Patience

United States

#21 Jul 11, 2012
About a stones throw away wrote:
<quoted text>
Someone I know later bought the house at 22332 Yale where that murder took place 1n 1987. At the time of purchase they knew nothing about what happened there. But it wasn't long before the neighbors told them. They since have moved. The house is not much more than a stones throw away from the police station.
If anybody wants Linda's case investigated now, they are going to need her last name and maybe even the file number. I don't know if police departments have computer databases for their cases but they definitely didn't have them in the past. That means that files have to be physically looked for just to find out whether they exist. That is one reason why Linda's survivors would be so important to opening the case.
Lost and Found

United States

#22 Jul 11, 2012
Patience wrote:
<quoted text>
If anybody wants Linda's case investigated now, they are going to need her last name and maybe even the file number. I don't know if police departments have computer databases for their cases but they definitely didn't have them in the past. That means that files have to be physically looked for just to find out whether they exist. That is one reason why Linda's survivors would be so important to opening the case.
Having read all this it makes me wonder how many unsolved murders there are in SCS? You'd think that if there were only a handful the police detectives would know exactly where those case files were. That they all would be kept together. And perhaps even know the names of the victims without looking them up. On the other hand if there are lots of unsolved murders here in SCS then that would be a different story.
No Columbo

United States

#23 Jul 11, 2012
Patience wrote:
<quoted text>
If anybody wants Linda's case investigated now, they are going to need her last name and maybe even the file number. I don't know if police departments have computer databases for their cases but they definitely didn't have them in the past. That means that files have to be physically looked for just to find out whether they exist. That is one reason why Linda's survivors would be so important to opening the case.
Out of curiosity I just did a quick search on the internet to see what I could learn about the lady named Linda and can't believe how easy it was. I started by googling "macomb county MI death records". First result on the list was the Macomb county clerk's office. I opened that and found a search prompt. It took me to a screen to enter a name and date range. Because we don't know her last name I just entered "Linda" for the first name. Then based on someone saying the murder was in 1987, I limited the search from January 1987 to December 1987. Three names came up. The first name listed was Linda Bettencourt and it says that she died September 26, 1987. So I did a google search of "linda bettencourt saint clair shores MI". First item on the search list results has her name in it and mentions her home and police. So I opened the topic and it's an article about some priest. About half way into the article there it is. Note: The following is a quote from the article.

" Linda Bettencourt, was uncharacteristically absent from work as manager of the Berkshire Inn in Eastpointe.

He went to her St. Clair Shores home and found the police already there.

Inside her tidy bungalow, Bettencourt, 34, lay dead in a hallway in a tangle of bloody clothes. The killer had stabbed her four times in the chest, once in the back, and slit her throat four times."

I then did a google search on the other two Linda's (Koeger and Ouweleen) that were listed as deceased on the Macomb County clerks' list and found nothing.

So I have to assume that the murder victims name is Linda Bettencourt and the murder took place on or around September 26,1987. I'm assumming the information about the house being at the addressed listed on Yale street by another poster is correct.

You'll have to excuse me now as I have to go start investigating who really killed JFK.

