OK Health Care Freedom Amendment, Sta...

OK Health Care Freedom Amendment, State Question 756

Created by CitizenTopix on Oct 11, 2010

1,604 votes

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Other (explain below)

Since: Apr 10

Location hidden

#20416 May 29, 2012
You don't close the defict overnight. But it can be done. It won't be done because the ultra rich are not about to make their money the old fashioned way. EARN IT. But for a fantasy here is how to close the deficit.

1.) Cut Military spending in half. Cut Military industrial spending by 75%. You gonna tell me Halliburton is not going to take the job if they have to do it honestly? Fine. Someone will.

2.) Institute workfare instead of welfare. Make people contribute in some way for assistance. The return would cut about 30 billion a year in value.

3.) Eliminate corporate welfare. There is absolutely no reason to be subsidizing tobacco or anything else for that matter. 90% of farming is corporate farming today. It's called free enterprise. There is no reason to be subsidizing the cost of milk (which continues to climb) In a free market people will control the prices. Again what are they going to do if they are not subsidized? Stop milking cows because of less profit? Someone will.

4.) Scale back our nuclear weapons program to nothing more than R & D. We have enough nukes to destroy the world 200 times over. So what if our nukes get there two minutes after theirs hit us. Dead is dead. First strike matters little with nukes.

5.) Nationalize the oil companies. If there is one single thing in the USA that should be nationalized it is the oil companies.

6. Legalize drugs and tax the h well out of them.

Problem solved.
Who Is Obama

Tulsa, OK

#20417 May 29, 2012
Reality wrote:
"Who is Obama" possesses recognition. Politics eventually corrupts everyone involved. Always has, always will.
So if you agree with that premise then you'll realize that the federal government will never provide any solutions.
But then examine yourself and ask yourself: Where are solutions found?
However, an answer to the question will never arrive if you refuse to deeply examine yourself first.
I've more money and more degrees than most people will ever achieve. Yet none of that is where my specialness lies.
The answer lies within ourselves.
Who Is Obama

Tulsa, OK

#20418 May 29, 2012
DustyOutlaw wrote:
<quoted text>
You're getting a little defensive here. Olberman is the left wing version of O'Reilly. Maddow is the left wing version of oh say that idiot Palin. None of those people represent anything other than the extremists IDIOTS of America. But to bring up one side without acknowledging the other being the same in opposite is defensive. I thought better of you.
What?

What one side Dusty? Did you not read the whole thing?

Justaminute was implying ( I thought ) that the dems never put the reps through the mill like the reps are doing to Obama now. I merely saying both sides have their demonize the other side programs.

You guys need to show me where I favored a side...instead pointing at a word. I'm just stating a simple observation that we all kniow is true.
Who Is Obama

Tulsa, OK

#20419 May 29, 2012
DustyOutlaw wrote:
You don't close the defict overnight. But it can be done. It won't be done because the ultra rich are not about to make their money the old fashioned way. EARN IT. But for a fantasy here is how to close the deficit.
1.) Cut Military spending in half. Cut Military industrial spending by 75%. You gonna tell me Halliburton is not going to take the job if they have to do it honestly? Fine. Someone will.
2.) Institute workfare instead of welfare. Make people contribute in some way for assistance. The return would cut about 30 billion a year in value.
3.) Eliminate corporate welfare. There is absolutely no reason to be subsidizing tobacco or anything else for that matter. 90% of farming is corporate farming today. It's called free enterprise. There is no reason to be subsidizing the cost of milk (which continues to climb) In a free market people will control the prices. Again what are they going to do if they are not subsidized? Stop milking cows because of less profit? Someone will.
4.) Scale back our nuclear weapons program to nothing more than R & D. We have enough nukes to destroy the world 200 times over. So what if our nukes get there two minutes after theirs hit us. Dead is dead. First strike matters little with nukes.
5.) Nationalize the oil companies. If there is one single thing in the USA that should be nationalized it is the oil companies.
6. Legalize drugs and tax the h well out of them.
Problem solved.
I can't say I don't agree with most of this. Soon it will be a have to do thing.
TAMARA

