Is Paul Ryan Completely Nuts???
Commode Doe

Caruthersville, MO

#24 Mar 19, 2013
John Doe wrote:
Alumni,
Would you tell me where you got your numbers from so I can study those in context?
Also, there have been amounts for the voucher mentioned. We have no idea if the vouch would be for $18,000 or $18.
Until the full details of the plan are released, I shall wait and see without passing judgement.
Jesus Christ Doe!!!!!!!!

Can you not EVER look anything up your self?????? You bitch about the poor being lazy and look at you????? Always asking for a hand out!!!!
1961 Alumni Rolla MO

Rolla, MO

#25 Mar 19, 2013
John Doe wrote:
Alumni,
Would you tell me where you got your numbers from so I can study those in context?
Also, there have been amounts for the voucher mentioned. We have no idea if the vouch would be for $18,000 or $18.
Until the full details of the plan are released, I shall wait and see without passing judgement.
I told you wrong, I was actually 62 yrs old when I checked with Blue Cross/Blue Shield & Prudential as to what it would cost for health insurance for me. I also checked with a couple of other insurance companies, but I can't remember which ones.

That was in 2005, and I have no doubt the rates would be higher now (especially for anyone 70-80 yrs old). So, the $18,000 & $36,000 rates I quoted were MY OWN ESTIMATION of what private insurance would cost for a 70-90 year old healthy & an sickly person. But, I'd be willing to bet that these figures would't be too far off base.

As I mentioned before in 2005, the cheapest health care coverage I could find was with a new plan AARP had come out with for people from 55-65 yrs old. This plan paid a set amount for each service, procedure, surgery etc. However, I was lucky & never had to use it.

I have no doubt, even with this insurance, there would have been large balance due that the insurance didn't pay if I had been in the hospital or had a serious illness. But, it did give some peace of mind to have this insurance (just in case)...
Commode Ryan

Caruthersville, MO

#26 Mar 20, 2013
Even current GOP members are now questioning Ryan.
But as long as he hates Obama for being Obama, he will get the Tea Billy support. Cant ya tell that from in here?
John Doe

Poplar Bluff, MO

#27 Mar 20, 2013
1961 Alumni Rolla MO wrote:
<quoted text>
I told you wrong, I was actually 62 yrs old when I checked with Blue Cross/Blue Shield & Prudential as to what it would cost for health insurance for me. I also checked with a couple of other insurance companies, but I can't remember which ones.
That was in 2005, and I have no doubt the rates would be higher now (especially for anyone 70-80 yrs old). So, the $18,000 & $36,000 rates I quoted were MY OWN ESTIMATION of what private insurance would cost for a 70-90 year old healthy & an sickly person. But, I'd be willing to bet that these figures would't be too far off base.
As I mentioned before in 2005, the cheapest health care coverage I could find was with a new plan AARP had come out with for people from 55-65 yrs old. This plan paid a set amount for each service, procedure, surgery etc. However, I was lucky & never had to use it.
I have no doubt, even with this insurance, there would have been large balance due that the insurance didn't pay if I had been in the hospital or had a serious illness. But, it did give some peace of mind to have this insurance (just in case)...
Thank you for the clarification, I appreciate it.

Personally, I wish I could find the actual proposed Ryan budget so I could study the numbers myself. I would also love to see a certain law retracted. no, I don't mean Obamacare. That boondoggle has been hung around our necks and I can't see how we'll ever get rid of it.

The law I am referring to that changed things so that social security funds were to go into the general fund instead of the Social Security/Medicare trust funds
1961 Alumni Rolla MO

Rolla, MO

#28 Mar 21, 2013
John Doe wrote:
<quoted text>
Thank you for the clarification, I appreciate it.
Personally, I wish I could find the actual proposed Ryan budget so I could study the numbers myself. I would also love to see a certain law retracted. no, I don't mean Obamacare. That boondoggle has been hung around our necks and I can't see how we'll ever get rid of it.
The law I am referring to that changed things so that social security funds were to go into the general fund instead of the Social Security/Medicare trust funds
I believe all Social Security payroll tax money started going into the general fund during the Reagan administration.

However, Clinton stopped this during his administration - so that that S.S. payroll tax money would (from that time forward) go only into the S.S. trust fund. So, I only hope that since Clinton changed this - all S.S. taxes are still going into the trust fund.

However, I don't know if Bush changed Clinton's ruling - and started having S.S. payroll tax money going back into the general fund or not.

But, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if he did...
John Doe

Poplar Bluff, MO

#31 Mar 21, 2013
Truth be told, there is no need for name calling. Discussing the issues and coming to a compromise that we can push our so called leadership to support is the way to go.
John Doe

Poplar Bluff, MO

#32 Mar 21, 2013
1961 Alumni Rolla MO wrote:
<quoted text>
I believe all Social Security payroll tax money started going into the general fund during the Reagan administration.
However, Clinton stopped this during his administration - so that that S.S. payroll tax money would (from that time forward) go only into the S.S. trust fund. So, I only hope that since Clinton changed this - all S.S. taxes are still going into the trust fund.
However, I don't know if Bush changed Clinton's ruling - and started having S.S. payroll tax money going back into the general fund or not.
But, I wouldn't be a bit surprised if he did...
Alumni,

I regret that I made an error. It is not that the funds go into the general fund. Where I made my mistake was that by law, the Government can invest the social security funds into things such as T-bills, T-Notes, and T-Bonds and all at the discretion of the Treasury Department.

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/When_was_Social_Sec...
John Doe

Poplar Bluff, MO

#33 Mar 21, 2013
Oh and Alumni, while I didn't do it and I have no control over it, I apologize for the name calling. you and I have been sanely discussing issues and I think coming to some accords on certain issues. There was no need for the name calling

“People Need To Chill”

Since: Mar 08

Location hidden

#35 Mar 22, 2013
John Doe wrote:
Oh and Alumni, while I didn't do it and I have no control over it, I apologize for the name calling. you and I have been sanely discussing issues and I think coming to some accords on certain issues. There was no need for the name calling
I find it odd that you have apologized more than once for Truthbetold, when we all know it is Comrade Winston doing the name calling in this debate. Regardless what name he uses, its so obvious when it is him. He can never communicate on an adult level and discuss anything civilly without injecting his hatred and name calling. As you can see he will never be a real man and apologize for anything.

I think who ever it was that called him a "bully" was 100% correct on that judgement call. The only way he can act civilly is if you agree 100% with him always.

This is whats wrong with our gov't today. People who act like him in power.
1961 Alumni Rolla MO

Rolla, MO

#36 Mar 22, 2013
Truthbetold wrote:
I make no such apologies. If you're going to preach about social security on a ridiculous thread YOU started, named "is Paul Ryan completely nuts???" And then tell bald faced lies, expect to be called out on it.
Act like you got some brains if you want to be treated as such....
Truthbetold,
I suppose since I'm the one who started this thread about Paul Ryan's insane budget - you have directed your venom in this post to me.

While, I might have been mistaken about the way the Social Security payroll tax money is handled by our government - I am definately not mistaken about how bad Paul Ryan's plan to voucherize Medicare will be!!!

Can you tell me JUST WHAT BALD FACED LIES I HAVE TOLD ABOUT HOW DEVASTATING THIS VOUCHER PLAN WILL BE TO MILLIONS & MILLIONS OF SENIORS???

I am really looking forward to how you will try to squirm out of this???

Come on, I waiting to hear from you about just how ALL MEDICARE BENEFICIERIES will be better off IF MEDICARE IS VOUCHERIZED...

I'm waiting...

I'm waiting...

I'm waiting...
John Doe

Poplar Bluff, MO

#38 Mar 22, 2013
1961 Alumni Rolla MO wrote:
<quoted text>
Truthbetold,
I suppose since I'm the one who started this thread about Paul Ryan's insane budget - you have directed your venom in this post to me.
While, I might have been mistaken about the way the Social Security payroll tax money is handled by our government - I am definately not mistaken about how bad Paul Ryan's plan to voucherize Medicare will be!!!
Can you tell me JUST WHAT BALD FACED LIES I HAVE TOLD ABOUT HOW DEVASTATING THIS VOUCHER PLAN WILL BE TO MILLIONS & MILLIONS OF SENIORS???
I am really looking forward to how you will try to squirm out of this???
Come on, I waiting to hear from you about just how ALL MEDICARE BENEFICIERIES will be better off IF MEDICARE IS VOUCHERIZED...
I'm waiting...
I'm waiting...
I'm waiting...
Alumni,

You have said two things that I have to challenge and I thought one of these we had talked out.

To start, I'd like to ask a simple question. Have you seen the Ryan Budget? I haven't and I can't find anywhere on line. Until we see what is in that budget, we can make any decisions on how sane or insane, how good or how bad that budget is.

Social Security/Medicare Vouchers. WOW, want to fire up the left, mention vouchers in relation to almost anything and the left goes off that gasoline when it is introduced to a lit match.

The voucher system could be good or bad. It all depends on the numbers and how it is set up to work. Until we have the acutal terms and the actual numbers, we will never know if the system is good or bad.

I am certain that we need to see the real number and the mechanics how the Ryan Budget is going to work and/or how a Social Security/Medicare voucher system is going to work before we pass any kind of a judgement.

