Army Sergeant One Of Victims in Downtown Shooting Spree

Full story: WGRZ Buffalo

One of the victim's of Sunday's shooting spree outside a Buffalo nightclub is a 26-year-old Army Sergeant, and father of two.

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brandy

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#1
Jan 14, 2008
 
Did it ever occur to anyone that most of the late night shootings in or around the so called ”entertainment districts” happen at or around the 4 pm closing? Does it occur to anyone that the one of the reasons we have bars open that late, is because at one time we had 1,000’s of steel plant employees working 24 hours a day, and after the 11pm shift ended many went out to “unwind”. I actually remember that after the 7:00 am shift was over some, too would go out. And drink their beer from Coffee cups,(That’s another story) but times have changed.

In most other cities bars close at 1 or 2 am. I had the opportunity to live in St. Louis for many years and the bars were pretty crowded by 8pm, a live band might start at 9pm, and then close at 1 am. People had a chance to get a bite to eat, get home and get some sleep all before the sun came up. I’m sure the business owners will complain that they will loose business. Maybe the police would back the idea that, if the closing hours were gradually moved back, each generation of the partying population would learn to get used to the difference. Even in St. Louis the home of the Anheuser-Busch Companies, their strong lobbying arm did not see the need to have establishments close late. Certainly their business is doing well. We can’t afford to have more senseless alcohol induced shootings, especially when witnesses are unwilling to come forward. Unfortunately, that too, is another story.
concerned

Niagara Falls, NY

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#2
Jan 14, 2008
 
brandy wrote:
Did it ever occur to anyone that most of the late night shootings in or around the so called ”entertainment districts” happen at or around the 4 pm closing? Does it occur to anyone that the one of the reasons we have bars open that late, is because at one time we had 1,000’s of steel plant employees working 24 hours a day, and after the 11pm shift ended many went out to “unwind”. I actually remember that after the 7:00 am shift was over some, too would go out. And drink their beer from Coffee cups,(That’s another story) but times have changed.
In most other cities bars close at 1 or 2 am. I had the opportunity to live in St. Louis for many years and the bars were pretty crowded by 8pm, a live band might start at 9pm, and then close at 1 am. People had a chance to get a bite to eat, get home and get some sleep all before the sun came up. I’m sure the business owners will complain that they will loose business. Maybe the police would back the idea that, if the closing hours were gradually moved back, each generation of the partying population would learn to get used to the difference. Even in St. Louis the home of the Anheuser-Busch Companies, their strong lobbying arm did not see the need to have establishments close late. Certainly their business is doing well. We can’t afford to have more senseless alcohol induced shootings, especially when witnesses are unwilling to come forward. Unfortunately, that too, is another story.
Right on !
Doesn't this ring a bell. When will somebody do something about it. But in Buffalo, who is to say it isn't going to happen at 2:00am.
kris2

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#3
Jan 14, 2008
 
Like someone already stated on another post just because you move the time doesn't mean the trouble will stop. They will just end up shooting each other at 2a.m. instead of 4. Maybe they will have time to be triaged at ECMC then back on the street in time for breakfast!! In Rochester bars close at 2a.m. guess what crime still happens!!
anonymous

Niagara Falls, NY

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#4
Jan 15, 2008
 

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One of the people shot was an army sargeant home on leave from Iraq. He is from Watertown and is facing drug charges there. That's a long way to go for drugs, Watertown to Buffalo. The nightclub has been closed according to Channel 7 news. Ghetto thugs will just go somewhere else downtown,,,,it;s no fun in there own hood.
Tim

