Elevated rail plan is the right way to go - Editorials

Full story: Honolulu Star-Bulletin

City Councilman Duke Bainum is like the guy who shows up late for the big meeting -- and everyone has to endure having to retell and rehear what was explained before.
Comments
1 - 20 of 155 Comments Last updated Jun 10, 2009
First Prev
of 8
Next Last

“Too small to notice”

Since: Jun 08

Kahuku , Ka'U

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#1
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

4

4

4

Elevated eyesore. 10 times more expensive. Who is going to hike a long distance just to walk again when you get there. All your time savings gone. Crazy waste of money we don't have.
willie

Farmington, MI

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#2
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

2

1

1

Actually a subway would be the way to go...not building anythng would be even better.
ad hominem

Honolulu, HI

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#3
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

6

4

3

what a complete disgrace of an editorial from someone who is suppose to be a public servant

instead of addressing the issue, let's start
start by attacking the person --- just brilliant

but should we expect less from this administration?
ad hominem

Honolulu, HI

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#4
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

5

2

2

from Wikipedia

An ad hominem argument, also known as argumentum ad hominem (Latin: "argument to the man", "argument against the man") consists of replying to an argument or factual claim by attacking or appealing to a characteristic or belief of the source making the argument or claim, rather than by addressing the substance of the argument or producing evidence against the claim.

The process of proving or disproving the claim is thereby subverted, and the argumentum ad hominem works to change the subject.
ad hominem

Honolulu, HI

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#5
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

4

3

3

a report from Ian Lind on his blog -- ILind.net

"... I was browsing through comments submitted during the “scoping” phase of the city’s EIS process for the proposed rail, and came upon this startling statement in an official response:

Vehicle and system technologies will not be selected prior to the draft Environmental Impact Statement. Comments about issues related to vehicle and system technologies will be considered when specifications are developed.

But the draft EIS was only delivered in November 2008, and a year earlier the public was being told it was just too late to change the technology choice already made by the mayor and his people.

So was the official city position in mid-2006, that no technology choices would be made prior to the EIS, simply a lie? A distortion? An obfuscation?"
onlyparadise

Mililani, HI

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#6
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

2

2

2

wayne must be from wayne's world.

what is wayne talking about the city council did a thorough research on elevated guideway versus ground tracks?

that is so laughable i cannot believe wayne even wrote that.

if we are going to have rail and i don't want one, lite rail is the most effective mode.
Casey Jones

Honolulu, HI

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#8
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

6

6

5

Bainum is just a carpetbagger seeking to gain attention by sticking his nose in the rail discussion and pandering to the critics like his predessors Ann Kobayashi, another shameless opportunist.
Opposed

United States

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#9
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

3

3

2

Mr. Yoshioka is spewing the same old lies about how the city looked at other alternatives to rail and gave them serious consideration. Bull. The fix was in from the beginning for the most expensive system possible: steel on steel overhead rail. What he doesn't touch on are the aesthetics. Overhead rail will be truly hideous, running along Honolulu's waterfront and blocking mauka/makai viewplanes and creating blight in our once beautiful city.

It's all about propping up the developers and unions so Mufi can move up to another office.
Jane Monroe

Mililani, HI

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#10
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

3

3

1

In this article that Wayne Yoshioka wrote, he doesn`t mention that we are in a big recession, maybe headed for a depression. We (the taxpayers) don`t have the money to pay for King Mufi`s plan. We the taxpayers can`t stand to have our taxes raised again. WAKE UP AND GET REAL. Come up with a plan that we the people can afford.
Trash Gordon

Honolulu, HI

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#11
Apr 30, 2009
 
ad hominem is not improper if the facts in question involve mistaking an ass for a hole in the ground.
Jerry Okamura

Makawao, HI

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#12
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

2

2

1

I wonder if anyone has given this some thought. The city planners make on basic assumption, when they spend money on such things as this mass transit plan, and that is that the population will not decrease. Now the odds are they are right, but what happens if they are not right?
alice

Honolulu, HI

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#13
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

9

7

7

rail is dead hon..it was always a shibai
manini

Honolulu, HI

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#14
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

5

3

3

Yoshioka tries to make the point that Phoenix has the luxury of ample land to build at street level. Two things wrong here. Downtown Phoenix is just as congested as downtown Honolulu but they were able to do it. This shows that if there is a willingness to do it, it can be done. Secondly, there is more than ample land between Kapolei and Waipahu to build rail at grade. Yet the administration continues to insist that section also be elevated. It's not unreasonable to speculate that if this stretch were built at grade, we might realaize enough savings to extend the system to UH at the outset. That would truly help alleviate traffic.
One other thing. It sure seems like a lot of Mufi's staff spend a lot of time defending the cities actions in Op-Ed pieces and letters to the editor. Hope they aren't doing that on city time, or is it considered official business if they affix their job title to it.
Mike

Kalispell, MT

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#15
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

1

1

Onlyparadise makes good sense about light rail. By the way Wayne means well and I don't think he's from Wayne's World.
manini

Honolulu, HI

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#16
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