Please, let's do what others are currently trying to do with the sequester. Let's not try to blame every thing on something we know nothing about.
1961 Alumni Rolla MO

Rolla, MO

#40 Mar 22, 2013
Truthbetold wrote:
<quoted text>first, you tried to insinuate s.s. funds were moved to the general budget by republicans - a lie. Then you tried to drag Ronald Reagan into you baloney _ a lie. Then you capped it off by giving slick Willie Clinton credit for restoring the SS funds off budget back out of the general funds, when he did no such thing.
Didn't I already admit that I made a mistake about the S.S funds?

Now, I still waiting for you to tell just how much better off senior citizens will be with Paul Ryan's vouchering Medicare. If you will recall - you also acused me of lying about Paul Ryan's budget - WHICH INCLUDES VOUCHERIZING MEDICARE. So, I'm still waiting for an answer from you.

I'm waiting...

I'm waiting...

I'm waiting...
John Doe

Poplar Bluff, MO

#41 Mar 22, 2013
1961 Alumni Rolla MO wrote:
<quoted text>
Didn't I already admit that I made a mistake about the S.S funds?
Now, I still waiting for you to tell just how much better off senior citizens will be with Paul Ryan's vouchering Medicare. If you will recall - you also acused me of lying about Paul Ryan's budget - WHICH INCLUDES VOUCHERIZING MEDICARE. So, I'm still waiting for an answer from you.
I'm waiting...
I'm waiting...
I'm waiting...
I am hurt Alumni. Completely cut to the quick that you ignored what I said and the questions I asked you.
1961 Alumni Rolla MO

Rolla, MO

#42 Mar 23, 2013
John Doe wrote:
<quoted text>
Alumni,
You have said two things that I have to challenge and I thought one of these we had talked out.
To start, I'd like to ask a simple question. Have you seen the Ryan Budget? I haven't and I can't find anywhere on line. Until we see what is in that budget, we can make any decisions on how sane or insane, how good or how bad that budget is.
Social Security/Medicare Vouchers. WOW, want to fire up the left, mention vouchers in relation to almost anything and the left goes off that gasoline when it is introduced to a lit match.
The voucher system could be good or bad. It all depends on the numbers and how it is set up to work. Until we have the acutal terms and the actual numbers, we will never know if the system is good or bad.
I am certain that we need to see the real number and the mechanics how the Ryan Budget is going to work and/or how a Social Security/Medicare voucher system is going to work before we pass any kind of a judgement.
Please, let's do what others are currently trying to do with the sequester. Let's not try to blame every thing on something we know nothing about.
No, I have not seen the Ryan budget. But, I do remember a few months back Ryan was mentioning a sum of $8,000. I don't know if Ryan meant for this $8,000. as a lump sum payment forever - or for one year. I never heard anymore about the $8,000.

If $8,000. would be the sum total payment forever - I doubt this amount would pay for even ONE YEAR of private insurance coverage for someone from age 65-90 or older.

As, a matter of fact, I know it wouldn't - because this would only equal $666.00 per month. And, several private insurances companies quoted me this approximate amount to cover me 8 years ago when I was only 62. And, I'm sure it would cost MUCH MORE NOW!

And I can't imagine this $8,000 in the form of a voucher for each Medicare beneficary PER YEAR.

Heck, millions & millions of Americans don't incur even $1,000 per year in costs to Medicare. I know I haven't yet -(even though I pay over $1200 in Medicare premiums every year. That's right, I'm actually paying more into Medicare every year that I've ever got out of it. This doesn't even count the 37 years of Medicare premiums I paid into Medicare when I was working.

So, if Ryan's plan would issue a $8,000 voucher per year to people like me - WHO INCUR VERY SMALL COSTS TO MEDICARE - our government would be hurting themselves badly & would be sure to go bankrupt much sooner.

All experts who have studied Ryan's bill say it would cost most Medicare beneficiars over $4,000 more out-of-pocket per year. Obviously, this would prohibit many,(if not - most) elderly people from being able to afford health coverage.
John Doe

Poplar Bluff, MO

#43 Mar 23, 2013
Alumni,

You have expertly shown the problem. People from both sides are making sweeping statements about budgets and vouchering when we have never seen the actual numbers or how any of is supposed to work.

I am not jumping on the new Dem budget because I just don't know what's in it. There's talk of tax hikes in the new Dem budget but the left is saying it is only on millionaires. Heck the last tax hike the dems got through was only supposed to be on millions too but it hit everyone and suddenly the talk of taxing the top 1% became taxing the top 2% with everyone else getting a 2 percent hike.

The problem we all face is what has been promised and never given. Transparency. Until the budgets are posted where all of us can see them and study, we're never going to know what is going.

My question is why will neither side posted their projected budgets and how they envision things working. Please note, I have said both sides here.

