Collins calls for closure of ECMC or Buffalo General

Collins says the Medical Center and Kaleida haven't been able to reach a merger deal ordered by the Berger Commission.

[Man With No Name]

Collins and Berger are right; this area is losing population and the law-abiding, decent folk can no longer afford to pay the way (ever increasing taxes) for the murderous gangs and two-bit thugs roaming Buffalo's streets, beating, raping and killing each other!!!

[CHANGE NEEDED]

Cut the ECMC administration and let Kaleida run both...These overpaid people are trying to keep their unneeded positions at ECMC...go get em Chris!

[lt stauffiger]

is this guy kidding?
theres not enough ambulances to staff the city as it is - what does he think will happen with a hospital closure? wake up Collins!!!!!!!!

[Pete from Buffalo]

A number one trauma center OR the heart and soul of the "medical campus". This guy has agendas similar to that of his mentally deficient predecessor and it doesnt matter who suffers as long as he prevails. Tell him to address 4 dollar a gallon gasoline or welfare fraud or county employee abuse not to set his sights on the public's well being!!!!!!!

[Janie]

Interesting that Kaleida and the Unions are portraying the County administration as anti-progress to gain support for their "cause".
The law suit brought forth by the County was not filed because they don't want to see a heart institute or because they don't want a huge grant. It was brought about because Kaleida (backed by the Unions) wants to control ECMC and it's assets and revenues without being responsible for the liabilities. That poses a HUGE financial burden on the residents of the County. It leaves us (the taxpayers) responsible for retirees and other liabilities with none of the revenues to offset it. That's ludicrous!!!!!
The unions are all for the County having to deal with the expenses because they know they have a stronger influence over the politicians than private sector, who would most likely do whatever it takes to get rid of those expenses.

[Barbara]

I can not believe they would even say to close ECMC. The only Trauma Hospital in Buffalo. ECMC has saved many people with a Trauma situation. Come on people of Western New York--Speak Up.

[Gunner]

Barbara wrote:

I can not believe they would even say to close ECMC. The only Trauma Hospital in Buffalo. ECMC has saved many people with a Trauma situation. Come on people of Western New York--Speak Up.

dontcha think they could move a trauma center? doubt thay would leave the area without one, even if ecmc closes. duh!!

[MARIE]

ECMC can't get additional ER beds approved but DeGraff (Kaleida) got theirs approved by the DOH and Suburban has had a huge remodel. Berger said close inpt beds, and Kaleida just decides to move them from Gates to Buffalo General,(still leaving beds that need to be closed to comply, so hmm... where do you think Newco is going to go to finds beds to close? Ya think ECMC?)
You wouldn't have your home remodeled without a written contract, but some want a multi-million dollar merger to go through on an promise and handshake? Who is really stone-walling here?

[funnyguy]

Tell me oh great knowledge ones JUST WHY does ERIE county need to be in business of health care when people are vacating ??? let the other hospitals take over it will saveyou taxes As for DeGRaff it was to close but lo & behold they were allowed to get beds Anything in ECCH can be moved to any other hospital Me thinks some ones toes are being steped on does it hurt? aww so some one will lose s few bucks Watch for rebutals now

[Sweetpea]

Seeing as Kaleida Health is following the Berger recommendations in the time frame they have been given and ECMC is breaking the law but doing nothing but cause problems, I feel ECMC should be closed down.

ECMC drains millions of taxpayer dollars and Kaleida Health, without the benefit of the taxpayers turned a profit. Kaleida continually reinvests in the Western New York community--you see it all over the news and television. What has ECMC done for the community? Answer: Drain millions of dollars from out pockets.

The unions at ECMC do not want to lose their great big fat pay and benefits package--that is why they refuse to follow the law and merge as Berger made law. I would rather have a health care facility in operation that turns its profit to community service then to bloat the pay and benefits of its employees.

Its very obvious that ECMC is desperate to keep "business as usual". The CEO must be a republican.

