Where is Foley's Hurricane Shelter???

Where is Foley's Hurricane Shelter???

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Imangttia

Foley, AL

#1 Aug 28, 2008
We know that the Foley Justice Building on Section Street is a shelter for the family's of the Foley Police Department. I have advocated that it should also allow all citizens of Foley to seek shelter there in case of an emergency. As of now, I do not know that it is. If anyone here can verify that all citizens of Foley are invited to seek shelter in this building if Gustav and the possible other hurricanes that are now active come in our direction, please let the rest of us know. Thank You.
Imangttia

Foley, AL

#2 Aug 28, 2008
Imangttia wrote:
We know that the Foley Justice Building on Section Street is a shelter for the family's of the Foley Police Department. I have advocated that it should also allow all citizens of Foley to seek shelter there in case of an emergency. As of now, I do not know that it is. If anyone here can verify that all citizens of Foley are invited to seek shelter in this building if Gustav and the possible other hurricanes that are now active come in our direction, please let the rest of us know. Thank You.
The Mayor and City Council can find money (even if they have not collected it yet) for everything else, yet when it comes to building a hurricane shelter that can accommodate hundreds of Foley citizens and can be used for other purposes when not serving as a shelter, there seems to be no urgency about this. Apparently, their attitude is: Let the citizens leave town or get blown away. We need another Fire Station and a hurricane shelter and that should be a priority.
T PainJr

Foley, AL

#3 Aug 28, 2008
Does any Citizen know or have they been told what the Hurricane or Emergency Evacuation Plan is? City buildings are required to have posted an evacuation diagram for emergency situations but the Citizens of Foley have no such information available. I hear that the police will drive around town in their cars with speaking systems on and tell us what to do. Sounds kinda like "Caveman Days".
You need to read this

Foley, AL

#4 Aug 28, 2008
Baldwin County Emergency Management is the sole agency to authorize opening shelters. In the past they had an arrangement with the Red Cross to operate the shelters. When Ivan approached the Red Cross said they would not operate a shelter in the coastal area where school building or other buildings coud not be certified to withstand certain wind speeds. They would only open shelters in Bay Minette. Then the governor ordered the evacuation of the entire county. What a problem both of those orders were. many had neither the money or the transportation to go anywhere and the old stand by the schools were not open as there was no one to operate them, the Red cross had operated them for the past 100 years.

Now Baldwin Emergency Management has a contract with the Baldwin County School System to provide employees as shelter managers and the cafeteria workers to feed the people in the shelter. That way the school personel take care of there own facilities and EMA reimburses the school board for salaries and food. This takes the Red Cross out of the shelter operating position in the event of strong storms being anticipated. The Baldwin County Commission with the help of the Department of Human resources operates the satalite court houses as special needs shelters for people with medical needs, but not in need of being in the hospital, the hospitals can not hold them and be crammed full in case of the need for mass care of injured. The satalite courthouses have auxilary power to run medical machines.

So you are right emergency service personel will be in the strong city building in order to have a place to hunker down during a storm event, and then be ready to serve YOU and me after the danger has past. What you and your cohorts need to do is to take a shelter management course and volunteer with the Red Cross or emergency management to help yourself and your fellow citizens, not just during a hurricane, how about a chemical spill, a tornado, flood conditions - will you be a taker or a giver, we will never know but you will. Now shut up and do something, city, county and state government is not responsible for you and yours - you are.
Enough said
Imangttia

Foley, AL

#5 Aug 28, 2008
"Now shut up and do something, city, county and state government is not responsible for you and yours - you are."

After a lengthy 3-paragraph diatribe explaining what government is doing to protect us (for which we as taxpayers are absorbing the costs and rightfully deserve such protection), you then say it is us who are responsible for our safety. Which way is it? Enough said.

