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SHAFT

Knoxville, TN

#41 Feb 17, 2013
the real anonymouse wrote:
Things can still be legal if they are not expressed in the Constitution. In fact many of the Bill of Rights do not say one damn thing the Government CAN do, it says what they CANNOT do. So exclusion from the Constitution generally means it is permitted. You have this strange idea that "Constitutional" only means it is in the Constitution when it also means it is legal within the framework of the Constitution. Why has no one, even with a Conservative judge, ever successfully argued and gotten progressive taxes overturned. So it is legal and allowed as a power of the Federal Government within the framework of the Constitution by Article I, Section 8, Clause 1 (you like those specific references right?) that gives the Government it's powers of taxation. "The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises"
*drops drumsticks*
Show me where it says congress shall have power to tax rich people more for more for the same damn thing.
PhD in History

United States

#42 Feb 17, 2013
SHAFT wrote:
<quoted text>Whats not true?
It is not true that taxing the rich at a high rate raises the tax on everybody. Check the tax tables from the 1950s. They were much more progressively graduated than the rates in the present tax code.

Fact is, the poor and middle class today are paying higher rates today than they were in 1950, while the rich are paying a far lower rate.
SHAFT

Knoxville, TN

#43 Feb 17, 2013
Its unfair to to rich people dummy. How would you like it if walmart charged you $100 for a loaf of bread but a welfare recipent $1.50 for the same damn loaf and you dont get any more damn bread. You would be on topix bitching bout it. Rich people pay more for govt but they dont get anymore benefits. You are dumb dumb dumb!

“Dewey Beats Truman!”

Since: Apr 12

Here

#44 Feb 17, 2013
It says Congress has the Power to collect taxes, period. If they taxed you based on how many times you took a shit, then that is legal within their power to collect. There would not need to be a special shit tax clause. If that were true as you seem to be claiming EVERY TAX would be illegal because it was not specifically mentioned by name in the Constitution. That is a logical fallacy. The power to tax and furthermore the determination on how those taxes are collected are not only legal, but very specifically in the Constitution.
SHAFT

Knoxville, TN

#45 Feb 17, 2013
PhD in History wrote:
<quoted text>
It is not true that taxing the rich at a high rate raises the tax on everybody. Check the tax tables from the 1950s. They were much more progressively graduated than the rates in the present tax code.
Fact is, the poor and middle class today are paying higher rates today than they were in 1950, while the rich are paying a far lower rate.
Mr. Phd rich people pay more in raw dollars. So dont give me any crap bout rates.

“Dewey Beats Truman!”

Since: Apr 12

Here

#46 Feb 17, 2013
SHAFT wrote:
Rich people pay more for govt but they dont get anymore benefits.
Because they don't use the roads more to move goods, or need educated workers to work for them, or use the cops and emergency services more either? They also don't create a larger burden with more pollution, financial and labor oversight either. They should obviously be given unlimited rights to do anything and everything like anarchists because money and it's pursuit are more powerful than basic human or constitutional rights.

See what I did there?
SHAFT

Knoxville, TN

#47 Feb 17, 2013
the real anonymouse wrote:
It says Congress has the Power to collect taxes, period. If they taxed you based on how many times you took a shit, then that is legal within their power to collect. There would not need to be a special shit tax clause. If that were true as you seem to be claiming EVERY TAX would be illegal because it was not specifically mentioned by name in the Constitution. That is a logical fallacy. The power to tax and furthermore the determination on how those taxes are collected are not only legal, but very specifically in the Constitution.
First if a tax is not mentioned in the constitution, such as obama care, it is illegal. Second if how those taxes are collected are mentioned in the constitution show me where it says rich folks pay more.
SHAFT

Knoxville, TN

#48 Feb 17, 2013
the real anonymouse wrote:
<quoted text>
Because they don't use the roads more to move goods, or need educated workers to work for them, or use the cops and emergency services more either? They also don't create a larger burden with more pollution, financial and labor oversight either. They should obviously be given unlimited rights to do anything and everything like anarchists because money and it's pursuit are more powerful than basic human or constitutional rights.
See what I did there?
The only thing i see is that you are an idiot.

“Dewey Beats Truman!”

Since: Apr 12

Here

#49 Feb 17, 2013
What taxes are mentioned in the Constitution? NONE! The power for Congress to collect them is! Say it slow and it might sink in. Congress. has. the. power. to. collect. taxes.
Why would the founders give Congress the power, but not specify which taxes? According to you, they just wanted to confuse people or something. Or else in their wisdom they knew taxes would need to reflect the society, so they gave Congress the power to collect in the most generic of terms so that they could change taxes with the times and need.

“Dewey Beats Truman!”

Since: Apr 12

Here

#50 Feb 17, 2013
What do you think "The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises" means exactly?
SHAFT

Knoxville, TN

#51 Feb 17, 2013
the real anonymouse wrote:
<quoted text>
Because they don't use the roads more to move goods, or need educated workers to work for them, or use the cops and emergency services more either? They also don't create a larger burden with more pollution, financial and labor oversight either. They should obviously be given unlimited rights to do anything and everything like anarchists because money and it's pursuit are more powerful than basic human or constitutional rights.
See what I did there?
...constitutional rights? Since when did you ever give a damn bout constitutional rights?
SHAFT

Knoxville, TN

#52 Feb 17, 2013
the real anonymouse wrote:
What taxes are mentioned in the Constitution? NONE! The power for Congress to collect them is! Say it slow and it might sink in. Congress. has. the. power. to. collect. taxes.
Why would the founders give Congress the power, but not specify which taxes? According to you, they just wanted to confuse people or something. Or else in their wisdom they knew taxes would need to reflect the society, so they gave Congress the power to collect in the most generic of terms so that they could change taxes with the times and need.
Everything mentioned in the constitution IS A TAX. Tax dollars pay for everything in the constitution such congressional pay, the presidents pay, military pay etc. If its in the constitution its a tax.
SHAFT

Knoxville, TN

#53 Feb 17, 2013
The things that congress collects taxes for is not open ended. Congress is only to collect taxes for things specifically mentioned in the constitution. Anything else is illegal. If congress wants a new taxing power the constitution must be amended and the new tax be put in it
SHAFT

Knoxville, TN

#54 Feb 17, 2013
the real anonymouse wrote:
What do you think "The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises" means exactly?
It means exactly what it says.

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