Patience

United States

#24 Jul 11, 2012
No Columbo wrote:
<quoted text>
Out of curiosity I just did a quick search on the internet to see what I could learn about the lady named Linda and can't believe how easy it was. I started by googling "macomb county MI death records". First result on the list was the Macomb county clerk's office. I opened that and found a search prompt. It took me to a screen to enter a name and date range. Because we don't know her last name I just entered "Linda" for the first name. Then based on someone saying the murder was in 1987, I limited the search from January 1987 to December 1987. Three names came up. The first name listed was Linda Bettencourt and it says that she died September 26, 1987. So I did a google search of "linda bettencourt saint clair shores MI". First item on the search list results has her name in it and mentions her home and police. So I opened the topic and it's an article about some priest. About half way into the article there it is. Note: The following is a quote from the article.
" Linda Bettencourt, was uncharacteristically absent from work as manager of the Berkshire Inn in Eastpointe.
He went to her St. Clair Shores home and found the police already there.
Inside her tidy bungalow, Bettencourt, 34, lay dead in a hallway in a tangle of bloody clothes. The killer had stabbed her four times in the chest, once in the back, and slit her throat four times."
I then did a google search on the other two Linda's (Koeger and Ouweleen) that were listed as deceased on the Macomb County clerks' list and found nothing.
So I have to assume that the murder victims name is Linda Bettencourt and the murder took place on or around September 26,1987. I'm assumming the information about the house being at the addressed listed on Yale street by another poster is correct.
You'll have to excuse me now as I have to go start investigating who really killed JFK.
That's pretty good but it doesn't help find the names of missing people. Even if they have been declared dead, I have no idea what the date of death would become. I wish the counties created lists of people who have been reported missing and never found with the date they were last seen. Right now various citizen-run sites list names that have been given to them or that are easily found on the net. But these sites only cover a few cases.
No Columbo

United States

#25 Jul 12, 2012
Patience wrote:
There is plenty that I am not telling here because I shouldn't. I am supposed to tell your county law enforcement that stuff. But they can't do anything with what I tell them because I don't know the names and they don't remember the case and can't find files and evidence, etc. I am just looking for people who DO know the names.
I only mentioned the boaters because somebody here told me to check newspaper archives. I did and the missing boaters were all I found. I don't know if the boating case is related. It could be. BTW, their names were Paul Gentile (then 30 of Detroit) and Gene Start (then 27 of St. Clair Shores.)If somebody wants to open that as a cold case, I say, "Do it!"
I was trying to keep this simple and only told the information that people would know in the first post.
It shouldn't be this hard to tell law enforcement something. I will tell you that I am trying to do this because law enforcement from another state put my picture on national television as a potential victim.
If I can get the case started with the names, you will probably find out more than I presently know about it.
Per the death records website for Macomb County, Gene (Eugene) Start died on June 4, 1973 and Paul Gentile died on June 6, 1973.

You said that law enforcement from another state put your picture on national television as a possible victim. What state and police agency? When (day/month/year) did they do that? If you sincerely want help on this then you have to give us everything, and I do mean everything you know. No holding back anything. Otherwise no more time will be spent trying to help you.
Patience

United States

#26 Jul 13, 2012
I only created this topic because I am looking for people who already know the names of the missing people and can tell the county those names. Any more information is appreciated, of course, but I don't think anybody should try to investigate it so don't.
The death dates for Gene Start and Paul Gentile are confusing. I have a newspaper article that says they disappeared on May 14 or May 15. I don't know why they were called "dead" in June. Maybe they were found and that determined the date.
The photograph of myself that I saw on TV is one of many photographs posted on the net by the Los Angeles County Sheriff at http://lacountymurders.com/wanted/Ladies1.htm... . I am posting this website because it is already out there on the net. If you know me, you can pick me out. If you don't, you don't need to know which photograph it is. So far I have not been able to convince anybody over there that the photograph is me from here in Michigan. The photographs are all cropped and don't have a lot of the useful background details. A few years ago, you could click on each photograph and expand them to make them bigger and show more of the background. I don't know why they changed it. There were several TV shows about these photographs in 2007 and 2008. More of the photographs were on other news sites at that time.#65 is shown standing on a wooden pier. Her mother recognized her and was on TV because the LA Sheriff is trying to find the pier. The pier has a Coast Guard flag on it in the expanded photograph. The pier also looks exactly like the Coast Guard pier south of Jefferson (Blossom Heath) Beach looked like in 1973. Good luck on getting anybody in law enforcement to check that out!
The Jefferson Beach area was very undeveloped in 1973 and looked totally different than today. You could see the whole lake from the shore. The north pier was just a long bent "sand bar" and the south (Coast Guard)pier was just a little structure. If anybody has photographs from that time of either pier or the lake from the beach, please copy and send them to the Los Angeles Sheriff. Maybe some of you might have more status than the rest of us and the Sheriff might get the point.
Patience

