County and Commissioner Fire Meeting

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Curious

Wichita, KS

#1 May 21, 2012
Does anyone know how it came out?

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#2 May 21, 2012
Curious wrote:
Does anyone know how it came out?
All 7 fire chiefs are to submitt a 1 year budget for thier barn. thats right each fire station,not the combined budget for the county presented by McCleary. the fire chiefs are to meet soon and consolidate their efforts so there is no large discrepancy on equipment issues and such. they will then present it to the three commissioners for review at the request of Mr. Brown. all in all, it was a bitch session and very little was accomplished....your local government doing what it does....ask questions only to get questions as answers.....nothing changes around here.

Since: May 12

Coffeyville, KS

#3 May 21, 2012
wally515 wrote:
<quoted text>All 7 fire chiefs are to submitt a 1 year budget for thier barn. thats right each fire station,not the combined budget for the county presented by McCleary. the fire chiefs are to meet soon and consolidate their efforts so there is no large discrepancy on equipment issues and such. they will then present it to the three commissioners for review at the request of Mr. Brown. all in all, it was a bitch session and very little was accomplished....your local government doing what it does....ask questions only to get questions as answers.....nothing changes around here.
Thank you for a lettin us know Wally515 Was this a beginnin of making each fire barn more independent and better run without feelins and politicin gettin in the way?
was there

Independence, KS

#4 May 21, 2012
It was a start, and beats dissolving the Rural Fire District 1 and go back to townships.

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#5 May 21, 2012
MG County Resident wrote:
<quoted text>Thank you for a lettin us know Wally515 Was this a beginnin of making each fire barn more independent and better run without feelins and politicin gettin in the way?
NO. this will be used as cannon fodder to relieve McCleary. the 7 stations have not gotten along for quite some time primarily due to them continuing to vote in the SAME fire chiefs. The fire board is calling FOUL at McCleary doing what he feels is his duty and that is ADMINISTERING the county budget with or without their knowledge or consent. He seems tired of getting 7 different priority lists each and every time they have a meeting and has decided to act alone with our without their approval. thus the hard feelings between him and them. the three wise men are way out of their comfort zone with this one and per Mr. Brown have answered their questions with his own questions....you want them deciding which bills to pay? even with two of them former rural volunteers, they have been away much too long to have a direct connected interest or feeling of what they need. they just know we tax payers do not want to pay more and the rural fire is way underfunded...so what to do? more with less i presume....that and they are attempting to establish SOP's and such....LOL its a long way from being over....I suggested that some of the fire stations suceed and create fire district no. 2 and let their local township trustees, tax and manage the station....that got some discussion....wonder if it will take legs and walk?

Since: May 12

Coffeyville, KS

#6 May 21, 2012
wally515 wrote:
<quoted text>NO. this will be used as cannon fodder to relieve McCleary. the 7 stations have not gotten along for quite some time primarily due to them continuing to vote in the SAME fire chiefs. The fire board is calling FOUL at McCleary doing what he feels is his duty and that is ADMINISTERING the county budget with or without their knowledge or consent. He seems tired of getting 7 different priority lists each and every time they have a meeting and has decided to act alone with our without their approval. thus the hard feelings between him and them. the three wise men are way out of their comfort zone with this one and per Mr. Brown have answered their questions with his own questions....you want them deciding which bills to pay? even with two of them former rural volunteers, they have been away much too long to have a direct connected interest or feeling of what they need. they just know we tax payers do not want to pay more and the rural fire is way underfunded...so what to do? more with less i presume....that and they are attempting to establish SOP's and such....LOL its a long way from being over....I suggested that some of the fire stations suceed and create fire district no. 2 and let their local township trustees, tax and manage the station....that got some discussion....wonder if it will take legs and walk?
Well ive always been a supportin the guys and gals out there workin hard to keep us safe and not so much on all the trouble makin nonsense. A fire district 2 is an interestin thought, him a makin sop's is ok in thery but hows he a gonna make em work in 7 diffrnt barns with differnt situations and the priorities so differnt? Im wonderin if the chiefs wouldnt make it on their own and without ol Mccleary and just havin them meet onct a month with the commissioners? Break down the coordinators pay and give it to the fire chiefs, aint they the ones a runnin their departments anyway?
was there

