PJP Financial Status
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Curious

Easthampton, MA

#1 Jul 12, 2009
Does anyone know how the PJP parish made out with their finances? The fiscal year ended in June and the appeals group's website said there would be a $101,000. deficit. Did it happen or were they wrong? Is there going to be a financial statement published for our parish? There usually is one around this time of year. Anyone know?
Curious Too

Easthampton, MA

#2 Jul 13, 2009
This is very interesting if its true but I heard the deficit higher, in the $110K to $120K range. That's a little more then their prediction. As a member of PJP parish I am really concerned and wonder how long we will have a church. Anyone got more info?
I agree we should see a financial statement.
Clarity

Ashfield, MA

#3 Jul 13, 2009
The collections for the parish of Pope John Paul the Great over the first 22 weeks of 2009 were down -$60,000 or -32%, as compared to the same time in 2008 when ND/ST and SSK were both open. The loss in collections was originally projected to be -21% or a deficit of $101,000(the figures in the appeal groups report submitted to the bishop).

Because the actual loss in collections is greater, the projected deficit for the Parish of Pope John Paul the Great could be as much as: negative $140,000.00 for its first year of operation. With an annual budget of appox.$520,000.00, a loss of this magnitude indicates that revenues are almost -30% less than the level needed to sustain the parish at its current subsistence level.

As stated in the appeal materials, there is now only one Catholic parish in Adams, and MANY members of the Catholic Community remain concerned that our bishop has chosen the least suitable church property to house the parish of Pope John Paul the Great. The SSK site remains a much less costly site to operate.
Wondering

Monsey, NY

#4 Jul 14, 2009
When will we see the moving van and for sale sign on the "mansion"?
Average Joe

Taunton, MA

#5 Jul 14, 2009
All of you are SICK!

Shame on you! Over the months to have to watch the hate of PJP! Every day someone had to write things about making the wrong choice, blah blah!

If it does fail who really wins here????

St Stans people refused to go to PJP, withheld money for collections, etc.

One thingis for sure, if the shoe was on the other foot, St Thomas and Notre Dame folks would not do the same thing!

What do you see when you look in the mirror???

How do you sleep at night!

Sad very sad!

and to "wondering", your last question was way out of line!
Lady Bug

Ashfield, MA

#6 Jul 14, 2009
Average Joe, we are not all sick as you say. What is occuring in Adams is that the bishop chose a church site that was on the verge of bankruptcy (ND/StT, was operating an avg.-$30,000.00 in the red, because its operating costs are so high)

He apparently thought that merging the two parishes and bringing the SSK money into the mix would resolve the situation (this would only be a temporary fix, however). The appeals group tried to bring all this to his attention, and avert a financial disaster.

Well, that didn't happen. We are seeing the fruits of his decision, a decision that set the Adams Catholic community up for failure. That is what is sick about this entire situation.
Done

Albany, NY

#7 Jul 14, 2009
Lady Bug - your comments are dead on. The decision to merge was a financial one. The decision regarding which church was a private/political-internal-to- Springfield one. It was contrary to the numbers Springfield had on hand and the study recommendations made by the UMass team. The semi-unified church is now paying the price for poor decision making on the part of Springfield administrators. Turning the clock back on it is extremenly difficult as it would be precedent setting. But...if the end result is to be a successful and vibrant Catholic community in Adams...then Springfield will need to find a way to manipulate that clock or we'll all be attending Mass in North Adams or Cheshire sooner then we think.
Average Joe

Taunton, MA

#8 Jul 14, 2009
Lady Bug, I would ask you and "done" to point your anger in person at the bishop!

Whats that?? You are all high and mighty on a blog but do not have the stones to go to the source??

Are you perfect? Perhaps the bishop has made a mistake? His he not human also? Perhaps it was a bad judgement call? Perhaps it is too late to go abck in time and correct ones wrong?

What I am trying to explain to you two along with many others is simple. Manyof St Stans thought "their" church was the be all end all and cry "sour grapes". Fact, I have not heard one negative from the St Thomas people. No "why me", no "why "our" church!

Fact Adams is not as populated as before, along time ago. Fact, a church or two had to close to cut cost. Fact, this may not be the end. It maybe that Adams will loose three churches and we will all have to commute to church!

I still stand by my comments above and do "sleep" very good!

I will contuine to support PJP as I am a church goer!

"Thanks be to god" "Now let us offer one another a sign of peace"!
Done

Albany, NY

#9 Jul 14, 2009
Sorry Average Joe...you just laid down the gauntlet in my opinion. I have the "stones" as you say it and have demonstrated that, in person and publicly when I've felt the need, so I have no problem jumping in on a blog and stating my opinion...which is what a blog is all about. The diocese of Springfield made a mistake...an administrative mistake...and now they need to make another decision. I personally believe they made the wrong one and I will use all resources at my disposal to do what I feel is right..including contacting the bishop's office directly if the impulse so strikes me agian. You don't agree with me? Who cares. I don't know you and, quite frankly, based on your perspective..have no desire to know you. You fall in line with diocesan edict and do what you feel you need to do. I will continue to do what I feel is right as well and hopefully the "right" and corrected decision will be made shortly. Afterall, the bishop "is human" so, as most humans do, he can admit his mistake and make the proper and administratively correct adjustment.
wondering

Chicopee, MA

#10 Jul 14, 2009
Average Joe,

Apparently you don't speak to very many St. Thomas former parishioners. Some of them are vigiling at St. Stans. All the ones I have spoken to agree with my question that you called "out of line"

Don't know what's wrong with closing a building that's not needed. We are going to need to save some money if those numbers are correct!

