Yes on Measure A

The debate on the DDR Mall has prompted me to write - as a downtown merchant - and as a resident of Mendocino County.

[Yes on A]

Thank you for that well written letter. It is important that as people cast their votes on Measure A they not only think about what they need, but also what their neighbors need.

[MendoGirl Ukiah]

My sentiments exactly! I think one of the problems is that Ukiah seems to have too many elitists who don't seem to realize that most of this county cannot and does not live as well as them.

[You have a point]

... but all your points can be solved by using the existing locales we have zoned for retail. You don't present a single argument to vote in favor of A in your letter that can't be addressed with already existing opportunities.
I am glad that you were able to build your career and business by starting in food service. However have you taken a look lately?
There was once a time where retail and fast food service was a launching pad for our youth to get into the working force and learn ethics, life skills etc. Now almost every fast food restaurant and retail is full of Mexicans, mostly adult Mexicans at that. No more do you see our local youth having these opportunities. You want to blame the fact that our youth are turning to trimming as a means to earn money? Start with the fact that Mexicans are taking all the jobs that used to be available to them. I know I know there is a TON more wrong with the trimming youth issue than just that but its valid for this argument.
Yes we have a section of our community that can't or don't shop downtown. The argument that others go to Santa Rosa to shop holds no water with me and others like me who hardly ever go there to shop. One guy keeps posting here how he spends thousands of dollars there each year and will continue to do so if we don't get this phantom mall. Thanks for supporting your community man. I have lived here 30 years and never found the need to shop south. I have no problem finding everything for my family, yes I have a kid too, right here in Ukiah. If I can do it so can others. They don't necessarily shop there out of need, they do it out of preference. There is a big dif in that. My wife and I aren't rich but we do make a modest income and we have no problem finding everything we need right here at an affordable price.
You don't address however all the problems that can arise from this project such as traffic, EIR, safety, water, sewer, and the BIG fact that if approved there is no accountability for DDR to fix things. The cost to fix things will land in our lap. Why would anyone vote for so many unsure things is beyond me. Part of the YES argument is that if we don't pass this then that property will sit there as an eyesore for another 20 years. Well there is ZERO guarantee that this mall will go in and even if they DO develop the property even DDR has said it could be upwards of 10 years before it happens.
Yes we want retail. We want jobs. We want options, availability, choices. We want our money to stay local. We want the Masonite site cleaned up and put to use. We want all these things you YES on A people want. What we DON'T want is to give up our local control to some going broke, out of state company who cares nothing about our community. We DON'T want to lose the most valuable option for industry should we find one. We DON'T want to be left holding the bill when issues arise that this measure alleviates DDR's responsibility from. We DON'T want to rezone valuable industry land for retail when we have empty retail lots just sitting. Let US rezone the property for OUR use that benefits OUR county, valley, community if it needs to be rezoned.
No, there are too many thing wrong with this measure to possibly vote yes. I agree there are some attractive things about developing the property but there are far too many unattractive things about this DDR deal. You can put lipstick on a pig... but its still just a pig.
By the way what restaurant is it that you own?

[MendoMike]

You have a point wrote:

... but all your points can be solved by using the existing locales we have zoned for retail. You don't present a single argument to vote in favor of A in your letter that can't be addressed with already existing opportunities.

Here's a couple of reasons- one is, money. We spend 170 million a year out of the County, money we need for our own tax base. It will not benefit Mendocino County one bit if we defer The Crossings project in favor of City zoned retail space at the Airport- we have no tax sharing agreement. The County needs tax revenue.

Another good reason is- look at the site. It is absolutely the most run down, depressing looking area in all of Mendocino County. If there was ever a site that needed to be cleaned up it's this one.

A third reason, and I admit this one is selfish,is I don't want to see ANY heavy industry in the heart of the Ukiah Valley. Not a slaughterhouse, not a pellet stove fuel factory, not even a sawmill- and rezoning the site will insure that doesn't happen because, let's fact it, once the economy turns there will be Eastern carpet baggers coming into town looking to exploit our natural resources, industrial lands and good natured, hard working people. ;)

So other than tax revenue, cleaning up an eyesore and protecting the Ukiah Valley from another heavy industry polluter you're almost right. Now why again are you No on A? I can't think of a single good reason to oppose it.

[Get Out]

You have a point wrote:

By the way what restaurant is it that you own?

You must not be a local.

[It will never be built]

Doesn't matter if Measure A passes or not. The Greatest Depression is going to imminently destroy commercial real estate. The mall will NEVER be built. If DDR wins, Masonite land will just sit there as an eye-sore for decades, like Fjord's.

