Melanie Leneghan Incoming Liberty Twp...
get real

Bucyrus, OH

#283 Sep 4, 2012
The REAL reality of it wrote:
<quoted text>
Ahem. They work in 24 hour shifts and then get then next 48 hours off. So that also means if they worked 48-72 hours on duty in a week, they get 120-96 hours off in that same week. Who the hell else gets that? Let's not pretned they are working the whole time either, because they are not. Just go ask the one of them!
Ahem,Ahem!!! Let's do the math. Working 8to 5, 5 days a week,= 40 hours. Working 8 to 5 is an 8 hour workday and 1 unpaid hour for lunch. Working 8 to 5 leaves you with 15 hours off plus your lunch = 16 hours per day off. 16 hours per day x 5 days = 80 hours off. Oh, and add the weekends 2 x 24 = 48 more hours. Total hours off work during a week = 128. That's who the h___ else. It's just a different schedule is all. Oh yea, don't forget to add in those 24 hour holidays an 8 to 5er doesn't have to work but a firefighter does, if it falls on his shift.
Costly Benefits

Tempe, AZ

#284 Sep 4, 2012
Firefighters/EMS retiring at age 48 will cost Liberty Township at least $1.2 million per person for pension benefits/medical coverage between the ages of 48 and 65. This is an outlandish cost which cannot be sustained. Changes must be made e.g. delaying the retirement age to 55 with reduced benefits which increase each year retirement is delayed beyond 55; elimination of paid medical benefits between the ages of 48 and 65. The only way to make these changes happen is to VOTE NO on the levy.And we wonder why they want an additional $2.5 million per year in property taxes
I am for the levy

Ashville, OH

#285 Sep 4, 2012
Costly Benefits wrote:
Firefighters/EMS retiring at age 48 will cost Liberty Township at least $1.2 million per person for pension benefits/medical coverage between the ages of 48 and 65. This is an outlandish cost which cannot be sustained. Changes must be made e.g. delaying the retirement age to 55 with reduced benefits which increase each year retirement is delayed beyond 55; elimination of paid medical benefits between the ages of 48 and 65. The only way to make these changes happen is to VOTE NO on the levy.And we wonder why they want an additional $2.5 million per year in property taxes
And all these issues are contract issues, that have to be addressed with the union. Voting down the levy is not going to get the contract changed.

As I have said before, Melanie and Peggy, we are on to you. This is outrageous conduct. I don't care what your agenda is, in the end you will not prevail.

Why anyone would vote for either one of you baffles me. It is clear you don't care about the residents, you are in this for yourselves. Prior trustees have worked for the residents, making this a better place to live. All we got from one term of Guzzo, is a union for the township employees, and a CEDA dispute with Powell that has cost the township plenty. That is not what I would call progress.

Curt Sybert, Mary Carducci and Bob Mann have worked tirelessly to make Liberty a better place to live. That is the kind of trustee we need. Not one who is divisive. Not one who refuses to listen. Not one who refuses to work with the other trustees.

The last thing this township needs is Melanie and Peggy in charge. They are a train wreck. There is no question in my mind they will create havoc with the employees, and get the township in unnecessary legal battles that we can ill afford. Ladies, your style of my way of the highway is not helpful.
The Days Are Gone

Egg Harbor Township, NJ

#286 Sep 4, 2012
when all you had to do was put a Fire Levy on the ballot and assume it would pass. If there was any opposition it was met with fear mongering, claims of increased insurance, etc.All that is being asked by those in opposition to the November Levy is change,change in the unsustainable pension/ health benefits, change in the current double taxation for EMS service, change by bringing in those skilled in lean studies to streamline the Fire Department, change in policy on requiring the fire chief and staff to live and pay property taxes in Liberty Township or at the least Delaware County, change to shorten the duration of any levy to two years to allow voters the opportunity to scrutinize the expenditures,. If this levy passes, one thing for sure the Fire Chief and Trustees will go back to their same old same old and ignore the voters for another five years. Difficult financial times require leaders who are willing to make the hard decisions. Placing a levy on the ballot which will increase the 2013 and beyond budgets from $6 million to $8.5 million is the gutless way .
Makes no sense

