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Reality Check

North Little Rock, AR

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#26129
Jul 31, 2013
 
BARNEYII wrote:
<quoted text>
Entitlements and welfare, are you suggesting they are the same thing?
Where did you get that figure of 42k per person?
First off, let me say as I usually do, but didn't in this occasion, that you need to take this article along with every other article with a grain of salt. I couldn't find the article I had found previously but I did find this: http://www.heritage.org/federalbudget/budget-...

This article breaks down to $68,000 per recipient (in the 19% for welfare and other entitlements). Even though that number would strengthen my argument, I have a hard time believing the dollar amount is that high. Just my opinion.
Duh

Jonesboro, AR

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#26130
Jul 31, 2013
 
BARNEYII wrote:
<quoted text>
I presume you meant Vladimir Lenin not "Lennon".
In a communist society many things are controlled by the state.
That could even be said to be a description of communism.

Since: Dec 10

Washington DC

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#26131
Jul 31, 2013
 
Reality Check wrote:
<quoted text>
First off, let me say as I usually do, but didn't in this occasion, that you need to take this article along with every other article with a grain of salt. I couldn't find the article I had found previously but I did find this: http://www.heritage.org/federalbudget/budget-...
This article breaks down to $68,000 per recipient (in the 19% for welfare and other entitlements). Even though that number would strengthen my argument, I have a hard time believing the dollar amount is that high. Just my opinion.
Are you familiar with the Heritage foundation? You would be wise to consider those numbers high coming from that group, however that is another story.

I agree they are to high, and my opinion why they are.

If you will notice they added Welfare to Entitlement programs to reach the their 62%.

They are not the same, just as their name suggests.

Social Security and Medicare ,unemployment, are entitlement programs and by far make up the bulk of that 62%.

Medicaid, SSI, food stamps, and housing assistance would be Welfare programs.

Entitlement programs either the recipient, or the recipient employer has paid into those funds and are entitled to get their money back.

Welfare you did not have to pay a dime to anyone to receive benefits.

'Entitlement'

Why are conservatives trying to convince me that is a dirty word.

Reality Check

North Little Rock, AR

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#26132
Jul 31, 2013
 
BARNEYII wrote:
<quoted text>
No beef with corporate welfare?
2010, The Walton's wealth has risen and most other Americans' wealth declined, it is now the case that the Walton family wealth is as large as the bottom 48.8 million families in the wealth distribution (constituting 41.5 percent of all American families) combined.
The report analyzes data from Wisconsin's Medicaid program, estimating that a single 300-person Wal-Mart Supercenter in that state likely costs taxpayers at least $904,542 per year and could cost up to $1,744,590 per year, or roughly $5,815 per employee.
Two sides to every argument, here is what Wal-Mart had to say.
Wal-Mart, in an analysis posted on its website, described the report as "flawed," criticizing the reliance on the data from Wisconsin to make "vast generalizations." In its rebuttal, the company said the report failed to take into account Wal-Mart's size and that the number of its workers on Medicaid is similar to other big retailers and comparable to the national average.
Now did they just say, others are doing it so it is okay for us to do the same?
Did I happen to mention the Walton's are big time Republicans?
I would answer your question with a some of questions of my own. How many jobs does a person who has never worked create? How many jobs does the CEO of Wal Mart create? What is their economic impact on the American economy? We need to give businesses who employ people that pay taxes to support the function of this nation as many business breaks as possible to enable them to hire as many people as possible. Having said that, I do believe that if a company CEO's are found taking the tax breaks and using them for their own personal use, then jail time is in order along with removal of the tax breaks. A company should be able to show a trail that clearly shows the usage of the funds for their intended purpose. As for the Walton's wealth, do you really think that they got their wealth off of the sale of one product? No, they get their wealth a few cents or dollars at a time. Since they probably have over 100K items in each Wal Mart and probably around 3,000-5,000 Wal Marts world wide, it wouldn't take long for revenues to add up. Especially since Wal Mart turns their inventory at least 2.5 times per year which is about average for retailers. Not to mention they are a publicly traded company. On the income front, did you know that income inequality has sped up and the gap has widened significantly under Obama? More so than under Bush. Under Obama, the rich are getting richer faster and the poor are getting poorer faster. He is not about income equality. He is about control and power regardless of who can survive his governing and who can't.
Dont Know Nothing