“CARPE DIEM”

Since: Jan 09

Location hidden

#11 Jul 14, 2009
Average Joe wrote:
St Stans people refused to go to PJP, withheld money for collections, etc.
!
you say they refused to go to PJP? I didnt know it was mandatory? Arent they free to worship anywhere they choose? Since they are devoted to SS and fell wronged(I agree with them) they have chosen to worship(and donate) elsewhere.
No one is withholding collections my dear. The problem stems from PJP assuming they would collect all of the SS money at PJP and that never happened. No ones fault here but fathers and the Diocese.
Remember the old saying, "you know what happens when you assume"
Average Joe

Taunton, MA

#12 Jul 14, 2009
To "Done", "wondering" and "CURLY1", I am indeed "in tune" with former St Thomas folks and I have yet to hear them chastise the bishop and Father Boyle as you and so many others have done!

Good luck with whatever it is you seek. I will contuine with PJP.
Really

Greenfield, MA

#13 Jul 14, 2009
Average Joe"]
St Stans people refused to go to PJP, withheld money for collections, etc.
One thingis for sure, if the shoe was on the other foot, St Thomas and Notre Dame folks would not do the same thing!
If the show was on the other foot and Notre Dame had the same Christmas Eve Midnight Mass that was held at St. Stans there would be no people from Notre Dame going to church! There are a lot of reasons St. Stan's people will not go to PJP and that is a big one!
Average Joe

Taunton, MA

#14 Jul 14, 2009
to "Really" your post makes no sense!

Another fine grad os St Stans???? Class of.....

The only "big one" is you!
PJP

Gansevoort, NY

#15 Jul 14, 2009
Anyone who has been tracking the collections at PJP will know things are looking good. If you look at the total collections for each month, you'll know that October, November and December's those months averaged $17,000 each. Starting in 2009, the first two months averaged $21,000 per month. Then starting in March thru to June the monthly collections were averaging $27,000 a month. No explanation why the collections have increased so much over the passed four month.

The fiscal budget for past year was $359,675, not the $520,000 stated in Clarity's posting (#3). You maybe surprise when you see the financial report.
Are you kidding

Easthampton, MA

#16 Jul 14, 2009
PJP wrote:
Anyone who has been tracking the collections at PJP will know things are looking good. If you look at the total collections for each month, you'll know that October, November and December's those months averaged $17,000 each. Starting in 2009, the first two months averaged $21,000 per month. Then starting in March thru to June the monthly collections were averaging $27,000 a month. No explanation why the collections have increased so much over the passed four month.
The fiscal budget for past year was $359,675, not the $520,000 stated in Clarity's posting (#3). You maybe surprise when you see the financial report.
Oh, we have been tracking the collections every week since the beginning of the year. Comparing 2008 weekly collection (of both parishes) to this years collection amount. Here are just a few examples:
2008 Week 1: ND/StT + SSK =$14,788 vs. 2009 JPG =$8,215 (decrease $6,573 or -44%).
2008 Week 5: ND/StT + SSK =$9,274 vs 2009 JPG =$5,776 (decrease $3,499 or -38%)
2008 Week 11: ND/StT + SSK =$7,460 vs 2009 JPG =$4,707 (decrease $2,753 or -37%)
2008 Week 17: ND/StT + SSK =$8,199 vs 2009 JPG =$4,681 (decrease $3,519 or -43%)
2008 Week 22: ND/StT + SSK =$9,154 vs 2009 JPG =$4,662 (decrease $4,492 or -49%)
Things are very bleak. If the financial report comes out otherwise, someone has cooked the books.
The Figures

Easthampton, MA

#17 Jul 14, 2009
Currently at the 2009 26th week:

Total Comparison Weekly Collection amount:
2008 ND/StT + SSK =$215,357 vs 2009 JPG $150,856 (decrease of $64,501)
Average Joe

Taunton, MA

#18 Jul 14, 2009
Well "Are you Kidding" & "The Figures", in a bad economy and recession I would say it is not too bad! There are still time to make that up!

You have to beliveeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee eee!

"Thanks be to GOD"!

AMEN!
Just the Facts

Easthampton, MA

#19 Jul 14, 2009
PJP wrote:
The fiscal budget for past year was $359,675, not the $520,000 stated in Clarity's posting (#3). You maybe surprise when you see the financial report.
I see that you are using the fiscal budget figures from the Parish of Notre Dame & St. Thomas ONLY and NOT including SSK's fiscal budget figure (I'm sorry,I thought we were the "yoked" Catholic Community of Adams)

Example: 2007-2008 ND/StT had a fiscal budget of $356,927 and SSK had a fiscal budget of $209,370 [together they total $566,297].

Nevertheless, even if you are using ONLY the ND/StT budget amount, for this years fiscal figures. Given the current level of collections, JPG will probally end up operating appox.$60,000 in the red, for its first full year of operation (Jan 09 - Dec 09).

I bet your favorite bedtime story was...THE EMPEROR'S NEW CLOTHES?
I Can Count

Easthampton, MA

#20 Jul 14, 2009
Average Joe wrote:
There are still time to make that up!
You have to beliveeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee eee!

AMEN!
Joe, do the math! The parish collection amount at this half-year mark, total $150,000. PJP quoted an annual budget of $360,000. Buddy, what is 150,000 x 2=$300,000? The parish is going to be short(in the red)$60,000!

This may be a good time to remind you SSK's fiscal budget was around $200,000. This budget we could afford, it would be within our means. AMEN!

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