Car buyers standing by GM

General Motors Corporation stock hit its lowest point in more than 75 years on Friday, falling to just $1.27 per share at one point. Full Story
Frank

Southfield, MI

#7274 Dec 26, 2012
Gville Jim wrote:
<quoted text>So, what you are saying is that you got pay raises, but it is only because you are a union member, not because of your work performance, or the quality of your work, it's only because of your union membership that you got those raises.
Nice!
For me, I'd rather get my pay raises because the owner see's my work effort, and production, and dedication.
I would love to get a pay raise for for the reasons you said but its not always like that. The company I work for has many plants that do the same kind of work but at different levels and our plant does the most difficult jobs and has their biggest customer. The current owners bought the company a few years ago and have done nothing but take from their employees, with the exception of us. We are the only union plant. If it was up to our owners we would be working for $8 an hour not $18 and cut benefits in half. I know they would do that because they done it at ALL their other plants and tried to do it at ours but good thing we had a voice and didn't have to just bend over and take it like the rest of them. It took a 3 month long strike but we won. I would love to find a job that pays close to what I make and get respected and pay based on performance but its not always like that. If there was no union I wouldn't make and have what I have. Sorry to go on for so long but I wanted to try to help you understand my situation.
Frank

Southfield, MI

#7276 Dec 26, 2012
Go Blue Forever wrote:
Exactly, pay raises should come from merit....and only during a healthy business climate....Unions have started out doing good, and ended up being a disservice to the american worker, let alone the manufacturing sector....
Not always the case. During the recession our plant was the only in our company not laying off and actually picking up more work. During the recession they closed a few of their non union plants and moved some of the work to our union plant. They wanted us not take our raise because that what they were doing at their other plants. The corporate big wigs met with our union to discuss us giving up our raises, our union wanted them to show them how they were loosing money at our place and to seen the books because the company wanted to changed a signed contract and take what we already have coming. We were willing to give our raise up if it would mean loss of jobs but it did't. After the union wanted to see the books that was the end.
Frank

Southfield, MI

#7277 Dec 26, 2012
sam wrote:
<quoted text>It doesn't work that way on the production floor.....merit means little. Unless you are related to the boss.
Exactly. There are some good manufacturers that treat their workers good and don't need a union but in most cases its not like that. Like you said you have to be related to the boss or be the one that spends the most time UNDER the bosses desk!!!

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#7278 Dec 26, 2012
So basically over the years, just like management, the union's ended up taking advantage of their power?
Frank

Southfield, MI

#7279 Dec 26, 2012
Go Blue Forever wrote:
So basically over the years, just like management, the union's ended up taking advantage of their power?
What power are you talking about?
Ronald

United States

#7280 Dec 26, 2012
sam wrote:
<quoted text>It doesn't work that way on the production floor.....merit means little. Unless you are related to the boss.
In blues case merit means something for him because he is under the desk most of the time.
Ronald

United States

#7281 Dec 26, 2012
Frank wrote:
<quoted text>What power are you talking about?
Blue has powerful neck muscles
Frank

Southfield, MI

#7282 Dec 26, 2012
Ronald wrote:
<quoted text>
In blues case merit means something for him because he is under the desk most of the time.
Be nice. Blue is a good guy just has different views than I do. Try to help him understand that unions are not all bad if thats your opinion not just say stupid stuff.
Ronald

United States

#7283 Dec 26, 2012
Frank wrote:
<quoted text>Be nice. Blue is a good guy just has different views than I do. Try to help him understand that unions are not all bad if thats your opinion not just say stupid stuff.
He has different views than me too, I prefer women. Anyway Most unions suck and destroy companies. They were good and very much needed at first then they became corrupt and a waste. They are ran similar to a dictatorship. That is not something that would be in the interest of the members.
Frank

Southfield, MI

#7284 Dec 26, 2012
Ronald wrote:
<quoted text>
He has different views than me too, I prefer women. Anyway Most unions suck and destroy companies. They were good and very much needed at first then they became corrupt and a waste. They are ran similar to a dictatorship. That is not something that would be in the interest of the members.
Some unions are corrupt but people need to try to understand that all unions are not bad. In a lot of situations (like mine) they are still very much needed. You can't say they are all bad and corrupt just because of the few you hear of that are. Even non union places can thank unions for the wages and benefits they have just because of the threat of a union coming in. Alot of people forget about that but if alot of the companies would have their way we all would be under paid.
Frank