United States

#27 Jul 24, 2012
I need to clarify just what location I have been talking about because it has changed more than I realized. Jefferson Beach was a real beach and kids like me LOVED it. It ran south from where the Jefferson Beach Grill is now to about Blackburn. The "L" shaped "sandbar" started near where the Grill is now and has been really built up. The Coast Guard Pier started at where Blackburn is now and has also been really built up. There was a boatwell for the Coast Guard Boat that was just north of the Coast Guard Pier.
Fellow Grad

Warren, MI

#28 Jan 28, 2013
Her name is Linda Bettencourt. As a fellow graduate of hers from EastDetroit High School, Class of 1971, myself and several of my fellow graduates have our own thoughts as to who was responsible for her death. Back when she was murdered, one has to remember that the St. Clair Shores police up until that time had very little experience in murder cases, so who knows what they messed up. I really do wish they would reopen the case and check out things that seem to be totally obvious to those of us that knew her and some of the other people involved.
No Columbo wrote:
<quoted tex
Out of curiosity I just did a quick search on the internet to see what I could learn about the lady named Linda and can't believe how easy it was. I started by googling "macomb county MI death records". First result on the list was the Macomb county clerk's office. I opened that and found a search prompt. It took me to a screen to enter a name and date range. Because we don't know her last name I just entered "Linda" for the first name. Then based on someone saying the murder was in 1987, I limited the search from January 1987 to December 1987. Three names came up. The first name listed was Linda Bettencourt and it says that she died September 26, 1987. So I did a google search of "linda bettencourt saint clair shores MI". First item on the search list results has her name in it and mentions her home and police. So I opened the topic and it's an article about some priest. About half way into the article there it is. Note: The following is a quote from the article.
" Linda Bettencourt, was uncharacteristically absent from work as manager of the Berkshire Inn in Eastpointe.
He went to her St. Clair Shores home and found the police already there.
Inside her tidy bungalow, Bettencourt, 34, lay dead in a hallway in a tangle of bloody clothes. The killer had stabbed her four times in the chest, once in the back, and slit her throat four times."
I then did a google search on the other two Linda's (Koeger and Ouweleen) that were listed as deceased on the Macomb County clerks' list and found nothing.
So I have to assume that the murder victims name is Linda Bettencourt and the murder took place on or around September 26,1987. I'm assumming the information about the house being at the addressed listed on Yale street by another poster is correct.
You'll have to excuse me now as I have to go start investigating who really killed JFK.
If you really care

Farmington, MI

#29 Jan 28, 2013
Fellow Grad wrote:
Her name is Linda Bettencourt. As a fellow graduate of hers from EastDetroit High School, Class of 1971, myself and several of my fellow graduates have our own thoughts as to who was responsible for her death. Back when she was murdered, one has to remember that the St. Clair Shores police up until that time had very little experience in murder cases, so who knows what they messed up. I really do wish they would reopen the case and check out things that seem to be totally obvious to those of us that knew her and some of the other people involved.<quoted text>
If you feel that strongly about getting the case reopened, then why don't you stop by the SCS police station and inquire what's going on with the case. Offer your thoughts. Perhaps have your fellow graduates accompany you and lend their opinions. It may be enough to get them to take a new look at the old case.
Fellow Grad

Warren, MI

#30 Jan 28, 2013
If you really care wrote:
<quoted text>
If you feel that strongly about getting the case reopened, then why don't you stop by the SCS police station and inquire what's going on with the case. Offer your thoughts. Perhaps have your fellow graduates accompany you and lend their opinions. It may be enough to get them to take a new look at the old case.
Now that I am semi-retired, I might just make that my project for a while and see if I can get a few other people to go with me. I really didn't really think that the police dept. would be very cooperative.
Patience