[MARIE]

Sweetpea wrote:

ECMC drains millions of taxpayer dollars and Kaleida Health, without the benefit of the taxpayers turned .

Unfortunately, it's the uninsured and underinsured that drain the county, and taxpayers, me included of millions of dollars through the Medicaid program and ECMC is still seen as the 'county hospital' and place to go if you don't have insurance. Not saying that everyone shouldn't have access to healthcare but those patients are going to have to be served at some hospital and tax dollars are still going to be paying the bill.
Every hospital in this area has debt... whether through loans from private corporations or the state loans. And in closing any hospital, those debts will need to be paid off... and how do you pay a debt when you're not bringing in any money? Closing any hospital will not be immediate, it will be a slow death. And pateints will need to go somewhere else so accomodations need to be made. If a hospital that has 100 ER patients a day closes, can you imagine the backlog at the other hospitals as well as tying up ambulances for hours on end.

I agree that something should be done about ending the public benefit corp but again, this was recommended by Berger and Newco decided they just didn't want to fight that fight so they were gonna work something else out on their terms. They're picking and choosing what they want to do as they go along and I wonder if they're giving it the consideration a lot of the public has been.

[SomeFacts]

ECMC payment structure is 50% State and 50% County. They get payed.
Kaleida lost 21 million last year to the uninsured and under insured. This is projected to rise to 27 million this year.

MARIE wrote:

<quoted text>
Unfortunately, it's the uninsured and underinsured that drain the county, and taxpayers, me included of millions of dollars through the Medicaid program and ECMC is still seen as the 'county hospital' and place to go if you don't have insurance. Not saying that everyone shouldn't have access to healthcare but those patients are going to have to be served at some hospital and tax dollars are still going to be paying the bill.
Every hospital in this area has debt... whether through loans from private corporations or the state loans. And in closing any hospital, those debts will need to be paid off... and how do you pay a debt when you're not bringing in any money? Closing any hospital will not be immediate, it will be a slow death. And pateints will need to go somewhere else so accomodations need to be made. If a hospital that has 100 ER patients a day closes, can you imagine the backlog at the other hospitals as well as tying up ambulances for hours on end.
I agree that something should be done about ending the public benefit corp but again, this was recommended by Berger and Newco decided they just didn't want to fight that fight so they were gonna work something else out on their terms. They're picking and choosing what they want to do as they go along and I wonder if they're giving it the consideration a lot of the public has been.

[Concerned Taxpayer]

Too many hospitals are the City time to consolidate. Who can afford to be in a city hositpal when it's so costly to park your car. This will also eliminate the over staffed nurses who are over paid and keep the ones who really want to care for the patients. Next hire a staff that can actually do the correct billing for the hospitals. This will save the county and the taxpayers money.

[Tony]

Tell me oh great knowledge ones JUST WHY does ERIE county need to be in business of health care when people are vacating ??
GIAMBRA MADE A DEAL WITH ECMC TO BAIL OUT THE COUNTY AND THAT DEBT IS STILL BEING PAID BACK, BY LEGAL AGREEMENT THAT MUST HAVE LOOKED GOOD TO HIM AT THE TIME. THANK HIM FOR THE MESS.

let the other hospitals take over it will saveyou taxes
YOU WILL STILL HAVE TO PAY TAXES TO COVER MEDICAID AND RETIREE HEALTH FOR PEOPLE WHO RETIRE BEFORE YOU CLOSE ECMC, IF YOU DO. SO NO REAL SAVINGS THERE.

As for DeGRaff it was to close but lo & behold they were allowed to get beds Anything in ECCH (ECMC?) can be moved to any other hospital
INCLUDING CARE FOR THE INDIGENT AND THEN THAT HOSPITAL WILL NEED YOUR TAXES TO PAY FOR THIER CARE.

SO WHERE IS THE SAVINGS?

