Missouri's Prop C: Voters Set to Chal...

Missouri's Prop C: Voters Set to Challenge Health Reform

There are 18908 comments on the TIME.com story from Aug 3, 2010, titled Missouri's Prop C: Voters Set to Challenge Health Reform. In it, TIME.com reports that:

Missouri voters go to the polls Tuesday for the first-in-the-nation referendum on President Obama's health care plan.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at TIME.com.

Norton

United States

#19693 Nov 5, 2012
Honorem et Veritas wrote:
<quoted text>
Ever study Socialism much? I thought since you were so 'knowledgeable' and by your handle, you might have.
Personally, I stopped reading when I realized it was a tax on all of us to fund medical treatment for everyone, even illegal aliens, against our will.
We will wind up in the same position as Spain before it's over. Not very smart.
I am so glad to hear someone with some common sense. Thank you!

CHEERS!
gullible much?

Farmington, MO

#19694 Nov 5, 2012
Honorem et Veritas wrote:
[QUOTE who="gullible much? "]<quoted text>
I've read it, and I will be happy to wait and see. And it's only a little over 900 pages, but I understand your difficulty with numbers and their exaggerations. "

Ever study Socialism much? I thought since you were so 'knowledgeable' and by your handle, you might have.
Personally, I stopped reading when I realized it was a tax on all of us to fund medical treatment for everyone, even illegal aliens, against our will.
We will wind up in the same position as Spain before it's over. Not very smart.
Lol! I have studied socialism, that's why I understand, instead of fear it.

We have always had a need for socialistic programs in our country, since it's founding. But including socialistic programs into a capitalistic, free market economy, does not make a country socialist.

The funny thing is, the health care reform has nothing to do with socialism, it's funny to me that you all focus on convincing the country that making people pay for healthcare is socialist, and miss all of the things that really are.

I love the "Spain" reference.(shaking
In my American made boots) Your right, we may end up exactly like Spain, or any other country, that exports their entire manufacturing base out country, but it will have nothing to do with our healthcare reform, just like Spain's issues have not.

But good fear tactics, I'm sure the weak minded buy that crap all day long. But I'm sure your bright enough to realize, even as you were typing it, that it has no basis in reality.
Norton

United States

#19695 Nov 5, 2012
[QUOTE who="gullible much? "]<quoted text>
Lol! I have studied socialism, that's why I understand, instead of fear it.
We have always had a need for socialistic programs in our country, since it's founding. But including socialistic programs into a capitalistic, free market economy, does not make a country socialist.
The funny thing is, the health care reform has nothing to do with socialism, it's funny to me that you all focus on convincing the country that making people pay for healthcare is socialist, and miss all of the things that really are.
I love the "Spain" reference.(shaking
In my American made boots) Your right, we may end up exactly like Spain, or any other country, that exports their entire manufacturing base out country, but it will have nothing to do with our healthcare reform, just like Spain's issues have not.
But good fear tactics, I'm sure the weak minded buy that crap all day long. But I'm sure your bright enough to realize, even as you were typing it, that it has no basis in reality.
[/QUOTE]

OK! What is so good about the healthcare reform that you say is not socialism? Please explain that!

CHEERS!
Norton

United States

#19696 Nov 5, 2012
I'm waiting for an explanation and all I got was
judgements on asking a question? Strange?

Just a simple, plain, easy to understand explanation of the healthcare that is suppose to be so good.

May be difficult to explain because it is so stupid?

CHEERS!
gullible much?

Farmington, MO

#19697 Nov 5, 2012
Norton wrote:
[QUOTE who="gullible much? "]<quoted text>
Lol! I have studied socialism, that's why I understand, instead of fear it.
We have always had a need for socialistic programs in our country, since it's founding. But including socialistic programs into a capitalistic, free market economy, does not make a country socialist.
The funny thing is, the health care reform has nothing to do with socialism, it's funny to me that you all focus on convincing the country that making people pay for healthcare is socialist, and miss all of the things that really are.
I love the "Spain" reference.(shaking
In my American made boots) Your right, we may end up exactly like Spain, or any other country, that exports their entire manufacturing base out country, but it will have nothing to do with our healthcare reform, just like Spain's issues have not.
But good fear tactics, I'm sure the weak minded buy that crap all day long. But I'm sure your bright enough to realize, even as you were typing it, that it has no basis in reality.
"

OK! What is so good about the healthcare reform that you say is not socialism? Please explain that!

