Is Peninsula Town Center a threat to City Center?

Dec 12, 2010 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: Hampton Roads Daily Press

Or is it? At first glance, the two giant outdoor town centers on the Peninsula might seem like they could turn into a big-time rivalry, the town center equivalent of the Washington Redskins versus the Dallas Cowboys or Boston Celtics against the Los Angeles Lakers .

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Shop In Williamsburg

Newport News, VA

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#1
Dec 12, 2010
 
Living between Williamsburg and Newport News, we went to the Hampton Town Center soon after it opened. We were there one evening with our dog to walk have grab a sandwich. We were immediately greeted by 2 Security officers and said we would have to leave because of the dog and that Town Center was private property...go figure. While exiting we had to navigate the street corner thugs who refused to move for pedestrian traffic, already staking out their rightful clams. Driving though Town Center was no different as folks would walk into the street to chat with friends in their cars while traffic is brought to a stop and horns begin to blow.
Typically we go to NN City Center for relaxing eveinig walks around the fountain, a bite to eat and the many activities and festivals. As for shopping. We also like to Newtown Center in Williamsburg as they have nice shops.

We will avoid the Hampton Town Center.....its not worth the aggravation. I don't think it will long until the Hampton Town Center turn into what was once the Colesium Mall.
Joe

Chincoteague Island, VA

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#2
Dec 12, 2010
 
Not only that but there is a special tax for the privilege to shop there! When it was the old Coliseum mall, the rent a cops were quick to harass and pester paying customers yet ignored the thugs breaking in cars and roaming the mall walking in packs and walking into people! I cant for the life of me understand why Hampton spent all that money there!
Shop in Williamsburg

Newport News, VA

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#3
Dec 13, 2010
 
Joe wrote:
Not only that but there is a special tax for the privilege to shop there! When it was the old Coliseum mall, the rent a cops were quick to harass and pester paying customers yet ignored the thugs breaking in cars and roaming the mall walking in packs and walking into people! I cant for the life of me understand why Hampton spent all that money there!
I forgot the extra tax....maybe because I didn't buy anything. Yea I remember "the packs" you speak of....walking five across...shoulder to shoulder daring you to try and make them move. LOL. Now they just stand in packs on the corners. My family will continue to avoid that area. Its not worth the aggravation.

Since: Mar 08

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#4
Dec 13, 2010
 
Joe wrote:
Not only that but there is a special tax for the privilege to shop there! When it was the old Coliseum mall, the rent a cops were quick to harass and pester paying customers yet ignored the thugs breaking in cars and roaming the mall walking in packs and walking into people! I cant for the life of me understand why Hampton spent all that money there!
Neither can I. If you follow the money trail that "Special Tax" ultimately winds up in the pockets of the Hampton City Administrative Bureaucrats. Customers in the Peninsula Town Center are paying it to make sure the six figure salaries of the Administrative drones aren't cut. The solution is simply not to shop there unless you absolutely have to.

“Drink up! Summer's comin'”

Since: Jul 10

San Diego, CA

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#5
Dec 14, 2010
 
Gammler wrote:
<quoted text>
Neither can I. If you follow the money trail that "Special Tax" ultimately winds up in the pockets of the Hampton City Administrative Bureaucrats. Customers in the Peninsula Town Center are paying it to make sure the six figure salaries of the Administrative drones aren't cut. The solution is simply not to shop there unless you absolutely have to.
The "Special Tax" goes to the developer as payment by the city. Kind of like, "If you build it, we will pay you." BTW, see if you can find the owner of the property. Strange how it is somewhat elusive in the tax assessor's office.

Since: Mar 08

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#6
Dec 15, 2010
 
Socialism is for Sissies wrote:
<quoted text>The "Special Tax" goes to the developer as payment by the city. Kind of like, "If you build it, we will pay you." BTW, see if you can find the owner of the property. Strange how it is somewhat elusive in the tax assessor's office.
The Hampton City government invented Three Card Monte. They are real good at "he went thataway". I guess everyone has a talent. Nothing they say can be taken at face value. If I hear something though I will post it here.
WiseOne

