Donald Rumsfeld protests too much, re...

Donald Rumsfeld protests too much, reveals too little - Editorials

There are 29 comments on the Honolulu Star-Bulletin story from Dec 15, 2008, titled Donald Rumsfeld protests too much, reveals too little - Editorials. In it, Honolulu Star-Bulletin reports that:

Donald Rumsfeld has revived a tactic that succeeded in his heyday as secretary of defense, when an administration in the fullness of power could manipulate public opinion by suggesting its critics were ...

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“Too small to notice”

Since: Jun 08

Kahuku , Ka'U

#1 Dec 15, 2008
It appears that Rumsfeld and his partners are perfectly content to let the people who followed their explicit orders take all the punishment. Jail is too good him. How about a cage in Gitmo ?
Kolea

Mililani, HI

#2 Dec 15, 2008
The clearest signal the US repudiates torture would be to investigate the practice, determine the facts and prosecute those who ordered any illegal activities.

Of course, an honest examination of the facts would likely make Rumsfeld, Cheney, Gonzales and some of their top aides vulnerable to arrest in other countries.

Good! Let them be vulnerable and afraid to travel. It would still be less than the "rendition" they deserve.
raingirl

Honolulu, HI

#3 Dec 15, 2008
I respect Kolea's tact and even-handedness. But, I can't get by the fact that Rumsfeld, like Bush, Cheney etc., is a simply an egotistical buffoon without hint of remorse or compassion. After having promoted the invasion of Iraq (killing 100s of 1000s of innocent Iraquis) and then the torture of various detainees, how can Rumsfeld even sleep at night? The guy clearly has no conscience, no moral center.
Big J-Hawaii Kai

United States

#5 Dec 15, 2008
This is what happens when you put a civilian in charge of Defense, with no experience at all in military matters. How about the Joint Chiefs of Staff, who are supposed to advise the Secretary of Defense? Well, that only works when the Secretary listens. It is Rumsfeld who should be tried as a war criminal.
All Politicians Use it

Honolulu, HI

#6 Dec 15, 2008
The tactic to silence works with any candidate as long as the media is willing to go along with it.

For Rumsfield it was to paint critics as 'patriotic".

For Obama, it is to paint critics as
" uncivil" and not having the 'right tone' of discussion. Then he goes SILENT in answering and disclosing the public's questions.

It's all the same.

Stonewalling is never acceptable for any party in public office.

Healthy questioning, healthy investigation, and healthy objectivity are all needed to protect our democracy.
Disgusted

Wahiawa, HI

#7 Dec 15, 2008
Big J-Hawaii Kai wrote:
This is what happens when you put a civilian in charge of Defense, with no experience at all in military matters. How about the Joint Chiefs of Staff, who are supposed to advise the Secretary of Defense? Well, that only works when the Secretary listens. It is Rumsfeld who should be tried as a war criminal.
Big J addressed the crux of the problem. Rummy was an airplane driver who never understood who was responsible for what. All these people who have never had a shot fired at them in anger tried to micromanage areas that they knew nothing about. Shrub and the KFC side order - Condaleeza Rice - should have determined our national goals and objectives in Iraq. Rummy should have made a decision, or at least a recommended course of action to the President whether to (1) kick Saddam's butt and tell him that next time he stepped out of line, there would be no Iraq, and left;(2)turned Iraq over to a capable Iraqi government; (3) occupied Iraq until there was a capable Iraqi government; or (4) decide NOT to go into Iraq after considering the previous because it was not in our best national interest. THEN, let the military plan the TACTICS, and provide the necessary assets to accomplish their mission. In their arrogance, neither Bush, Cheney, Rice or Rumsfeld would do that, or admit their failure.
If the military can try a young SGT for making a split second life and death decision, why are the Big Four, above, NOT BEING TRIED for decisions that they made in the safety and comfort of their offices and conference rooms? Why have the Democrats NOT INITIATED IMPEACHMENT proceedings?
Disgusted

Wahiawa, HI

#8 Dec 15, 2008
Correction. Fifth line from the bottom, should read "would NOT do that".
Mr Neuman

Haiku, HI

#10 Dec 15, 2008
When the savage horrors of Mumbai are inflicted upon America will we still blame Rumsfeld?
Kahukuan

Las Vegas, NV

#11 Dec 15, 2008
From the get go Rumsfeld was a loser. The best thing he did for this nation was to resign and wished it was sooner.
Americas Unsolved Mystery

Hilo, HI

#12 Dec 15, 2008
Yes.

Put him under oath and grill him about 9/11.

Then send him to the Hague.
Jerry Okamura

Kaneohe, HI

#13 Dec 15, 2008
Knights of the Roundtable concept. That there is a good way to fight a war and there is a bad way to fight a war. Of course fighting the "good way" is of little comfort if you lose the war because you did the "right thing". Same basic concept when we talk about "harsh interrogation" tactics. The goal is to get information to prevent someone from dying. If you play by the rules, more people will die. If you don't play by the rules, you just may be able to reduce the number of people who will die. Catch 22....
Perhaps

Haiku, HI

#14 Dec 15, 2008
Mr Neuman wrote:
When the savage horrors of Mumbai are inflicted upon America will we still blame Rumsfeld?
It depends. How has the war in Iraq decreased (or increased) the likelihood of an attack on America? How has the war in Iraq impacted the perception of America in the Middle East? Have we created more terrorists by attacking and occupying Iraq? Have we diverted resources to the war in Iraq that could have been used against al Quaeda and other terrorist organizations?
Mental Cases in Charge

Washington, DC

#15 Dec 15, 2008
"The guy clearly has no conscience, no moral center."

