created by: Red_Fist | Dec 8, 2012

Grand Rapids, MI

31 votes

UNIONS GO AWAY and DIE ALREADY !, THEY HAVE......?

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  • Outlived usefulness.?
  • Just trim them back.?
  • Total Union control.?

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to be announced

Grand Rapids, MI

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#21
Dec 12, 2012
 

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SeenItBefore wrote:
<quoted text>Live in the delusion you desire. The people living in the State of Michigan will not benefit from this. That is proven from other state's experience. RTW states have a higher poverty rate, lower life expectancy rate, higher infant mortality rate, etc. than non RTW states. You would just rather live by your prejudice than the realities. You got your way now we shall see what happens. Be prepared to pack your bags.
You are so off on this one, Michigan will benefit greatly, and my pay will not go down.

I do not work for a union and have worked in an at will state in Michigan for years.

The fact is only 17% of workers in Michigan work for unions. So will it affect them?, Maybe, but not if they have a good strong union.

You cannot compare Michigan to other RTW states anymore than you can compare Michigan To Cali.,a non RTW state.

The sky is falling for you because, you have been told it is, no other reason. Lets just let this play out.

I think most will find Snyder is a hero on this one!
Chip

Madison, WI

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#22
Dec 12, 2012
 

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SeenItBefore wrote:
<quoted text>
You're talking out of your waste shoot. The facts are RTW states are more impoverished than non-RTW states. States that go RTW, like MI just has, drop in economic wealth.
Go argue with the facts stupid:
"Median wages in 20 of the 22 Right to Work (RTW) states are lower than the median weekly wages in Wisconsin which were $722 in 2009. This is $256 more a month for the Wisconsin household. Annual median income in Wisconsin is $4,900 higher a year than the average median income in RTW states which adds a significant amount of purchasing power to support Wisconsin businesses.
In RTW states, 28% of jobs pay poverty wages compared to 20% of jobs in Wisconsin. Employees who earn poverty level wages cannot buy homes, cars or appliances. They pay no income tax and many require state assistance to meet their families’ basic needs. Low wages hurt both the worker and the state’s economy as a whole."
http://www.wiafscme.org/index.cfm...
http://emwillmar.locals.educationminnesota.or...
Once again for all you uneducated over emotionalized idiots: All this RTW legislation does is cause those who work in a union shop to choose not to "have to" pay union dues while still receiving the benefits those who choose to pay their way pay for the benefits union representation negotiates with the company.
In my opinion if you union malcontents were at all interested in fairness the law would be those who don't pay union dues would not receive any the benefits negotiated for. But that just isn't the way the right-wing works, is it.
Seems a little silly to use RTW laws as the only economic indicator comparing states. I was just wondering why you didn't compare Texas, a RTW state with Cali, a non-RTW state?

You seem to want to compare wages without regard to cost of living, most RTW states are in the south and have a lower cost of living, and therefore lower wages regardless of union or not.

I know this wasn't in the article so you didn't consider it, looks like the author spoon fed this information to you and you didn't bother thinking for yourself.

Ever consider any of the bad things caused by unions? They cause unemployment, outsourcing, inflation...
Chip

Madison, WI

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#23
Dec 12, 2012
 

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http://www.theblaze.com/stories/raw-footage-c...

SIB: is that you on the video attacking someone?
robin hood

Jefferson City, MO

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#24
Dec 12, 2012
 

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union's where at one time very good for the country, i would not have a problem with union's if unions would stay at the factory and not in washington.

unions need to stay out of politics, stand up the people that pay for them, to set in there offices.

just like the workers from chrysler that got caught on tape smokeing pot and drinking, the unions got there jobs back. now i'm not sure but i'm willing to bet that boths of those things a agianist the company polices so why should they have gotten there jobs back.

teachers unions are bring down the education system, by not bieng able to get rid of teachers that arn't doing the job.
Chip

Madison, WI

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#25
Dec 12, 2012
 

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SeenItBefore wrote:
<quoted text>
So do-tell how unions force you to work where there is one. Because nobody educated you, I will. There is NO LAW stating you have to work where there is a union. You CAN always get a job where there isn't one. Now though you can work at a unionized company and get all the benefits union members pay representation for without having to contribute. You should be doing the Snoopy happy dance now.
Payola where unions are concerned? Apparently you have been living with your head up some republicans back side. You really should check where the largest payola is. Unions fall WAY behind in that arena.
If it's the individuals right to not work for a union shop, shouldn't it also be an individuals right as an owner to not employ union workers?

