Independents dilema
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query

Erie, PA

#1 Jul 4, 2012
I voted for Barack Obama 4 years ago because he was a force for change.
I'm not completely happy with the job he's done, but I don't think it's been as bad as is being portrayed by some here and in the media.
Things I don't like are the healthcare bill and the out of control spending.
As a parent of two and married, we watch our money pretty carefully and we know that we can't spend what we don't have.
I'm concerned for the fall because I'm not sure Mitt Romney is going to be tough enough to hold the line on spending and I don't know how he thinks he's going to repeal a bad bill without having the Congress and the Senate behind him.
Is anyone else feeling concerned about the way they should vote this fall?
Do I take a chance on the President for 4 more years and maybe see legislation that reaches into my 401K or IRA because we need more funds to pay for that which we cannot afford? Do I take a chance on a health care bill no one has read and that every day seems to bring forth more disconcerting regulations that surely can't be good for growth?
Do I take a chance on a business man who seems to have an ok record but not great or perfect and who I'm not sure is going to have the wherwithall to be firm and say no more spending?
So I'm just wondering if anyone else is feeling this way.
Neither Nor

United States

#2 Jul 4, 2012
Simple. Don't vote. Boycott the polls if you really want change and change FAST. To bad the rest of the nation can't see a simple fix.
Jim

Erie, PA

#3 Jul 4, 2012
As a parent of two and married, we watch our money pretty Do I take a chance on the President for 4 more years and maybe see legislation that reaches into my 401K or IRA because we need more funds to pay for that which we cannot afford? Do I take a chance on a health care bill no one has read and that every day seems to bring forth more disconcerting regulations that surely can't be good for growth?
Do I take a chance on a business man who seems to have an ok record but not great or perfect and who I'm not sure is going to have the wherwithall to be firm and say no more spending?
So I'm just wondering if anyone else is feeling this way.

What concerns you about the health care plan? I'm trying to watch what goes on and would like to know what you know. Also, do you know if there is another plan that has been designated by the Repb's? I haven't heard...just that they don't like this one.
Northsida

Erie, PA

#4 Jul 4, 2012
best four years of my life have come under obama.
Observer1

Erie, PA

#5 Jul 4, 2012
Northsida wrote:
best four years of my life have come under obama.
So how's the view from "under" him?
Fact

Erie, PA

#6 Jul 4, 2012
Jim wrote:
As a parent of two and married, we watch our money pretty Do I take a chance on the President for 4 more years and maybe see legislation that reaches into my 401K or IRA because we need more funds to pay for that which we cannot afford? Do I take a chance on a health care bill no one has read and that every day seems to bring forth more disconcerting regulations that surely can't be good for growth?
Do I take a chance on a business man who seems to have an ok record but not great or perfect and who I'm not sure is going to have the wherwithall to be firm and say no more spending?
So I'm just wondering if anyone else is feeling this way.
What concerns you about the health care plan? I'm trying to watch what goes on and would like to know what you know. Also, do you know if there is another plan that has been designated by the Repb's? I haven't heard...just that they don't like this one.
The Reps put forth many proposals but were excluded from the drafting of the obamacare bill. Look on the national site and you can see their plan. Obamacare does nothing the states could have mandated themselves. Keep you kids on your insurance till 26? Fla mandated it until your kids are in their 30's. In California the insurance companies must pay for sex changes and viagra to be considered by the state to sell them insurance. Same can be done with preexisting conditions by being able to buy insurance out of state. Obama care is nothing but smoke and mirrors and solves nothing. How about working on jobs that provide healthcare benefits.
query

Erie, PA

#7 Jul 5, 2012
Neither Nor wrote:
Simple. Don't vote. Boycott the polls if you really want change and change FAST. To bad the rest of the nation can't see a simple fix.
I don't understand your comment.
I didn't say I don't want to vote, I do.
How is boycotting going to do anything?
query