Edmond, OK

#20420 May 29, 2012
DustyOutlaw wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm not getting into the allergy meds debate. I'm a Libertarian on drugs. Legalize them all and let the morons kill themselves. Good riddance. It would cut crime, it would be a start on balancing the budget by cutting the DEA by about 75%(put them working the cartels and that's just for border security). It would cut prison expenses by billions. I'm simply not interested in pursing drug addicts since the majority of drug addicts in this country are pharmaceutical legal addicts.
You missed my point completely: I said if I have to show ID for getting an allergy med or writting a check then I do not see what the problem is to show ID when a person votes. When you go to the doctors or any other medical place you show ID and if you have insurance ID for insurance. I am not debating illegal drugs.

Since: Apr 10

Location hidden

#20421 May 29, 2012
TAMARA wrote:
<quoted text>You missed my point completely: I said if I have to show ID for getting an allergy med or writting a check then I do not see what the problem is to show ID when a person votes. When you go to the doctors or any other medical place you show ID and if you have insurance ID for insurance. I am not debating illegal drugs.
I understood your point Tamara. Stop being defensive, I was agreeing with you. My point was that we are a messed up country. We can go to the doctor and become legal addicts yet we have to show an I.D. to buy over the counter drugs which makes no sense at all. Then we further the compound the problem by not requiring I.D. to vote but again you don't want them meth heads to get that sudafed that will make less than 1/8th ounce of meth no matter how much they buy. It's just insane.
TAMARA

Edmond, OK

#20422 May 29, 2012
DustyOutlaw wrote:
<quoted text>
I understood your point Tamara. Stop being defensive, I was agreeing with you. My point was that we are a messed up country. We can go to the doctor and become legal addicts yet we have to show an I.D. to buy over the counter drugs which makes no sense at all. Then we further the compound the problem by not requiring I.D. to vote but again you don't want them meth heads to get that sudafed that will make less than 1/8th ounce of meth no matter how much they buy. It's just insane.
Sorry I miss unstood you. Yes I agree it is insane. Every time I have to get one of those allergy pills out of those little packets I hope someone cracks a finger off. I actually would rather shoot the ones that get caught making this darn stuff! I know that some what harsh but I am tired of the bad guys taking my rights and freedom away!
Jumpmaster82

Carrollton, TX

#20423 May 29, 2012
ron everhart K2C 1975 wrote:
i hope you people DO vote to pull out. i just spent a long weekend out that way, and based on what i saw, and what i already know about the relative allocation of federal dollars to states versus the contributions from those states, y'all independent-minded don't tread on me Okies are already on welfare, and progressive states like my adopted home are footing the bill for all the ignorant, self-destructive behavior out there. just be sure and write into the amendment that whoever can't - or won't - pay their own way, gets to die, period, and none of this "you can't make me buy insurance but i can go to the ER and the taxpayers have to save me" stuff.
BTW, your comments about Hugo - everywhere I went in several towns this weekend was just the same... what happened to the great state I left in 1982?
I'm just wondering how fair is it to allow people to opt out and push the cost of their health care onto the rest of us.
Packing Heat

United States

#20424 May 29, 2012
Justaminute wrote:
<quoted text>
The same place your getting your tax breaks for the rich and the same place you got it from for your war in Afghanistan and Iraq.


Justaminute, your ideology and hatred for white people and rich people will never allow you to come to any reasonable solution. Your socialistic minded brain leads you straight to a bridge to nowhere but the edge of that cliff. You can raise the tax rates on rich people to 100% but that will get you nowhere at all. 100% of nothing is still nothing you ignorant dolt when those rich people finally runs out of money or gets enough of your senseless excessive taxing and just leaves the United States!

