Capitalism Versus Communism?

Capitalism Versus Communism?

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Tea Party Solution

United States

#1 Dec 18, 2012
The righties in these blogs repeatedly show that they view our country's dilemma as "freedom" versus "communism". It goes like this:


__________
Capitalism Communism

No Governmental Control Any Governmental Control
of Business, Market Forces, Of Business, Market Forces,
or Social Issues Or Social Issues

So, this is a continuum where 'Capitalism' is simplistically equated with no governmental control, at one end

And any governmental control, which they call 'Communism', is at the other end of the continuum.

If powerful special interest groups can convince enough people that this continuum is valid, it opens the way for them to gain power unofficially.

In their propaganda campaigns to arouse public fears, they use loaded words, such as social engineering, communism, socialism, politics of envy, and class warfare. The big corporate cartels actually use focus groups to come up with these emotionally loaded words, which they can then use in their propaganda-- and in the propaganda of their political shills. Limbaugh and Fox News and the right-wing blogosphere will also use these buzzwords continually.

Big health insurance firms found through their focus groups that the term "government takeovor" got the knee-jerk emotional reaction they were looking for, during the healthcare debate.

These big health insurance firms were surprised and extremely pleased by how well their propaganda campaign worked. It was so successful that it inspired tea partiers on Medicare to wheel around on their government-paid scooters at rallies waving signs that said, "Keep the government out of my Medicare!".

It's apparent that many in our country are incapable of thinking logically. Instead, they make decisions based mainly or completely from their emotions. And the big corporate interests are very sophisticated in manipulating these emotions.
Tea Party Solution

United States

#2 Dec 18, 2012
The continuum above came out poorly.

It should show Capitalism on the left side, where there's no government control, and Communism on the right side where there's total government control.
GRANDPA NICOLAI

Chico, CA

#3 Dec 19, 2012
Tea Party Solution wrote:
The righties in these blogs repeatedly show that they view our country's dilemma as "freedom" versus "communism". It goes like this:
__________
Capitalism Communism
No Governmental Control Any Governmental Control
of Business, Market Forces, Of Business, Market Forces,
or Social Issues Or Social Issues
So, this is a continuum where 'Capitalism' is simplistically equated with no governmental control, at one end
And any governmental control, which they call 'Communism', is at the other end of the continuum.
If powerful special interest groups can convince enough people that this continuum is valid, it opens the way for them to gain power unofficially.
In their propaganda campaigns to arouse public fears, they use loaded words, such as social engineering, communism, socialism, politics of envy, and class warfare. The big corporate cartels actually use focus groups to come up with these emotionally loaded words, which they can then use in their propaganda-- and in the propaganda of their political shills. Limbaugh and Fox News and the right-wing blogosphere will also use these buzzwords continually.
Big health insurance firms found through their focus groups that the term "government takeovor" got the knee-jerk emotional reaction they were looking for, during the healthcare debate.
These big health insurance firms were surprised and extremely pleased by how well their propaganda campaign worked. It was so successful that it inspired tea partiers on Medicare to wheel around on their government-paid scooters at rallies waving signs that said, "Keep the government out of my Medicare!".
It's apparent that many in our country are incapable of thinking logically. Instead, they make decisions based mainly or completely from their emotions. And the big corporate interests are very sophisticated in manipulating these emotions.
>
>
SOLUTION,

That is one of the reasons I quite frequently refer to conservatives as being brainwashed....

As you pointed out, there are key words or combinations of key words intended to elicit a knee jerk response from most conservatives....

Those words capitalize on conservative insecurities and fears and their utterance has the same effect on conservatives as strings do on puppets....
annoyed

Chico, CA

#4 Dec 19, 2012
GRANDPA NICOLAI wrote:
<quoted text>
>
>
SOLUTION,
That is one of the reasons I quite frequently refer to conservatives as being brainwashed....
As you pointed out, there are key words or combinations of key words intended to elicit a knee jerk response from most conservatives....
Those words capitalize on conservative insecurities and fears and their utterance has the same effect on conservatives as strings do on puppets....
"That is one of the reasons I quite frequently refer to conservatives as being brainwashed...."

And the other reasons????? Could it just be that continuing to search for decisivness is what you're after???? They say actions speak louder than words....what do you think?(Don't be a HIO)

It should be common knowledge each party mirrors the efforts of the other. Perhaps in slightly different form but always non-the-less.