[Taxpayer]

I'm for it all the way. Even if DDR can't afford to build, rezoning will allow them to sell to somebody who will build. No industry is coming here and nobody is inviting them to come, that is a sick joke and a smoke screen. It would be a waste of time. We have no work force, no shipping by rail, and the last industrial land near the airport is now commercial waiting for a mall (hypocrisy)to be built.
If our Supes and planning department won't do their jobs then the voters will have to.

VOTE YES ON A

[You have a point]

MendoMike wrote:

<quoted text>
So other than tax revenue, cleaning up an eyesore and protecting the Ukiah Valley from another heavy industry polluter you're almost right. Now why again are you No on A? I can't think of a single good reason to oppose it.

Why am I voting no? I think I covered that in my reply which if you read you'll see I addressed the arguments you use to vote yes.

170 mil spent out of county, where does that number really come from and again, while people do shop out of county, they don't NEED to... its a choice. They can easily spend their money here. I do. I find no need or reason to go south as I mentioned.

That eye sore, which I agree it is, will still be that way for YEARS even IF DDR builds there. And what happens if they don't which is a real possibility most YES people ignore.

I agree with you on the heavy industry, I would not want those type of factories here, however lets work on that as a community. there are MANY things we can use that land for.

I can't argue the tax revenue point, city vs. county. You're right on that one, but again that is something that can and should be addressed within our local government. Its not something that can't be changed.

Why does no one from the YES side ever address the REAL issues such as the water, sewer blah blah blah that I already mentioned. Or the way DDR is going around the system and wont be accountable for other issues that will cost us money to fix if they really do build the site? The fact that DDR is in financial hardship? The fact that no retailer has committed to actually coming here if this passes?

It's just not as simple as "hey lets build a big mall and all our problems are solved." I am willing to bet they wouldn't even employ local contractors to build... our local 'community minded, family oriented Thurston gang didn't even employ locally to build they're worthless dealership. And the labor crew? all Mexicans.

Why with so many 'not sures' and 'what ifs'... no guarantee that any of the points you make for your argument to vote yes, would anybody take that chance? I don't get it. I want whats best for our community and nothing yet has convinced me otherwise that this is our god sending fix all.

Funny thing is we both want the same things, retail, jobs, money in the county, that eye sore cleaned up, but DDR and this phantom mall is not the answer.

[You have a point]

Get Out wrote:

<quoted text>
You must not be a local.

So 30 years in this community doesn't make me a local huh? Willing to bet I've been here longer than you have. And I spend my $$ here to.... do you? Who is the real local.

[You have a point]

Taxpayer wrote:

I'm for it all the way. Even if DDR can't afford to build, rezoning will allow them to sell to somebody who will build. No industry is coming here and nobody is inviting them to come, that is a sick joke and a smoke screen. It would be a waste of time. We have no work force, no shipping by rail, and the last industrial land near the airport is now commercial waiting for a mall (hypocrisy)to be built.
If our Supes and planning department won't do their jobs then the voters will have to.
VOTE YES ON A

About as sick a smoke screen as DDR being our God Send. You're absolutely right though, if the supes won't do their jobs then lets do something about it instead of dreaming some out of state company is going to step in and 'save' us.

I can't agree more for the main reasons you YES people want the mall, I simply am not convinced that THIS deal and DDR are the way to fix the issues we all seem to agree on. To many variables, too many unknowns, no guarantees, and too many real issues that can affect the community in a negative way when weighed against the few maybe positive things that 'may' happen.

Vote NO on A.

[the fearless spectator]

It's refreshing to read a clear and seemingly honest opinion on this very community dividing topic. If the writer has a political agenda so be it.....the non-elitism is welcome, most ordinary people can relate to that; I think I'll vote yes on A......

[if there was]

IF there was a mall project in front of the planning commission or board of supervisors, your arguments would make sense, agree with them or not. But there is no mall project. There is no Costco. There is no safe space for teens to hang out. There is only a zoning change that lets DDR claim the land is worth, what? 6 times what they paid for it.
---
Do you really think it's a good idea to set a precedent whereby any big corporation from outtahere can gamble on winning a local election with slick big money campaigning, to allow them to bypass the local planning process and local control by local elected officials?
---
Do you know that DDR is right now suing Seabrook NH for turning down their permit because DDR refused to do as much mitigation of traffic impact as two traffic engineers reviewing the plan, the fire chief and the police chief said was necessary (using DDR's own cars-per-hour figures to model the impact of increased traffic)? Google it, you'll see. I doubt the fire chief and police chief in Seabrook, NH are NIMBY reflexively anti-growth progressive elitist pot growers.... probably the Seabrook planning board members aren't either.(Seabrook NH has a nuclear power plant, and many malls already.)