Erie, PA

#8 Jul 5, 2012
Jim wrote:
As a parent of two and married, we watch our money pretty Do I take a chance on the President for 4 more years and maybe see legislation that reaches into my 401K or IRA because we need more funds to pay for that which we cannot afford? Do I take a chance on a health care bill no one has read and that every day seems to bring forth more disconcerting regulations that surely can't be good for growth?
Do I take a chance on a business man who seems to have an ok record but not great or perfect and who I'm not sure is going to have the wherwithall to be firm and say no more spending?
So I'm just wondering if anyone else is feeling this way.
What concerns you about the health care plan? I'm trying to watch what goes on and would like to know what you know. Also, do you know if there is another plan that has been designated by the Repb's? I haven't heard...just that they don't like this one.
I have concerns about exactly who is going to pay.
Unless I'm just not getting it, those who make above $250K can keep the insurance they have, right? So they won't pay. And if you're wealthy enough to either pay with insurance or pay outright out of your pocket then you won't pay either.
So who is left? People who don't have health insurance can't afford it, don't want it because they don't think they need it, or just aren't interested enough to bother at all until they need care.
So the option for them is to buy it or pay a penalty/tax. If you can't afford it and you're forced to pay then aren't you going to have to give up something else to make that happen? And isn't that a further strain on these people? If you just don't care to buy it and pay the tax and then you need care, where is the money for that going to come from?
Do you see my point?
As far as a Republican plan, all I can think of at the moment is what Paul Ryan put forth and it seems to take into account using the market as competition model and to allow pools of consumers to purchase insurance at less cost because they'll have the purchasing power of a group.
One thing that is lacking in both plans is addressing the legal aspects and by that I mean lawyers who get all these people to join in on class action law suits and then go after these drug companies and doctors and force them to carry these huge policies in case something goes wrong. I think that adds to the cost of services more than anything and it gets passed on to us.
Neither Nor

United States

#9 Jul 5, 2012
query wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't understand your comment.
I didn't say I don't want to vote, I do.
How is boycotting going to do anything?
The point being that it would put this country in a total tailspin. In turn making every elected official from local to the White House reevaluate their “job”.
mary p-

Ellwood City, PA

#10 Jul 5, 2012
query wrote:
I voted for Barack Obama 4 years ago because he was a force for change.
I'm not completely happy with the job he's done, but I don't think it's been as bad as is being portrayed by some here and in the media.
Things I don't like are the healthcare bill and the out of control spending.
As a parent of two and married, we watch our money pretty carefully and we know that we can't spend what we don't have.
I'm concerned for the fall because I'm not sure Mitt Romney is going to be tough enough to hold the line on spending and I don't know how he thinks he's going to repeal a bad bill without having the Congress and the Senate behind him.
Is anyone else feeling concerned about the way they should vote this fall?
Do I take a chance on the President for 4 more years and maybe see legislation that reaches into my 401K or IRA because we need more funds to pay for that which we cannot afford? Do I take a chance on a health care bill no one has read and that every day seems to bring forth more disconcerting regulations that surely can't be good for growth?
Do I take a chance on a business man who seems to have an ok record but not great or perfect and who I'm not sure is going to have the wherwithall to be firm and say no more spending?
So I'm just wondering if anyone else is feeling this way.
I'm not a big Romney fan either, but as EVERYONE on here knows, I detest Obama. There are plenty of reasons for that. First, all politicians are politicians first...no doubt about that. But, putting that aside, Obama's very ideaology is big government, and dependence on the government....not what this country was founded on. It keeps people down, gives them no incentive to do better in life. The economy is worse than it has ever been, and yet it is always someone or some stupid reason for it in his mind. Obama has kowtowed to some of the most evil dictators in this world, apologizing for our country, while treating Israel like garbage. He's protected the likes of Holder, gone out of his way to cause racial, and class divisions, and has pretty much done anything he's wanted to do, not really caring about what the citizens of this country want, and bypassing Congress any times he feels the need. This is not the way the US government is supposed to work. That's why we have 3 branches of gov., to provide the checks and balances needed in a free society. He may be president, but he is not a king, nor a dictator. I may not care for Romney, but I believe he is a person with better character, has more respect for the Constitution, and the people of this country. Bottom line, for me is that 4 more yrs. of Obama, with no election looming ahead in a second term, he will do ANYTHING we wants....nothing will stop him......could go on for hrs.,As YOU KNOW......ANYBODY BUT OBAMA.....
mary p-