Medford, OR

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#26135
Aug 2, 2013
 

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Reality Check wrote:
<quoted text>
How many jobs does the CEO of Wal Mart create? What is their economic impact on the American economy? We need to give businesses who employ people that pay taxes to support the function of this nation as many business breaks as possible to enable them to hire as many people as possible. Having said that, I do believe that if a company CEO's are found taking the tax breaks and using them for their own personal use, then jail time is in order along with removal of the tax breaks. A company should be able to show a trail that clearly shows the usage of the funds for their intended purpose. As for the Walton's wealth, do you really think that they got their wealth off of the sale of one product? No, they get their wealth a few cents or dollars at a time. Since they probably have over 100K items in each Wal Mart and probably around 3,000-5,000 Wal Marts world wide, it wouldn't take long for revenues to add up. Especially since Wal Mart turns their inventory at least 2.5 times per year which is about average for retailers. Not to mention they are a publicly traded company. On the income front, did you know that income inequality has sped up and the gap has widened significantly under Obama? More so than under Bush. Under Obama, the rich are getting richer faster and the poor are getting poorer faster. He is not about income equality. He is about control and power regardless of who can survive his governing and who can't.
lol it still amazes me that you are on here spewing rhetoric. "We need to give businesses who employ people that pay taxes to support the function of this nation as many business breaks as possible to enable them to hire as many people as possible." Tell that to your Republican buddies on the hill who just shot down a bill to reduce corporate tax rates and in exchange for an infrastructure bill. "I do believe that if a company CEO's are found taking the tax breaks and using them for their own personal use, then jail time is in order along with removal of the tax breaks." That is about the smartest thing I have heard you say; however, why should CEO's take advantage of tax breaks that would nullify all the breaks they receive already in the tax code that allows them to pay under 15% and sometimes lower than 10%? 25% or 30% is still higher than that last time I checked. Concerning Wal-Mart, you would think you would know a little about a business that started in your home state. I grew up there years ago and I still know how it started and how the family got their wealth. Sam worked for JCP to start out, quit and started his own business, and did excellent. He then found a bigger space and opened up a chain of Ben Franklin Stores. Those stores did excellent as well. He then opened the first Wal-Mart Discount City store in 1962, and stocked the shelves with AMERICAN made products. Something Wal-Mart and other retailers have forgotten how to do. He then passed away and left stock shares to his children to avoid estate taxes, and so will the rest of his family. Forget helping the AMERICANS that helped build your business by paying in your share of taxes, lets give away stock shares and take advantage of capitol gains taxes and other tax breaks to avoid paying in as much money as possible. LOL, your reasoning is a joke. Please inform yourself on what you are talking about before you actually start talking. Oh and that income equality gap started growing when? Oh yeah, when Bush first offered the tax breaks. The US economy is not your strong point is it? Nor is knowledge of the Constitution, bill of rights, political science, any of our founding fathers, Declaration of Independence, Arkansas history, US history, our marginal tax rate and tax code, or intellectual capitol. When you quit practicing your artificial ignorance, the rest of the world will be here in reality waiting.
Reality Check

