Marriage licenses now available in NH for gays

Gay couples can now apply for marriage licenses in New Hampshire -- though the unions can't be performed until Jan.

[religion kills]

Progress....in spite of being fought every step of the way by religious idealogues.
Today the house passed ENDA!...finally. of course there was a lot of opposition, but the Family Research Council summed up why we have these infantile fights: "we are going to fight this in the courts, there is not enough protection for religion". Yep, you heard it, the good people trying to protect our values want to make sure that priests can incite violence freely. You've got to wonder why these people get any funding given what they say, PUBLICLY.
Oh well, today is a good day, we have won something that has been 22 years in the coming.

[PENNY]

I wish to congratulate all those who are preparing to enter into marriage, in NH or in any other place on this planet, whatever their gender preferences are. My wish to all is a long happy life together!

[PENNY]

religion kills wrote:

Progress....in spite of being fought every step of the way by religious idealogues.
Today the house passed ENDA!...finally. of course there was a lot of opposition, but the Family Research Council summed up why we have these infantile fights: "we are going to fight this in the courts, there is not enough protection for religion". Yep, you heard it, the good people trying to protect our values want to make sure that priests can incite violence freely. You've got to wonder why these people get any funding given what they say, PUBLICLY.
Oh well, today is a good day, we have won something that has been 22 years in the coming.

I have never understood why someone else's religious values have to be made everyone's values, by law, by gum! Each person in this country has the freedom to hold to their own religious truths, and my hope is that the courts will agree to not hold everyone hostage to those "truths." I am pleased that the House has passed ENDA. No person should be be discriminated against at work based on something as personal as his/her partner preferences. Yes, today is a good day...for liberty.

[religion kills]

PENNY wrote:

<quoted text>
I have never understood why someone else's religious values have to be made everyone's values, by law, by gum! Each person in this country has the freedom to hold to their own religious truths, and my hope is that the courts will agree to not hold everyone hostage to those "truths." I am pleased that the House has passed ENDA. No person should be be discriminated against at work based on something as personal as his/her partner preferences. Yes, today is a good day...for liberty.

Unfortunately I was mistaken...it was hate crimes, not ENDA, that was passed. But, thanks for the encouragement.

People continue to ask me why I'm against religion, even when it is clear I am being personally attacked by religion. Some say it is not the attackers, it is just the leadership of some sects. I totally disagree, of course.

The issue of equal rights is huge...hugely important and I am appalled that something as simple and seemingly (on face value) as beautiful as the concept of religion is being used to take away people's rights (I read a quote today...a woman with religious reasons for being against marriage equality in maine told an activist "I simply don't want you to have what I have." How selfish).

But the religion question is unfortunately much, much bigger than that question of equal rights. Even in so-called gay-friendly churches, parishoners fear of death is being used to make them do the work of the church leadership, which is basically cult-building.

I wish people who chose to worship would do it privately and would abide by the generally societal-affirming moral codes. It is when they try to say their moral code is the only one, or worse, it is better than another, that we have these issues.

I would challenge any of these do-gooders to put their record of honesty, integrity and hard work against mine or my family's. We've seen the results of this type of effort play out in the press all too often in the form of ugly tail spins into tragedy and scandal.

You said it best. Something to continue to hope for.

[Chelmsford Kid]

Religion was formed by uneducated ignorant man to try and explain the world around him as well as construct laws to lawless societies.

Within the last 100 years much of civilization has realized that religion has no basis in reality or science.

Religion has absolutely no right to interfere with the laws of a nation. They are simply a private club that you choose to join or choose not to join. Their club rules are only applicable to club members within the confines of their club houses and churches and within the confines of their homes.

The problem is that these religious clubs are trying to push their religious agendas on non club members within society.

Of course we are starting to see progress in the squashing of human rights violations that these clubs have been allowed to impose on mankind for years.

We are seeing the more educated states realize this and begin to end human rights violations. It's always the most educated that lead the way hence New England is where it begins.

Massachusetts
"By the Sword We Seek Peace, But Peace Only Under Liberty"
New Hampshire
"Live Free or Die"

[TRICK FLOWER]

religion kills wrote:

<quoted text>
Unfortunately I was mistaken...it was hate crimes, not ENDA, that was passed. But, thanks for the encouragement.
People continue to ask me why I'm against religion, even when it is clear I am being personally attacked by religion. Some say it is not the attackers, it is just the leadership of some sects. I totally disagree, of course.
The issue of equal rights is huge...hugely important and I am appalled that something as simple and seemingly (on face value) as beautiful as the concept of religion is being used to take away people's rights (I read a quote today...a woman with religious reasons for being against marriage equality in maine told an activist "I simply don't want you to have what I have." How selfish).
But the religion question is unfortunately much, much bigger than that question of equal rights. Even in so-called gay-friendly churches, parishoners fear of death is being used to make them do the work of the church leadership, which is basically cult-building.
I wish people who chose to worship would do it privately and would abide by the generally societal-affirming moral codes. It is when they try to say their moral code is the only one, or worse, it is better than another, that we have these issues.
I would challenge any of these do-gooders to put their record of honesty, integrity and hard work against mine or my family's. We've seen the results of this type of effort play out in the press all too often in the form of ugly tail spins into tragedy and scandal.
You said it best. Something to continue to hope for.