CHEERS!
The money stays in the hands of private insurance companies, that's what makes it non socialistic! Is that simple point that hard to grasp?

As for what is good about it, the list is long, think about the things that your shepherd Romney says he would keep for starters, the rest I have posted until my fingers have gotten tired of doing the work of others, but I don't change the names on my posts so feel free to look back and see the good in the bill.

Are there bad ideas there as well? Certainly, it was written by politicians and the heritage foundation, there are always things that create expense and benefit very few. Those are the parts that need to be fine tuned. Like any new bill or law, changes will be necessary as time progresses and deficiencies are noted.
gullible much?

Farmington, MO

#19698 Nov 5, 2012
Norton wrote:
I'm waiting for an explanation and all I got was
judgements on asking a question? Strange?

Just a simple, plain, easy to understand explanation of the healthcare that is suppose to be so good.

May be difficult to explain because it is so stupid?

CHEERS!
Those that judge what they don't know or understand are the true failure of our wonderful nation. A willingness to remain uneducated or ignorant about a topic that can affect millions is about as unpatriotic a thing as I can think of.

By your willingness to accept propaganda without question. I'd say maybe you'd be more comfortable in a communist country?
Norton

United States

#19699 Nov 5, 2012
[QUOTE who="gullible much? "]<quoted text>
Those that judge what they don't know or understand are the true failure of our wonderful nation. A willingness to remain uneducated or ignorant about a topic that can affect millions is about as unpatriotic a thing as I can think of.
By your willingness to accept propaganda without question. I'd say maybe you'd be more comfortable in a communist country?
[/QUOTE]

Well I guess Pelosi is unpatriotic then. She didn't want us to know what was in the bill......just accept it. Hogwash! I am not accepting propaganda without question. That is why I ask the question, duh! I think you are the one that would be more comfortable in a communist country!

Congress didn't even understand the dxxx bill! There are hidden things in that bill.......like a huge tax increase. I don't care what you say I think it is a bad thing. I don't think you really understand it either because you can't even explain it.

CHEERS!
gullible much?

Farmington, MO

#19700 Nov 5, 2012
Norton wrote:
[QUOTE who="gullible much? "]<quoted text>
Those that judge what they don't know or understand are the true failure of our wonderful nation. A willingness to remain uneducated or ignorant about a topic that can affect millions is about as unpatriotic a thing as I can think of.
By your willingness to accept propaganda without question. I'd say maybe you'd be more comfortable in a communist country?
"

Well I guess Pelosi is unpatriotic then. She didn't want us to know what was in the bill......just accept it. Hogwash! I am not accepting propaganda without question. That is why I ask the question, duh! I think you are the one that would be more comfortable in a communist country!

Congress didn't even understand the dxxx bill! There are hidden things in that bill.......like a huge tax increase. I don't care what you say I think it is a bad thing. I don't think you really understand it either because you can't even explain it.

CHEERS!
It's 900+ pages for a reason, never said it was easy reading, however the huge tax increase that is associated with it by the right wing prop machine, is actually a reference to HR3200, not HR3590. There is no new income taxing, only a few base items like tobacco and tanning beds, and the individual mandate, if you want to call not letting people be mooches an additional tax.

There aren't expenses associated with the program that need a huge new source of income, many of the pages are just regulations on insurance companies and providers, none of which compromise care in any way that I can find.

My brother who is in medicine,(convenient care clinics throughout Texas and surrounding states) hated the bill also, until he actually looked at it. The regulations that he thought would be stifling for his businesses have actually become a selling point for him to convince other doctors to invest in expansions with him.

I'm not a liberal by nature, I just hate liers, the uninformed, and political spin and propaganda, both sides have those things in droves, but my old party seems to have taken it to a new level this election.

