madman

Carlisle, PA

#19 Jan 19, 2013
Sense wrote:
By the way, we do actually have neighborhoods around here that have rules...wait...is that a demolition car getting readied in the next door yard?...call the "me, me, me" police...I can feel my property value plummeting...wait...tear down the neighbors' kids clubhouse...it clashes with my goddy lawn ornaments and stock "I bought it at a garage sale wood lawn ornaments....Looossserrr...not hing you've said you can back up with facts...other than "you don't agree"...TooooooooL.
If only Latrobeans were this fussy...
Thinking like a madman

Carlisle, PA

#20 Jan 19, 2013
window washer wrote:
Spoken like a true liberal. You've been sampling some of Obama's purple cool-aide again haven't you. I have a better idea. How about we make all the school districts use the soon to be shutter state prison. It's already secure.
Better yet?

Why don't you take the $70,000 salary and buy all the little kiddies bullet proof vests that they can pass on to the next class each year. So what if Jimmy's is too tight and Mary's is too large.

And, while you're dressing the kiddies for a Police State, let's dress them as little Hitler Youth in white t-shirts and white cotton tighty-whities.

We can make all the children stand military style too, for all events and make military khakis the school uniform.

Yes, let's fill the schools with guns and ammo and fear as a "deterrent"...

Oh wait, isn't that what our laws are for? our penal system? our currently employed police, sheriffs and troopers, CIA, FBI, and every other government agency under the sun...

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