Throgs Neck updates safety regs in disaster's wake -
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#1 Aug 10, 2007
Hindsite, Kneejerk paranoia.
Bumper to bumper traffic can sit idle on the bridge sometimes but a few 'overweight' trucks cannot pass when there is a fraction of the cars on teh bridge. idiots
#2 Aug 11, 2007
The MTA is to be commended.
If these restrictions were used on interstate 35W bridge it this writers opinion the bridge would today still be standing.
It is almost axiomatic in the bridge business that one bridge disaster every 30 years.
Some would call it a generation thing. One generation fails to pass on to the next generation all that they learned in their time frame of service.
When the committee this writer chaired [A3C13-1990-1996] elected to invite Dr. Ron Mayboro of Weidlinger Associates to present a paper at our Annual Transportation Research Board Meeting it was because he had determined thru his studies that the inertial thrust of Busses and other heavy vehicles when slamming on their brakes in stop and go conditions on bridges induced massive fatigue cracking.
It is this writes opinion that is what happened on the Minnesota 35W bridge.
They took two lanes out of service. They transferred all traffic to the two remaining lanes. This caused a creep speed situation with concomitant stop and go brake slamming.
A staccato of heavy vehicles slamming their brakes with
80,000 pounds of mass. This sudden stopping generates and inertial thrust of huge magnitude to supporting structure.
This was the case on the 35W. Add to that equation the hot ambient temperature. The steel probably measured on surface about 120 degrees F.
This constant repetition of brakes slamming and inertial thrust leads to fatigue cracking.
A paper clip opened and bent up and down will result in the steel failing in fatigue right before your eyes..
Hence the loud reported sound at the time of collapse.
When steel and concrete fail the report is over 120 decibels in sound energy realized.
This tragedy could have been avoided.
We here in New York thank God have a fulcrum of some of the best bridge engineers on the planet earth.
Old soldiers in the bridge bearing and joints game take our hats of to the MTA for their actions and new regulations
You cannot ask for anything better than what MTA did in this regard.
One other item for consideration. It might not be a bad time to consider another location for a bridge crossing form Long Island to the mainland.
With every good wish.
GOD BLESS THE MTA.
JOHN W BUGLER
#3 Aug 13, 2007
How gullible are we! If a load goind over the TNB is so heavy that it would put the bridge in danger, Why the hell are they making it go back over the bridge for a second trip!!!! Is it because they are making a double toll? It shure as hell is not because of and structural integrity issues! My email is JCFC [email protected] please enlighten me, thanks
#4 Sep 4, 2007
I agree with you. Its extortion that the southbound trucks are forced to pay the toll and than turn around and pay the toll again. Pay twice and not cross the bridge. NYS has weight laws for a reason. How come just about every other bridge in downstate NY is good for 120,000 pounds on six axles but the TNB is only good for 80,000 on five? Its makes you wonder why the only bridges that are deemed unsafe are owned by the MTA. Where is all our toll money going. Not to fix the bridges.
To John Bugler,
Minnesota is an 80,000 pound state. So they did have those restrictions and the bridge still failed. You speak of tipping your hat to the MTA and then you say that because the Minnesota DOT had lanes closed and all the traffic was put into two lanes and than the heavy trucks made the bridge fail. The MTA has been restricting heavy trucks to the center lane of the TNB for three years. Putting all the stress and pounding the trucks give to one lane. So in one sentenece you tip your hat and than condemn them in the next.
MY BIGGEST QUESTION IS..... A 'JERSEY BARRIER' WEIGHS 9200 POUNDS.... THERE MUST BE OVER 100 'JERSEY BARRIERS' LINING THE RIGHT LANES OF BOTH SIDES OF THE BRIDGE ..... DOESN'T THE ALMOST 1 MILLION POUNDS OF CONCRETE BARRIER SITTING IN THE RIGHT LANE OF BOTH NORTH AND SOUTH TRAFFIC LANES CONTRIBUTE AT ALL TO THE STRESS ON THE BRIDGE?
AND WHY ARE FIVE AXLE 100,000 POUND MILK TRUCKS STILL ALLOWED TO CROSS THE BRIDGE AND 105,000 POUND SIX AXLE SAND TRUCKS ARE NOT?
#5 Sep 6, 2007
It all comes down the the good old dollar!! If you pay alittle more to get another permit, the bridge gets stronger. I would like to know where all the money that we pay for Tax mileage, tolls and various permits is going because it certainly is not being used to repair the roads or bridges.
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