Buffalo, NY

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#5
Jan 15, 2008
 
It is pretty sad that this Army Sgt survived 2 tours in Iraq and came home safe, only to be shot on the street outside of a nightclub.
However, with the drug history that is hanging over his head, I'm not surprised.
Typically, not always, people in the military are taught discipline and restraint. Too bad this kid didn't learn anything while he has been in the military. This just goes to show that you can't take the ghetto out of some people!
I think it is a great thing that The Space nightclub is closing, GOOD RIDDANCE!!!!
The Chippewa District, although I don't think it is the greatest place, never had these problems until the hip-hop clubs began to surface. I obviously don't think it is the music itself, it is the type of crowd that is drawn to this type of club that is the problem! Whenever previous hip-hop clubs opened, they were always shut down due to violence, and when it was shut down, the violence always stopped until a new club opened in its place.
I was the one on a previous post that said closing bars at 2am won't solve the problem of violence, it will only change the time of the violence.
Even bars on the East Side know better. The people who patronize these bars are primarily black. The bar owners have a strict dress code, because they don't want thugs in the club. They also enforce(to the best of their ability) an age requirement of 25. It is pretty sad when even black club owners try to restrict ghetto thugs from entering their establishments!!!
anonymous

Niagara Falls, NY

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#6
Jan 15, 2008
 
Tim wrote:
It is pretty sad that this Army Sgt survived 2 tours in Iraq and came home safe, only to be shot on the street outside of a nightclub.
However, with the drug history that is hanging over his head, I'm not surprised.
Typically, not always, people in the military are taught discipline and restraint. Too bad this kid didn't learn anything while he has been in the military. This just goes to show that you can't take the ghetto out of some people
I think it is a great thing that The Space nightclub is closing, GOOD RIDDANCE!!!!
The Chippewa District, although I don't think it is the greatest place, never had these problems until the hip-hop clubs began to surface. I obviously don't think it is the music itself, it is the type of crowd that is drawn to this type of club that is the problem! Whenever previous hip-hop clubs opened, they were always shut down due to violence, and when it was shut down, the violence always stopped until a new club opened in its place.
I was the one on a previous post that said closing bars at 2am won't solve the problem of violence, it will only change the time of the violence.
Even bars on the East Side know better. The people who patronize these bars are primarily black. The bar owners have a strict dress code, because they don't want thugs in the club. They also enforce(to the best of their ability) an age requirement of 25. It is pretty sad when even black club owners try to restrict ghetto thugs from entering their establishments!!!
Excellent post. The owner of Hemingway's, which is a very decent place, was on tv this a.m. and you could see he was upset. His place is right next door to that thug club. I believe his business has suffered because of this. People are not willing to come downtown to patronize the better places because of the problems with the thug bars. I hope now that it'sclosed, things will be better for the legitimate business owners there.

Since: Dec 07

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#7
Jan 15, 2008
 

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I moved from a city that had it's clubs/bars close at midnight. And there was always something bad going on every night at closing time.
The problem is, when you boot a large group of drunk people out at the same time, they congregate outside before leaving.
This has nothing to do with race, it has to do with too many drunk people in one place with nothing to do.

The best stratagey is to have everyone disperse as soon as they walk out the doors. Bar owners could even help out by having taxi's pre-paid and ready to help out with some of the crowd.
anonymous

Niagara Falls, NY

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#8
Jan 15, 2008
 

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Frosty wrote:
I moved from a city that had it's clubs/bars close at midnight. And there was always something bad going on every night at closing time.
The problem is, when you boot a large group of drunk people out at the same time, they congregate outside before leaving.
This has nothing to do with race, it has to do with too many drunk people in one place with nothing to do.
The best stratagey is to have everyone disperse as soon as they walk out the doors. Bar owners could even help out by having taxi's pre-paid and ready to help out with some of the crowd.
Prepaid taxi's???? So the ghetto thugs can mug the cab drivers?. It has everything to do with race, drugs, turf, guns and drinking.
Tim