[Nova]

You have a point wrote:

<quoted text>
Why am I voting no? I think I covered that in my reply which if you read you'll see I addressed the arguments you use to vote yes.
170 mil spent out of county, where does that number really come from and again, while people do shop out of county, they don't NEED to... its a choice. They can easily spend their money here. I do. I find no need or reason to go south as I mentioned.
That eye sore, which I agree it is, will still be that way for YEARS even IF DDR builds there. And what happens if they don't which is a real possibility most YES people ignore.
I agree with you on the heavy industry, I would not want those type of factories here, however lets work on that as a community. there are MANY things we can use that land for.
I can't argue the tax revenue point, city vs. county. You're right on that one, but again that is something that can and should be addressed within our local government. Its not something that can't be changed.
Why does no one from the YES side ever address the REAL issues such as the water, sewer blah blah blah that I already mentioned. Or the way DDR is going around the system and wont be accountable for other issues that will cost us money to fix if they really do build the site? The fact that DDR is in financial hardship? The fact that no retailer has committed to actually coming here if this passes?
It's just not as simple as "hey lets build a big mall and all our problems are solved." I am willing to bet they wouldn't even employ local contractors to build... our local 'community minded, family oriented Thurston gang didn't even employ locally to build they're worthless dealership. And the labor crew? all Mexicans.
Why with so many 'not sures' and 'what ifs'... no guarantee that any of the points you make for your argument to vote yes, would anybody take that chance? I don't get it. I want whats best for our community and nothing yet has convinced me otherwise that this is our god sending fix all.
Funny thing is we both want the same things, retail, jobs, money in the county, that eye sore cleaned up, but DDR and this phantom mall is not the answer.

Talking out of your A...ss

[Michael Toschi]

We should vote yes on Measure A because retailers that want to come to Mendocino Crossings that are not able to, they have the availability to come to the Ukiah Airport area like PetSmart (Jeff Adams said Mendocino Crossings has only room for one pet store tenant, and Petco is doing better than PetSmart, financially, and they already have a letter of intent from Petco.), Borders (Jeff Adams said it likely that Barnes & Noble is likely to come to Mendocino Crossings because Barnes & Noble is doing better than Borders, financially, even though Barnes & Noble has not expressed interest to come to Mendocino Crossings, at this time), and retailers like those.

[For The Local Economy]

First.. again with the we need the taxes. Well, first lets make sure that our county is spending their dollars local. Go to County Admin and ask them to open the books to show where the money is being spent. Ask them who their contracted vendor is for office supplies. You are a tax payer, you have the right to this information. They will tell you.. it is a business in SONOMA County. Yeah.. that is helpful.
Secondly Where are the letters of intent? Why havent they been in their glossy marketing campaign mailers that fill my mailbox every day? Why? Because every business is suffering in this economy and not many are expanding. These are all promises based on suppositions. If you vote yes, then we propose to do this. I havent seen anything where they commit to do it. Lets see the letters, and lets hear from the people who will absolutely, for certain commit to moving their business to Ukiah with a population of 15,000.
Now, take a drive around our valley. Look at the pretty green, smogless hills. Look at the children who breathe clean air. Then take a drive a little bit further south maybe about an hour or so. Look at the smog, look at the conjestion. Think about all that traffic, in your nice peaceful, clean valley.
Spend your money with your neighbors and friends. Support them like they have supported this community for a very long time. Make a commitment to not letting another business go under because the money earned here leaves the area. This is your home, take care of it for yourself.. your family and your future.
No on A.

[Ukiah Pariah]

You have a point wrote:

... but all your points can be solved by using the existing locales we have zoned for retail. You don't present a single argument to vote in favor of A in your letter that can't be addressed with already existing opportunities.
I am glad that you were able to build your career and business by starting in food service. However have you taken a look lately?
There was once a time where retail and fast food service was a launching pad for our youth to get into the working force and learn ethics, life skills etc. Now almost every fast food restaurant and retail is full of Mexicans, mostly adult Mexicans at that. No more do you see our local youth having these opportunities. You want to blame the fact that our youth are turning to trimming as a means to earn money? Start with the fact that Mexicans are taking all the jobs that used to be available to them. I know I know there is a TON more wrong with the trimming youth issue than just that but its valid for this argument.
Yes we have a section of our community that can't or don't shop downtown. The argument that others go to Santa Rosa to shop holds no water with me and others like me who hardly ever go there to shop. One guy keeps posting here how he spends thousands of dollars there each year and will continue to do so if we don't get this phantom mall. Thanks for supporting your community man. I have lived here 30 years and never found the need to shop south. I have no problem finding everything for my family, yes I have a kid too, right here in Ukiah. If I can do it so can others. They don't necessarily shop there out of need, they do it out of preference. There is a big dif in that. My wife and I aren't rich but we do make a modest income and we have no problem finding everything we need right here at an affordable price.
You don't address however all the problems that can arise from this project such as traffic, EIR, safety, water, sewer, and the BIG fact that if approved there is no accountability for DDR to fix things. The cost to fix things will land in our lap. Why would anyone vote for so many unsure things is beyond me. Part of the YES argument is that if we don't pass this then that property will sit there as an eyesore for another 20 years. Well there is ZERO guarantee that this mall will go in and even if they DO develop the property even DDR has said it could be upwards of 10 years before it happens.
Yes we want retail. We want jobs. We want options, availability, choices. We want our money to stay local. We want the Masonite site cleaned up and put to use. We want all these things you YES on A people want. What we DON'T want is to give up our local control to some going broke, out of state company who cares nothing about our community. We DON'T want to lose the most valuable option for industry should we find one. We DON'T want to be left holding the bill when issues arise that this measure alleviates DDR's responsibility from. We DON'T want to rezone valuable industry land for retail when we have empty retail lots just sitting. Let US rezone the property for OUR use that benefits OUR county, valley, community if it needs to be rezoned.
No, there are too many thing wrong with this measure to possibly vote yes. I agree there are some attractive things about developing the property but there are far too many unattractive things about this DDR deal. You can put lipstick on a pig... but its still just a pig.
By the way what restaurant is it that you own?

Carol and her husband, Chris, and their son, Will own the North State Cafe, a very high-end restaurant. They have been working hard, and making a living in a difficult business. Thank you, Carol, for taking a position on Measure A in a logical, well-written, non-threatening manner. You are a class act.

[Get Out]

You have a point wrote:

<quoted text>
So 30 years in this community doesn't make me a local huh? Willing to bet I've been here longer than you have. And I spend my $$ here to.... do you? Who is the real local.

You have not been here longer than I have, even if 30 years is true. I doubt it is, if you don't know what restaurant Carol owns. You loose on all accounts. Pay up and get your nose out of our business.

[Get Out]

You have a point wrote:

<quoted text>
Why does no one from the YES side ever address the REAL issues such as the water, sewer blah blah blah that I already mentioned. Or the way DDR is going around the system and wont be accountable for other issues that will cost us money to fix if they really do build the site? The fact that DDR is in financial hardship? The fact that no retailer has committed to actually coming here if this passes?

Those have been addressed time and time again. The "no" folks merely ignore the answers and regurgitate the same hysteria (see your quote above) rather than trying to further the discussion with legitimate counterpoints. But hey, its how Rove got W in office twice, so I suppose it’s a proven tactic. Good luck with that.

[MendoMike]

For The Local Economy wrote:

Now, take a drive around our valley. Look at the pretty green, smogless hills. Look at the children who breathe clean air. Then take a drive a little bit further south maybe about an hour or so. Look at the smog, look at the conjestion. Think about all that traffic, in your nice peaceful, clean valley.

LOL, you crack me up...So you propose a heavy industry right in the heart of the Ukiah Valley- maybe a wood pellet mill, maybe a slaughterhouse- because it'll pollute less than retail stores? You guys are reaching, and you're coming up short.

Also why do you insist there will be no CEQA at the site? Do a Google for CEQA, read it, and you'll understand it's State regulations that cannot be waived by a vote at the County level. If you don't believe me then call Millview water district and ask them.

[Ohboy]

DDR has a background in going over the head of local planning throughout the United States. If DDR would have come up some specific s on this project and would of gone through the process without some costly election it might of been recieved better by the citizens. DDR wants a slam dunk deal no doubt with as little obligations as possable. Its all about proper planning for Ukiah Valley. Non-Valley residents might veiw Ukiah as a supply center for themselfs and unfortnately could care less about the everyday impacts from this project that would effect our valley residents. The postive of this proposed project is it has brought alot of focus into our future planning in this county and thats all we have to thank DDR for and nothing else.