Isn't that the definition of a Sociopath? Our gov't has been run by at least one sociopath over the past 8 years? That's a scary thought.
Lingle Da Snubber

Hilo, HI

#16 Dec 15, 2008
I read somewhere that Al Quaeda was formed, trained and financed by the CIA in the eighties to fight the Soviets in Afghanistan?

Doesn't "Al Quaeda" mean "The Toilet" or "Going to the toilet" in Arabic?

What kind of fundamentalists name their group, "The Toilet"?
Sam

Kilauea, HI

#17 Dec 15, 2008
Jerry Okamura wrote:
Knights of the Roundtable concept. That there is a good way to fight a war and there is a bad way to fight a war. Of course fighting the "good way" is of little comfort if you lose the war because you did the "right thing". Same basic concept when we talk about "harsh interrogation" tactics. The goal is to get information to prevent someone from dying. If you play by the rules, more people will die. If you don't play by the rules, you just may be able to reduce the number of people who will die. Catch 22....
Mr. Okamura, I suggest you do a little homework - TORTURE DOESN'T WORK. Even if you have no moral reservations about doing what's wrong for a 'Christian' nation, you should consider that information derived from torture techniques is flawed, unhelpful, useless, and a waste of time.

We all want to protect our people. But let's do it the right way, the effective way, the moral way.
Bleedingheartlib eral

United States

#18 Dec 15, 2008
"Harsh interrogation methods"??? They should tourture these guys and then torture them some more. It is insane that we treat the very people who would have no problem slitting your daughter's throat with any respect at all. They are human debris that should be ground up and thrown into the water for shark food. Rumsfield is not the enemy. It is the crazy muslim exremists who are the enemy. Why do we keep forgetting that?
ValleyIsleLaw

Honolulu, HI

#19 Dec 15, 2008
Perhaps it is fortunate that in just a few weeks Obama will be president. He seems to have proven himself to be a pragmatist rather than the ideologue the left had hoped. Will he be condemned by the Bulletin's editorial staff, Raingirl, Kolea, Big J at al when he continues pragmatic policies to protect our country and its citizens - many identical to the policies of the Bush administration ? It is just so much more difficult to govern a country and protect its citizens from the likes of Islamic terrorists than it is to write asinine editorials and blog comments. Perhaps "harsh interrogation techniques" will be relabeled "creative interrogation techniques" and all will be good in the land of OZ and the faithful far left. Or maybe Barack will immediately order that the Gitmo orange jumpsuits be exchanged for pink jumpsuits and this will appease the critics. Let's all agree to meet back here in 12 months and see if things are pretty much on the same course as they are today.
MrLouis

Marshall, VA

#20 Dec 15, 2008
Right he should talk to the likes of you.
BozoNemesis

AOL

#21 Dec 15, 2008
Bleedingheartliberal wrote:
"Harsh interrogation methods"??? They should tourture these guys and then torture them some more. It is insane that we treat the very people who would have no problem slitting your daughter's throat with any respect at all. They are human debris that should be ground up and thrown into the water for shark food. Rumsfield is not the enemy. It is the crazy muslim exremists who are the enemy. Why do we keep forgetting that?
I DON'T forget who the enemy is; I will NEVER forget! I will NEVER, EVER forget that picture on the Newsweek cover showing the three young ladies holding hands while falling to their deaths from above the flaming floors of one of the World Trade Center buildings on 9/11. And the same lolo losers pushing their liberal swill online here are the same ones that cry bloody murder when they perceive that THEIR ox is gored (e.g., lack of ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING that they desire with the cost borne by others)! If there were no muslims on this earth, there would have been no 9/11/2001 massacre, so it doesn't take a lot of smarts to conclude what the solution to the problem is. This bunch of freebee-mongering lolos DON'T HAVE THE FOGGIEST NOTION who the REAL enemy is!'Nuff said...
charles

Honolulu, HI

#22 Dec 15, 2008
BozoNemesis wrote:
<quoted text>I DON'T forget who the enemy is; I will NEVER forget! I will NEVER, EVER forget that picture on the Newsweek cover showing the three young ladies holding hands while falling to their deaths from above the flaming floors of one of the World Trade Center buildings on 9/11. And the same lolo losers pushing their liberal swill online here are the same ones that cry bloody murder when they perceive that THEIR ox is gored (e.g., lack of ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING that they desire with the cost borne by others)! If there were no muslims on this earth, there would have been no 9/11/2001 massacre, so it doesn't take a lot of smarts to conclude what the solution to the problem is. This bunch of freebee-mongering lolos DON'T HAVE THE FOGGIEST NOTION who the REAL enemy is!'Nuff said...
Hmmmm... using this "logic," then, if there were no white male Americans, there would have been no Oklahoma City bombing where little children lost their lives.

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