Buffalo, NY

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#9
Jan 15, 2008
 

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Frosty wrote:
I moved from a city that had it's clubs/bars close at midnight. And there was always something bad going on every night at closing time.
The problem is, when you boot a large group of drunk people out at the same time, they congregate outside before leaving.
This has nothing to do with race, it has to do with too many drunk people in one place with nothing to do.
The best stratagey is to have everyone disperse as soon as they walk out the doors. Bar owners could even help out by having taxi's pre-paid and ready to help out with some of the crowd.
I agree with your post to a certain extent.
However, at 4am when all of the other bars empty out, with literally hundreds of drunken white people kicked to the street, why aren't there any shootings then? I know there are alot of fights, but why not any shootings?
It seems the shootings and extreme violence only take place at the clubs where hip-hop is the main draw.
Sorry, but you can't argue with the facts!
Ron T

Niagara Falls, NY

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#10
Jan 15, 2008
 
It's to my understanding that the more serious victim was the target of the shooting and it was due to a retaliation. In addition, he has an arrest warrant (for drugs) pending in Watertown, NY. If this information is correct then the other victims are innocent bystanders to his intentional demise.

The people that retaliated knew about his whereabouts and waited for the opportunity to put him underground.

In response to security, bring back the Buffalo Special Police. The mayor and the police department needs to get their heads out of their asses and put the TRAINED volunteer police force back on the streets for a secure presence. I know, some knucklehead is going to write and comment about guns, wannabe cops etc; however these men and woman are trained (NYS Peace Officer training) and I have seen them patrolling Seneca Street. I am not suggesting that they return fire when shot at; however just the presence of a trained person in uniform will deter crime.

The Buffalo Police are swamped and each officer cannot be at multiple places at once!

Some are against this idea of the Buffalo Special Police; however are you against the idea of volunteer fireman and woman? Mmm!

Ron T
www.ipranked.com
Food for thought

Dayton, OH

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#11
Jan 15, 2008
 
anonymous wrote:
<quoted text>Prepaid taxi's???? So the ghetto thugs can mug the cab drivers?. It has everything to do with race, drugs, turf, guns and drinking.
Couldnt have said it better: from race to drinking...nothing like a white drunk man. And after serving 2 tours in the war I would smoke weed to. LOL

Since: Dec 07

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#12
Jan 15, 2008
 

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Tim wrote:
<quoted text>
It seems the shootings and extreme violence only take place at the clubs where hip-hop is the main draw.
Sorry, but you can't argue with the facts!
Have you listened to that music? It'd make me want to shoot something too.
JK =P

The reason white people aren't shooting people at the clubs is that they are too busy killing their family members at home or shooting random people in schools or malls.
Tim

Buffalo, NY

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#13
Jan 15, 2008
 
Frosty wrote:
<quoted text>
Have you listened to that music? It'd make me want to shoot something too.
JK =P
The reason white people aren't shooting people at the clubs is that they are too busy killing their family members at home or shooting random people in schools or malls.
Real intelligent response!
The music itself is not the cause for this type of behavior. Everyone knows that hip-hop music is most popular in nightclubs for the reasons of dancing. That's fine.
Nightclubs in the 'burbs play hip-hop music to draw in crowds. But, at the end of the night, when everyone is kicked out, you NEVER hear about shootings and extreme violence. These people have had just as many drinks as people in the city(probably as much drug use too), but you NEVER hear about the violence. Why? Because there aren't a bunch of ghetto thugs hanging around in these places.
Take Hertel Ave. in the city. The same thing applies.
Hip-hop is a big draw for the clubs, but at the end of the night, NO shootings. Why? Because there are no ghetto thugs in these places.
This isn't necessarily a race issue, because you can see black people in the clubs in the 'burbs, but they aren't ghetto thugs! They have a good time like everyone else, and at the end of the night, go home just like everyone else! The same thing applies at clubs on Hertel and anywhere else.
Seriously, why do you think even black nightclub owners on the East Side don't want this type of element in their bars? That is why they enforce dress codes and the 25 year age limit on their patrons, which just happen to be black.
HA HA HA

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#14
Jan 15, 2008
 

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Lets see.........bench warrant for DRUGS!!!! Down town at 4 a.m. in the morning.........hmmmmmmm...... ....GOT WHAT HE DESERVED!!!! Druggie!!!!!
City of Good Neighbors