North Little Rock, AR

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#26136
Aug 2, 2013
 
Dont Know Nothing wrote:
<quoted text>lol it still amazes me that you are on here spewing rhetoric. "We need to give businesses who employ people that pay taxes to support the function of this nation as many business breaks as possible to enable them to hire as many people as possible."
Believe me, if it were up to me, corporations would pay 0% in corporate taxes. You do realize it was Wal Mart that brought Chinese merchandise into the American market don't you? Wal Mart is the reason that every retail store now carries merchandise made overseas. But make no mistake, you and every other consumer are behind those decisions, are the reason products with Made in America on them are now a needle in a haystack instead of a dime a dozen. American consumers drive the disposable society we live in. American consumers only care about price and it shows in our purchasing habits. Stop buying things not made in America and the Made in China products will start disappearing from the shelves. Retailers won't stock things that don't sell. Why do liberals always want to blame someone else for things they either caused or helped cause? Please tell me how putting in a business, where a ton of capital is required and only the business owner can lose everything if it is not repaid, that also offers products and services to make life easier for the buying public isn't helping the public. You and other liberals always come from the position of "we bought your product and now your rich and evil" standpoint, yet nobody twisted your arm to buy the services or products. I will never get that. If you think someone is too rich or evil then stop shopping with them. You don't see the 70-80 hour weeks that many of these "rich evil" people go through. All you look at are quarterly earnings reports and wish that someone would take from them and give to you so you can continue working the 40 hour or less week you work yet increase your lifestyle. It's insulting but it clearly shows how little you know about business so I really can't take much offense.
Reality Check

North Little Rock, AR

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#26137
Aug 2, 2013
 
BARNEYII wrote:
<quoted text>
Are you familiar with the Heritage foundation? You would be wise to consider those numbers high coming from that group, however that is another story.
I agree they are to high, and my opinion why they are.
If you will notice they added Welfare to Entitlement programs to reach the their 62%.
They are not the same, just as their name suggests.
Social Security and Medicare ,unemployment, are entitlement programs and by far make up the bulk of that 62%.
Medicaid, SSI, food stamps, and housing assistance would be Welfare programs.
Entitlement programs either the recipient, or the recipient employer has paid into those funds and are entitled to get their money back.
Welfare you did not have to pay a dime to anyone to receive benefits.
'Entitlement'
Why are conservatives trying to convince me that is a dirty word.
If you think Welfare, SSI, and food stamps have not become entitlements then I now have a greater understanding of why you support liberalism. You have never been exposed to the lives these individuals live. You are ignorant of the meat and potatoes of the issue. You are only looking at the numbers and listening to the left wing spin of those numbers. I agree that entitlement was set up to mean exactly what you said. HOWEVER, the prevelent thought is that income and corporate taxes on the wealthy should go up so that those receiving welfare, SSI, and food stamps may have a better quality of life which makes those programs entitlements. If funds are taken out of a person's income for a dedicated program, that program is an entitlement. You can't get around that even if you use the historical definition of entitlements. That should explain why conservatives see the word entitlement as dirty. You should too.
Reality Check

North Little Rock, AR

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#26138
Aug 2, 2013
 
Is the media finally realizing that Obama is bad for America? CNN came out with a report about the corruption of the IRS and the FEC that blistered the Obama administration. The report was about the collusion between the two when they shared information about conservative's tax records in the 2012 elections. That's illegal and a government no-no. The report also cited the extreme pressure that FBI agents were under to remain silent. The Obama administration was even cited by an anonymous FBI agent that said agents, who were conducting the investigation, and their families were threatened if they didn't keep silent. ABC also had a report today that said, though the unemployment rate dipped to 7.4% that we shouldn't get excited because it has more to do with a reduction in labor participation than actual jobs created. We're talking about CNN and ABC, not Fox News. Believe me, I'm not getting too excited because I know those two organizations are still in the tank for Obama but it was nice to see actual Journalism coming from them instead of liberal spin.

Since: Dec 10

Washington DC

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#26139
Aug 2, 2013
 
Reality Check wrote:
<quoted text>
If you think Welfare, SSI, and food stamps have not become entitlements then I now have a greater understanding of why you support liberalism. You have never been exposed to the lives these individuals live. You are ignorant of the meat and potatoes of the issue. You are only looking at the numbers and listening to the left wing spin of those numbers. I agree that entitlement was set up to mean exactly what you said. HOWEVER, the prevelent thought is that income and corporate taxes on the wealthy should go up so that those receiving welfare, SSI, and food stamps may have a better quality of life which makes those programs entitlements. If funds are taken out of a person's income for a dedicated program, that program is an entitlement. You can't get around that even if you use the historical definition of entitlements. That should explain why conservatives see the word entitlement as dirty. You should too.
"If funds are taken out of a person's income for a dedicated program, that program is an entitlement"
..........