Are you just as upset that nearly half of Americans who pay no federal income taxes are getting the benefits paid by others?
ohyuckObama

Grand Rapids, MI

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#26
Dec 12, 2012
 

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instead of bad pushy business owneers, we now have it the other way, too much power and bad pushy unions.
Linda

United States

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#28
Dec 12, 2012
 
ohyuckObama wrote:
instead of bad pushy business owneers, we now have it the other way, too much power and bad pushy unions.
Pushy? More like punchy, vulgar, fat, lazy turds!

Since: Feb 08

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#29
Dec 12, 2012
 
SeenItBefore wrote:
What sickens the right-wing is unions are the only true democracy in the workplace. And as we are finding out Republicans/right-wing despise democracy.
Good Day,

Long time no see SIB!

Dude, really? Unions are the purest form of Democracy in the workplace? You know well better than that. I know you do.

If anything, Unions (old dinos like AFL-CIO, UAW, SEIU, MEA, etc.) are anything but Democratic, but instead Autocratic if not down right Communistic. For example - Oh you can't get that promotion, even if you are more qualified, than the person(s) who have more seniority than you. Is that "Democratic"? Is that fair and free? Not so much...

Steelie
SeenItBefore

Jenison, MI

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#30
Dec 12, 2012
 

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One thing each and every one of you democracy haters are missing is it's been LAW for many years a dues paying union member can opt-out of any portion of the dues they pay be used for any political funding.

It's so very true that we have the highest educated population that's ever been on the planet while at the same time the dumbest population that's ever been on the planet.
SeenItBefore

Jenison, MI

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#31
Dec 12, 2012
 

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Steelie wrote:
<quoted text>
Good Day,
Long time no see SIB!
Dude, really? Unions are the purest form of Democracy in the workplace? You know well better than that. I know you do.
If anything, Unions (old dinos like AFL-CIO, UAW, SEIU, MEA, etc.) are anything but Democratic, but instead Autocratic if not down right Communistic. For example - Oh you can't get that promotion, even if you are more qualified, than the person(s) who have more seniority than you. Is that "Democratic"? Is that fair and free? Not so much...
Steelie
Don't go putting words in my mouth Steelie. I said unions are the only democracy in the workplace. I never said purest form.

Are you really trying to make every one believe a privately owned company is any other form of "governance" than a dictatorship/kingdom/authorita rian and yes even autocratic? Seriously?

You are SO VERY wrong about promotions. I have never EVER experienced ANY unionized company where the union employee was prohibited from being "promoted". In fact in many union contracts there are provisions for the increased wages for Lead Men/Lead Person etc. I have the proof in writing.

Plus I have NEVER seen any provision in ANY union contract that prohibits a unionized person from being promoted up in the company out of the union.

Seriously, with respect Steelie you don't know what you're talking about.

The ONLY thing that prohibits a union member employee from being promoted is managements despising unionization.

And yes I have seen many employees that were more qualified passed over for promotion in favor of, to be kind, the more "politically correct" employee, even within the union ranks.
SeenItBefore

Jenison, MI

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#33
Dec 12, 2012
 
James wrote:
<quoted text>
Why do YOU think that is?
All the text books are written in TX. Think TX is a Liberal state? And our teachers are obligated by state law and local school boards to teach and test out of the text books....

Since: Feb 08

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#34
Dec 12, 2012
 
SeenItBefore wrote:
<quoted text>
Don't go putting words in my mouth Steelie. I said unions are the only democracy in the workplace. I never said purest form.
Are you really trying to make every one believe a privately owned company is any other form of "governance" than a dictatorship/kingdom/authorita rian and yes even autocratic? Seriously?
You are SO VERY wrong about promotions. I have never EVER experienced ANY unionized company where the union employee was prohibited from being "promoted". In fact in many union contracts there are provisions for the increased wages for Lead Men/Lead Person etc. I have the proof in writing.
Plus I have NEVER seen any provision in ANY union contract that prohibits a unionized person from being promoted up in the company out of the union.
Seriously, with respect Steelie you don't know what you're talking about.
The ONLY thing that prohibits a union member employee from being promoted is managements despising unionization.
And yes I have seen many employees that were more qualified passed over for promotion in favor of, to be kind, the more "politically correct" employee, even within the union ranks.
Good Day,

Hey SIB! I personally saw quite few people denied legitimate promotions due to SENIORITY. When I was in college I worked part itme in a UFCW shop. I can't tell you the number of times people used their "seniority" ranking to prevent those who really deserved promotions from getting them. One woman was a real pain in the neck on this stuff, always challenging any promotion of anyone better than her, and seniority backed her up. Sad. That is what prevents improvements in productivity and positive attitudes. Although, I did see a few people "rescued" by corporate in terms of emmancipating these talented employees from the Union.

Autocratic - please explain then why "big" Unions (many) are in favor of killing private voting so that they can then know which employee voted how. Intimidation much?