United States

#31 Jan 29, 2013
Fellow Grad wrote:
<quoted text>
Now that I am semi-retired, I might just make that my project for a while and see if I can get a few other people to go with me. I really didn't really think that the police dept. would be very cooperative.
If you try the St. Clair Shores Police and they look at the case, I guess you will want to quietly wait for the results. But if they won't look at it, come back here and complain about it. Neither my father nor I could get the Police to take our calls in 1973 about the missing people. My father got a lawyer and wrote a letter but the letter apparently got filed in the trashcan. That is why I am not trying the St. Clair Shores Police now. Since it will have been 40 years as of this spring, I hope that someone who knows the names of the missing people starts asking about the case and finds me here. I just thought of this. If the Police don't cooperate, you might complain about it to the Macomb County Cold Case Prosecutors. You know the victim's name, place and date of the crime so you can talk to them about it. I only know the date and place so there is no way to look for the file.
Clarification Needed

Northville, MI

#32 Jan 29, 2013
Patience wrote:
<quoted text>If you try the St. Clair Shores Police and they look at the case, I guess you will want to quietly wait for the results. But if they won't look at it, come back here and complain about it. Neither my father nor I could get the Police to take our calls in 1973 about the missing people. My father got a lawyer and wrote a letter but the letter apparently got filed in the trashcan. That is why I am not trying the St. Clair Shores Police now. Since it will have been 40 years as of this spring, I hope that someone who knows the names of the missing people starts asking about the case and finds me here. I just thought of this. If the Police don't cooperate, you might complain about it to the Macomb County Cold Case Prosecutors. You know the victim's name, place and date of the crime so you can talk to them about it. I only know the date and place so there is no way to look for the file.
Patience, I think that "Fellow Grad" is talking about looking into the Linda Bettencourt murder and not the missing people from 1973. "Fellow Grad" please correct me if I'm wrong.

Fellow Grad

Warren, MI

#33 Jan 29, 2013
Clarification Needed wrote:
<quoted text>
Patience, I think that "Fellow Grad" is talking about looking into the Linda Bettencourt murder and not the missing people from 1973. "Fellow Grad" please correct me if I'm wrong.
Yes, you are right, I am talking about the case of Linda Bettencourt who was murdered in her home. I have heard through the grapevine, and this is heresay, that the State Police were also called in to investigate. But as I said, that is heresay.
Patience

United States

#34 Jan 29, 2013
Clarification Needed wrote:
<quoted text>
Patience, I think that "Fellow Grad" is talking about looking into the Linda Bettencourt murder and not the missing people from 1973. "Fellow Grad" please correct me if I'm wrong.
I understand that "Fellow Grad" was talking about a different case than me but he was still talking about the same police department in the same county. He also sounded like he wasn't sure that the St. Clair Shores Police would be cooperative. Macomb County now has Prosecutors assigned to Cold Cases. Ordinarily the police will send their Cold Cases to the Prosecutors but if the police are a problem, "Fellow Grad" might be able to get the Prosecutors to look at the file themselves. He can do this because he has the name of the victim. etc. I can't because I only know the place and date of the incident I want investigated.
Patience

United States

#35 Jan 29, 2013
This is about the missing people from 1973. I saw a newspaper article once about the "Myth of the Missing People on Jefferson." It had a photograph of a man standing near the Jefferson Beach Marina holding a picture of his missing brother. Among the other details was the fact that they had found a woman's blood on the beach and they had been looking for her. I didn't realize then that I was the woman they were looking for. I just didn't remember it. Now I not only remember it but I have information that I didn't even know at that time. I can't believe that it is this difficult to come forward as a witness when I know there are people somewhere who want me to! And there is evidence that I will match. I expected this to be a well known case. It will have been 40 years this spring. I hope the survivors try again and connect with me.
Speaking Out

Wixom, MI

#36 Jan 30, 2013
Patience wrote:
This is about the missing people from 1973. I saw a newspaper article once about the "Myth of the Missing People on Jefferson." It had a photograph of a man standing near the Jefferson Beach Marina holding a picture of his missing brother. Among the other details was the fact that they had found a woman's blood on the beach and they had been looking for her. I didn't realize then that I was the woman they were looking for. I just didn't remember it. Now I not only remember it but I have information that I didn't even know at that time. I can't believe that it is this difficult to come forward as a witness when I know there are people somewhere who want me to! And there is evidence that I will match. I expected this to be a well known case. It will have been 40 years this spring. I hope the survivors try again and connect with me.
How many people do you think read this? If you want to get a larger audience to hear your story than why not speak for 5 minutes at the podium near the end of the next council meeting? You'll have the mayor, council and city attorney listening. Plus all the viewers at home watching live and even more later watching the reruns for the next or two. I betting you'll get people who remember to call you.
Patience