I liked Romneycare when it was passed in Mass, I liked the Heritage Foundations ideas on a typically democratic issue, it leaves doctors and insurance companies with their autonomy, and ability to profit in tact. That was the heritage foundations primary goal and they succeeded.

Massachusetts loves their healthcare, and if the GOP had been bright, they would have worked with the dems to roll it out nationally, and take credit down the road for something that will be much better received than it is now, while its in limbo.

This one issue is what will define Obama's presidency, and he knows it! That could have been Mitts legacy, and If he'd run in 2016 on it, he would have won in a landslide, but instead he will be moving into the oblivion of so many others that tried to be king!
gullible much?

Farmington, MO

#19701 Nov 5, 2012
Norton wrote:
[QUOTE who="gullible much? "]<quoted text>
Those that judge what they don't know or understand are the true failure of our wonderful nation. A willingness to remain uneducated or ignorant about a topic that can affect millions is about as unpatriotic a thing as I can think of.
By your willingness to accept propaganda without question. I'd say maybe you'd be more comfortable in a communist country?
"

Well I guess Pelosi is unpatriotic then. She didn't want us to know what was in the bill......just accept it. Hogwash! I am not accepting propaganda without question. That is why I ask the question, duh! I think you are the one that would be more comfortable in a communist country!

Congress didn't even understand the dxxx bill! There are hidden things in that bill.......like a huge tax increase. I don't care what you say I think it is a bad thing. I don't think you really understand it either because you can't even explain it.

CHEERS!
Ps. I have a severe distaste for Pelosi, on that we can agree.

Since: Nov 12

Cabool

#19702 Nov 6, 2012
[QUOTE who="gullible much? "]<quoted text>
Lol! I have studied socialism, that's why I understand, instead of fear it.
We have always had a need for socialistic programs in our country, since it's founding. But including socialistic programs into a capitalistic, free market economy, does not make a country socialist.
The funny thing is, the health care reform has nothing to do with socialism, it's funny to me that you all focus on convincing the country that making people pay for healthcare is socialist, and miss all of the things that really are.
I love the "Spain" reference.(shaking
In my American made boots) Your right, we may end up exactly like Spain, or any other country, that exports their entire manufacturing base out country, but it will have nothing to do with our healthcare reform, just like Spain's issues have not.
But good fear tactics, I'm sure the weak minded buy that crap all day long. But I'm sure your bright enough to realize, even as you were typing it, that it has no basis in reality.
[/QUOTE]
One question:
Can you give us any examples of countries where a Socialistic government is in power that you admire and would like to live in?
Norton

United States

#19703 Nov 6, 2012
[QUOTE who="gullible much? "]<quoted text>
It's 900+ pages for a reason, never said it was easy reading, however the huge tax increase that is associated with it by the right wing prop machine, is actually a reference to HR3200, not HR3590. There is no new income taxing, only a few base items like tobacco and tanning beds, and the individual mandate, if you want to call not letting people be mooches an additional tax.
There aren't expenses associated with the program that need a huge new source of income, many of the pages are just regulations on insurance companies and providers, none of which compromise care in any way that I can find.
My brother who is in medicine,(convenient care clinics throughout Texas and surrounding states) hated the bill also, until he actually looked at it. The regulations that he thought would be stifling for his businesses have actually become a selling point for him to convince other doctors to invest in expansions with him.
I'm not a liberal by nature, I just hate liers, the uninformed, and political spin and propaganda, both sides have those things in droves, but my old party seems to have taken it to a new level this election.
I liked Romneycare when it was passed in Mass, I liked the Heritage Foundations ideas on a typically democratic issue, it leaves doctors and insurance companies with their autonomy, and ability to profit in tact. That was the heritage foundations primary goal and they succeeded.
Massachusetts loves their healthcare, and if the GOP had been bright, they would have worked with the dems to roll it out nationally, and take credit down the road for something that will be much better received than it is now, while its in limbo.
This one issue is what will define Obama's presidency, and he knows it! That could have been Mitts legacy, and If he'd run in 2016 on it, he would have won in a landslide, but instead he will be moving into the oblivion of so many others that tried to be king![/QUOTE]

No disrespect.....but, I think you have on rose-colored glasses!
I don't believe Obamacare is a good thing. Nothing Pelosi and Reid have been involved with has been good......let alone Obama!
When they get sneaky..........I don't trust them! I think Obama is in bed with the Islamist, too. There is just something about him I don't trust on anything! Obamacare is a way to get total control of the people.

