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# Messianic Jews say they are persecuted in Israel

There are 72074 comments on the Newsday story from Jun 21, 2008, titled Messianic Jews say they are persecuted in Israel. In it, Newsday reports that:

Safety pins and screws are still lodged in 15-year-old Ami Ortiz's body three months after he opened a booby-trapped gift basket sent to his family.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Newsday.

JOEL

Mumbai, India

#46938 Jan 13, 2013
CORRECTION:

The unification of contradictions leads one into a state of equilibrium in which none of the contradictions can have ITS free play but IS subservient to the superior unifying force that bears down on them to convert them into pliant instruments of its superior consciousness and energy.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#46939 Jan 13, 2013
Good night.

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#46940 Jan 13, 2013
JOEL wrote:
QUESTION:
Why are the coverings of manholes circular or round and not square in shape?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manhole_cover

The question of why manhole covers are typically round was made famous by Microsoft when they began asking it as a job-interview question.[6][7] Originally meant as a psychological assessment of how one approaches a question with more than one correct answer, the problem has produced a number of alternate explanations, from the pragmatic ("Manhole covers are round because manholes are round.")[6] to the philosophical.

Reasons for the shape include:

A round manhole cover cannot fall through its circular opening, whereas a square manhole cover may fall in if it were inserted diagonally in the hole.(A Reuleaux triangle or other curve of constant width would also serve this purpose, but round covers are much easier to manufacture. The existence of a "lip" holding up the lid means that the underlying hole is smaller than the cover, so that other shapes might suffice.)

Round tubes are the strongest and most material-efficient shape against the compression of the earth around them, and so it is natural that the cover of a round tube assume a circular shape.
The bearing surfaces of manhole frames and covers are machined to assure flatness and prevent them from becoming dislodged by traffic. Round castings are much easier to machine using a lathe.
Circular covers do not need to be rotated to align with the manhole.

A round manhole cover can be more easily moved by being rolled.

A round manhole cover can be easily locked in place with a quarter turn (as is done in countries like France). They are then hard to open unless you are authorised and have a special tool. Also then they do not have to be made so heavy - traffic passing over them cannot lift them up by suction.

Other manhole shapes can be found, usually squares or rectangles. Nashua, New Hampshire may be unique in the U.S. for having triangular manhole covers that point in the direction of the underlying flow. The city is phasing out the triangles, which were made by a local foundry, because they are not large enough to meet modern safety standards and a manufacturer for larger triangles cannot be found.[8] Some manhole covers in Hamilton, Bermuda are triangular, and hinged. Some triangular water-main covers also exist in San Francisco.[9]
Eric
#46941 Jan 13, 2013
JOEL wrote:
QUESTION:
Why are the coverings of manholes circular or round and not square in shape?
To conform with the extruded cylindrical pipe beneath.

Plus, it means that you don't have to turn the cover to fit the opening as it is universally symmetrical.

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#46943 Jan 13, 2013
Eric wrote:
<quoted text>
To conform with the extruded cylindrical pipe beneath.
Plus, it means that you don't have to turn the cover to fit the opening as it is universally symmetrical.
This is a sexist conversation and I want nothing of it

The term we use now is "peopleholes".
Eric
#46944 Jan 13, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
This is a sexist conversation and I want nothing of it
The term we use now is "peopleholes".
I thought it was utility accesses.

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#46945 Jan 13, 2013
Eric wrote:
<quoted text>
I thought it was utility accesses.
I didnt want to confuse everyone here, but where I live the man/people/utility holes are not necessarily round.

Fiber optic, gas, electrical, and other conduits are often rectangular. Stormsewer and regular sewer tend to be round.

We have evolved passed the notion of utility as being sewer.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#46946 Jan 13, 2013
DUALISM, COMPLEMENTARITY, NONDUALISM, HOLON & UNIFIED FIELD:

"Evidence obtained under different experimental conditions cannot be comprehended within a single picture, but must be regarded as complementary in the sense that only the totality of the phenomena exhausts the possible information about the objects."

- Niels Bohr

1) Dualism merges into complementarity and complementarity must necessarily merge in nondualism in which the various effects are simply viewed as so many manifested aspects of one reality - a unified field of consciousness-energy in which information on every aspect exists in involved state with an innate causal mechanism as part of the system.

2) Besides, each aspect is differentiated only on the surface, while at a deeper or a more fundamental level all the possible aspects that comprise the cosmos exist in involved form.

3) A holon is something that is simultaneously a whole and a part. It makes sense to consider every event a holon.

4) Dissolve the observer-observed divide and experience the reality by becoming that. Then there's no I and no You, no here and no there, no past, no present and no future, no subjective and no objective, no external and no internal and no he and no she. Only one reality.

Yeah !

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#46947 Jan 13, 2013
WHO is doing the posting?

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#46948 Jan 13, 2013
(please dont take that as a negative comment..)
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#46949 Jan 13, 2013
QUESTION:

Consider the wave-particle duality.

Measurements like the one involving the double-slit experiment can demonstrate one or the other, but not both, phenomena at a particular moment.

The principle of complementarity explains this as being due to the very nature of the measuring devices used.

A measuring device may be designed to investigate or demonstrate either the particle or wave aspects, but the demonstration of one necessarily precludes the possibility of simultaneously demonstrating the other, because the object being measured is unavoidably affected by the measurement.

It is impossible to design a measuring device that demonstrates both phenomena simultaneously not because of lack of creativity on the part of the experimenter, but simply because such a device is literally inconceivable.

1) Why is this so? Why can't both aspects of one object - its wave and particulate nature - be investigated or demonstrated simultaneously?

2) Is the measuring instrument part of the event being observed/measured? An omnijective context? Can the observer be independent of the observed?