4

3

2

Opposed wrote:
Mr. Yoshioka is spewing the same old lies about how the city looked at other alternatives to rail and gave them serious consideration. Bull. The fix was in from the beginning for the most expensive system possible: steel on steel overhead rail. What he doesn't touch on are the aesthetics. Overhead rail will be truly hideous, running along Honolulu's waterfront and blocking mauka/makai viewplanes and creating blight in our once beautiful city.
It's all about propping up the developers and unions so Mufi can move up to another office.
And if Mufi moves, Yoshioka will have his lips glued to Mufi's okole to make sure he moves up with him. Can you imagine Dwayne as the director of the state DOT. Hahahaha
alice

Honolulu, HI

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#17
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

9

8

7

manini wrote:
Yoshioka tries to make the point that Phoenix has the luxury of ample land to build at street level. Two things wrong here. Downtown Phoenix is just as congested as downtown Honolulu but they were able to do it. This shows that if there is a willingness to do it, it can be done. Secondly, there is more than ample land between Kapolei and Waipahu to build rail at grade. Yet the administration continues to insist that section also be elevated. It's not unreasonable to speculate that if this stretch were built at grade, we might realaize enough savings to extend the system to UH at the outset. That would truly help alleviate traffic.
One other thing. It sure seems like a lot of Mufi's staff spend a lot of time defending the cities actions in Op-Ed pieces and letters to the editor. Hope they aren't doing that on city time, or is it considered official business if they affix their job title to it.
well said indeed.
PuppetYoshioka

Honolulu, HI

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#18
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

5

3

2

The Star Bulletin must be hurting big time for pro rail ad money to give Wayne Yoshioka's stupid editorial even a square inch of space. I am not a Bainum supporter and voted for Mufi but I am against the rail because I don't believe it is economically viable. Only one person in the history of this State has raised our GET ... that credit goes to Mufi. Mufi has taxed the hell out of me and I never have had to pay so much in property taxes and fees as I have under Mufi. I really though when Mufi had the slogan "do we need it, can we afford it, can we maintain it" that it meant a smaller less expensive government and hopefully more productive and efficient. What Mufi has created is a money gobbling monster city government machine that none of us can afford. Wayne Yoshioka is a paid puppet with our taxpayers money.
Hawaii Resident

United States

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#19
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

2

1

1

Opposed wrote:
Mr. Yoshioka is spewing the same old lies about how the city looked at other alternatives to rail and gave them serious consideration. Bull. The fix was in from the beginning for the most expensive system possible: steel on steel overhead rail. What he doesn't touch on are the aesthetics. Overhead rail will be truly hideous, running along Honolulu's waterfront and blocking mauka/makai viewplanes and creating blight in our once beautiful city.
It's all about propping up the developers and unions so Mufi can move up to another office.
This is sounding like The SuperFerry Deja Vu. Are we about to go half the distance and then stop. Didn't we already vote on this. Hideous? Maybe to some, but beauty lies in the eyes of the beholder. Can Honolulu afford to wait any longer for constructive changes in traffic congestion?
willie

Farmington, MI

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#20
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

4

3

3

"I really though when Mufi had the slogan "do we need it, can we afford it, can we maintain it" that it meant a smaller less expensive government"

The problem is yes he did say that but he did not say that saying NO to any of those three would mean it was not going to be done anyway. For rail, do we need it, no. Can we afford it, bigger no. Can we maintain it, sure, just stop maintaining everything else. The bigger question should have been "Will it help my political career"....for rail it might, depends on how many of those union workers actually get to work on it....there is no promise that ANY local companies will build it since they have zero expertise in building a rail system and with federal money a stake, it goes to the lowest bidder not the mayor's friends.
willie

Farmington, MI

|
Report Abuse
|
Judge it!
|
#21
Apr 30, 2009
 

Judged:

3

2

1

"Didn't we already vote on this."

If you call being asked if the rail should be steel on steel (and no other options like..should we even HAVE rail) a vote on it then yeah, it was voted on.

Tell me when this thread is updated: (Registration is not required)

Add to my Tracker Send me an email

First Prev
of 8
Next Last
Type in your comments below
Name
(appears on your post)
Comments
Characters left: 4000
Type the numbers you see in the image on the right:

Please note by clicking on "Post Comment" you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

19 Users are viewing the Honolulu Forum right now

Search the Honolulu Forum:
Title Updated Last By Comments
Isle housing bottom seen - Business (Apr '09) 9 min Guru 61,768
OBAMA COUNTDOWN for DAYS LEFT In Office UNTIL N... (Jan '14) 17 min Guru 1,780
Pearl City Man Arraigned on Wire Fraud 2 hr Leeward Lolo 2
Gangs in Hawaii (Oct '07) 7 hr Joe Balls 721
Gang Nightmare (Oct '07) 9 hr Leeward Lolo 5
Last Post Wins (Apr '11) 11 hr -Lily- 2,135
Preacher Jim (Feb '11) 16 hr Mynah Lockup 323
•••
•••
•••
Honolulu Dating

more search filters

less search filters

•••

Honolulu Jobs

•••
Enter and win $5000
•••
•••

Honolulu People Search

Addresses and phone numbers for FREE

•••

Honolulu News, Events & Info

Click for news, events and info in Honolulu
•••

Personal Finance

Mortgages [ See current mortgage rates ]
•••