Independence, KS

#7 May 22, 2012
The stations are going along just fine, nice try. Breaking up the district will leave some without money, mutual aid is ok, but taxpayers will not support unlimited aide to other townships.
et one

Latham, KS

#8 May 22, 2012
wally515 wrote:
<quoted text>NO. this will be used as cannon fodder to relieve McCleary. the 7 stations have not gotten along for quite some time primarily due to them continuing to vote in the SAME fire chiefs. The fire board is calling FOUL at McCleary doing what he feels is his duty and that is ADMINISTERING the county budget with or without their knowledge or consent. He seems tired of getting 7 different priority lists each and every time they have a meeting and has decided to act alone with our without their approval. thus the hard feelings between him and them. the three wise men are way out of their comfort zone with this one and per Mr. Brown have answered their questions with his own questions....you want them deciding which bills to pay? even with two of them former rural volunteers, they have been away much too long to have a direct connected interest or feeling of what they need. they just know we tax payers do not want to pay more and the rural fire is way underfunded...so what to do? more with less i presume....that and they are attempting to establish SOP's and such....LOL its a long way from being over....I suggested that some of the fire stations suceed and create fire district no. 2 and let their local township trustees, tax and manage the station....that got some discussion....wonder if it will take legs and walk?
Actually, Wally, sounds like politics reared it's ugly head again last night....as far as McCleary is concerned, my vote, if I had one would be to tell him goodbye. I have attempted to work with the man, was in fact asked to work with him, by him; only to be cursed like a dog when he didn't like what was proposed. Funny, no one else had big issues with the plan proposed. The man has some serious issues...I do hope he isn't elected Sheriff as I'm not sure what he would do with that kind of authority. Would bet the county would lose several deputies pretty quickly.

Now, as for him wanting the firefighters to be able to meet minimum standards...that is normal for EVERY FIRE SERVICE or POLICE SERVICE going, volunteer or not! It is a matter of public safety and officer safety for the responder to be physically able to perform. There is more to fire fighting than running down the road, lights flashing and sirens blasting...there is a very specific FIRE SCIENCE involved and as you learned recently, there is more to know than just how to squirt water on a grass fire.

I have belonged to several volunteer agencies in other states, and you were REQUIRED to take training, pass physical and academic tests as well as being able to demonstrate your ability to do the work safely. I find it strange that Mr. McCleary would make statements to the effect that "you can't get volunteers to do any training", etc. Those who volunteer their time and effort for the public good, are for the most part more than willing to take classes, to practice, to work to improve their equipment and themselves.....those who do not should be asked to leave.

Now, as to the station chiefs being elected; wtf, buddy. The Chief of a station should be the most qualified, best trained and certified firefighter and should not be elected in a "beauty contest", but should be appointed by the fire board ... as it is done in many other places. May not be a popular thought, but it works!

Anyhow, hope all is going your way today. Really hope that they get their act together before we have some really devastating event occour which they have no training for [a HAZMAT spill comes to mind] and they run up and get their people dead or worse, crippled for life from chemical vapor poisioning.
wally515

Parsons, KS

#9 May 22, 2012
was there wrote:
The stations are going along just fine, nice try. Breaking up the district will leave some without money, mutual aid is ok, but taxpayers will not support unlimited aide to other townships.
we already are....any station will come to the aid of the other if asked....unlimited requests always responded to...regardless of money....
was there

Independence, KS

#10 May 22, 2012
wally515 wrote:
<quoted text>we already are....any station will come to the aid of the other if asked....unlimited requests always responded to...regardless of money....
duuuuuuhhhhhhhhhhh because it's one district, it doesn't matter. After YOU separated the district it will.

Since: May 12

Independence, Ks

#11 May 22, 2012
Had the opportunity to speak with some people involved with the rural fire department last week and this SOP or Guidelines that Mr. McCleary is attempting to introduce by resolution has some problems that need addressed.

There is now a movement underway in the Equal Opportunities department in the Dept. of Justice that could soon limit background checks from being performed on potential applicants.