NOTE: Bohr implies that it is not possible to regard objects governed by quantum mechanics as having intrinsic properties independent of determination with a measuring device.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#46950 Jan 13, 2013
Frijoles wrote:
WHO is doing the posting?
The i in I in THAT.

Ha ha ha ha ha
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#46952 Jan 13, 2013
Eric wrote:
<quoted text>

To conform with the extruded cylindrical pipe beneath.

Plus, it means that you don't have to turn the cover to fit the opening as it is universally symmetrical.
No, it's not that.

See, if a manhole cover is a square of side a then the length of its diagonal is a x (2)^1/2 or a times square root 2 = a x 1.41 = 1.41 a.

This diagonal length (1.41 a) of a square is greater by a factor 0.41 when compared to its side which is a or by 41 % and so the square cover can easily slide into the manhole along the diagonal and will have to be replaced often and besides it is also a waste of metal to construct a shape like a square that has a larger surface area.

On the other hand, if a manhole cover is circular, its semi-perimeter or half its circumference is (2 x pi x r)/2 = pi x r = 3.14 x r, whereas the diameter of a circle is 2r.

So, we clearly see that 3.14 r (half the circumference or any half of the round cover) is greater in measure than the diameter of the circle (2r) by a factor: 3.14r - 2r = 1.14r.

So, the circular cover of the manhole will not slide into the manhole and besides the circular shape has a smaller surface area and thus would use less metal for its fabrication.

This is my logic.

Best Regards.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#46954 Jan 13, 2013
SCHROEDINGER'S CAT, BOHR & PURE CONSCIOUSNESS:

Schröedinger's Cat did not pose any riddle to Bohr.

The cat would be dead or alive long before we open the box to find out.

What Bohr claimed was, however, that the state of the object and the state of the instrument are dynamically INSEPARABLE during the interaction.

QUOTE - "What Bohr claimed was, however, that the state of the object and the state of the instrument are dynamically inseparable during the interaction."

JOEL -

1) The problem with this observation attributed to Bohr is that the observer has designed and fabricated the measuring instrument keeping in mind the specific properties of the object that he wishes to measure and besides while operating the measuring device he employs other instruments like his mind and senses that're part of the investigation under progress.

2) The cat, too, is a sentient creature depending on whether it is alive or dead but expressed sentience of a reasonably high order is what distinguishes the live cat from matter which on the surface appears insentient but its precise functioning and the order we encounter in its structure and operations indicates an involved intelligent principle at work. Blind physical laws, chance and molecular pulls and pushes cannot explain the order and purpose we see everywhere in the universe and in self.

3) Activity is a sign of energy and order, precision and purpose suggest an inherent consciousness at work.

4) Since, activity of the atomic or sentient kind involves the use of energy and as matter and sentient object are in fact forms of precisely formulated bits of information-in-energy at work, the clear inference is that consciousness inheres in energy which accounts for the information content and the various degrees of precision and order that're encountered as a result of this in nature and self.

5) So, activity, order and purpose go hand in hand and this then brings us the inarguable conclusion that consciousness and energy form a unified system - a unified field of consciousness-energy - in the absence of which neither the well-ordered cosmos nor self in the individual as an aspect of the cosmos could have arisen.

6) Supramental states, Mind, Vital, Matter are the various manifested modes of the unified field of consciousness-energy.

7) As consciousness and energy are self-existent as they can neither be created nor destroyed, so the unified field of consciousness-energy is the ultimate reality. What need, then, for the extra-cosmic and anthropopathic God or G-d who creates from nothing?(smiles)

THE ULTIMATE QUESTION:

“Kasminu Bhagvo Vigyate Sarvmindh Vigyatam Bhavati”

(“What Is THAT by knowing which everything else is known?")

PURE CONSCIOUSNESS with its inherent component of PURE ENERGY.

When all activity at the cosmic or individual ceases or when the Manifestation is withdrawn into the Unified Field, all activity enters a state of suspension and so the Energy part of the system enters a state of dormancy and what remains in manifest form is only Pure Consciousness.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#46956 Jan 13, 2013
BOTTOMLINE:

As consciousness and energy are self-existent as they can neither be created nor destroyed, so the unified field of consciousness-energy is the ultimate reality. What need, then, for the fictitious extra-cosmic and anthropopathic God or G-d who creates from nothing?

(smiles)
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#46957 Jan 13, 2013
Bye, everyone.
JOEL

Mumbai, India

#46958 Jan 13, 2013
QUESTION:

Schroedinger's cat can be both dead and alive at the same time? How?

(smiles)
idgaf
#46959 Jan 13, 2013
So, in 42425 postings, have you guys come up with any solutions or compromises that will address the original problems? Sounds like never ending arguments. You all will never agree on idealogies or religions. Faith is what you are comfortable with, be happy with what you have. I see why the conflicts in Israel and the surrounding areas never get resolved. This small topix forum thread is proof of inabilities to compromise and address the root of problems or perceived problems if they truly are problems.

“Legumes of the World Unite ”

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#46960 Jan 13, 2013
idgaf wrote:
So, in 42425 postings, have you guys come up with any solutions or compromises that will address the original problems? Sounds like never ending arguments. You all will never agree on idealogies or religions. Faith is what you are comfortable with, be happy with what you have. I see why the conflicts in Israel and the surrounding areas never get resolved. This small topix forum thread is proof of inabilities to compromise and address the root of problems or perceived problems if they truly are problems.
what problems are you referring to?
idgaf
#46961 Jan 13, 2013
Assuming that the problem or topic needing some kind of worldly resolution is ....

Messianic Jews say they are persecuted in Israel

Or, it's just a forum for differences of opinions I suppose ...

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