Since: Apr 08

Mobile, AL

#6 Aug 28, 2008
Foley High School has always opened as a shelter for the citizens of Foley. The Justice Center is used for police and some family so it does not take away space from the shelter for citizens, and so a police station is not left unmanned. Why sit here and complain about it when you don't even know what you are talking about? A simple call to your local police department would answer your question of where the shelters in Foley are.
WE KNOW

Foley, AL

#8 Aug 29, 2008
xissors wrote:
Foley High School has always opened as a shelter for the citizens of Foley. The Justice Center is used for police and some family so it does not take away space from the shelter for citizens, and so a police station is not left unmanned. Why sit here and complain about it when you don't even know what you are talking about? A simple call to your local police department would answer your question of where the shelters in Foley are.
if you had read what they were asking then you would not have been such a snmart ass about it. can people not be kind anymore. it is people like you that give southerners a bad name.
guitar picker

Foley, AL

#9 Aug 29, 2008
I was born and raised in the South, and I'm coming to the conclusion that there are a lot of SOUTHERN towns with a lot of "unhospitable" people, and they didn't move here from "up North". The days of Southern hospitality in general died some time ago, and it's too bad because it was such a rich heritage that money couldn't buy.
Imangttia

Foley, AL

#10 Aug 29, 2008
guitar picker wrote:
I was born and raised in the South, and I'm coming to the conclusion that there are a lot of SOUTHERN towns with a lot of "unhospitable" people, and they didn't move here from "up North". The days of Southern hospitality in general died some time ago, and it's too bad because it was such a rich heritage that money couldn't buy.
I'm from up North but, I was born and raised south of the Mason/Dixon Line so give me a pass. In general, I find Southerns very friendly and talkative. The one difference I have noticed is that Southern women congregate a lot more with other women then do Northern women. At times, I actually feel a little sorry for their husbands who I see alone lots of times while their wives are out of the house with 'The Belles'.
amazed at you

Danville, KY

#11 Aug 29, 2008
Imangttia wrote:
"Now shut up and do something, city, county and state government is not responsible for you and yours - you are."
After a lengthy 3-paragraph diatribe explaining what government is doing to protect us (for which we as taxpayers are absorbing the costs and rightfully deserve such protection), you then say it is us who are responsible for our safety. Which way is it? Enough said.
I've read your posts, all over the Foley forum and I'm wondering since you are so outspoken and seem to know what is wrong with everyone and what needs to be done to correct everything, why you haven't run for public office yourself, or put yourself in the position to really change things. So far, all I've seen from you is a hypercritical, bitter person with a lot of time on your hands. Maybe if you put your time and energy into POSITIVE and contructive actions, you might have a much happier day. Try smiling once in a while, it might help.

The Local governments have to provide shelter for the first responders that remain to take care of those who either ignore or can not evacuate when told to. If evacuation orders come, it is best to evacuate if you can. As a trauma surgeon, I was flown into the front lines immediately after Katrina. It is not a place you want to be.

P.S. A smart American should prepare to sustain himself and family for 3 days after a natural disaster. No matter how perfect a government is(be it local, state, or federal), there are limits to their ability. So stock up on food, water, batteries and all the other various items in the GOV. suggested survival kit.

Just a little free advice, you might seek some counseling for your anger. Anger will kill you, man.
Imangttia

Foley, AL

#12 Aug 29, 2008
"The Local governments have to provide shelter for the first responders that remain to take care of those who either ignore or can not evacuate when told to"