Southfield, MI

#7285 Dec 26, 2012
Ronald wrote:
<quoted text>
He has different views than me too, I prefer women. Anyway Most unions suck and destroy companies. They were good and very much needed at first then they became corrupt and a waste. They are ran similar to a dictatorship. That is not something that would be in the interest of the members.
Have you ever been a union member?
Ronald

United States

#7286 Dec 26, 2012
Frank wrote:
<quoted text>Some unions are corrupt but people need to try to understand that all unions are not bad. In a lot of situations (like mine) they are still very much needed. You can't say they are all bad and corrupt just because of the few you hear of that are. Even non union places can thank unions for the wages and benefits they have just because of the threat of a union coming in. Alot of people forget about that but if alot of the companies would have their way we all would be under paid.
Oh yes that is the talking points of the unions. So anything good is because unions could come in. If that is what you would like to believe that then keep drinking that KoolAid. Did you ever thing that maybe not all companies are bad? Maybe they would like you to be happy as a employee so that you possibly would be a good employee. Then maybe you would become a asset to the company. Then maybe the company would stay in business longer. Don't drink the KoolAid it rots the brain.
Ronald

United States

#7287 Dec 26, 2012
Frank wrote:
<quoted text>Have you ever been a union member?
Yes, 3 times
Ronald

United States

#7288 Dec 26, 2012
Frank you must either be a negro or speak in Spanish As one of the many taco people the unions bend over for. Which is it Jason?

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#7289 Dec 27, 2012
Frank wrote:
<quoted text> Be nice. Blue is a good guy just has different views than I do. Try to help him understand that unions are not all bad if thats your opinion not just say stupid stuff.
I don't feel all unions are bad....but many have become too powerfull and have set their member's up for failure in global manufacturing.....teacher's unions that won't allow the dismissel of bad teachers.....loss of simple common sense, isn't just a union problem....management has had a hand in being average and below average in products.....
Old Rocker

Hudsonville, MI

#7290 Dec 27, 2012
Frank, I believe we have had this discussion of merit pay increases before. Nearly any job can be measured. In a nutshell, those who produce more get paid more, with a quality factor included to insure work is being done correctly. Even in the case of assembly line work, it could be a group incentive. You are only as fast as your slowest worker. Peer pressure works wonders in this case.

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#7291 Dec 27, 2012
Meanwhile, seem's Toyota has taken back Number #1 status....overcoming their earthquake, tsunami and the sudden acceleration lawsuits....What can you say, they have a great lineup....
Frank

New London, OH

#7292 Dec 27, 2012
Go Blue Forever wrote:
<quoted text>I don't feel all unions are bad....but many have become too powerfull and have set their member's up for failure in global manufacturing.....teacher's unions that won't allow the dismissel of bad teachers.....loss of simple common sense, isn't just a union problem....management has had a hand in being average and below average in products.....
People also have to remember management negotiates contracts they agree with what they put in there.
Frank

New London, OH

#7293 Dec 27, 2012
Ronald wrote:
Frank you must either be a negro or speak in Spanish As one of the many taco people the unions bend over for. Which is it Jason?
And people called me a racist on here before, yet they say nothing about your comments.
Frank

New London, OH

#7294 Dec 27, 2012
Old Rocker wrote:
Frank, I believe we have had this discussion of merit pay increases before. Nearly any job can be measured. In a nutshell, those who produce more get paid more, with a quality factor included to insure work is being done correctly. Even in the case of assembly line work, it could be a group incentive. You are only as fast as your slowest worker. Peer pressure works wonders in this case.
We had another conversation on here before and I do believe it was with you. You guys didn't know about the operators union and other skilled unions that members join and are trained at union training centers to perfect their jobs and companies rely on these unions for skilled workers when they are doing jobs in different areas of the country. So alot of people don't fully understand unions they just want to run their mouths about them when they really have no idea. A friend of mine was trained and paid by the operator engineers union and now he can go anywhere in the country and be on a job site the next day.

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