Tell you what. Watch the Rachel M. show and see how many deliberate falsehoods or serious ommisions or deliberatly misconstrued speechs you find. It's not hard: Just try to drop some preconcieved notions before you start and you may be as surprised/ashamed as I first was.

It's a shame one of the thinkers in this forum should become so mired down in the past when there's so much to be done in the future. I thought that was a Republican game.
Tea Party Solution

Chico, CA

#5 Dec 19, 2012
annoyed wrote:
<quoted text>
And the other reasons????? Could it just be that continuing to search for decisivness is what you're after???? They say actions speak louder than words....what do you think?(Don't be a HIO)
It should be common knowledge each party mirrors the efforts of the other. Perhaps in slightly different form but always non-the-less..
What you wrote above makes no sense. I can't figure out the points you're trying to make, nor how they relate to anything GRANDPA said.
annoyed wrote:
Tell you what. Watch the Rachel M. show and see how many deliberate falsehoods or serious ommisions or deliberatly misconstrued speechs you find. It's not hard: Just try to drop some preconcieved notions before you start and you may be as surprised/ashamed as I first was.
Tell you what, watch Maddow's show today, or tomorrow, and show us all the "serious omissions or deliberately misconstrued speeches" you have found. Let me know which day.
annoyed wrote:
It's a shame one of the thinkers in this forum should become so mired down in the past when there's so much to be done in the future. I thought that was a Republican game.
Again, I have no idea of what you're saying. Can you explain who's "mired down in the past", and give an example of what you mean?
GRANDPA NICOLAI

Chico, CA

#6 Dec 19, 2012
annoyed wrote:
<quoted text>
"That is one of the reasons I quite frequently refer to conservatives as being brainwashed...."
And the other reasons????? Could it just be that continuing to search for decisivness is what you're after???? They say actions speak louder than words....what do you think?(Don't be a HIO)
It should be common knowledge each party mirrors the efforts of the other. Perhaps in slightly different form but always non-the-less.
Tell you what. Watch the Rachel M. show and see how many deliberate falsehoods or serious ommisions or deliberatly misconstrued speechs you find. It's not hard: Just try to drop some preconcieved notions before you start and you may be as surprised/ashamed as I first was.
It's a shame one of the thinkers in this forum should become so mired down in the past when there's so much to be done in the future. I thought that was a Republican game.
>
>
I am not quite sure what it is you mean about my "continuing search for decisiveness," and no one could be an HIO other than HIO himself/herself....

Political parties are like breweries, they package their beers in different colored containers but in the end the drinks taste pretty much the same...

One need not watch Rachel M nor Faux talking heads to know that just about everyone always spins things to place themselves and their agenda in the best of lights... Everyone from your granny to the President of the United States engages in double speak....You know.... "uncle Joe went to heaven" to
"guns don't kill people people kill people" to "collateral damage" and everything in between... and oh yes, sometimes we do omit to say the things that could derail our arguments....
annoyed

Redding, CA

#7 Dec 20, 2012
GRANDPA NICOLAI wrote:
<quoted text>
>
>
I am not quite sure what it is you mean about my "continuing search for decisiveness," and no one could be an HIO other than HIO himself/herself....
Political parties are like breweries, they package their beers in different colored containers but in the end the drinks taste pretty much the same...
One need not watch Rachel M nor Faux talking heads to know that just about everyone always spins things to place themselves and their agenda in the best of lights... Everyone from your granny to the President of the United States engages in double speak....You know.... "uncle Joe went to heaven" to
"guns don't kill people people kill people" to "collateral damage" and everything in between... and oh yes, sometimes we do omit to say the things that could derail our arguments....
So much for an honest and open debate then???????

"and oh yes, sometimes we do omit to say the things that could derail our arguments.."

Good of you to say this but this is exactly what I mean. Lying (in it's many forms) is a twisting of reality. Now in Ol' MS people's reality is twisted one way and in New York their reality is twisted 180 degrees in the opposite direction. Is there any hope for meaningful dialog between these people???????? NOT without change....and politicians control such things to their own advantage and supply their party's "twist." How do you like it?

And yet everyone from your kid to your pastor embraces this situation with open arms for PERSONAL ADVABTAGE, just as you say. I don't...or at least I try not to (and sometimes try to untwist). I don't think that's so bad (not easy I'll tell you); I wish more people did the same. It's like voting against the latest communications tax here in Chico: I don't want to compromise our children's (and grandchildren's) futures and burden them without their consent. Some people don't care, just as long as they get THEIR personal advantage.