Ellwood City, PA

#11 Jul 5, 2012
anytime..oops
query

Erie, PA

#12 Jul 5, 2012
Neither Nor wrote:
<quoted text>The point being that it would put this country in a total tailspin. In turn making every elected official from local to the White House reevaluate their “job”.
Do you really think that would happen?
I understand the frustration behind the sentiment and believe me on some level I appreciate it very much, but not voting has never really been an option.
I want to make the best decision I can based on facts and not slogans.
I seem to hear nothing but slogans and promises from these people.
Put Amercia back to work-how?
Forward-to what?
No taxes-big lie.
When did we learn to expect slogans and promises instead of detailed plans that we can understand without having a law degree?
I'll suggest this though, what would cause a re-evaluation would be term limits for everyone. The President has them, why not Congress and the Senate? Why not say 2 terms at best and then you're done. I think that would do more to stop the gravy train that has become Amercian politics than not voting would.
query

Erie, PA

#13 Jul 5, 2012
mary p- wrote:
<quoted text>I'm not a big Romney fan either, but as EVERYONE on here knows, I detest Obama. There are plenty of reasons for that. First, all politicians are politicians first...no doubt about that. But, putting that aside, Obama's very ideaology is big government, and dependence on the government....not what this country was founded on. It keeps people down, gives them no incentive to do better in life. The economy is worse than it has ever been, and yet it is always someone or some stupid reason for it in his mind. Obama has kowtowed to some of the most evil dictators in this world, apologizing for our country, while treating Israel like garbage. He's protected the likes of Holder, gone out of his way to cause racial, and class divisions, and has pretty much done anything he's wanted to do, not really caring about what the citizens of this country want, and bypassing Congress any times he feels the need. This is not the way the US government is supposed to work. That's why we have 3 branches of gov., to provide the checks and balances needed in a free society. He may be president, but he is not a king, nor a dictator. I may not care for Romney, but I believe he is a person with better character, has more respect for the Constitution, and the people of this country. Bottom line, for me is that 4 more yrs. of Obama, with no election looming ahead in a second term, he will do ANYTHING we wants....nothing will stop him......could go on for hrs.,As YOU KNOW......ANYBODY BUT OBAMA.....
I remember feeling that way about Bush and voting for Obama and I guess that's just my point. Is my vote now just come down to ABBO? It seems that in the last several election cycles I'm doing no more than that.
I don't like some of the things you mention about the President, but I remember also voting for Bush the first time because I thought Al Gore was just plain weird. And I then voted for him again because Kerry seemed like an elitist, but so did Bush! See? I do think that government is too big and too regulatory, but my question is who really has bothered to scale it back?
I thought Bush would, but he spent billions too. Granted, not as much or as fast as Obama but he wasn't fiscally responsible in that regard. My point is we get a lot of promises and no follow through. Just the other day Mitt Romney said he's going to repeal Obamacare. Well ok, how? Then I heard just a slight little change, he's going to work on repealing it. That's my clue that he now is in the hands of handlers who are telling him whoa wait a minute, they'll come back at you and pound you with it, just like they did with Obama on Gitmo.
I still respect the office of the Presidency and I don't think anyone is ever fully ready to assume the job. I think you find out pdq on day one that all those promises are pretty hard to keep.
As far as the racial stuff, that really bothers me because I think if anyone was to ever have had a chance at being thought provoking about race it was Obama. And I thought he would too, but then he just seemed to wade in on issues that he has no business being in and that stirred the pot and did no good. I am disappointed there, but I don't think he is solely responsible. I think the media loves a good race baiting story and we eat it up depending upon our perspective.
Sorry for rambling here but your reply had a lot in it. I do appreciate your being honest about where you stand.
mary p-

