Coffeyville Refinery loses in Tax Appeals Court

[Interesting]

CVR lost in the Tax appeals court. Will the county and cities that set money aside now be able to use that money to set aside the high taxes in Montgomery County?

[Xkansan]

They will probably close now so they won't have to pay anymore of high taxes even though they are soooo
profitable.

[living large]

I agree, they can afford to close and move to a county, in a state that will show them the red carpet! Hide and watch! Montgomery county won a battle, but will lose the war!

[Indy_Dick]

living large wrote:

I agree, they can afford to close and move to a county, in a state that will show them the red carpet! Hide and watch! Montgomery county won a battle, but will lose the war!

You just don't close a refinery, pull up stakes and move it. If it were moved, I'm sure that the old location would be looked at by the EPA for cleanup costs. The refinery needs to pay its taxes and continue its money making operations. Not every location that a refinery could set up at would want one, even if it brought jobs to the area. The labor in this area is about as low cost as a refinery is going to get. It will stay here and appeal its taxes each year in hopes of getting them reduced somewhat.

[living large]

Indy_Dick wrote:

<quoted text>You just don't close a refinery, pull up stakes and move it. If it were moved, I'm sure that the old location would be looked at by the EPA for cleanup costs. The refinery needs to pay its taxes and continue its money making operations. Not every location that a refinery could set up at would want one, even if it brought jobs to the area. The labor in this area is about as low cost as a refinery is going to get. It will stay here and appeal its taxes each year in hopes of getting them reduced somewhat.

You are clueless!

[Xkansan]

True Iny D. Not many areas would let them get by with all the chemicals. Occasionally the stinch would be so bad even in Indy that I would get headaches. But Mg County can't afford to lose them, either.

[O really]

Xkansan wrote:

True Iny D. Not many areas would let them get by with all the chemicals. Occasionally the stinch would be so bad even in Indy that I would get headaches. But Mg County can't afford to lose them, either.

there are hundreds of counties that will PAY them to move.

[BBB]

Nope, there is a national security issue here. Refineries just can't pickup and move or close. I am sure with a limited amount of refining capacity in the nation the government would step in. I agree that the labor in your area is about as cheap as can be found. It takes years to build a refinery, not something that can simply be built in a few months. With the Arabian Gulf in a heightened state of turmoil I would say now would not be a good time to close any refinery, anywhere. The owners of the Coffeyville refinery are in a pickle, they are going to kick and scream but they are there, simple as that. Yes, I would hope the property owners can now get a rebate on the high taxes. With the current crooks (in my opinion) you have for commissioners, I would watch really watch how the issue goes with them trying to find a way to deal with the money.

[Concerned Citizen]

living large wrote:

I agree, they can afford to close and move to a county, in a state that will show them the red carpet! Hide and watch! Montgomery county won a battle, but will lose the war!

Watch and see if this does not have a very negative impact on Montgomery county. It may not be soon but it will happen.

[get a clue]

Its not the refinery any way its the nitrogen plant they can move anytime they want and leave the refinery still intact wait and see.

[Apples]

get a clue wrote:

Its not the refinery any way its the nitrogen plant they can move anytime they want and leave the refinery still intact wait and see.

You say apples I say oranges, it's still CVR regardless. If they decide to throw a hissy fit and storm out of Montgomery County so be it. Do you realize the sun will rise tomorrow in their absence? The old threat of "we built this facility on wheels and can roll it out any time" is one people should all reply, "get rolling you sunzabitches"

[shew]

Apples wrote:

<quoted text>You say apples I say oranges, it's still CVR regardless. If they decide to throw a hissy fit and storm out of Montgomery County so be it. Do you realize the sun will rise tomorrow in their absence? The old threat of "we built this facility on wheels and can roll it out any time" is one people should all reply, "get rolling you sunzabitches"

you sound like one of our commissioners. I have another idea, I say we realize how many of MILLIONS of dollars they filter into our county, and we do what we have to do to keep them.

[wally515]

this topic is way off purpose!! What does the County do with 12 million dollars that will soon be released for expenditures? Do we do what the idiotic Reporter says and GIVE it to departments/agencies or do we give it BACK to the people who payed in EXTRA when that money was frozen. Do we spend, invest, or lower everyones taxes....thats what we should be debating!!! NOT if the Refinery stays or goes. They aint going anywhere

[Indy_Dick]

shew wrote:

<quoted text>you sound like one of our commissioners. I have another idea, I say we realize how many of MILLIONS of dollars they filter into our county, and we do what we have to do to keep them.