But as long as someone wants to BE a democrat or republican they are working against themselves being just human. I guess it makes them feel safer.
Repubicans make me puke

Lincoln, CA

#8 Dec 20, 2012
annoyed wrote:
<quoted text>
So much for an honest and open debate then???????
"and oh yes, sometimes we do omit to say the things that could derail our arguments.."
Good of you to say this but this is exactly what I mean. Lying (in it's many forms) is a twisting of reality. Now in Ol' MS people's reality is twisted one way and in New York their reality is twisted 180 degrees in the opposite direction. Is there any hope for meaningful dialog between these people???????? NOT without change....and politicians control such things to their own advantage and supply their party's "twist." How do you like it?
And yet everyone from your kid to your pastor embraces this situation with open arms for PERSONAL ADVABTAGE, just as you say. I don't...or at least I try not to (and sometimes try to untwist). I don't think that's so bad (not easy I'll tell you); I wish more people did the same. It's like voting against the latest communications tax here in Chico: I don't want to compromise our children's (and grandchildren's) futures and burden them without their consent. Some people don't care, just as long as they get THEIR personal advantage.
But as long as someone wants to BE a democrat or republican they are working against themselves being just human. I guess it makes them feel safer.
It's extremely hard if not impossible to have an open debate when the other person (you) doesn't make sense.
GRANDPA NICOLAI

Chico, CA

#9 Dec 21, 2012
annoyed wrote:
<quoted text>
So much for an honest and open debate then???????
"and oh yes, sometimes we do omit to say the things that could derail our arguments.."
Good of you to say this but this is exactly what I mean. Lying (in it's many forms) is a twisting of reality. Now in Ol' MS people's reality is twisted one way and in New York their reality is twisted 180 degrees in the opposite direction. Is there any hope for meaningful dialog between these people???????? NOT without change....and politicians control such things to their own advantage and supply their party's "twist." How do you like it?
And yet everyone from your kid to your pastor embraces this situation with open arms for PERSONAL ADVABTAGE, just as you say. I don't...or at least I try not to (and sometimes try to untwist). I don't think that's so bad (not easy I'll tell you); I wish more people did the same. It's like voting against the latest communications tax here in Chico: I don't want to compromise our children's (and grandchildren's) futures and burden them without their consent. Some people don't care, just as long as they get THEIR personal advantage.
But as long as someone wants to BE a democrat or republican they are working against themselves being just human. I guess it makes them feel safer.
>
>
One can not have a meaningful dialog with people who insist on making up their own definitions for the relevant words pertinent to the topic of discussion at hand.

In Geometry, terms such as point, line, plane, etc are rigorously and unambiguously defined, and parallel lines are no better than perpendicular ones, they just are.... mathematicians understand each other just by jutting numbers and diagrams on a chalk board...

Enter the field of politics and words such as capitalist, socialist, liberal, conservative, etc.. etc are tainted or loaded with connotations and innuendos....

Enter a fool like SOCIOPATH, aka INFANTILE and all those words mean whatever the ignoramus wants them to mean in any given post

Then we have LOCAL IDIOT who plagiarizes and cuts and pastes from right wing blogs instead of communicating in his own words, so one does not know whom or what one is debating with.

When you add to the mix of nuts a clown like HERE IS ONE whose sole purpose here is to spread disinformation and disrupt as many dialogs as possible with his ceaseless lies, tirades and calling anyone who disagrees with his mindless tripe a liar....

Thats how we end up with this goat roping contest known as the CHICO FORUM......
Local