Are the families of local responders, responders too? My only point, originially, was to point out that this fantastic and superbly built Foley Justice Center should not be for the exclusive use of the Foley Police Department employees and their families. In case of emergencies, like a severe hurricane or a flood, everyone is a "responder". Haven't you seen on numerous occasions the hundreds of normal citizens helping their neighbors, filling and stacking sand bags, transporting the injured to the nearest hospital, etc.? Why aren't these people and their families allowed to enter the Foley Justice Center Building also? You don't know me but I have contributed more than most to worthwhile associations and organizations--not only as a member, but also served them as Secretary, Treasurer, Vice-President and President. There comes a time when younger people need to be given the chance to contribute and the older ones need to step aside to make room for fresh ideas and young blood; but, this does not preclude us old folks from drawing on a liftime of experiences to point out problems that need attention. If you interpret this condemnation of many different subjects as being mean-spirited rather than an attempt to arouse those who can otherwise make a difference for the better, then you are mistaken. And, as an aside; I have curiously noted since I brought up the subject of the limited accessibility of the Foley Justice Center to normal Foley Citizens, there has been an outpouring of defensive posts pointing out why it has to be reserved for the Police Department and their families. You know as well as I know, that very few people were and are aware of this restriction and it almost seems that those who did know and those who do know prefered to keep it a secret so that the public will not get up in arms about this injustice. I'm happy that I could bring this matter to, at least, the limited number of citizens that monitor this blog. That, I feel, is a very positive way for us old folks to contribute to the discussion.
NoBody

Houston, TX

#13 Aug 29, 2008
We need to keep in mind that the Justice Center houses the Police Department and Municipal Court. Both agencies have off-limits and limited access areas every day of the week. Yes, during emergencies, the employee's immediate family members are allowed to stay there, but even they are confined to certain areas. This actually makes the space inside very limited. Remember that the police are out DURING and AFTER major storms doing thier best to protect you and your assets. Allowing the public to use the PD as a shelter would cause more officers to be at the PD guarding the off-limits areas and not on the street where they are most needed. Also, it's very likely that, with the exception of the jail, the structure is not wind rated as a shelter. Ever think of that?

Since: Apr 08

Mobile, AL

#14 Sep 1, 2008
Imangttia wrote:
"The Local governments have to provide shelter for the first responders that remain to take care of those who either ignore or can not evacuate when told to"
Are the families of local responders, responders too? My only point, originially, was to point out that this fantastic and superbly built Foley Justice Center should not be for the exclusive use of the Foley Police Department employees and their families. In case of emergencies, like a severe hurricane or a flood, everyone is a "responder". Haven't you seen on numerous occasions the hundreds of normal citizens helping their neighbors, filling and stacking sand bags, transporting the injured to the nearest hospital, etc.? Why aren't these people and their families allowed to enter the Foley Justice Center Building also? You don't know me but I have contributed more than most to worthwhile associations and organizations--not only as a member, but also served them as Secretary, Treasurer, Vice-President and President. There comes a time when younger people need to be given the chance to contribute and the older ones need to step aside to make room for fresh ideas and young blood; but, this does not preclude us old folks from drawing on a liftime of experiences to point out problems that need attention. If you interpret this condemnation of many different subjects as being mean-spirited rather than an attempt to arouse those who can otherwise make a difference for the better, then you are mistaken. And, as an aside; I have curiously noted since I brought up the subject of the limited accessibility of the Foley Justice Center to normal Foley Citizens, there has been an outpouring of defensive posts pointing out why it has to be reserved for the Police Department and their families. You know as well as I know, that very few people were and are aware of this restriction and it almost seems that those who did know and those who do know prefered to keep it a secret so that the public will not get up in arms about this injustice. I'm happy that I could bring this matter to, at least, the limited number of citizens that monitor this blog. That, I feel, is a very positive way for us old folks to contribute to the discussion.
unless there is no room at the regular shelters in Foley, such as the high school, what does it matter? i can't remember the last time the Foley High School shelter was at capacity because of a hurricane, and i've lived here all of my life. so, what does it matter?
Imangttia

United States

#15 Sep 1, 2008
"unless there is no room at the regular shelters in Foley, such as the high school, what does it matter? i can't remember the last time the Foley High School shelter was at capacity because of a hurricane, and i've lived here all of my life. so, what does it matter?"