[Laurie14779]

Close Buffalo General. I have heard nothinbg but horror stories from people that have been treated there. Keep ECMC open - they saved my husband's life

[Your Name Here]

How about reporting some facts so the people can make informed decisions?

Are these facilities being supported with tax dollars and if so, how much? Are they making a profit? At what capacity are they being used? Who owns the hospitals?

[funnyguy]

OUCH i jist hit the point key & need hospitalization now which one do I go to ??? there are so many its hard to chose ouch

[funnyguy]

[QUOTE who="Tony"
Tell me oh great knowledge ones JUST WHY does ERIE county need to be in business of health care when people are vacating ??
GIAMBRA MADE A DEAL WITH ECMC TO BAIL OUT THE COUNTY AND THAT DEBT IS STILL BEING PAID BACK, BY LEGAL AGREEMENT THAT MUST HAVE LOOKED GOOD TO HIM AT THE TIME. THANK HIM FOR THE MESS.
let the other hospitals take over it will saveyou taxes
YOU WILL STILL HAVE TO PAY TAXES TO COVER MEDICAID AND RETIREE HEALTH FOR PEOPLE WHO RETIRE BEFORE YOU CLOSE ECMC, IF YOU DO. SO NO REAL SAVINGS THERE.
As for DeGRaff it was to close but lo & behold they were allowed to get beds Anything in ECCH (ECMC?) can be moved to any other hospital
INCLUDING CARE FOR THE INDIGENT AND THEN THAT HOSPITAL WILL NEED YOUR TAXES TO PAY FOR THIER CARE.
SO WHERE IS THE SAVINGS?
[/QUOTE]THERE is the rebutal like I said

[know the facts]

i think that many of the tax-payers should get the facts befor deciding and not listen to people who dont have a clue. house keeping, enviromental services, patient transporters, groundskeepers, and general laborers start off at a whopping $11.15 an hour and after 20 years they can make it up to the big money approx.$15.00 an hour. maintenance workers start off at $12.30 an hour and after 20 years they will be at an unheard of cost almost $16.70 an hour. skilled tradesmen at journeyman level they make the big bucks they start off at $14.15 an hour and make it all the way up to $20.30 an hour after 20 something years. outside non union tradesmen with journeyman type knowledge start of at the $18.00-$20.00 an hour range, journeyman tradesman from the union sector make $30.00 an hour. the rns are in the $22.00-$23.00 dollar an hour range which from my understanding is about $10.00-$15.00 dollars an hour less than the other hospitals. wow those people at ecmcc are really overpaid huh. ecmcc cant get qualified nures to work and stay there they are constantly loosing them and hiring new ones you would think with them great benefits it would be easy. when they run ads to get skilled trades workers the people laugh and say no thank you when they find out what the rate of pay is. if you took the difference in pay and the money value difference in benefits the nurses at the other hospitals would end up with a better retirement $12.00 an hour more is 24,000 a year put it into a retirement account even with no interest that is 240,000.00 ever 10 years after 30 years of service that would be 720,000.00 plus interest by the way thats better than what the ecmcc nures would get. the union tradesmen benefits are better than those at ecmcc and their pay is double. so i quess people should know what they are talking about befor they say how overpaid all the county workers are. there is without doubt a lot of waste in government but that waste is not on the backs of the working stiffs i would say lets look at the ones who drive county cars or have people drive them or make enough to buy there prostitutes!

[learn your facts]

lt stauffiger wrote:

is this guy kidding?
theres not enough ambulances to staff the city as it is - what does he think will happen with a hospital closure? wake up Collins!!!!!!!!

the ambulances have nothing to do with the hospitals.
It's a totally different company. Maybe you should call Rural Metro and tell them to increase their fleet size.
As for the hospitals: the population is HALF the size it was 30 years ago but we still have the same amount of hospital beds. With many duplication of services. This drives the price of health care up.
That's the whole reason for the Berger Commission telling the region to close facilities.