Hidden Valley Lake, CA

#10 Dec 21, 2012
GRANDPA NICOLAI wrote:
<quoted text>
>
>
One can not have a meaningful dialog with people who insist on making up their own definitions for the relevant words pertinent to the topic of discussion at hand.
In Geometry, terms such as point, line, plane, etc are rigorously and unambiguously defined, and parallel lines are no better than perpendicular ones, they just are.... mathematicians understand each other just by jutting numbers and diagrams on a chalk board...
Enter the field of politics and words such as capitalist, socialist, liberal, conservative, etc.. etc are tainted or loaded with connotations and innuendos....
Enter a fool like SOCIOPATH, aka INFANTILE and all those words mean whatever the ignoramus wants them to mean in any given post
Then we have LOCAL IDIOT who plagiarizes and cuts and pastes from right wing blogs instead of communicating in his own words, so one does not know whom or what one is debating with.
When you add to the mix of nuts a clown like HERE IS ONE whose sole purpose here is to spread disinformation and disrupt as many dialogs as possible with his ceaseless lies, tirades and calling anyone who disagrees with his mindless tripe a liar....
Thats how we end up with this goat roping contest known as the CHICO FORUM......
Now you know why HIO calls you "grumpy".
Your defeatist attitude is duly noted.......yet again.
No facts or examples of anything you say..........just personal ad hominem attack and innuendo..........a useless waste of time and space.
You are acting like obama in regard to the fiscal cliff. He wants us to go over the edge(tax hikes for everyone) and is using the same tactics as you are using in your "unlikely quest" for meaningful debate.
You are not only insincere, but you are a liar and a sham of an American who is only interested in spreading propaganda in favor of your socialist philosophy.
Your personal attacks only serve to prove your inability to carry on a useful dialogue with anyone. When you are faced with superior intellect of factual info. that proves you wrong, you attack the messenger.
Discrediting the messenger is an age old tactic used by those who cannot figure out a way to win an argument. This reply answers a post that proves my point to be true.
You are where you belong.....a defeatist ole socialist pos.

If you want to have a meaningful discussion, make a statement about the topic at hand, instead of posting yet another ad hominem personal attack that does not address anything but your fervent desire to insult those who may disagree with you.
Tea Party Solution

San Clemente, CA

#11 Dec 21, 2012
Local wrote:
<quoted text>
You are where you belong.....a defeatist ole socialist pos.
If you want to have a meaningful discussion, make a statement about the topic at hand, instead of posting yet another ad hominem personal attack that does not address anything but your fervent desire to insult those who may disagree with you.
You're response illustrates exactly the 'ad hominem attacks' that you're criticizing.

Your response does not address anything about this topic, which is exactly what you're blaming GRANDPA for doing.

So, reply to the topic-- which is about the use of emotionally loaded buzzwords, such as 'defeatist ole socialist pos', and how such meaningless and superficial words make many people respond emotionally, and leave their intellects incapable of reasonable thought.

“Government IS the problem.”

Since: Jan 08

Chico, CA

#12 Dec 21, 2012
Tea Party Solution wrote:
The righties in these blogs repeatedly show that they view our country's dilemma as "freedom" versus "communism". It goes like this:
__________
Capitalism Communism
No Governmental Control Any Governmental Control
of Business, Market Forces, Of Business, Market Forces,
or Social Issues Or Social Issues
You are again, of course, wrong.

Which conservatives have ever advocated for no government control or zero regulations?
Every Libertarian or conservative economist that I have read state that their must be some government control and some regulations.

I would like to see some proof to the claims you are making re Big health insurance firms being surprised and pleased.

Most corporations do not want a free market, hence the myriad lobbyists in Washington spending billions of dollars to sway the corrupt politicians to do their bidding.

Try again, as most of this post was wrong.
Tea Party Solution

San Clemente, CA

#13 Dec 21, 2012
Sam Lowree wrote:
<quoted text>
Which conservatives have ever advocated for no government control or zero regulations?
YOU have made such blanket assertions. YOU have recently said that ALL regulations take away our freedoms.
Sam Lowree wrote:
<Every Libertarian or conservative economist that I have read state that their must be some government control and some regulations.
You and many righties, including repub presidential candidates during the primaries, have wanted to eliminate the EPA and de-regulate Wall Street and the Big Banks even more. You want to de-regulate the guys who brought down our economy 4 years ago, and the guys who destroyed the Gulf, killed many of their workers, and harmed thousands of small businesses.
Sam Lowree wrote:
<I would like to see some proof to the claims you are making re Big health insurance firms being surprised and pleased.
Read Potter's book,'Deadly Spin', about how the health insurance firms discovered through their focus groups the most emotionally laden terms to use in their propaganda, terms such as 'government takeover'. The insurance industry then showed their bought-off repub politicians how to use these knee-jerk terms in their speeches. and the industry also hired people to use these buzzwords in supposedly neutral op-ed articles in newspapers and websites. And then they get influential media such as Limbaugh and Fox News to throw around the same ideas. These are just a few of the ways that big business cartels push their agendas-- and righties just lap it up.
Sam Lowree wrote:
<Most corporations do not want a free market, hence the myriad lobbyists in Washington spending billions of dollars to sway the corrupt politicians to do their bidding..
Hooray! You finally admit the fact of the corporate/ political alliance. I would just add that the corporations are also corrupt, not just the politicians who take their bribes. But the crazy thing is that what the politicians and corporations are doing is completely legal. Corrupt, yes, but legal. That's why getting the money out of politics would be the best thing we can do to clean up this whole bought-off mess.
GRANDPA NICOLAI