I don't know what the owners are complaining about. When they bought the facility out of bankruptcy in 2004 it was off of the tax rolls until the end of 2008. That 4 whole years of no real estate taxes. Add to that the 6 years that it existed before that off the tax rolls as an incentive to Farmland. Ten years of no taxes on the facility. Thats ten years more than the average Joe has had for a break on his real estate taxes.

Yes, I know that it was set up as an incentive for Farmland to invest in the facility and hire more employees locally. Still, times up on the deal and its time to pay the piper.

My next concern is what happens when the Nitrogen plant appeals this ruling. Who do they appeal it to? Rabid didn't say in his article what court the appeal would be to. State Supreme Court? This has been in the courts since 2009, how much longer can this drag out?

Also, if the nitrogen plant loses the appeal, I am concerned about what the county commissioners will decide to do with the 12 millon dollars in escrow that would be freed up. Here's hoping they don't go on a spending spree just because it's there. A reduction of the mill levy would be a nice relief for everyone, even if it was just for one year.

[Taxed to the Max]

Indy_Dick wrote:

<quoted text>I don't know what the owners are complaining about. When they bought the facility out of bankruptcy in 2004 it was off of the tax rolls until the end of 2008. That 4 whole years of no real estate taxes. Add to that the 6 years that it existed before that off the tax rolls as an incentive to Farmland. Ten years of no taxes on the facility. Thats ten years more than the average Joe has had for a break on his real estate taxes.
Yes, I know that it was set up as an incentive for Farmland to invest in the facility and hire more employees locally. Still, times up on the deal and its time to pay the piper.
My next concern is what happens when the Nitrogen plant appeals this ruling. Who do they appeal it to? Rabid didn't say in his article what court the appeal would be to. State Supreme Court? This has been in the courts since 2009, how much longer can this drag out?
Also, if the nitrogen plant loses the appeal, I am concerned about what the county commissioners will decide to do with the 12 millon dollars in escrow that would be freed up. Here's hoping they don't go on a spending spree just because it's there. A reduction of the mill levy would be a nice relief for everyone, even if it was just for one year.

The commissioners are probably already trying to spend it. To hell with the taxpayors.

[gomer]

Taxed to the Max wrote:

<quoted text>
The commissioners are probably already trying to spend it. To hell with the taxpayors.

They need to give it back, I need it!

[dude man]

they shut the one down in ark city in the early 90's. boom. just like that. i know, i bought property from the fleeing locals for pennies on the dollar. looks like i get to own some of the new dead coffeyville here soon. but, yes they can shut it down and leave the remains sitting there as they did in ark city. and they will.

BBB wrote:

Nope, there is a national security issue here. Refineries just can't pickup and move or close. I am sure with a limited amount of refining capacity in the nation the government would step in. I agree that the labor in your area is about as cheap as can be found. It takes years to build a refinery, not something that can simply be built in a few months. With the Arabian Gulf in a heightened state of turmoil I would say now would not be a good time to close any refinery, anywhere. The owners of the Coffeyville refinery are in a pickle, they are going to kick and scream but they are there, simple as that. Yes, I would hope the property owners can now get a rebate on the high taxes. With the current crooks (in my opinion) you have for commissioners, I would watch really watch how the issue goes with them trying to find a way to deal with the money.

[dude man]

this has been spent for legal fees. it has been in court for years and lawyers aren't free. it is gone to an attorneys bank account. i would be more interested in who the attorney was as they are the ones taking the money.

wally515 wrote:

this topic is way off purpose!! What does the County do with 12 million dollars that will soon be released for expenditures? Do we do what the idiotic Reporter says and GIVE it to departments/agencies or do we give it BACK to the people who payed in EXTRA when that money was frozen. Do we spend, invest, or lower everyones taxes....thats what we should be debating!!! NOT if the Refinery stays or goes. They aint going anywhere

[BBB]

Nope, wrong. There won't be a refinery closing in Coffeyville, KS. As I said, this happens to be a national security issue. Let's put it this way, it will be interesting to see how fast you see the government move on the issue if the owners of the refinery even attempt to close any part of that facility.

As for the money, it should go back to the taxpayer.