Ellwood City, PA

#14 Jul 5, 2012
query wrote:
<quoted text>
I remember feeling that way about Bush and voting for Obama and I guess that's just my point. Is my vote now just come down to ABBO? It seems that in the last several election cycles I'm doing no more than that.
I don't like some of the things you mention about the President, but I remember also voting for Bush the first time because I thought Al Gore was just plain weird. And I then voted for him again because Kerry seemed like an elitist, but so did Bush! See? I do think that government is too big and too regulatory, but my question is who really has bothered to scale it back?
I thought Bush would, but he spent billions too. Granted, not as much or as fast as Obama but he wasn't fiscally responsible in that regard. My point is we get a lot of promises and no follow through. Just the other day Mitt Romney said he's going to repeal Obamacare. Well ok, how? Then I heard just a slight little change, he's going to work on repealing it. That's my clue that he now is in the hands of handlers who are telling him whoa wait a minute, they'll come back at you and pound you with it, just like they did with Obama on Gitmo.
I still respect the office of the Presidency and I don't think anyone is ever fully ready to assume the job. I think you find out pdq on day one that all those promises are pretty hard to keep.
As far as the racial stuff, that really bothers me because I think if anyone was to ever have had a chance at being thought provoking about race it was Obama. And I thought he would too, but then he just seemed to wade in on issues that he has no business being in and that stirred the pot and did no good. I am disappointed there, but I don't think he is solely responsible. I think the media loves a good race baiting story and we eat it up depending upon our perspective.
Sorry for rambling here but your reply had a lot in it. I do appreciate your being honest about where you stand.
I think most of us are tired of holding our noses and voting...but, we have to play with the cards we are dealt, and take it from there. On a personal level. This is a really ugly year...people aren't working, times are hard, tons of political scandals, new "rules and regulations" every time you turn around, many of which are infringing on our personal freedoms....That will only get worse the more people become dependent on the government....once they are "taking care" of you. they "own" you and call the shots in your life.....The numbers of people dependent of the goverment have increased drastically during this administration...food stamps users have risen something like 30%. since 2008. I myself, think that it's by design.....O's "socialistic" ideaology warrants it.....Sorry, but the major difference I see betweet O and Romney is the Obama is downright dangerous, and Romney is not....Might not be the best choice, he may not be the best President, but I believe that he will work to improve this country, while O has worked to destroying this country as we know it, and as it was intended to be by the Founding Fathers....
query

Erie, PA

#15 Jul 5, 2012
mary p- wrote:
<quoted text>I think most of us are tired of holding our noses and voting...but, we have to play with the cards we are dealt, and take it from there. On a personal level. This is a really ugly year...people aren't working, times are hard, tons of political scandals, new "rules and regulations" every time you turn around, many of which are infringing on our personal freedoms....That will only get worse the more people become dependent on the government....once they are "taking care" of you. they "own" you and call the shots in your life.....The numbers of people dependent of the goverment have increased drastically during this administration...food stamps users have risen something like 30%. since 2008. I myself, think that it's by design.....O's "socialistic" ideaology warrants it.....Sorry, but the major difference I see betweet O and Romney is the Obama is downright dangerous, and Romney is not....Might not be the best choice, he may not be the best President, but I believe that he will work to improve this country, while O has worked to destroying this country as we know it, and as it was intended to be by the Founding Fathers....
Please don't think you have to apologize for your opinion to me. I'm not trying to be contentious I'm really just feeling a great deal of disappointment in our political process of late.
I think the numbers speak volumes and they don't lie. One of the trends I've been noticing is that the job numbers get released one day and covered with a great deal of fanfare, good or bad depending upon what news you watch. Then weeks later, they always seem to be revising them upward and it never seems to make the news! If I didn't have the internet and do my own research, I'd just go on believing the media and what they report.
I do believe government has gotten so big and so involved and one thing I would love to hear from either one of these men, is just one real effort to maybe just look at the redundancy of programs.
I volunteer at a family services shelter here in town and we are 1 of at least 15 organizations that exist. There are private and publicly funded services and truthfully half the time our shelter is not at full capacity. That doesn't mean I don't think we're necessary but does no one ask anymore if maybe we could look at the duplicate services in our own towns, start there, and eliminate some of the excess? I think sometimes the money gets taken and put forth into these programs because they feel like more money will solve the problems. All that seems to happen is that the organizations get bigger and compete with one another. Then the government has to fund what it funded last year because it's in the budget. I've seen that too, just adding 10% to a budget on a whim and a prayer. Some of these people have no idea how to live within a real budget. And I think neither does our government.
mary p-