Tonawanda, NY

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#15
Jan 15, 2008
 
Move it (the nightclubs) back to the Eastside where it belongs!
Ron T

Niagara Falls, NY

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#16
Jan 15, 2008
 
HA HA HA wrote:
Lets see.........bench warrant for DRUGS!!!! Down town at 4 a.m. in the morning.........hmmmmmmm...... ....GOT WHAT HE DESERVED!!!! Druggie!!!!!
To top it off for the night, there were victims of his stupidity too. Keep in mind, I'm sure his "posse" was (singular term) waiting for him!

RT
www.ipranked.com
AKJ

Americus, GA

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#17
Jan 15, 2008
 
God help our nation. And for those with negative comments, God bless you to. I'll pray for you all.

Since: Dec 07

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#18
Jan 15, 2008
 
Tim wrote:
<quoted text>
Real intelligent response!
My response was meant more as a joke than anything. Sorry if it offended (it's hard to tell in text).

I agree with a lot of what you are saying and the points you've made. Club owners can only do so much to keep a "bad element" out of their club. And I applaud their efforts. The problem is, the "bad element" still exists regardless, and I don't think anyone has a real solution for this.

As for the person who suggested they got what they deserved, what about the other people who were also shot randomly?
Linda

Orchard Park, NY

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#19
Jan 15, 2008
 

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Frosty wrote:
<quoted text>
My response was meant more as a joke than anything. Sorry if it offended (it's hard to tell in text).
I agree with a lot of what you are saying and the points you've made. Club owners can only do so much to keep a "bad element" out of their club. And I applaud their efforts. The problem is, the "bad element" still exists regardless, and I don't think anyone has a real solution for this.
As for the person who suggested they got what they deserved, what about the other people who were also shot randomly?
THOSE OTHER PEOPLE WERE WITH HIM AND YOU REAP WHAT YOU SOW. PICK BETTER FRIENDS. I REALLY RESENT SHOWING HIS PICTURE WITH A UNIFORM ON BECAUSE THIS INCIDENT DIDN'T HAPPEN WHILE HE WAS SERVING OUR COUNTRY. HE SHOULD HAVE BEEN HOME WITH HIS WIFE AND CHILDREN. WHAT WAS HE DOING IN BUFFALO ON A WEEKEND AND TILL 4:00 A.M. LOOKS TO ME LIKE HE WAS A BAD FATHER, BAD HUSBAND, BAD FRIEND AND BAD SOLDIER. WHY DID HE JOIN THE SERVICE? WAS IT TO AVOID A JAIL SENTENCE. IT WILL BE INTERESTING TO SEE ABOUT THE DRUG CHARGE IN WATERTOWN.

Since: Dec 07

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#20
Jan 15, 2008
 
Linda wrote:
<quoted text> THOSE OTHER PEOPLE WERE WITH HIM AND YOU REAP WHAT YOU SOW. PICK BETTER FRIENDS. I REALLY RESENT SHOWING HIS PICTURE WITH A UNIFORM ON BECAUSE THIS INCIDENT DIDN'T HAPPEN WHILE HE WAS SERVING OUR COUNTRY. HE SHOULD HAVE BEEN HOME WITH HIS WIFE AND CHILDREN. WHAT WAS HE DOING IN BUFFALO ON A WEEKEND AND TILL 4:00 A.M. LOOKS TO ME LIKE HE WAS A BAD FATHER, BAD HUSBAND, BAD FRIEND AND BAD SOLDIER. WHY DID HE JOIN THE SERVICE? WAS IT TO AVOID A JAIL SENTENCE. IT WILL BE INTERESTING TO SEE ABOUT THE DRUG CHARGE IN WATERTOWN.
I may have missed this, but where did it say the other people that were shot were his friends?

I'm not sure how his going out while visiting friends and family makes him a bad father, husband or friend? Was there more news about this on TV perhaps?

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