Columbus, OH

#287 Sep 4, 2012
Costly Benefits wrote:
Firefighters/EMS retiring at age 48 will cost Liberty Township at least $1.2 million per person for pension benefits/medical coverage between the ages of 48 and 65. This is an outlandish cost which cannot be sustained. Changes must be made e.g. delaying the retirement age to 55 with reduced benefits which increase each year retirement is delayed beyond 55; elimination of paid medical benefits between the ages of 48 and 65. The only way to make these changes happen is to VOTE NO on the levy.And we wonder why they want an additional $2.5 million per year in property taxes
Your post makes absolutely no sense. First, these are all set at the state level by Ohio law and can't be changed by a local municipality. So for you to think that voting no for your local fire department will get this done, you are wrong! Second, where do you get the 1.2 million per person? That number is nowhere close to what is paid into the firefighters pension. I work with public pension funds and the average firefighter or police officer is not even close to a half million dollars over their career that is paid into their pension fund, which is mandated by a state law. Third, you obviously do not follow politics because as of right now, Sept 12 is the hearing date for changing these pension laws in Ohio for all the pension systems and in it includes raising the firefighter retirement age, and increasing the pension cost on the firefighters. It is a good thing for tax payers but I certainly do not want a 55 year old firefighter to attempt to rescue my family.

Also, everything I have read about the Liberty Township fire department shows they have been operating with the use of their past carry-overs. Looks like the extra $2.5 million more will help get them back to the proper funding levels. The cost of everything has gone up over the past 10 years and your fire taxes has dropped over the past 10 years! I would be proud of that, it says a lot about your local officials. I wish my local department could say the same.

It is reassuring to know that no matter how the public or local bloggers feel about their firefighters, I am sure that they will continue to serve you regardless of your support or not.
Makes no sense

Columbus, OH

#288 Sep 4, 2012
The Days Are Gone wrote:
when all you had to do was put a Fire Levy on the ballot and assume it would pass. If there was any opposition it was met with fear mongering, claims of increased insurance, etc.All that is being asked by those in opposition to the November Levy is change,change in the unsustainable pension/ health benefits, change in the current double taxation for EMS service, change by bringing in those skilled in lean studies to streamline the Fire Department, change in policy on requiring the fire chief and staff to live and pay property taxes in Liberty Township or at the least Delaware County, change to shorten the duration of any levy to two years to allow voters the opportunity to scrutinize the expenditures,. If this levy passes, one thing for sure the Fire Chief and Trustees will go back to their same old same old and ignore the voters for another five years. Difficult financial times require leaders who are willing to make the hard decisions. Placing a levy on the ballot which will increase the 2013 and beyond budgets from $6 million to $8.5 million is the gutless way .
Really? Show me the difficult financial time! Did I not just read last week in the Gazette that Delaware County is on record sales tax pace and they have the lowest unemployment rate in Ohio? Is Powell not the 11th wealthiest city in Ohio? Are people still buying and building in Powell? According to the Olentangy Valley News, 550 new townhome apartments coming to Powell. I fail to see the difficult financial times, so please quit using it as an excuse. If it was truly that bad, maybe you should have let Wal-Mart build, that would of created a whole lot more jobs for the township. Any community that can afford to fight a corporation from coming into their area cannot cry about a bad economy.

I also fail to see the double taxation. Does Delaware County not pay Liberty Township for every EMS call they take? So the residents are getting their money in return, no double taxation there. If it is not enough, then maybe the trustees should approach the county about getting more money per run. I have worked and helped manage local governments that have both fire-based EMS and separate departments. Believe me, you get so much more bang for your buck with fire-based EMS and there are hundreds of studies available on the internet to support this. EMS can only do EMS. Firefighter/Paramedics can do so much more, from Haz-Mat calls to rescue emergencies and from fire fighting to prevention and education. Why do people bundle their services in their personal lives? Because they can get so much more for their dollar when they combine their cable, phone and internet into one instead of having a separate company handling each. Isn't that what Gov Kasich wants, less government agencies that can do more?
Makes no sense