Ellwood City, PA

#16 Jul 5, 2012
query wrote:
<quoted text>
Please don't think you have to apologize for your opinion to me. I'm not trying to be contentious I'm really just feeling a great deal of disappointment in our political process of late.
I think the numbers speak volumes and they don't lie. One of the trends I've been noticing is that the job numbers get released one day and covered with a great deal of fanfare, good or bad depending upon what news you watch. Then weeks later, they always seem to be revising them upward and it never seems to make the news! If I didn't have the internet and do my own research, I'd just go on believing the media and what they report.
I do believe government has gotten so big and so involved and one thing I would love to hear from either one of these men, is just one real effort to maybe just look at the redundancy of programs.
I volunteer at a family services shelter here in town and we are 1 of at least 15 organizations that exist. There are private and publicly funded services and truthfully half the time our shelter is not at full capacity. That doesn't mean I don't think we're necessary but does no one ask anymore if maybe we could look at the duplicate services in our own towns, start there, and eliminate some of the excess? I think sometimes the money gets taken and put forth into these programs because they feel like more money will solve the problems. All that seems to happen is that the organizations get bigger and compete with one another. Then the government has to fund what it funded last year because it's in the budget. I've seen that too, just adding 10% to a budget on a whim and a prayer. Some of these people have no idea how to live within a real budget. And I think neither does our government.
The government doesn't know how to live within their own budgets...neither side...that is a given. Not only that, government is so big and growing bigger all the time, that the left hand doesn't even know what the right hand is doing...so much red tape and no communication......not only does they apply to legit social services, but it also leaves so much open to outright fraud, food stamp, welfare, social security, medicare....we've been raped by them all. I absolutely disagree with Obamacare, have from the get go, but even if I did want it, can you imagine the red tape and the fraud on the taxpayer that will going along with it. I am a proud conservative, but have voted independently in most elections....the person, not the party.....Having said that, for me, there is no way in Hell O would get my vote....didn't last time, and certainly wouldn't this time.....but, that's what makes America great, and what I try to protect with my vote......we are FREE to choose our government.....
query

Erie, PA

#17 Jul 5, 2012
mary p- wrote:
<quoted text>The government doesn't know how to live within their own budgets...neither side...that is a given. Not only that, government is so big and growing bigger all the time, that the left hand doesn't even know what the right hand is doing...so much red tape and no communication......not only does they apply to legit social services, but it also leaves so much open to outright fraud, food stamp, welfare, social security, medicare....we've been raped by them all. I absolutely disagree with Obamacare, have from the get go, but even if I did want it, can you imagine the red tape and the fraud on the taxpayer that will going along with it. I am a proud conservative, but have voted independently in most elections....the person, not the party.....Having said that, for me, there is no way in Hell O would get my vote....didn't last time, and certainly wouldn't this time.....but, that's what makes America great, and what I try to protect with my vote......we are FREE to choose our government.....
I understand your objection to the health care bill. My concerns are stated above because who is going to pay and my feeling is that everyone will and mostly the people that can least afford it. Legitimately least afford it. I get the need to tell people that we're doing this so everyone assumes responsibility, but will it change the outcome? Will there not still be people who decide to take the penalty/tax and wait until they need services?
What is so ironic is that there has to be a way to get the money from all taxpayers because there is no way that just the middle class could fund it. And how do they do that? They have to start taxing health related goods and services and that's where the real concern for me is and that's where I feel the growth of government shouldn't be. It's like they did with smokers but you notice they didn't ban cigarettes ha ha! If smoking kills why wouldn't we just stop selling cigarettes wouldn't that make any sense?
You're very nice to keep responding and I wish that I could be as sure as you are. I was raised a Democrat and I switched to Independent because I feel like both parties do the same thing. They say different things, but they do the same thing, you know what I mean?
mary p-

Ellwood City, PA

#18 Jul 5, 2012
I was a Dem. for many years....but, it was a different party then. As far as the healthcare bills goes, honestly, I'm not sure anyone excactly knows what's in it or what to expect. I don't think they even know....but, for me, I don't want anyone but myself or my doctor making my choices. I don't want to be told where to go, who I have to see, or what I can have or not have. Common sense to me is that poorest already have heathcare..you can see that in any ER anytime of the day or night. The very rich won't be affected anyhow, bcause they can still afford whatever come their way. It's the middle class that's going to get crapped on again......Finances, are one thing, but, I losing our American freedoms is what is most important to me.....Just don't want to be controlled by them. Incidentally,I know and have spoken to several Drs. over the last couple of years......they HATE it......they don't want the government telling them who and how to treat patients either...Added to the tax roles are the gazillion new government workers added to handle the load of paperwork and screw-ups....we can't afford that either.....Besides, some segments of society are exempt.....THEM, a good many unions, certain relegions, and certain special interest to the Obama administration. Common sense tells me that if it's not good enough for them, why should it be ok for the rest of us peons....
query