CHEERS!

“So it's not you, It's them?”

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#19704 Nov 6, 2012
Norton wrote:
<quoted text>
No disrespect.....but, I think you have on rose-colored glasses!
I don't believe Obamacare is a good thing. Nothing Pelosi and Reid have been involved with has been good......let alone Obama!
When they get sneaky..........I don't trust them! I think Obama is in bed with the Islamist, too. There is just something about him I don't trust on anything! Obamacare is a way to get total control of the people.
CHEERS!
Of course you don't trust him. You don't trust him because you've confirmed here multiple times you're a card-carrying CON apologist, shill, toadie troll and he's a fairly centrist DEM. So you hate anything DENs do or say. You also don't like him because you've confirmed here on several occasions that you're an old-school racist geezer. I'm sure you've noticed that your President is black! It's okay, we forgive you and accept you for exactly who you are!

Since: Nov 12

Cabool

#19705 Nov 6, 2012
Norton wrote:
<quoted text>
No disrespect.....but, I think you have on rose-colored glasses!
I don't believe Obamacare is a good thing. Nothing Pelosi and Reid have been involved with has been good......let alone Obama!
When they get sneaky..........I don't trust them! I think Obama is in bed with the Islamist, too. There is just something about him I don't trust on anything! Obamacare is a way to get total control of the people.
CHEERS!
Norton,
This person(gullible) is a paid Communist/Socialist Troll. I'd bet money on it. I know from experience. Look into it. They are everywhere, infiltrating forums like this trying to make us think there are more of them than us and trying to keep us aggravated and arguing with them. However it is doesn't even live here I'm sure.
gullible much?

Farmington, MO

#19706 Nov 6, 2012
Norton wrote:
[QUOTE who="gullible much? "]<quoted text>
It's 900+ pages for a reason, never said it was easy reading, however the huge tax increase that is associated with it by the right wing prop machine, is actually a reference to HR3200, not HR3590. There is no new income taxing, only a few base items like tobacco and tanning beds, and the individual mandate, if you want to call not letting people be mooches an additional tax.
There aren't expenses associated with the program that need a huge new source of income, many of the pages are just regulations on insurance companies and providers, none of which compromise care in any way that I can find.
My brother who is in medicine,(convenient care clinics throughout Texas and surrounding states) hated the bill also, until he actually looked at it. The regulations that he thought would be stifling for his businesses have actually become a selling point for him to convince other doctors to invest in expansions with him.
I'm not a liberal by nature, I just hate liers, the uninformed, and political spin and propaganda, both sides have those things in droves, but my old party seems to have taken it to a new level this election.
I liked Romneycare when it was passed in Mass, I liked the Heritage Foundations ideas on a typically democratic issue, it leaves doctors and insurance companies with their autonomy, and ability to profit in tact. That was the heritage foundations primary goal and they succeeded.
Massachusetts loves their healthcare, and if the GOP had been bright, they would have worked with the dems to roll it out nationally, and take credit down the road for something that will be much better received than it is now, while its in limbo.
This one issue is what will define Obama's presidency, and he knows it! That could have been Mitts legacy, and If he'd run in 2016 on it, he would have won in a landslide, but instead he will be moving into the oblivion of so many others that tried to be king! "

No disrespect.....but, I think you have on rose-colored glasses!
I don't believe Obamacare is a good thing. Nothing Pelosi and Reid have been involved with has been good......let alone Obama!
When they get sneaky..........I don't trust them! I think Obama is in bed with the Islamist, too. There is just something about him I don't trust on anything! Obamacare is a way to get total control of the people.