“Radical Islam! Radical Islam! ”

Since: Mar 08

Location hidden

#44 Mar 24, 2013
John Doe wrote:
Alumni,
You have expertly shown the problem. People from both sides are making sweeping statements about budgets and vouchering when we have never seen the actual numbers or how any of is supposed to work.
I am not jumping on the new Dem budget because I just don't know what's in it. There's talk of tax hikes in the new Dem budget but the left is saying it is only on millionaires. Heck the last tax hike the dems got through was only supposed to be on millions too but it hit everyone and suddenly the talk of taxing the top 1% became taxing the top 2% with everyone else getting a 2 percent hike.
The problem we all face is what has been promised and never given. Transparency. Until the budgets are posted where all of us can see them and study, we're never going to know what is going.
My question is why will neither side posted their projected budgets and how they envision things working. Please note, I have said both sides here.
What’s left of the "working poor and middle class" will always be the payroll check drawing citizens who pay any new taxes. If the democrats want to increase taxes by a trillion dollars, you can bet it will come from the people who draw a payroll check.

You say it's going to come from removing loopholes from the very rich? Who do you think works for the very rich? Who do the very rich sell their products and services to? Who owns the Democratic Party, the George Soros, GE, Google, Warren Buffet types or is it the poor who don't want to pay taxes?

Enjoy watching those poor ultra rich elites suffer, while you pay for that trillion dollar tax increase they say you need so they can increase government control over your lives. Get rid of that salt, put the big gulp down and sell all your guns. Start walking to work rather than drive that SUV. I'm sure the ultra rich will sell their gulf streams and five lakeside mansions, yeah, right...

Stupid Sheeple
Avid Reader

Caruthersville, MO

#45 Mar 24, 2013
ComradeWinston wrote:
<quoted text>What’s left of the "working poor and middle class" will always be the payroll check drawing citizens who pay any new taxes. If the democrats want to increase taxes by a trillion dollars, you can bet it will come from the people who draw a payroll check.
You say it's going to come from removing loopholes from the very rich? Who do you think works for the very rich? Who do the very rich sell their products and services to? Who owns the Democratic Party, the George Soros, GE, Google, Warren Buffet types or is it the poor who don't want to pay taxes?
Enjoy watching those poor ultra rich elites suffer, while you pay for that trillion dollar tax increase they say you need so they can increase government control over your lives. Get rid of that salt, put the big gulp down and sell all your guns. Start walking to work rather than drive that SUV. I'm sure the ultra rich will sell their gulf streams and five lakeside mansions, yeah, right...
Stupid Sheeple
Your a idiot. Ryans plan will increase taxes on every American $2K and your for helping the rich pay less taxes? You stupid fool! I've never read anymore negative hate filled posts than when I read any of yours. Its like your on a witch hunt out to destroy America.
John Doe

Poplar Bluff, MO

#46 Mar 24, 2013
Avid Reader wrote:
<quoted text>
Your a idiot. Ryans plan will increase taxes on every American $2K and your for helping the rich pay less taxes? You stupid fool! I've never read anymore negative hate filled posts than when I read any of yours. Its like your on a witch hunt out to destroy America.
Avid, How do you know this? I haven't seen the Ryan Budget and can't find it on line. Have you? If so please tell me where it is. I would like an opportunity to study it. How do you know what the Ryan Budget will do?
Gene

Caruthersville, MO

#47 Mar 24, 2013
In 2015 relative to todays tax system those making $1 million or more would enjoy an average tax cut of $265,000 and see their after tax income increase by 12.5 percent. By contras, half of those making between $20,000 and $30,000 would get no tax cut at all. On average, people in that income group would get a tax reduction of $129. Ryan would raise their after tax income by 0.5 percent.

Nearly all middle-income households (those making between $50,000 and $75,000) would see their taxes fall, by an average of roughly $1,000. Ryan would increase their after-tax income by about 2 percent.

Ryan would extend all of the 2001/2003 tax cuts, and then consolidate individual rates to just two—10 and 25 percent. In addition, he’d repeal the Alternative Minimum Tax, reduce the corporate rate from 35 percent to 25 percent, and kill the tax provisions of the 2010 health reform law.

As always the Republicans protect the wealthy and piss on everyone else
Gene

Caruthersville, MO

#48 Mar 24, 2013
The myth of raising taxes on middle class income of $2000 is bullshit. Another lie from the Obama White House. Ryan plan will lower tax rates, from 39.6 percent to 25 percent for those earning more than $400,000. Now thats bullshit too! If your going to lower tax rates lower everyones tax rates or simply pay a flat tax.

Sen Tom Coburn made some bold statements about the Democrat budget and I loved his comments about career politicians as well. That man has my respect for telling it like it is on BOTH sides of the fence, unlike assholes like Comrade and Doe Boy who look to blame everything on Democrats and Obama.

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