Damn, where did you get such and idea?

OH I know, that came from my post that you are issuing this rebuttal to.


"Entitlement programs either the recipient, or the recipient employer has paid into those funds and are entitled to get their money back"

Since: Dec 10

Washington DC

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#26140
Aug 2, 2013
 
Reality Check wrote:
<quoted text>
If you think Welfare, SSI, and food stamps have not become entitlements then I now have a greater understanding of why you support liberalism. You have never been exposed to the lives these individuals live. You are ignorant of the meat and potatoes of the issue. You are only looking at the numbers and listening to the left wing spin of those numbers. I agree that entitlement was set up to mean exactly what you said. HOWEVER, the prevelent thought is that income and corporate taxes on the wealthy should go up so that those receiving welfare, SSI, and food stamps may have a better quality of life which makes those programs entitlements. If funds are taken out of a person's income for a dedicated program, that program is an entitlement. You can't get around that even if you use the historical definition of entitlements. That should explain why conservatives see the word entitlement as dirty. You should too.
First, I am a meat and potatoes type of person, and I can tell you that your idea that;

"income and corporate taxes on the wealthy should go up so that those receiving welfare, SSI, and food stamps may have a better quality of life"


Is only a PREVALANT thought among the ultra conservative, and racial bigots.

People who cannot grasp the concept that the cost to society would be much greater without a social welfare safety blanket.

Not to mention the moral baggage that a Christian COULD add to the equation of not having a social welfare program.

After all you said this Country is a Christian country founded by Christians.

Entitlement is a bad word, A quote by a self professed Christian.

As I have said before, it's not Christians I have a problem with,
its the Hypocrites claiming to be Christians that tar my roof.

Since: Dec 10

Washington DC

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#26141
Aug 2, 2013
 
Reality Check wrote:
Is the media finally realizing that Obama is bad for America? CNN came out with a report about the corruption of the IRS and the FEC that blistered the Obama administration. The report was about the collusion between the two when they shared information about conservative's tax records in the 2012 elections. That's illegal and a government no-no. The report also cited the extreme pressure that FBI agents were under to remain silent. The Obama administration was even cited by an anonymous FBI agent that said agents, who were conducting the investigation, and their families were threatened if they didn't keep silent. ABC also had a report today that said, though the unemployment rate dipped to 7.4% that we shouldn't get excited because it has more to do with a reduction in labor participation than actual jobs created. We're talking about CNN and ABC, not Fox News. Believe me, I'm not getting too excited because I know those two organizations are still in the tank for Obama but it was nice to see actual Journalism coming from them instead of liberal spin.
"anonymous FBI agent"

Now that phrase really says a lot about "actual Journalism" .

Since: Dec 10

Washington DC

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#26142
Aug 2, 2013
 
Reality Check wrote:
Is the media finally realizing that Obama is bad for America? CNN came out with a report about the corruption of the IRS and the FEC that blistered the Obama administration. The report was about the collusion between the two when they shared information about conservative's tax records in the 2012 elections. That's illegal and a government no-no. The report also cited the extreme pressure that FBI agents were under to remain silent. The Obama administration was even cited by an anonymous FBI agent that said agents, who were conducting the investigation, and their families were threatened if they didn't keep silent. ABC also had a report today that said, though the unemployment rate dipped to 7.4% that we shouldn't get excited because it has more to do with a reduction in labor participation than actual jobs created. We're talking about CNN and ABC, not Fox News. Believe me, I'm not getting too excited because I know those two organizations are still in the tank for Obama but it was nice to see actual Journalism coming from them instead of liberal spin.
Do you think the 162,000 NET jobs created had a bit to do with the drop.

No reason to get excited at all, this was just the 34th-straight month of job creation. A gain, but way short of what is needed.