Chico, CA

#14 Dec 21, 2012
Local wrote:
<quoted text>
Now you know why HIO calls you "grumpy".
Your defeatist attitude is duly noted.......yet again.
No facts or examples of anything you say..........just personal ad hominem attack and innuendo..........a useless waste of time and space.
You are acting like obama in regard to the fiscal cliff. He wants us to go over the edge(tax hikes for everyone) and is using the same tactics as you are using in your "unlikely quest" for meaningful debate.
You are not only insincere, but you are a liar and a sham of an American who is only interested in spreading propaganda in favor of your socialist philosophy.
Your personal attacks only serve to prove your inability to carry on a useful dialogue with anyone. When you are faced with superior intellect of factual info. that proves you wrong, you attack the messenger.
Discrediting the messenger is an age old tactic used by those who cannot figure out a way to win an argument. This reply answers a post that proves my point to be true.
You are where you belong.....a defeatist ole socialist pos.
If you want to have a meaningful discussion, make a statement about the topic at hand, instead of posting yet another ad hominem personal attack that does not address anything but your fervent desire to insult those who may disagree with you.
>
>
I don't much care what nor why HIO calls me whatever it is he calls me, HIO has zero credibility as far as most intelligent posters and readers of TOPIX are concerned...

But someone like you, who is constantly pounding on teachers and accusing President OBAMA of trying to destroy America has very little room to talk about "defeatists attitudes" wouldn't you say...???

As far as facts go, I offer the Chico Forum as exhibit A, where the intelligent reader can see for himself/herself where your HIO, aka HERE IS ONE aka MEXITROLL interjects himself into just about every thread and starts posting totally irrelevant stuff from threads that ended months ago in an attempt to disrupt the ongoing dialog....

The intelligent reader will also soon see how HERE IS ONE childishly labels posters as liars simply because they disagree with him....

As exhibit B I offer someone who goes by the handles of "THE INFANTILE LEFT WING" and "SOCIOPATHIC LIBERALS" now tell us , what kind of an intelligent dialog could one have with such a one...?

Or how could one have a meaningful political dialog with someone who openly announces "The government IS the problem" on his avatar...?

There is absolutely no need for me to "discredit the messengers" on these fora because "the messengers" do an outstanding job at discrediting themselves...

Finally, the only superior intellects currently posting on these threads are SOLUTION, ARE YOUR EYES OPEN, TSQ, RABBIT, and a couple of others who's moniker I can't recall at the moment... I haven't quite figured out ANNOYED yet...

The only person on your side who could be considered an intellect of sorts is SAM, but he is the guy whose opinions are preceded by his avatar...

“Government IS the problem.”

Since: Jan 08

Chico, CA

#15 Dec 21, 2012
Tea Party Solution wrote:
<quoted text>
YOU have made such blanket assertions. YOU have recently said that ALL regulations take away our freedoms.
Yes. Do regulations take away your freedoms?
That being said, I have never said that we need to do away with government or with all regulations. No one, except those 99%ers, want anarchy.
Tea Party Solution wrote:
<quoted text>
You and many righties, including repub presidential candidates during the primaries, have wanted to eliminate the EPA and de-regulate Wall Street and the Big Banks even more. You want to de-regulate the guys who brought down our economy 4 years ago, and the guys who destroyed the Gulf, killed many of their workers, and harmed thousands of small businesses.
Yes, at this point in time the EPA is doing more harm than good, we don't need unfettered environmental whacko bureaucrats making laws. Wall Street and the banks are anything but in regulated. It is government intervention in the market that causes recessions.
Tea Party Solution wrote:
<quoted text>
Hooray! You finally admit the fact of the corporate/ political alliance. I would just add that the corporations are also corrupt, not just the politicians who take their bribes. But the crazy thing is that what the politicians and corporations are doing is completely legal. Corrupt, yes, but legal. That's why getting the money out of politics would be the best thing we can do to clean up this whole bought-off mess.
I never denied the fact that cronyism is alive and well. You blame the corporations for the corruption and I blame the politicians. Do away with the corporations and you will still have politicians buying votes from someone. Do away with the politicians and you end cronyism.
Repubicans make me puke

Lincoln, CA

#16 Dec 21, 2012
GRANDPA NICOLAI wrote:
<quoted text>
>
>
One can not have a meaningful dialog with people who insist on making up their own definitions for the relevant words pertinent to the topic of discussion at hand.