Columbus, OH

#289 Sep 4, 2012
The REAL reality of it wrote:
<quoted text>
Ahem. They work in 24 hour shifts and then get then next 48 hours off. So that also means if they worked 48-72 hours on duty in a week, they get 120-96 hours off in that same week. Who the hell else gets that? Let's not pretned they are working the whole time either, because they are not. Just go ask the one of them!
The average firefighter in central Ohio that works a 24-48 schedule works 2912 hours a year and they work every Holiday that falls on their shift. The 40 hour a week employee works 2080 hours a year and most get all Holidays off. 2912-2080=832 hours or an extra 35 days more per year away from their families than those of us who are privileged to work 40 hours a week. I am grateful for the sacrifice that are made by my local firefighters and their spouses and children, especially those that have to work Christmas or Thanksgiving so I can rest easy with my family knowing that if I need them on those days, they are there! The least I can do is support them when they need me. If I have issues with politicians, I take it up with the politicians. I certainly do not take it out on those who serve and sacrifice so much for me and my family.
Makes no sense

Columbus, OH

#290 Sep 4, 2012
Wake up wrote:
Thank you for making my point for me, get real. wWs are already taxed to death on stuff we don't need or want or are threatened into voting yes. Most people in Powell pay an income tax of 2.5% to the City of Columbus, which we didn't get to vote for, an additional income tax to the City of Powell, taxes to Liberty Township, taxes to the county and taxes to the schools, let alone state and federal income taxes, FICA, unemployment insurance, etc. So again, I thank you for making my point for me.
That is what you get when you choose to block commercial growth from coming into your community. You have to work somewhere! Can you imagine the income tax base from a big box retailer in Powell? Not to mention how they would share a majority of your property tax, which means a reduction in the amount of taxes you would pay for fire and EMS! By living in a upscale bedroom community, it is now you and your neighbor that shares the tax cost, the same tax cost that you and your neighbors have all voted for with the multiple school levies. You get what you pay for, you want great schools, great safety services, then quit crying when it's time to support them financially and you have no other help because you don't want commercial growth.
Separate Levys

Tempe, AZ

#291 Sep 4, 2012
After the Levy is defeated the way to go is a separate levy for Fire and another one for EMS. Over 58% of the locals believe that they are taking home less money than they did four years ago. Tell those homeowners struggling to make house payments and on the brink of foreclosure that they need to pay more property taxes. People are getting sick and tired of getting a yearly escrow increase from their lender.The old it is only $10-20 more per month from government officials is a bunch of malarky because every special interest taxation levy MRDD, parks, fire, schools, etc adds up. Why can't local governments live within there means or if they must increase confine the increase to that in social security Cuts in budgets can be made just look how much Olentangy Schools has cut from their budget in the last year. Kind of makes you wonder how flush the district finances were actually.

The amount Delaware County reimburses Liberty for EMS does not come close to covering the excessive cost per EMS run for Liberty Township($4.2Million for EMS out of a $6million dollar budget). Why are the costs so high? One reason is that liberty Township has half the runs of Delaware City and a whole bunch of idle time . Delaware City has a slightly higher population but gets more bang for their buck.

Each voter should ask themselves how many times in the 30 year period of a mortgage do they expect to call 911 for fire or ems?? Balance that against how much money you will pay over 30 years and run the numbers how much money you would have after 30 years if you invested the ems property taxes rather than having that money involuntarily taken from your paycheck in the form of property tax.
Makes no sense