Just imagine what it could have been without Republican obstruction.
Reality Check

North Little Rock, AR

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#26143
Aug 2, 2013
 
BARNEYII wrote:
<quoted text>
"If funds are taken out of a person's income for a dedicated program, that program is an entitlement"
..........
Damn, where did you get such and idea?
OH I know, that came from my post that you are issuing this rebuttal to.
"Entitlement programs either the recipient, or the recipient employer has paid into those funds and are entitled to get their money back"
Let me help you with your own quote. You said: "They are not the same, just as their name suggests.

Social Security and Medicare ,unemployment, are entitlement programs and by far make up the bulk of that 62%.

Medicaid, SSI, food stamps, and housing assistance would be Welfare programs." What you are referencing above is the part of your quote I agreed with. What I was referring to was personal income tax for the sole purpose of funding welfare, SSI, and food stamps making them entitlements even though most of the recipients never paid into those programs. Of course, you already knew that and was just trying to turn it around. It's the definition of entitlement that has changed thanks to liberalism infecting our once great nation.
Reality Check

North Little Rock, AR

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#26144
Aug 2, 2013
 
BARNEYII wrote:
<quoted text>
"anonymous FBI agent"
Now that phrase really says a lot about "actual Journalism" .
We're talking about CNN so I know that "actual journalism" is rare. Would you want your name known if you were telling that about an administration that was threatening you and your family? I sure hope not.
Reality Check

North Little Rock, AR

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#26145
Aug 2, 2013
 
BARNEYII wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you think the 162,000 NET jobs created had a bit to do with the drop.
No reason to get excited at all, this was just the 34th-straight month of job creation. A gain, but way short of what is needed.
Just imagine what it could have been without Republican obstruction.
ABC cited that the reason it dropped was more about the lack of labor participation than actual jobs created (net or gross). You still don't get it do you? You only get hung up on the feel-good numbers. I mean, with almost 3 straight years of jobs growth, the participation rate must be in the 80% range by now. Right? I know you and the Obama administration care how many American's are working and paying taxes, or does "everyone getting a fair shot" only apply to 50%-60% of the nation? It explains alot if that's the case. You ask where we would be if there were no Republican obstruction. I would say 9.5% unemployment with 45% participation rate. That's giving Obama the benefit of the doubt, that he actually wants America to succeed, of course.
Guestless

Jonesboro, AR

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#26146
Aug 2, 2013
 
BARNEYII wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you think the 162,000 NET jobs created had a bit to do with the drop.
No reason to get excited at all, this was just the 34th-straight month of job creation. A gain, but way short of what is needed.
Just imagine what it could have been without Republican obstruction.
Now if he could only think of a way to come up with full time jobs.

Since: Dec 10

Washington DC

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#26147
Aug 2, 2013
 
Reality Check wrote:
<quoted text>
Let me help you with your own quote. You said: "They are not the same, just as their name suggests.
Social Security and Medicare ,unemployment, are entitlement programs and by far make up the bulk of that 62%.
Medicaid, SSI, food stamps, and housing assistance would be Welfare programs." What you are referencing above is the part of your quote I agreed with. What I was referring to was personal income tax for the sole purpose of funding welfare, SSI, and food stamps making them entitlements even though most of the recipients never paid into those programs. Of course, you already knew that and was just trying to turn it around. It's the definition of entitlement that has changed thanks to liberalism infecting our once great nation.
How can you call SSI, food stamps, and entitlement after just saying,

"even though most of the recipients never paid into those programs"

and you could not be more wrong about food stamps.

Among SNAP households with at least one working-age, non-disabled adult, more than half work while receiving SNAP and more than 80 percent work in the year prior to or the year after receiving SNAP. The rates are even higher for families with children more than 60 percent work while receiving SNAP, and almost 90 percent work in the prior or subsequent year.(See Figure 1.)[3]

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/...

Based on your theory, tax dollars are used, so it is a entitlement program.

That would make the Department of Defense one Hell of a entitlement program, wouldn't it?