Enter a fool like SOCIOPATH, aka INFANTILE and all those words mean whatever the ignoramus wants them to mean in any given post
Then we have LOCAL IDIOT who plagiarizes and cuts and pastes from right wing blogs instead of communicating in his own words, so one does not know whom or what one is debating with.
When you add to the mix of nuts a clown like HERE IS ONE whose sole purpose here is to spread disinformation and disrupt as many dialogs as possible with his ceaseless lies, tirades and calling anyone who disagrees with his mindless tripe a liar....
Thats how we end up with this goat roping contest known as the CHICO FORUM......
Gramps, you should have used Mexi -troll as your example.
GRANDPA NICOLAI

Chico, CA

#17 Dec 22, 2012
Repubicans make me puke wrote:
<quoted text>
Gramps, you should have used Mexi -troll as your example.
>
>
Yeah, I know, but wether we refer to it as HERE IS ONE or MEXITROLL we are still talking about the same siht....
Repubicans make me puke

Lincoln, CA

#18 Dec 22, 2012
GRANDPA NICOLAI wrote:
<quoted text>
>
>
Yeah, I know, but wether we refer to it as HERE IS ONE or MEXITROLL we are still talking about the same siht....
As usual you're right.
annoyed

United States

#19 Dec 22, 2012
GRANDPA NICOLAI wrote:
<quoted text>
>
>
One can not have a meaningful dialog with people who insist on making up their own definitions for the relevant words pertinent to the topic of discussion at hand.
In Geometry, terms such as point, line, plane, etc are rigorously and unambiguously defined, and parallel lines are no better than perpendicular ones, they just are.... mathematicians understand each other just by jutting numbers and diagrams on a chalk board...
Enter the field of politics and words such as capitalist, socialist, liberal, conservative, etc.. etc are tainted or loaded with connotations and innuendos....
Enter a fool like SOCIOPATH, aka INFANTILE and all those words mean whatever the ignoramus wants them to mean in any given post
Then we have LOCAL IDIOT who plagiarizes and cuts and pastes from right wing blogs instead of communicating in his own words, so one does not know whom or what one is debating with.
When you add to the mix of nuts a clown like HERE IS ONE whose sole purpose here is to spread disinformation and disrupt as many dialogs as possible with his ceaseless lies, tirades and calling anyone who disagrees with his mindless tripe a liar....
Thats how we end up with this goat roping contest known as the CHICO FORUM......
I agree EXCEPT instead of CHICO FORUM I'd say (with the proper politicians names inserted) "That's how we end up with this goat roping contest known as AMERICAN POLITICS.

The problem is to debate/discuss/negotiate HONESTLY everyone puts their cards on the table...but we're taught from birth to always have an advantage, secrets or "hole card."

But if you can't understand or debate/ negotiate the basic, underlying differences how can you ever reach any acceptable conclusions?

Can people evolve/educate/change so this becomes less of a problem? Perhaps, but without a person or occurance to bring us all together, it won't happen.

An example (which just occured to me): WWII was over in record time when most (ok, not the bush family) pulled together (even in the short term). How long would that have taken with the politicians (here and abroad) we have now; 10 years? 20? 30? Against the raving mad German juggernaught we'd have LOST. Today it's worse than the original Tower of Babel.

Local

Hidden Valley Lake, CA

#20 Dec 22, 2012
Tea Party Solution wrote:
<quoted text>
You're response illustrates exactly the 'ad hominem attacks' that you're criticizing.
Your response does not address anything about this topic, which is exactly what you're blaming GRANDPA for doing.
So, reply to the topic-- which is about the use of emotionally loaded buzzwords, such as 'defeatist ole socialist pos', and how such meaningless and superficial words make many people respond emotionally, and leave their intellects incapable of reasonable thought.
First things first.
my response(post #10) proves my point to be true(especially in regard to the ole pos's statement about me)...no copy and paste...just LOCAL.

Therefore, "grumpy" has been proven to be a sheiit disturber/liar...yet again. He should not be taken seriously about anything.

I will respond to your post #1 on this thread another time.

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