CHEERS!
Ah. Conspiracy theorists aren't worth arguing with.. Have a good life living in fear of everything and everyone!

They're out to get you! Your guns! And your bible! Lmao!! Bye bye now. Have to go vote.

I hope Obama's hired jihadist Islamic thugs don't get you at the polls!

CHEERS!
gullible much?

Farmington, MO

#19707 Nov 6, 2012
Honorem et Veritas wrote:
<quoted text>Norton,
This person(gullible) is a paid Communist/Socialist Troll. I'd bet money on it. I know from experience. Look into it. They are everywhere, infiltrating forums like this trying to make us think there are more of them than us and trying to keep us aggravated and arguing with them. However it is doesn't even live here I'm sure.
See my reply to Norton

Aka: CHEERIOS BOY.

Since: Nov 12

Cabool

#19708 Nov 6, 2012
[QUOTE who="gullible much? "]<quoted text>
See my reply to Norton
Aka: CHEERIOS BOY.
[/QUOTE]
I'm not at all surprised by your reply. Typical communist/socialist troll response. Use the talking points...if that fails, call people fearful, paranoid or conspiracy theorists.
Go sell your Marxist/Socialist propaganda BS elsewhere. I prefer liberty and the freedom to profit from my labor without undue governmental interference and over reaching regulation.
I despise people like you. And in case you were wondering, I hold the WTO and the UN in contempt as well.
Norton

United States

#19709 Nov 6, 2012
Chilli J wrote:
<quoted text>
Of course you don't trust him. You don't trust him because you've confirmed here multiple times you're a card-carrying CON apologist, shill, toadie troll and he's a fairly centrist DEM. So you hate anything DENs do or say. You also don't like him because you've confirmed here on several occasions that you're an old-school racist geezer. I'm sure you've noticed that your President is black! It's okay, we forgive you and accept you for exactly who you are!
My President is black? Best of my knowledge he is half white. Where am I wrong on this? I am not a racist! I may be old-school but it seems to me some of you need to go back to school. I do not understand why you people cannot see that this President is lost. He may be a good person but he does not have what it takes to be President. There are hidden things about him that are beginning to come out and they scare me. I believe he is Muslim and he has done nothing to prove me wrong. I do not believe he understand finances or how to deal with our enemies. Those that hate us will not be swayed by smooth talk. They will just laugh at us. We need a President that will stand firm and mean what he says. We cannot and should not reduce our military. We need to be the best in the world. People died for our freedom.......let's support those people that have died for our freedoms.

GOD BLESS AMERICA AND VOTE ROMNEY FOR PRESIDENT!

CHEERS!
Norton

United States

#19710 Nov 6, 2012
[QUOTE who="gullible much? "]<quoted text>
Ah. Conspiracy theorists aren't worth arguing with.. Have a good life living in fear of everything and everyone!
They're out to get you! Your guns! And your bible! Lmao!! Bye bye now. Have to go vote.
I hope Obama's hired jihadist Islamic thugs don't get you at the polls!
CHEERS![/QUOTE]

I think you are right........out to get our guns, Bible and our freedom of speech!

CHEERS!

Since: Oct 12

Haslet, TX

#19711 Nov 6, 2012
VOTE NO wrote:
Personal health care is an individual responsibility!
It's not the job of our government to regulate our
health. If this bill passes, say good bye to all
alternative health care, and yes your vitamins and
nutrients as well. Why should a health conscious
person, who eats right and exercises, and doesnt
smoke and drink, pay for someone who doesn't give
a shit about their own health? Just doesn't make
sense to me.
FREE HEALTH CARE IS NOT FREE!!! LETS KEEP THE GOVERNMENT
OUT OF OUR LIVES!
darling every other country but us has it. It isn't as aweful as you have heard. If it is done properly it means you can keep your private insurance or have one government funded. That would mean people like me with a pre exsisting disease can get help when needed. It should also mean health care will stop being a money making business and go back yo making people healthy. I hope it passes
captain

Saint Louis, MO

#19712 Nov 6, 2012
well said

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