It's the principle of the thing--don't we live in a Country where all people are to be equal and no one is more equal than any other person. Also, who ever said that the Foley High School is certified safe? With all of the past high school buildings collapsing during high winds, I wonder if the Foley High School is rated for some level of wind speed--and, if it is, I'd like to know how it compares to the rating of the Foley Justice Building. I doubt that it is anywhere as safe.

Since: Apr 08

Mobile, AL

#16 Sep 1, 2008
Imangttia wrote:
"unless there is no room at the regular shelters in Foley, such as the high school, what does it matter? i can't remember the last time the Foley High School shelter was at capacity because of a hurricane, and i've lived here all of my life. so, what does it matter?"
It's the principle of the thing--don't we live in a Country where all people are to be equal and no one is more equal than any other person. Also, who ever said that the Foley High School is certified safe? With all of the past high school buildings collapsing during high winds, I wonder if the Foley High School is rated for some level of wind speed--and, if it is, I'd like to know how it compares to the rating of the Foley Justice Building. I doubt that it is anywhere as safe.
some grocery store workers and their families stay in local grocery stores for shelter sometimes. i guess we should force grocery stores to shelter people and open those up to the public also. some fire departments let families stay there, so i guess those should be forced to be open too. alot of local businesses house employees families, so we should force private businesses open for storm shelters. the battleship in Mobile housed employees during Katrina, so i guess the government should also force the battleship to open to the public for a storm shelter also.

what school collapses are you talking about? the only one that comes to mind is the school at Enterprise, but it took a direct hit from a tornado, not a hurricane. any building that takes a direct hit from a tornado is going to collapse, theres no way around that. having every tom, dick, and harry staying at the police department is just a bad idea for so many reasons.
Imangttia

United States

#17 Sep 1, 2008
xissors wrote:
<quoted text>
some grocery store workers and their families stay in local grocery stores for shelter sometimes. i guess we should force grocery stores to shelter people and open those up to the public also. some fire departments let families stay there, so i guess those should be forced to be open too. alot of local businesses house employees families, so we should force private businesses open for storm shelters. the battleship in Mobile housed employees during Katrina, so i guess the government should also force the battleship to open to the public for a storm shelter also.
what school collapses are you talking about? the only one that comes to mind is the school at Enterprise, but it took a direct hit from a tornado, not a hurricane. any building that takes a direct hit from a tornado is going to collapse, theres no way around that. having every tom, dick, and harry staying at the police department is just a bad idea for so many reasons.
First of all, private businesses are not funded by the tax payers and we can only hope that if there is an emergency where a private business can come to the fore, they will. Remember seeing all of the private storefront businesses in New York that took is hundreds of people fleeing down the street from the fallen Trade Center buildings? Have you ever noticed the number of fire departments that have a building attached to the building that houses the fire and rescue vehicles that is about 2-3 times as large? What is this building used for? It is a money maker for the Volunteer Fire Departments that holds bingo nights, Friday night dances, rents it out for weddings, etc. Are you telling me that these buildings could not also be used to shelter people during and emergency without impeding the fire and rescue operations when these other auxiliary activities apparently do not? The cruise ship in Mobile was used by the government for a year or more to house victims of Katrina so I think the battleship could also be used for the same purpose--right? I think that the point you are making is that since you think exclusivity in the provision of various shelters for some is the correct way to go, then anyone who suggests that such accommodations should be available to everyone during an emergency is wrong.
NoBody

Foley, AL

#18 Sep 2, 2008
I am pretty darn sure that if the shelters that are provided by the county reached capacity or even if someone simply couldn't make it to one of those shelters for some reason, the police would allow the PD to open up as overflow shelter or case-by-case.