United States

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#7
Dec 30, 2010
 

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Shop In Williamsburg wrote:
Living between Williamsburg and Newport News, we went to the Hampton Town Center soon after it opened. We were there one evening with our dog to walk have grab a sandwich. We were immediately greeted by 2 Security officers and said we would have to leave because of the dog and that Town Center was private property...go figure. While exiting we had to navigate the street corner thugs who refused to move for pedestrian traffic, already staking out their rightful clams. Driving though Town Center was no different as folks would walk into the street to chat with friends in their cars while traffic is brought to a stop and horns begin to blow.
Typically we go to NN City Center for relaxing eveinig walks around the fountain, a bite to eat and the many activities and festivals. As for shopping. We also like to Newtown Center in Williamsburg as they have nice shops.
We will avoid the Hampton Town Center.....its not worth the aggravation. I don't think it will long until the Hampton Town Center turn into what was once the Colesium Mall.
Yup,give those dirtbags who "CONTROL" the area time enough,and they will turn HAMPTON TOWN CENTER into "THUG SLUM CENTER".where you wii be able to load up on CRACK ,WOMEN.amd GUNS. Wonder how long it will takw for the "FOR RENT" aigns to start popping up in vacant store windows. SECURETY is going after the wrong animals.The ones they want to ask to leave are the HOODS on 2 legs...
WiseOne

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#8
Dec 30, 2010
 

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Gammler wrote:
<quoted text>
The Hampton City government invented Three Card Monte. They are real good at "he went thataway". I guess everyone has a talent. Nothing they say can be taken at face value. If I hear something though I will post it here.
The "GOOD OL' BOY NETWORK...What else???
Hampton

Newport News, VA

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#9
Nov 14, 2011
 

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Joe wrote:
Not only that but there is a special tax for the privilege to shop there! When it was the old Coliseum mall, the rent a cops were quick to harass and pester paying customers yet ignored the thugs breaking in cars and roaming the mall walking in packs and walking into people! I cant for the life of me understand why Hampton spent all that money there!
Wrong, the PTC is both private and public property.The PTC was forcing the company that owns this mall, yes it nothing but a cheesy mall, a company Community Standards, everywhere here. Some of these standards? You may not take pictures of the buildings, exchange user information, no dogs, no carrying weapons. The problem, it is not clear, because the City of Hampton and the PTC don't seem to want to tell you, but, those streets, street lamps, parks, the parking deck are all publice property. I would thing the sidewalks are too. Hampton set up a TIF via of CDA, where 63 million in local taxes over the next 30 years will pay off bonds issued on behalf of the city to pay off the cost. The total bonds issued were 93 million, the 0.5% tax, well they call it a fee, goes to pay of the this difference (93 - 63 million ) not coming in from a str8 tax. A open carry org group had to take city hall to task about weapons, Va is an open carry state, i.e. handguns may be carried most places if they are in plain view aka open. The rent o cops were stopping and making peope leave. So, the city gets the bill for all the upkeep of the public areas now, unlike most malls, and in 30 years when the taxpayer and shopper pays this place off, guess they can section. 8 it, or tear it down since most malls seem to last about that long before a redevelop.. Oh, the PTC collects the parking meters coins, after an unknow overhead % that the PTC keeps, some % goes to charity. Nice they or the city will not tell you.
Hampton

Newport News, VA

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#10
Nov 14, 2011
 
Sorry about the typos, problem using mobile device and small screen.

Since: Mar 08

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#11
Nov 15, 2011
 
Hampton wrote:
<quoted text>
Wrong, the PTC is both private and public property.The PTC was forcing the company that owns this mall, yes it nothing but a cheesy mall, a company Community Standards, everywhere here. Some of these standards? You may not take pictures of the buildings, exchange user information, no dogs, no carrying weapons. The problem, it is not clear, because the City of Hampton and the PTC don't seem to want to tell you, but, those streets, street lamps, parks, the parking deck are all publice property. I would thing the sidewalks are too. Hampton set up a TIF via of CDA, where 63 million in local taxes over the next 30 years will pay off bonds issued on behalf of the city to pay off the cost. The total bonds issued were 93 million, the 0.5% tax, well they call it a fee, goes to pay of the this difference (93 - 63 million ) not coming in from a str8 tax. A open carry org group had to take city hall to task about weapons, Va is an open carry state, i.e. handguns may be carried most places if they are in plain view aka open. The rent o cops were stopping and making peope leave. So, the city gets the bill for all the upkeep of the public areas now, unlike most malls, and in 30 years when the taxpayer and shopper pays this place off, guess they can section. 8 it, or tear it down since most malls seem to last about that long before a redevelop.. Oh, the PTC collects the parking meters coins, after an unknow overhead % that the PTC keeps, some % goes to charity. Nice they or the city will not tell you.
For maybe the only time, Randy Gilliland was right. I don't have to shop there and I don't.