Columbus, OH

#292 Sep 4, 2012
Separate Levys wrote:
After the Levy is defeated the way to go is a separate levy for Fire and another one for EMS. Over 58% of the locals believe that they are taking home less money than they did four years ago. Tell those homeowners struggling to make house payments and on the brink of foreclosure that they need to pay more property taxes. People are getting sick and tired of getting a yearly escrow increase from their lender.The old it is only $10-20 more per month from government officials is a bunch of malarky because every special interest taxation levy MRDD, parks, fire, schools, etc adds up. Why can't local governments live within there means or if they must increase confine the increase to that in social security Cuts in budgets can be made just look how much Olentangy Schools has cut from their budget in the last year. Kind of makes you wonder how flush the district finances were actually.
The amount Delaware County reimburses Liberty for EMS does not come close to covering the excessive cost per EMS run for Liberty Township($4.2Million for EMS out of a $6million dollar budget). Why are the costs so high? One reason is that liberty Township has half the runs of Delaware City and a whole bunch of idle time . Delaware City has a slightly higher population but gets more bang for their buck.
Each voter should ask themselves how many times in the 30 year period of a mortgage do they expect to call 911 for fire or ems?? Balance that against how much money you will pay over 30 years and run the numbers how much money you would have after 30 years if you invested the ems property taxes rather than having that money involuntarily taken from your paycheck in the form of property tax.
If 58% are bringing home less now, which they aren't they just believe they are because things cost more, why don't they cut as well. Start with selling their house or not purchasing one that is going to cost so much that it puts them on the brink of foreclosure. Maybe not go out and purchase that new vehicle when the one you have works just fine. If they know they won't be able to afford it, no one is forcing them to live in one of the wealthiest communities in Ohio with the best school district in the state. Why can't local governments live within their means, that's simple, cost of operation continues to rise. Why can't people live within their means, because the cost of food, insurance and gas continue to increase. Same idea! If I am not able to afford to feed my family, then I will find another source of income versus trying to cut one of my kids out of my family picture. Local governments are the same, you must provide the service and the cost of that service continues to rise. Eventually you will need another more income or find another source. If the people of Liberty Township feel they don't want to pay more for fire and EMS then they must be ok with an all volunteer or part-time paid fire department. It's a simple choice.

By the way, according to the US Bureau or Labor and Statistics, the average Delaware County employee has seen their wages increase from $67,348 a year in Jan 2008 to $76,918 in Sept of 2011. That represents roughly a 15% increase over 3 and a half years, or just over 4% a year. So the belief of the 58% is simply a belief, not the truth.

Why don't each voter ask themselves "how many times am I going to use my homeowners insurance policy of the life of my 30 year mortgage?" Chances are very little, so maybe I can go without. Your local fire department is an insurance policy that communities must have. What if you are in a accident and it's not even your fault. Will you not need Fire and EMS? The cost of a life saving insurance policy is a whole lot cheaper than the cost of an insurance policy that would replace your belongings only.
Assume the Risk

Toronto, Canada

#293 Sep 4, 2012
Just like with medical insurance many are willing to take the risk and not purchase medical insurance. A good solution is a stand alone fire department and having Delaware County provide EMS .Delaware County has already indicated that should the levy fail they will cover Liberty Township. I'll take that risk along with mutual aide until a fire only levy can be passed in February.
Makes no sense

Columbus, OH

#294 Sep 4, 2012
Assume the Risk wrote:
Just like with medical insurance many are willing to take the risk and not purchase medical insurance. A good solution is a stand alone fire department and having Delaware County provide EMS .Delaware County has already indicated that should the levy fail they will cover Liberty Township. I'll take that risk along with mutual aide until a fire only levy can be passed in February.
Along with assuming the risk, you also assume that you will get mutual aid. Most mutual aid is a 2-way street, you must give to receive. If Liberty Township has nothing to give, then other departments will be less likely to provide assistance. How is that fair to their citizens. Typical Liberty Township residents wanting something for nothing or at the cost to others. How is that fair for Concord or Washington Township residents? I would be livid if I was a trustee for those townships thinking my staff and vehicles will be taking several runs a day into Liberty Township and leaving their own taxpayers unprotected.

Also, nowhere has Delaware County come out and stated they could cover Liberty Township with the same level of service currently being provided. Everything I have read stated that Chief Farmer MAY be able to provide an EMS vehicle, but he stated in the OVN that it would not be the same level that Liberty residents are use to. As for the county commissioners, they haven't even commented on the issue because they know in order to provide Liberty with 2 trucks, they would need to pull 2 vehicles from other county locations and that would not be fair to the other citizens.