You have one other slight problem you are not accounting for in your equation! You keep saying you will get it from the money from Iraq and Afghanistan out of one side of your mouth yet out the other side admit those wars were not paid for and I agree they weren't! There never was any money saved for those wars, it was and is all borrowed money that we have to pay back that is already spent. How the hell are you going to use money that does not exist, BORROW MORE FOR MORE ENTITLEMENT FREEBIES?

Remember you ignorant dolt? That was and is borrowed money that simply quits being borrowed as the wars come to an end yet we still have to pay back what is already spent!
That is the ridiculous side of your argument! You fools just don't get it! There are no more money wells to keep pumping money from you ignorant dolt! The adage of Bob Dylan explains that problem best you ignorant goofball, NO MONEY WELLS and…

"The pump don't work 'cause the vandals took the handles." ~ Subterranean Homesick Blues, Bob Dylan.~ That debt is the $16+ Trillion Dollars and climbing fast dumbass. You can't borrow anymore. We also have $60+ Trillion in unfunded entitlement debt beyond our $16 Trillion Debt that Obama and the Democrats have never ever in the last 1000+ days, Obama's entire 1st and only term ever passed a budget for! No Plan whatsoever as to how it will be paid back beyond disarming America and surrender!

You are an ignorant liberal hack with Obama's same ideology, quote:
"I mean, I do think at a certain point you’ve made enough money."
That Marxist Minded Moron doesn’t get to decide when people have “made enough money!” Neither does any of you ignorant Liberals Hacks!

Furthermore, the responsibility of any entrepreneur isn’t to “grow our economy,” core or otherwise. It’s to grow his own economy. In a properly regulated capitalist system, the natural tension of self-interests creates economic growth through innovation and efficient use of capital and resources. We do not have a properly regulated capitalist system in this country anymore, it is corrupt to the core from every damn corner of Washington DC!

Put simply, in a properly regulated capitalist system a free people work for themselves, not for the damn government. Barack Hussein Obama and Liberal Hacks seem to have a serious problem understanding that very simple to understand concept. If me fighting for those as well as myself to keep what is rightfully earned and owned by those and myself make me a Republican then so be it! Color me shocked… I am a damn Republican.
This is a question that Liberals never consider. But the old adage is always in play:“Failure to plan is planning to fail.” If you fail to steer your own ship, don't complain about the port you wind up in. It is far better to regret what you have done than what you haven't done.

Investment Capital is money that was earned income by an individual or company that is taxed at whatever their income tax rate is at the time they earn it. Sometimes their investment creates a job and sometimes it doesn't but that is not the point. The point is they already paid their fare share of taxes so they get to decide how it is spent, not some damn politician or liberal hack! That is as bad as Inheritance Tax!
Packing Heat

United States

#20425 May 29, 2012
Who Is Obama wrote:
<quoted text>
>>>16 trillion would put every man, women and child in America through Harvard. Tell me where that money went and then tell me why I need to dig in my pocket and send more. <<<
WMCOL wrote:
<quoted text>
Glad you asked. Bush and GOP are responsible for 13-trillion of that 16-trillion.

Well it went for war against people who did not attack us and who did not have WMD and for Haliburton and subs, and their owners, and other profiteers.

Most of 3-trillion (Obama spending) that makes up rest of 16-trillion went for interest on 13-trillion Bush/GOP spending, and some went for stimulus that helped save this nation from a depression.

Very hard to come up with solutions when the credible facts of who spent what are repeatedly denied. It is why Bush and GOP used a Spending Measure in lieu of their last budget so that the spending would go unnoticed by the incautious observers and appear to be Obama's. Guess what? The deception has worked. Many WRONGLY believe Obama spending is 5 to 6 trillion. Even when they look at official records that show they are wrong.
Here you go again with your fuzzy math! Both parties are not really good with this type of accounting and others see through it every time you all rare its ugly head! Politicians all use this type of accounting known as Fuzzy Math.
The debt when Clinton left office was:$5.7 trillion in January 2001
The debt when George W. Bush took office was:$5.7 trillion in January 2001
$3.0 Trillion – Bush Tax Cuts
$1.4 Trillion – War in Afghanistan and Iraq
And some cheap dope for the old folks not paid for, so what?
The debt when George left office was:$10.7 trillion by December 2008