“Drink up! Summer's comin'”

Since: Jul 10

San Diego, CA

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#12
Nov 15, 2011
 
Do the aprtment renters have to pay that .5% tax on rent as well?
really

Hampton, VA

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#14
Nov 16, 2011
 
If I wanted to hang out with dogs coming up to me sniffing and pooping, I would visit a dog park. I'm thankful that Peninsula Town Center has a no dog policy.
Shop In Williamsburg wrote:
Living between Williamsburg and Newport News, we went to the Hampton Town Center soon after it opened. We were there one evening with our dog to walk have grab a sandwich. We were immediately greeted by 2 Security officers and said we would have to leave because of the dog and that Town Center was private property...go figure. While exiting we had to navigate the street corner thugs who refused to move for pedestrian traffic, already staking out their rightful clams. Driving though Town Center was no different as folks would walk into the street to chat with friends in their cars while traffic is brought to a stop and horns begin to blow.
Typically we go to NN City Center for relaxing eveinig walks around the fountain, a bite to eat and the many activities and festivals. As for shopping. We also like to Newtown Center in Williamsburg as they have nice shops.
We will avoid the Hampton Town Center.....its not worth the aggravation. I don't think it will long until the Hampton Town Center turn into what was once the Colesium Mall.
The hand basket 2 the PTC

Newport News, VA

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#15
Nov 16, 2011
 

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http://weblogs.dailypress.com/features/shoppi...

Read Gilliland bull "Basically, with the CDA that was put in place, the property owner Mall Properties agreed to tax itself," said Gilliland.
"The revenue from that taxation can then be used to repay bonds set up to redevelop the property, so you get the redevelopment you want, but don't place a debt burden on the citizens at large," he said.

Neatly ignores telling you the total bill is 93 million, that that 0.5% extra tax fee is just a small part. Financing for the city's burden to build this, i.e. buying the street, parks, parking deck, installing lights, etc, comes from the sale of $92.5-million in 30-year bonds. To repay the bonds, the City levied a special ad valorem real estate tax in the amount of $0.25 per $100 value. In addition, the city diverts all incremental taxes above those collected during a base year as well as 50% of incremental sales tax, 25% of incremental meals tax and 50% of incremental amusement tax. There is also a facility charge transaction fee (.5% fee applied to all retail purchases and fine dining) that is collected by the City Council approved Community Development Authority. These taxes pay off about 60 million of the 93 million the shooper's fee the rest.

When you look at the lost taxes generated by building the PTC for the next 30 years, for what is nothing more than a mall, the City Center looks pretty good. The construction of the buildings in the City Center seem less like a mall. Take a good look at the construction. The roads in the PTC maybe public, Hampton may call them roads, but they are are tight, more like just a way to get you to a parking lot, i.e. that do not add to the road infrastructure, unlike the City Center.

Given that the PTC cannibalized other stores in the area that have their full taxes go to the general tax fund, check out the closed Monqolian BBQ across from the PTC, the one in the PTC seems to be doing find, the real question is the PTC a threat to Hampton going bankrupt. When did the taxpayer start picking up the tab for building a mall?
What

Newport News, VA

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#16
Nov 16, 2011
 
really wrote:
If I wanted to hang out with dogs coming up to me sniffing and pooping, I would visit a dog park. I'm thankful that Peninsula Town Center has a no dog policy.
<quoted text>
Given the streets, public areas are being payed for by the Hampton tax payer, they belong to the public, I would argue that the PTC's dog policy is a moot point, BuckO Within stores, etc, the PTC can enforce whatever they want on property they own. For public places that falls under local laws. Maybe you should asked the PTC's rent a cop. I wouldn't want my dog sniffing you, would be afraid he might get something.