You are assuming a whole hell of a lot thinking this way! I am so grateful that the citizens in my community back our fire and EMS and passed a tax increase to avoid using other surrounding departments. Go to youtube and watch how fast fire doubles in a structure and ask yourself if you would want to wait the extra 5-7 minutes for a mutaul aid truck, that is if you even have one coming.
No Trust Trustees

Toronto, Canada

#295 Sep 4, 2012
These are the same two individuals who cost the township hundred's of thousands if not millions of dollars with their failed Walmart litigation. While some of the costs may be absorbed by insurance, premiums will surely rise and there is the lost taxes factor, etc. So if these two individuals lawyers did not know what they were doing on the Walmart issue how can we trust that they know much about cost savings and finances when it comes to the Fire Department and EMS.
Seems like they were running scared of the Fire chief and did not want to go against the grain. homework. Once burned by Chuck Davis they did they easiest thing put a 42% tax increase on the ballot as an all or nothing proposition, literally jamming it to the taxpayers. Vote NO NO NO.
Makes no sense

Columbus, OH

#296 Sep 4, 2012
No Trust Trustees wrote:
These are the same two individuals who cost the township hundred's of thousands if not millions of dollars with their failed Walmart litigation. While some of the costs may be absorbed by insurance, premiums will surely rise and there is the lost taxes factor, etc. So if these two individuals lawyers did not know what they were doing on the Walmart issue how can we trust that they know much about cost savings and finances when it comes to the Fire Department and EMS.
Seems like they were running scared of the Fire chief and did not want to go against the grain. homework. Once burned by Chuck Davis they did they easiest thing put a 42% tax increase on the ballot as an all or nothing proposition, literally jamming it to the taxpayers. Vote NO NO NO.
If I remember right, it was all 3 trustees that wanted Wal-mart out and the whole Wal-mart case began long before Sybert and Carducci were even in office. So the blame does not fall solely on them. Even if they were the ones to blame, they were simply doing the will of the "Wedgewood" people, so to say they did not know what they were doing is wrong. They were doing what they were "elected" to do, that is to stop big-box retailers, thus stopping tax generators all while using tax payers money to do so.

To say they were running scared of the fire chief and did not want to go against the grain is ridiculous. Why would you go against the fire chief? Township trustees know nothing about running a fire department. Why do you think they have a fire chief? The chief figures how much money he is going to need to "maintain" current operations and tells the trustees what it will cost and then the fiscal officer figures out how many mills that will take. Why would you not listen to the fire chief? If you ask me, I would not want my fire department to "maintain", but to advance in the next 5 years. Advancing your fire and EMS services only does good things for a community. A community or its leaders that do not listen to the chief obviously knows what it takes to run a fire department. So why don't you step up and apply for the job! I am grateful for elected officials that listen to those they appoint. What good is it if you are paying an employee of your company to do a specific job and then not let them do their job or not listen to them in their field of expertise? Talk about a waste of money! Why don't you get rid our your fire chief and let the trustees run the department? Oh, yeah, that's right...they don't have a clue on what it takes to manage a fire department or run command of a fire or mass casualty scene. That's why we have fire chiefs! Listen to them!

As for the 42%, after reading this article...
http://www.thisweeknews.com/content/stories/h...
it is quite obvious that the Liberty Township residents are getting a steal for their tax dollars when it comes to Fire and EMS protection.
Senseless Levy

Tempe, AZ

#298 Sep 5, 2012
Giving the Fire/EMS an aditional $2.5 million in 2013 and each of the next five years means one thing, the money will be burning a hole in their pocket and they will hire more personnel for an already bloated department. Next salaries and benefits will be increased as evidenced by the doubling of Yamaricks salary. He is now the highest paid medical director in the area and for what doing" more things". Then there will be the purchase of the latest gadgets and a token fire truck or two or three and don't forget the Chief and his staff will need new peronsal vehicles as well. And the second thing for sure the current Trustee majority will rubber stamp any requests for carte blanche spending. The taxpayers are tapped out we need to take a stand. It is not the end of the world if we defeat this Levy. They always come back with another one and most of the time it is more rationale and for less money..
get real