Steelie
SeenItBefore

Jenison, MI

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#35
Dec 12, 2012
 
Steelie wrote:
<quoted text>
Good Day,
Hey SIB! I personally saw quite few people denied legitimate promotions due to SENIORITY. When I was in college I worked part itme in a UFCW shop. I can't tell you the number of times people used their "seniority" ranking to prevent those who really deserved promotions from getting them. One woman was a real pain in the neck on this stuff, always challenging any promotion of anyone better than her, and seniority backed her up. Sad. That is what prevents improvements in productivity and positive attitudes. Although, I did see a few people "rescued" by corporate in terms of emmancipating these talented employees from the Union.
Autocratic - please explain then why "big" Unions (many) are in favor of killing private voting so that they can then know which employee voted how. Intimidation much?
Steelie
"Autocratic - please explain then why "big" Unions (many) are in favor of killing private voting so that they can then know which employee voted how. Intimidation much?"

I have no idea what your talking about here. Please explain.
SeenItBefore

Jenison, MI

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#36
Dec 12, 2012
 
Steelie wrote:
<quoted text>
Good Day,
Hey SIB! I personally saw quite few people denied legitimate promotions due to SENIORITY. When I was in college I worked part itme in a UFCW shop. I can't tell you the number of times people used their "seniority" ranking to prevent those who really deserved promotions from getting them. One woman was a real pain in the neck on this stuff, always challenging any promotion of anyone better than her, and seniority backed her up. Sad. That is what prevents improvements in productivity and positive attitudes. Although, I did see a few people "rescued" by corporate in terms of emmancipating these talented employees from the Union.
Autocratic - please explain then why "big" Unions (many) are in favor of killing private voting so that they can then know which employee voted how. Intimidation much?
Steelie
Are you by chance talking about job bidding here? A job classification opens up and is put up for bidding?
Linda

United States

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#37
Dec 12, 2012
 

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SeenItBefore wrote:
<quoted text>"Autocratic - please explain then why "big" Unions (many) are in favor of killing private voting so that they can then know which employee voted how. Intimidation much?"

I have no idea what your talking about here. Please explain.
Nothing new here just as lost as ever. Hey, try getting an education troll.
Troll

Fort Myers, FL

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#38
Dec 12, 2012
 
Troll wrote:
<quoted text>
Sorry, cannot explain it because all the teachers went to Lansing to protest, thus leaving me all alone in the classroom. So now I'm intellectually challenged. anyway, follow the money to China.
My teacher was AWOL again today. Where is she at??? Protesting in Lansing again??? That bitch
Bob

Big Rapids, MI

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#39
Dec 13, 2012
 

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Troll wrote:
<quoted text>
My teacher was AWOL again today. Where is she at??? Protesting in Lansing again??? That bitch
Don't worry, I'm sure you'll be able to take over her job some day.....

Let's hope its a minimum wage job with no benefits by the time you finally get there!
Unbelivable

Morristown, TN

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#40
Dec 13, 2012
 
to be announced wrote:
<quoted text>You are so off on this one, Michigan will benefit greatly, and my pay will not go down.
I do not work for a union and have worked in an at will state in Michigan for years.
The fact is only 17% of workers in Michigan work for unions. So will it affect them?, Maybe, but not if they have a good strong union.
You cannot compare Michigan to other RTW states anymore than you can compare Michigan To Cali.,a non RTW state.
The sky is falling for you because, you have been told it is, no other reason. Lets just let this play out.
I think most will find Snyder is a hero on this one!
BULL,You will not be happy with the out come
SeenItBefore

Jenison, MI

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#41
Dec 13, 2012
 
to be announced wrote:
<quoted text>You are so off on this one, Michigan will benefit greatly, and my pay will not go down.
I do not work for a union and have worked in an at will state in Michigan for years.
The fact is only 17% of workers in Michigan work for unions. So will it affect them?, Maybe, but not if they have a good strong union.
You cannot compare Michigan to other RTW states anymore than you can compare Michigan To Cali.,a non RTW state.
The sky is falling for you because, you have been told it is, no other reason. Lets just let this play out.
I think most will find Snyder is a hero on this one!
It all depends on your definition of a hero.

What we are dealing with here is a group of reincarnated believers in medieval feudalism.
to be announced

Grand Rapids, MI

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#42
Dec 13, 2012
 

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Unbelivable wrote:
<quoted text>BULL,You will not be happy with the out come
It doesn't have to affect anyone, if you are happy with your Union, continue to pay your dues!

Basicaly what all you people are saying is, our union sucks and now no one will pay!

Makes it sound like Unions have lost their usefullness, and can no longer use fear to make you pay dues.

I know of too many stories where unions do not protect you, especially if you have a chronic illness. If you smoke pot and drink during work however........

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