Currently an applicant must sign a waver before their application will be accepetd, which would be unlawful should this be signed into law.
et one

Latham, KS

#12 May 22, 2012
Indy Truth wrote:
Had the opportunity to speak with some people involved with the rural fire department last week and this SOP or Guidelines that Mr. McCleary is attempting to introduce by resolution has some problems that need addressed.
There is now a movement underway in the Equal Opportunities department in the Dept. of Justice that could soon limit background checks from being performed on potential applicants.
Currently an applicant must sign a waver before their application will be accepetd, which would be unlawful should this be signed into law.
There is a very good reason for background checks for ALL Emergency Responders. Simply put you really don't want a pedophile or other criminal type dealing with your wife, kids, grandparents, etc., during an emergency. Ask the American Red Cross; they sent three known, convicted pedophiles to Florida as part of the 2004 hurricane disaster response....with several little kids molested.

Since then it has been policy for all response personnel to be background checked....get a grip folks, the person who wants to be in the fire service, EMS, police, etc., should expect to be background checked....it's going to happen whether they like it or not. We restrict pedophiles to not living within a specific radius of children or schools; what makes anyone think that because you are a volunteer firefighter you should be exempted.

As for the "DOJ lawsuit" not going to happen because of background checks. They are the ones who insist on them to begin with. If there is an ADA issue, then that may come about...but criminal background checks are not part of a ADA issue. Now, if you are talking about "mode of living" checks, that may be another issue.
Interesting topic

Carrollton, TX

#13 May 22, 2012
et one wrote:
<quoted text>
There is a very good reason for background checks for ALL Emergency Responders. Simply put you really don't want a pedophile or other criminal type dealing with your wife, kids, grandparents, etc., during an emergency. Ask the American Red Cross; they sent three known, convicted pedophiles to Florida as part of the 2004 hurricane disaster response....with several little kids molested.
Since then it has been policy for all response personnel to be background checked....get a grip folks, the person who wants to be in the fire service, EMS, police, etc., should expect to be background checked....it's going to happen whether they like it or not. We restrict pedophiles to not living within a specific radius of children or schools; what makes anyone think that because you are a volunteer firefighter you should be exempted.
As for the "DOJ lawsuit" not going to happen because of background checks. They are the ones who insist on them to begin with. If there is an ADA issue, then that may come about...but criminal background checks are not part of a ADA issue. Now, if you are talking about "mode of living" checks, that may be another issue.
This does not appear to concern McCleary since there is a registered offender on one of the departments by Caney presently and has continued to be even after registering as a sex offender. The offender is the son of the woman that was working as McCleary's secretary for quite some time, if McCleary gets sheriff, one would hope he does better on his backgrounds.

http://www.accesskansas.org/kbi/offender_regi...
Interesting topic

Carrollton, TX

#14 May 22, 2012
et one wrote:
<quoted text>
There is a very good reason for background checks for ALL Emergency Responders. Simply put you really don't want a pedophile or other criminal type dealing with your wife, kids, grandparents, etc., during an emergency. Ask the American Red Cross; they sent three known, convicted pedophiles to Florida as part of the 2004 hurricane disaster response....with several little kids molested.
Since then it has been policy for all response personnel to be background checked....get a grip folks, the person who wants to be in the fire service, EMS, police, etc., should expect to be background checked....it's going to happen whether they like it or not. We restrict pedophiles to not living within a specific radius of children or schools; what makes anyone think that because you are a volunteer firefighter you should be exempted.
As for the "DOJ lawsuit" not going to happen because of background checks. They are the ones who insist on them to begin with. If there is an ADA issue, then that may come about...but criminal background checks are not part of a ADA issue. Now, if you are talking about "mode of living" checks, that may be another issue.
Some interesting reading for you:

The U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) recently issued new Enforcement Guidance with respect to an employer's consideration of arrest and conviction records in employment decisions. The guidance discusses employer practices that the EEOC considers permissible and impermissible based on its interpretation of Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. It bars the use of arrest records alone in making adverse employment decisions. The guidance also requires that any policy excluding individuals with past convictions from consideration for a position be narrowly-tailored to both the position in question and business necessity.