Since: Mar 08

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#17
Nov 16, 2011
 
The hand basket 2 the PTC wrote:
http://weblogs.dailypress.com/ features/shoppingblog/2010/01/ extra_charge_at_peninsula_town .html
Read Gilliland bull "Basically, with the CDA that was put in place, the property owner Mall Properties agreed to tax itself," said Gilliland.
"The revenue from that taxation can then be used to repay bonds set up to redevelop the property, so you get the redevelopment you want, but don't place a debt burden on the citizens at large," he said.
Neatly ignores telling you the total bill is 93 million, that that 0.5% extra tax fee is just a small part. Financing for the city's burden to build this, i.e. buying the street, parks, parking deck, installing lights, etc, comes from the sale of $92.5-million in 30-year bonds. To repay the bonds, the City levied a special ad valorem real estate tax in the amount of $0.25 per $100 value. In addition, the city diverts all incremental taxes above those collected during a base year as well as 50% of incremental sales tax, 25% of incremental meals tax and 50% of incremental amusement tax. There is also a facility charge transaction fee (.5% fee applied to all retail purchases and fine dining) that is collected by the City Council approved Community Development Authority. These taxes pay off about 60 million of the 93 million the shooper's fee the rest.
When you look at the lost taxes generated by building the PTC for the next 30 years, for what is nothing more than a mall, the City Center looks pretty good. The construction of the buildings in the City Center seem less like a mall. Take a good look at the construction. The roads in the PTC maybe public, Hampton may call them roads, but they are are tight, more like just a way to get you to a parking lot, i.e. that do not add to the road infrastructure, unlike the City Center.
Given that the PTC cannibalized other stores in the area that have their full taxes go to the general tax fund, check out the closed Monqolian BBQ across from the PTC, the one in the PTC seems to be doing find, the real question is the PTC a threat to Hampton going bankrupt. When did the taxpayer start picking up the tab for building a mall?
One of things I watch about the Hampton City government's budget is debt service. Pete Peterson's soothing rhetoric notwithstanding, the last time the Daily Press published Hampton's budget it was the second highest item in the budget, behind education. Debt service has to be paid before anything else, such as salaries for teachers, policemen, fireman, Road repair, and even City of Hampton bureaucrats. With all of the Taj Mahals the Hampton City government is building, debt service has nowhere to go but up. I've already heard rumors the City Council, along with the City Manager, is going to try and "end run" with the real estate tax, the bottom line of which is higher real estate taxes. Property values are dropping and all they have to do is to not send out new assessments reflecting that fact while raising the tax rate.

For anyone who believes the honeyed words coming out of the Hampton City government, I have a bridge in Brooklyn I want to talk to you about. The bottom line is that any student of government will tell you that approximately 80% of all governmental expenditures go to personnel. The Hampton City bureaucrats with their six figure salaries are clamoring for a raise on your dime. They think we fell off the turnip truck.

There is a City Council election next May. Maybe we should take a bar of soap to the polls on election day and was six of the seven City Council members along with the City Manager's mouths out with soap.

“The opposite of Progress ”

Since: Nov 08

is Congress

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#18
Nov 17, 2011
 
Gammler wrote:
<quoted text>
One of things I watch about the Hampton City government's budget is debt service. Pete Peterson's soothing rhetoric notwithstanding, the last time the Daily Press published Hampton's budget it was the second highest item in the budget, behind education. Debt service has to be paid before anything else, such as salaries for teachers, policemen, fireman, Road repair, and even City of Hampton bureaucrats. With all of the Taj Mahals the Hampton City government is building, debt service has nowhere to go but up. I've already heard rumors the City Council, along with the City Manager, is going to try and "end run" with the real estate tax, the bottom line of which is higher real estate taxes. Property values are dropping and all they have to do is to not send out new assessments reflecting that fact while raising the tax rate.
For anyone who believes the honeyed words coming out of the Hampton City government, I have a bridge in Brooklyn I want to talk to you about. The bottom line is that any student of government will tell you that approximately 80% of all governmental expenditures go to personnel. The Hampton City bureaucrats with their six figure salaries are clamoring for a raise on your dime. They think we fell off the turnip truck.
There is a City Council election next May. Maybe we should take a bar of soap to the polls on election day and was six of the seven City Council members along with the City Manager's mouths out with soap.
I am so glad I moved out of Hampton. However, I went to Newport News (for now). Local governments seem even more twisted and corrupt than Federal and State officials.

“The opposite of Progress ”

Since: Nov 08

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#19
Nov 17, 2011
 
Shop In Williamsburg wrote:
We will avoid the Hampton Town Center.....its not worth the aggravation. I don't think it will long until the Hampton Town Center turn into what was once the Colesium Mall.
Spot on on that last sentence. I refuse to go there. Hampton built the thugs a nicer place to hang out.

Since: Mar 08

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#20
Nov 18, 2011
 
Lee Hall wrote:
<quoted text>
I am so glad I moved out of Hampton. However, I went to Newport News (for now). Local governments seem even more twisted and corrupt than Federal and State officials.
I don't know if the Newport News City government is as bad as Hampton's or not. At least one doesn't hear much about it; one hears plenty about Hampton's, little of any of it is very flattering.

Will the last middle or working call class person leaving Hampton kindly turn out the lights?

“The opposite of Progress ”

Since: Nov 08

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#21
Nov 18, 2011
 
Gammler wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't know if the Newport News City government is as bad as Hampton's or not. At least one doesn't hear much about it; one hears plenty about Hampton's, little of any of it is very flattering.
Will the last middle or working call class person leaving Hampton kindly turn out the lights?
Hampton seems to be falling apart. I remember them beating out every other city for looting during Isabel. A proud moment.

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