The debt when Obama took office was:$10.7 trillion by December 2008
The debt as 02/2012 with Obama is:$15.5 trillion by February 2012
$1.4 Trillion – Obama Stimulus spending in response to the 2008 Financial Crisis

The total unfunded debt of this nation and its causes:
Social programs enacted during the Great Depression and the buildup and involvement in World War II during the F.D. Roosevelt and Truman presidencies in the 1930s and 1940s caused the largest increase a sixteen-fold increase in the gross public debt from $16 billion in 1930 to $260 billion in 1950.
$3.6 Trillion – Economic changes (including lower than expected tax revenues due to recession). Because neither party is blameless for the decisions that led to this problem, both parties have a responsibility to solve it.

The present value of these deficits or unfunded obligations is an estimated $45.8 trillion. This is the amount that would have to be set-aside during 2009 so that the principal and interest would pay for the unfunded obligations through 2084. Approximately $7.7 trillion relates to Social Security, while $38.2 trillion relates to Medicare and Medicaid. In other words, health care programs will require nearly five times the level of funding than Social Security. Adding this to the national debt and other federal obligations would bring total obligations to nearly $62 trillion. However, these unfunded obligations are not counted in the national debt.

The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) has indicated that: "Future growth in spending per beneficiary for Medicare and Medicaid the federal government’s major health care programs will be the most important determinant of long-term trends in federal spending. Changing those programs in ways that reduce the growth of costs which will be difficult, in part because of the complexity of health policy choices is ultimately the nation’s central long-term challenge in setting federal fiscal policy."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congressional_Bu...
Packing Heat

United States

#20426 May 29, 2012
President Obama’s fourth budget has now been released, which allows for a relatively full accounting of deficit spending during his four years in office. The picture isn’t pretty, but it is revealing.
http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files...

According to the White House’s own figures (see table S-1 here for 2011 to 2013,
http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files...
And table S-1 here for 2010),
http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files...

The actual or projected deficit tallies for the four years in which Obama has submitted budgets are as follows:$1.293 trillion in 2010,$1.300 trillion in 2011,$1.327 trillion in 2012, and $901 billion in 2013. In addition, Obama is responsible for the estimated $200 billion (the Congressional Budget Office’s figure) that his economic “stimulus” added to the deficit in 2009.

Moreover, he shouldn’t get credit for the $149 billion in TARP (Troubled Asset Relief Program) repayments made in 2010 and 2011 to cover most of the $154 billion in bank loans that remained unpaid at the end of the 2009 fiscal year — loans that count against President Bush’s 2009 deficit tally.

Adding all of this up, deficit spending during Obama’s four years in the White House (based on his own figures) will be an estimated $5.170 trillion or $5,170,000,000,000.00. To help put that colossal sum of money into perspective, if you take our deficit spending under Obama and divide it evenly among the roughly 300 million American citizens, that works out to just over $17,000 per person — or about $70,000 for a family of four.

The previous record for most deficit spending during a presidency was set by President George W. Bush (see table 1.3 in the White House’s Historic Tables).
http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/budget/Historic...

During Bush’s 8-year administration, total deficit spending was $3.402 trillion. That’s a truly extraordinary and reckless sum. It’s also $1.768 trillion less than deficit spending in just four years under Obama. Per year, deficits under Bush averaged $425 billion. Per year, deficits under Obama (according to his own numbers) will average $1.293 trillion or more than three times as much.

Because the gross domestic product (GDP) nearly always grows from year to year, the most favorable way to view Obama’s deficit spending is as a percentage of GDP. Surely he can’t look as bad in that light, right?