United States

#37 Jan 30, 2013
Speaking Out wrote:
<quoted text>
How many people do you think read this? If you want to get a larger audience to hear your story than why not speak for 5 minutes at the podium near the end of the next council meeting? You'll have the mayor, council and city attorney listening. Plus all the viewers at home watching live and even more later watching the reruns for the next or two. I betting you'll get people who remember to call you.
I am ill and live too far away to make the drive. I have never lived in St. Clair Shores so I am not familiar with the City Council. I have lived in southeastern Michigan all of my life. Generally speaking, you will only get listened to at a City Council meeting if you have been "invited." That is why these Topix pages exist. It would still be worth the TV audience if I could get in easily and safely but I don't think I can. I did try to contact the Macomb Daily but I got no response.
Speaking Out

Waterford, MI

#38 Jan 31, 2013
Patience wrote:
<quoted text>I am ill and live too far away to make the drive. I have never lived in St. Clair Shores so I am not familiar with the City Council. I have lived in southeastern Michigan all of my life. Generally speaking, you will only get listened to at a City Council meeting if you have been "invited." That is why these Topix pages exist. It would still be worth the TV audience if I could get in easily and safely but I don't think I can. I did try to contact the Macomb Daily but I got no response.
To speak at the podium during audience participation at the end of a SCS Council Meeting doesn't require an invitation. Anybody and everybody is allowed 5 minutes to speak their peace about whatever they want. And you don't have to be a resident of SCS either. Access to City Hall is handicap friendly and there are plenty of handicap parking spaces outside. Inside the building there are no steps or stairs to deal with. Meetings are on the 1st and 3rd Monday's at 7pm. How long a meeting lasts is based on the agenda.
Patience

United States

#39 Feb 1, 2013
Speaking Out wrote:
<quoted text>
To speak at the podium during audience participation at the end of a SCS Council Meeting doesn't require an invitation. Anybody and everybody is allowed 5 minutes to speak their peace about whatever they want. And you don't have to be a resident of SCS either. Access to City Hall is handicap friendly and there are plenty of handicap parking spaces outside. Inside the building there are no steps or stairs to deal with. Meetings are on the 1st and 3rd Monday's at 7pm. How long a meeting lasts is based on the agenda.
Thanks, but I was talking about the drive being a problem. I don't have much energy to do that. I might try something else though.
Agent99

Harrison Township, MI

#40 Mar 20, 2014
Patience wrote:
The problem with the 1973 Cold Case is that I know the date and the place but I do not know the names of the missing people. So I can't get anybody to just look up a file. That is why I am going to the public hoping that someone remembers the case and can deliver the names.
I don't expect much from the SCS Police anyway. They hung up on phone calls and ignored letters from witnesses in 1973.
I do know that evidence was collected at the beach that day and the evidence was evaluated. For example, they were having trouble figuring out what part of the human anatomy the bone was. It was an unusual shape but it was too hard to be deformed, etc.
I don't know who was investigating the case or what law enforcement agency had the evidence. I wonder what is done with evidence for unsolved cases in Macomb County. Do the individual police departments store it?
I would think all cases even unsolved are stored wherever Macomb County Sheriffs Store Their files.(at The Sheriffs Office or possibly a Storage Facility) Most paper work has been tranposed to Computers now.(Not the actual evidence) You could call the shiriffs department on Elizabeth in Mt Clemens. You need to find a retired St Clair Shores Officer or Detective. What you are asking for is available it is just hitting on the right person. Don't stop searching SCS archived new papers at the SCS Library.

Good Luck

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