Bucyrus, OH

#299 Sep 6, 2012
No Trust Trustees wrote:
These are the same two individuals who cost the township hundred's of thousands if not millions of dollars with their failed Walmart litigation. While some of the costs may be absorbed by insurance, premiums will surely rise and there is the lost taxes factor, etc. So if these two individuals lawyers did not know what they were doing on the Walmart issue how can we trust that they know much about cost savings and finances when it comes to the Fire Department and EMS.
Seems like they were running scared of the Fire chief and did not want to go against the grain. homework. Once burned by Chuck Davis they did they easiest thing put a 42% tax increase on the ballot as an all or nothing proposition, literally jamming it to the taxpayers. Vote NO NO NO.
Who insisted the township fight to keep Walmart out?(hint: they live mostly in a subdivision beginning with a "W") Who were the trustees when that happened?(hint: none are in office now) Who is this Chuck Davis who burned somebody? Whom did he burn?(no hints for these last 2 cause I have no idea what you're talking about and obviously neither do you. You're just spewing out more intentional misinformation and misdirection).
get real

Bucyrus, OH

#300 Sep 6, 2012
Senseless Levy wrote:
Giving the Fire/EMS an aditional $2.5 million in 2013 and each of the next five years means one thing, the money will be burning a hole in their pocket and they will hire more personnel for an already bloated department. Next salaries and benefits will be increased as evidenced by the doubling of Yamaricks salary. He is now the highest paid medical director in the area and for what doing" more things". Then there will be the purchase of the latest gadgets and a token fire truck or two or three and don't forget the Chief and his staff will need new peronsal vehicles as well. And the second thing for sure the current Trustee majority will rubber stamp any requests for carte blanche spending. The taxpayers are tapped out we need to take a stand. It is not the end of the world if we defeat this Levy. They always come back with another one and most of the time it is more rationale and for less money..
Please tell, who "always comes back wth another" fire levy that's "more rationale and for less money"? Never seen one fail here before. Of course, never seen this kind of politicized smear campaign over our fire and ems future services, either. Those "latest gadgets" and "token firetrucks" aren't just for show as you are implying. Here's some more spewing out intentional misinformation this is becoming so childish and if it weren't for the seriousness of the harmful end you're hoping to accomplish, it would be funny. Right now it's just plain scary that you are able to lie so easily. Do you sleep well? I wonder how well you would sleep if you knew you had a part in demolishing our fire and ems protection?
It Is The Benefits

Tempe, AZ

#301 Sep 6, 2012
Lavish pension and health benefits for firefighter/EMS personnel are not sustainable. Give me a break $21,310 of pension contributions on a $66.596 avg salary, plus non disclosed health care cost of say $8,000-10,000 per firefighter/EMS family with only a $1-2k deductible.( Most private employers have gone to a $5,000 deductible)

The majority of taxpaying property owners would love to have such liberal benefits. It is time for a change. The movement can start in Liberty township and other communities, by voting down excessive levy's. Then watch the unions cry when their jobs are in jeopardy. If we continue with the same old same old our kids and grand kids can look forward to being another California or even Greece.

JUST SAY NO to the 42% Fire Levy INCREASE IN OUR Property Taxes
Public Servants

Netherlands

#302 Sep 6, 2012
It does not seem right for public servants to have better benefits than those in the private sector who pay their salaries.
get real

Bucyrus, OH

#303 Sep 6, 2012
Public Servants wrote:
It does not seem right for public servants to have better benefits than those in the private sector who pay their salaries.
OH my. The term public servants disappeared long years ago. Are are public employees. So, how much would you charge to run into a burning house to rescue someone you didn't know? What risks are you willing to take? Would you be willing to do that on your salary as a private sector employee? Prob not! My bet's with the trained professionals. If you appreciate what they do and what they are trained to do and what they are willing to do for us then support them!

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