Well, prior to Obama, our annual deficit spending had only exceeded 6.0 percent of GDP during the Civil War, World War I, and World War II. Except during those huge conflicts, our deficits had never exceeded 6.0 percent of GDP in any year not during the Great Depression, not at the height of the Cold War defense buildup, not ever. But that’s no longer the case. During Obama’s four years in the White House (and, again, using his own numbers), annual deficit spending will average 8.4 percent of GDP.

That’s nearly double the average annual level of deficit spending under any other post-War president. As it stands, this has truly been a historic presidency more profligate than any other by far, Obama's own numbers prove it!
Packing Heat

United States

#20427 May 29, 2012
Jumpmaster82 wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm just wondering how fair is it to allow people to opt out and push the cost of their health care onto the rest of us.


More fair if he never uses it or if he is one that was already paying his way. Not everyone is as irresponsible as liberals. There are those that actually pay their own bills. You just need the healthy to pay in your pool so you pay less. Nothing fair about that!

Since: Apr 10

Location hidden

#20428 May 29, 2012
Who do you think you're impressing with all this cut and paste nonsense Heat? Nobody reads it.
Packing Heat

United States

#20429 May 29, 2012
DustyOutlaw wrote:
Who do you think you're impressing with all this cut and paste nonsense Heat? Nobody reads it.


Facts are never to impress anyone and especially those that want their purple lip Kenyan to look good. Fact is his own numbers prove what a failure he is. He is toast come November 6th, 2012 no matter how bad you want socialized medicine. What's funnier is you can't show where Obama's own numbers are wrong. Even he knows he is a failure.

Since: Apr 10

Location hidden

#20430 May 29, 2012
Packing Heat wrote:
<quoted text>
Facts are never to impress anyone and especially those that want their purple lip Kenyan to look good. Fact is his own numbers prove what a failure he is. He is toast come November 6th, 2012 no matter how bad you want socialized medicine. What's funnier is you can't show where Obama's own numbers are wrong. Even he knows he is a failure.
You know what I think of your "facts"? About the same thing I think of Minutes "facts". Anyone can find a website that backs up whatever rhetorical BS they have to say. I know you man. You're a racist, a right wing extremist toad and you will never ever admit anything good that a democrat has done and never ever make full admittance for what a Republican has done. When you decide to hold your own side as responsible as you hold Obama get back to me. Until then you're just a flaming hick. You gave yourself away by supporting that atrocity known as the Ryan Plan. You're the enemy. Nothing you have to say, nothing you post is good for America. You're a traitor to the American way, to American values, to decent morality. You're not a conservative. You stain the name conservative. You're a racist bubba. End of story.

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#20431 May 29, 2012
Packing Heat wrote:
<quoted text>
<quoted text>
Here you go again with your fuzzy math! Both parties are not really good with this type of accounting and others see through it every time you all rare its ugly head! Politicians all use this type of accounting known as Fuzzy Math.
The debt when Clinton left office was:$5.7 trillion in January 2001
The debt when George W. Bush took office was:$5.7 trillion in January 2001
$3.0 Trillion – Bush Tax Cuts
$1.4 Trillion – War in Afghanistan and Iraq
And some cheap dope for the old folks not paid for, so what?
The debt when George left office was:$10.7 trillion by December 2008
The debt when Obama took office was:$10.7 trillion by December 2008
The debt as 02/2012 with Obama is:$15.5 trillion by February 2012
$1.4 Trillion – Obama Stimulus spending in response to the 2008 Financial Crisis
The total unfunded debt of this nation and its causes:
Social programs enacted during the Great Depression and the buildup and involvement in World War II during the F.D. Roosevelt and Truman presidencies in the 1930s and 1940s caused the largest increase a sixteen-fold increase in the gross public debt from $16 billion in 1930 to $260 billion in 1950.
$3.6 Trillion – Economic changes (including lower than expected tax revenues due to recession). Because neither party is blameless for the decisions that led to this problem, both parties have a responsibility to solve it.
The present value of these deficits or unfunded obligations is an estimated $45.8 trillion. This is the amount that would have to be set-aside during 2009 so that the principal and interest would pay for the unfunded obligations through 2084. Approximately $7.7 trillion relates to Social Security, while $38.2 trillion relates to Medicare and Medicaid. In other words, health care programs will require nearly five times the level of funding than Social Security. Adding this to the national debt and other federal obligations would bring total obligations to nearly $62 trillion. However, these unfunded obligations are not counted in the national debt.
The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) has indicated that: "Future growth in spending per beneficiary for Medicare and Medicaid the federal government’s major health care programs will be the most important determinant of long-term trends in federal spending. Changing those programs in ways that reduce the growth of costs which will be difficult, in part because of the complexity of health policy choices is ultimately the nation’s central long-term challenge in setting federal fiscal policy."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Congressional_Bu...
==========
>>>The debt when George left office was:$10.7 trillion by December 2008<<<