Best practices. The EEOC states that employers eliminate policies or practices that exclude individuals from employment based on their having any criminal record whatsoever, as this will never be consistent with business necessity.
WTH

Parsons, KS

#15 May 22, 2012
Interesting topic wrote:
<quoted text>This does not appear to concern McCleary since there is a registered offender on one of the departments by Caney presently and has continued to be even after registering as a sex offender. The offender is the son of the woman that was working as McCleary's secretary for quite some time, if McCleary gets sheriff, one would hope he does better on his backgrounds.
http://www.accesskansas.org/kbi/offender_regi...
What the hell??????????

Since: May 12

Coffeyville, KS

#16 May 22, 2012
WTH wrote:
<quoted text>What the hell??????????
Ima guessin this kinda deal is more of what the newspaper was a talkin about about lack of communication. Lookin like ol Mccleary is a straightn that department out alright, specially if he done let a sex offender on the dept. He shore is a screenin em good!

Since: May 12

Independence, Ks

#17 May 22, 2012
Interesting topic wrote:
<quoted text>Some interesting reading for you:
The U.S. Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC) recently issued new Enforcement Guidance with respect to an employer's consideration of arrest and conviction records in employment decisions. The guidance discusses employer practices that the EEOC considers permissible and impermissible based on its interpretation of Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964. It bars the use of arrest records alone in making adverse employment decisions. The guidance also requires that any policy excluding individuals with past convictions from consideration for a position be narrowly-tailored to both the position in question and business necessity.
Best practices. The EEOC states that employers eliminate policies or practices that exclude individuals from employment based on their having any criminal record whatsoever, as this will never be consistent with business necessity.
This is exactly what I was meaning in my prior post.

What needs to be understood in this hard headed area communities we live in is that times are changing, good example is what was mentioned before, is ADA and other forms of discrimination, as the City of Independence can tell you.

The city of Independence, Kansas learned a lesson the hard way, and it ended with sales taxes being raised first, and eventually it will be likely that property taxes will take yet another hit.

It is important to run an organization above board, without controversy, honesty and transparency.

This is not being done in the rural fire, and as long as the present leadership is at the helm, then they will continue to be doomed.

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#18 May 22, 2012
Indy Truth wrote:
<quoted text>This is exactly what I was meaning in my prior post.
What needs to be understood in this hard headed area communities we live in is that times are changing, good example is what was mentioned before, is ADA and other forms of discrimination, as the City of Independence can tell you.
The city of Independence, Kansas learned a lesson the hard way, and it ended with sales taxes being raised first, and eventually it will be likely that property taxes will take yet another hit.
It is important to run an organization above board, without controversy, honesty and transparency.
This is not being done in the rural fire, and as long as the present leadership is at the helm, then they will continue to be doomed.
which leadership? those on the fire board, chiefs or McCleary?

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#19 May 22, 2012
was there wrote:
The stations are going along just fine, nice try. Breaking up the district will leave some without money, mutual aid is ok, but taxpayers will not support unlimited aide to other townships.
thanks to a request and charollette being already on top of things...here is what the 7 Stations have to set budgets against....assessed value...and actual tax $$$...
STATION ASSESSED VALUE TAX $$$ RECEIVED
Sycamore $14,112,583 $1,875,424
Cherryvale $13,289,650 $1,757,620
Independence $34,579,847 $4,519,324
Havana $6,133,823 $780,703
Tyro $15,748,310 $1,924,156
Dearing $82,811,190 $11,035,031
Liberty $18,076,842 $2,430,394

Since: May 12

Independence, Ks

#20 May 22, 2012
wally515 wrote:
<quoted text>which leadership? those on the fire board, chiefs or McCleary?
I was concentrated on McCleary, the chiefs and board members are many times the same person, but not always.

From my understanding, the alienation between the stations is brought on by misunderstandings spread about by Mr. McCleary.

In checking on the furnace issue and the gas turned off by Atmos over a month ago, I learned that the broken furnace was shut off at the valve many months ago by the members of the division station, and the issue reported to McCleary, who had all of the furnace heaters checked out by a maintainance person. The furnace was Never "red tagged" by Atmos as McCleary blamed the delay in getting gas service restored telling the Commissioners that that (atmos)was the reason.

Seperating the stations and allowing a budget consistant with past records for each would be far more common sence than the way it is currently done. The fire chiefs seem to agree (outside earshot of McCleary) that Mr. McCleary is not measuring up.

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