Have you ever seen a exclusive tax deduction for SNAP, or Welfare on a pay check stub, as you said, money was collected just for that purpose, like Social Security or Medicare does?
Guestless

Jonesboro, AR

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#26148
Aug 2, 2013
 
BARNEYII wrote:
<quoted text>
How can you call SSI, food stamps, and entitlement after just saying,
"even though most of the recipients never paid into those programs"
and you could not be more wrong about food stamps.
Among SNAP households with at least one working-age, non-disabled adult, more than half work while receiving SNAP and more than 80 percent work in the year prior to or the year after receiving SNAP. The rates are even higher for families with children more than 60 percent work while receiving SNAP, and almost 90 percent work in the prior or subsequent year.(See Figure 1.)[3]
http://www.cbpp.org/cms/...
Based on your theory, tax dollars are used, so it is a entitlement program.
That would make the Department of Defense one Hell of a entitlement program, wouldn't it?
Have you ever seen a exclusive tax deduction for SNAP, or Welfare on a pay check stub, as you said, money was collected just for that purpose, like Social Security or Medicare does?
Are you in the percentage that worked prior to drawing?
Reality Check

North Little Rock, AR

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#26149
Aug 2, 2013
 
BARNEYII wrote:
<quoted text>
First, I am a meat and potatoes type of person, and I can tell you that your idea that;
"income and corporate taxes on the wealthy should go up so that those receiving welfare, SSI, and food stamps may have a better quality of life"
Is only a PREVALANT thought among the ultra conservative, and racial bigots.
People who cannot grasp the concept that the cost to society would be much greater without a social welfare safety blanket.
Not to mention the moral baggage that a Christian COULD add to the equation of not having a social welfare program.
After all you said this Country is a Christian country founded by Christians.
Entitlement is a bad word, A quote by a self professed Christian.
As I have said before, it's not Christians I have a problem with,
its the Hypocrites claiming to be Christians that tar my roof.
I never said we shouldn't have a safety blanket. I said the one we have is broken and have also gone so far as to say that there are those that really need help that can't get it because we have leeches, pretending to be needy, that suck up funds before they can get to those that really need help. Again, you have a gross misunderstanding of what a Christian is so you REALLY need to study it before you go ignorantly blurting out liberal talking points about Christians. For example, the Westboro Baptist Church is an established church that claims to be Christian but I can assure you they are not.

Since: Dec 10

Washington DC

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#26150
Aug 2, 2013
 
Reality Check wrote:
<quoted text>
ABC cited that the reason it dropped was more about the lack of labor participation than actual jobs created (net or gross). You still don't get it do you? You only get hung up on the feel-good numbers. I mean, with almost 3 straight years of jobs growth, the participation rate must be in the 80% range by now. Right? I know you and the Obama administration care how many American's are working and paying taxes, or does "everyone getting a fair shot" only apply to 50%-60% of the nation? It explains alot if that's the case. You ask where we would be if there were no Republican obstruction. I would say 9.5% unemployment with 45% participation rate. That's giving Obama the benefit of the doubt, that he actually wants America to succeed, of course.
No, you do not get it, if you do, you do a damn good job of hiding it.

The recession killed off 7.9 million jobs, I do not give a Rats ass about a labor participation percentage that has been dropping for several straight years, in large part due to baby boomers retiring and when you lose 7.9 million jobs, what do you expect?

The fact is, new people becoming work eligible every day. The economy must create enough jobs each month for them and gain some of the 7.9 Mill. jobs back.

If you have not notice we still have a high UE rate and a Republican Majority House not doing a damn thing about it
because the economy is doing well enough to produce those jobs and regaining some of the 7.9 million lost jobs.

Big business continues to line their pockets with cash, big business is happy, that makes Republicans ecstatic.

Some of the people who voted Republican crying,

'WORST PRESIDENT EVER'

I said some, because the Republican base is starting to turn on its own. Look at Mitch McConnell the incumbent Senator trailing in the polls to a Democrat not to mention having to fight it out with a another Republican for the GOP nomination.




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