You forgot to count his 2008-2009 Spending Measure used to fund the government in lieu of a regular budget.

Obama's first budget was the 2009-2010 budget.
Justaminute

Edmond, OK

#20432 May 29, 2012
DustyOutlaw wrote:
<quoted text>
You're getting a little defensive here. Olberman is the left wing version of O'Reilly. Maddow is the left wing version of oh say that idiot Palin. None of those people represent anything other than the extremists IDIOTS of America. But to bring up one side without acknowledging the other being the same in opposite is defensive. I thought better of you.
That's Dr. Rachel Maddow to you Dusty. I think her PhD in political science as well as a Rhodes Scholar make ole Sara closer aligned Packing Heat that Dr. Maddow. The one thing about here she always researches and if she makes a mistake she'll come right out in hew next show and issues and correction, none of the talking heads on any channel even her own will do that.

Olbermann has been gone quite a while; Chris Mathews is more aligned with O'Reilly any way.

Justaminute

Edmond, OK

#20433 May 29, 2012
Boy Heat, your need to hold something back, we're just getting started.

I'm a self-hating white!

I expected for you to be on a full-birther rant. Especially since your Candidate the Mittster has cozied up to Donald Trump. Their joined at the hip now, I personally think they are the perfect couple!

This is gonna be fun!
Justaminute

Edmond, OK

#20434 May 30, 2012
Justaminute wrote:
Boy Heat, your need to hold something back, we're just getting started.
I'm a self-hating white!
I expected for you to be on a full-birther rant. Especially since your Candidate the Mittster has cozied up to Donald Trump. Their joined at the hip now, I personally think they are the perfect couple!
This is gonna be fun!
Heat,

I saw your little love note icons.

Just think, it would be so perfect:

Romney/Trump 2012

We could also call them the:

Heir/Hair 2012

Mormon puzzler:

If Mormons think other Christians are correct in their faith, why do they try and convert you to theirs and rebaptize you?

Romney puzzlers:

If Romney knows so much about job creation, why didn't he do it when he was Governor of Massachusetts?

When he was Governor of Massachusetts, which was during an economic boom period, his state was 47th out of 50 in job creation. That was one of the main reasons he didn't seek a second term. And is was well after his Bain years.

If Romney is not a birther, why did he release his birth certificate on the day he held a fundraiser with Trump?

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#20435 May 30, 2012
Justaminute wrote:
<quoted text>
Heat,
I saw your little love note icons.
Just think, it would be so perfect:
Romney/Trump 2012
We could also call them the:
Heir/Hair 2012
Mormon puzzler:
If Mormons think other Christians are correct in their faith, why do they try and convert you to theirs and rebaptize you?
Romney puzzlers:
If Romney knows so much about job creation, why didn't he do it when he was Governor of Massachusetts?
When he was Governor of Massachusetts, which was during an economic boom period, his state was 47th out of 50 in job creation. That was one of the main reasons he didn't seek a second term. And is was well after his Bain years.
If Romney is not a birther, why did he release his birth certificate on the day he held a fundraiser with Trump?
==========

Yeah, but so what if he is fatally flawed and has arisen from hell itself? He is not black, and that right there makes him better than President Obama.

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