Erie, PA

#19 Jul 5, 2012
mary p- wrote:
I was a Dem. for many years....but, it was a different party then. As far as the healthcare bills goes, honestly, I'm not sure anyone excactly knows what's in it or what to expect. I don't think they even know....but, for me, I don't want anyone but myself or my doctor making my choices. I don't want to be told where to go, who I have to see, or what I can have or not have. Common sense to me is that poorest already have heathcare..you can see that in any ER anytime of the day or night. The very rich won't be affected anyhow, bcause they can still afford whatever come their way. It's the middle class that's going to get crapped on again......Finances, are one thing, but, I losing our American freedoms is what is most important to me.....Just don't want to be controlled by them. Incidentally,I know and have spoken to several Drs. over the last couple of years......they HATE it......they don't want the government telling them who and how to treat patients either...Added to the tax roles are the gazillion new government workers added to handle the load of paperwork and screw-ups....we can't afford that either.....Besides, some segments of society are exempt.....THEM, a good many unions, certain relegions, and certain special interest to the Obama administration. Common sense tells me that if it's not good enough for them, why should it be ok for the rest of us peons....
Oh boy you have that right on the money! So many exemptions ahead of this bill and so many lawsuits still in the pipeline asking for an exemption, makes you wonder why if it's so good, as you say.
Aside from being put into some program managed by the government I, like you, don't want to have to be told who I can see or worse yet, see someone different each time I have to go to the doctor. And no wonder doctors would hate it. My understanding is that they're going to have to take more Medicaid or Medicare patients and they'll be paid less to treat them. Begs the question, who would want to spend all that money to get a degree and then work for peanuts? I've always felt that there are services for which I am willing to pay and a doctor is right at the top of my list. Just have a coronary bypass one time and you'll be making sure you have the top of the line for that surgery.
All in all there are still too many unanswered questions for me to feel that this is the better or best way to go.
And I think Mitt Romney is in a precarious position with his very similar plan in MA. It just leaves him looking like he's stradling a line and can't really come down too hard on this issue because he allowed the same thing in his state. I know there are those who will argue that it was different because it wasn't a national plan or those who will say he was a Republican in a Democrat state, but when all is said and done, it makes me also concerned about Romney and his judgement.
Plus I think if Romney gets in it's going to be an uphill battle to get things done because so many of the laws enacted are already in place. I've not yet seen a tax repealed or a government program shut down. Once they're in, they're in and especially if they have jobs attached to them.
mary p-

Ellwood City, PA

#20 Jul 5, 2012
query wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh boy you have that right on the money! So many exemptions ahead of this bill and so many lawsuits still in the pipeline asking for an exemption, makes you wonder why if it's so good, as you say.
Aside from being put into some program managed by the government I, like you, don't want to have to be told who I can see or worse yet, see someone different each time I have to go to the doctor. And no wonder doctors would hate it. My understanding is that they're going to have to take more Medicaid or Medicare patients and they'll be paid less to treat them. Begs the question, who would want to spend all that money to get a degree and then work for peanuts? I've always felt that there are services for which I am willing to pay and a doctor is right at the top of my list. Just have a coronary bypass one time and you'll be making sure you have the top of the line for that surgery.
All in all there are still too many unanswered questions for me to feel that this is the better or best way to go.
And I think Mitt Romney is in a precarious position with his very similar plan in MA. It just leaves him looking like he's stradling a line and can't really come down too hard on this issue because he allowed the same thing in his state. I know there are those who will argue that it was different because it wasn't a national plan or those who will say he was a Republican in a Democrat state, but when all is said and done, it makes me also concerned about Romney and his judgement.
Plus I think if Romney gets in it's going to be an uphill battle to get things done because so many of the laws enacted are already in place. I've not yet seen a tax repealed or a government program shut down. Once they're in, they're in and especially if they have jobs attached to them.
I just happen to be one of them who figures that anyone is better than O...it's worth the shot to me to take a chance on someone else......could not possibly be any worse.....but, that's what so great about this country....we are free to decide.....I'd rather fight the "uphill battle" to repeal things, than to keeping getting new things that need repealed......There are no easy answers, but it is what it is, and the best we can do is try to educate ourselves, learn as much as possible, and vote with what your conscience tells you to do......Romney for me, no Obama.....

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