Since: Apr 08

Mobile, AL

#19 Sep 2, 2008
Imangttia wrote:
<quoted text>
First of all, private businesses are not funded by the tax payers and we can only hope that if there is an emergency where a private business can come to the fore, they will. Remember seeing all of the private storefront businesses in New York that took is hundreds of people fleeing down the street from the fallen Trade Center buildings? Have you ever noticed the number of fire departments that have a building attached to the building that houses the fire and rescue vehicles that is about 2-3 times as large? What is this building used for? It is a money maker for the Volunteer Fire Departments that holds bingo nights, Friday night dances, rents it out for weddings, etc. Are you telling me that these buildings could not also be used to shelter people during and emergency without impeding the fire and rescue operations when these other auxiliary activities apparently do not? The cruise ship in Mobile was used by the government for a year or more to house victims of Katrina so I think the battleship could also be used for the same purpose--right? I think that the point you are making is that since you think exclusivity in the provision of various shelters for some is the correct way to go, then anyone who suggests that such accommodations should be available to everyone during an emergency is wrong.
what happened with the World Trade Center was a flat out unexpected terrorist attack. how in the world can you compare the chaos of that happening and people running inside a store to save their life to the organized and systematic evacuation of an area into a shelter over the course of 36+ hours due to an event that we know is coming days in advance? you are flat out comparing apples to oranges, and stretching greatly to do so.

please tell me what fire departments in Baldwin County have large buildings attached to them that are used for bingo halls and Friday night dances. i've been in every firehouse in Baldwin County, and the only one i can think of that does have a type of bingo hall attached is the Elsanor fire station, in which they are in the process of building a new station because.....the building they are in isn't even big enough to park all of their equipment in.

the cruise ship in Mobile was used to house Katrina victims AFTER the storm, not during. i don't think it would be wise of the government to house people on a BOAT during a storm.

you still have not addressed the point that i have never seen the Foley High School shelter reach capacity and turn people away. so why, if the regular shelter is not full, are you SO concerned about family members of police personnel being housed at the police station? if anything, that frees up how many ever citizens to be sheltered at the high school. ultimately, as long as everybody is sheltered, WHAT DOES IT MATTER?
amazed at you

Danville, KY

#20 Sep 2, 2008
Enteprise High School took a direct hit from a F4 tornado. No building could have stood up to that. The interior concrete block "reinforced" wall collapsed, covering the students that died. The school officials did everything within their power to protect the children, however there was a horrific outcome. Our city school board now is faced with not only rebuilding, but lawsuits, because the wall did not hold. There, Mr. Imangttia, could be another reason why the city government does not want citizens in it's buildings, when ample evacuation warnings have been given. The liabiliy to the city is great.

As I stated before, if an evacuation order is issued it is best to leave. I know sometimes it seems a waste, especially if the storm does not turn out as big and spectacular as thought...but better safe than sorry. During Katrina, some of the worst injuries I saw were those who were "untrained first responders". Well meaning people, but untrained in using heavy equiptment, chain saws, ladders, and not familiar with downed electrical lines. There are so many hazards. It is really best not to be in the area unless you are trained and have to be there. If told to evaculate, you really should evacuate.
Imangttia

United States

#21 Sep 2, 2008
amazed at you wrote:
Enteprise High School took a direct hit from a F4 tornado. No building could have stood up to that. The interior concrete block "reinforced" wall collapsed, covering the students that died. The school officials did everything within their power to protect the children, however there was a horrific outcome. Our city school board now is faced with not only rebuilding, but lawsuits, because the wall did not hold. There, Mr. Imangttia, could be another reason why the city government does not want citizens in it's buildings, when ample evacuation warnings have been given. The liabiliy to the city is great.
As I stated before, if an evacuation order is issued it is best to leave. I know sometimes it seems a waste, especially if the storm does not turn out as big and spectacular as thought...but better safe than sorry. During Katrina, some of the worst injuries I saw were those who were "untrained first responders". Well meaning people, but untrained in using heavy equiptment, chain saws, ladders, and not familiar with downed electrical lines. There are so many hazards. It is really best not to be in the area unless you are trained and have to be there. If told to evaculate, you really should evacuate.
You are exactly right.

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