If my religious leader told me something was against God, I have the options of either going with that, or disagreeing and taking another path. Therefore, it is not the religious leaders who are at fault for people denigrating same-sex marriage; it is the responsibility of each of us to form our own beliefs. Frankly, Whomever the guy up the street marries is not any of my business and affects my life not one whit, unless the individuals involved wish to include me in their happiness! How much do those denigraters (I do not include that nut, Phelps here) think their God would approve of the murders of gay people? How can anyone believe God would approve of this? Equal rights is a Constitutional issue, not a moral one. Even if I were the most avid gay-hater, I could not deny any person in this country the same Constitutional rights others have. Nor can I understand why some people simply cannot see it that way!

[Peppy]

religion kills wrote:

Progress....in spite of being fought every step of the way by religious idealogues.
Today the house passed ENDA!...finally. of course there was a lot of opposition, but the Family Research Council summed up why we have these infantile fights: "we are going to fight this in the courts, there is not enough protection for religion". Yep, you heard it, the good people trying to protect our values want to make sure that priests can incite violence freely. You've got to wonder why these people get any funding given what they say, PUBLICLY.
Oh well, today is a good day, we have won something that has been 22 years in the coming.

Next up RK is the Maine gay marriage referendum. I will be interested to see how the vote comes out.

[TRICK FLOWER]

religion kills wrote:

<quoted text>
Unfortunately I was mistaken...it was hate crimes, not ENDA, that was passed. But, thanks for the encouragement.
People continue to ask me why I'm against religion, even when it is clear I am being personally attacked by religion. Some say it is not the attackers, it is just the leadership of some sects. I totally disagree, of course.
The issue of equal rights is huge...hugely important and I am appalled that something as simple and seemingly (on face value) as beautiful as the concept of religion is being used to take away people's rights (I read a quote today...a woman with religious reasons for being against marriage equality in maine told an activist "I simply don't want you to have what I have." How selfish).
But the religion question is unfortunately much, much bigger than that question of equal rights. Even in so-called gay-friendly churches, parishoners fear of death is being used to make them do the work of the church leadership, which is basically cult-building.
I wish people who chose to worship would do it privately and would abide by the generally societal-affirming moral codes. It is when they try to say their moral code is the only one, or worse, it is better than another, that we have these issues.
I would challenge any of these do-gooders to put their record of honesty, integrity and hard work against mine or my family's. We've seen the results of this type of effort play out in the press all too often in the form of ugly tail spins into tragedy and scandal.
You said it best. Something to continue to hope for.

Error forgiven! I didn't even have the sense to check it out. LOL Now, what we have to deal with is whether and when our President/glorious leader of our military will do as he has promised, and actually do away with DADT! That has to be the silliest rule ever brought about in this country. You can be gay and enlist, just don't mention it to anyone. How on God's green planet does that give added protection to the U.S.?! Anyone who wants to enlist (even if I don't get it) ought to be able to enlist "as is" and merely obey the same rules and laws everyone else does. Kinda like people! Geez!

[religion kills]

TRICK FLOWER wrote:

<quoted text> If my religious leader told me something was against God, I have the options of either going with that, or disagreeing and taking another path. Therefore, it is not the religious leaders who are at fault for people denigrating same-sex marriage; it is the responsibility of each of us to form our own beliefs. Frankly, Whomever the guy up the street marries is not any of my business and affects my life not one whit, unless the individuals involved wish to include me in their happiness! How much do those denigraters (I do not include that nut, Phelps here) think their God would approve of the murders of gay people? How can anyone believe God would approve of this? Equal rights is a Constitutional issue, not a moral one. Even if I were the most avid gay-hater, I could not deny any person in this country the same Constitutional rights others have. Nor can I understand why some people simply cannot see it that way!

Thank you..couldn't have said it better.

[religion kills]

Peppy wrote:

<quoted text>
Next up RK is the Maine gay marriage referendum. I will be interested to see how the vote comes out.

Hey Peppy, yes, next up is Maine! It is very close...I was just there and I'm following what I can from afar.

One of the ads being run is a blatant lie, claiming schools we teach "homosexual marriage" to children. they don't even teach "heterosexual marriage" today. In fact Gov. Baldacci's education minister hit the airwaives to refute that claim.

I'm proud of our catholic governor for signing the marriage equality bill. He was originally against it but realized, thanks to lots of activism, that his religious beliefs were not relevant to the debate. He wrote a very empassioned opinion piece about his change of heart. The Portland Bishop was dismissive.

It is a big fight...fairness and equality vs. the catholic church. And, yes, those are the sides. No group in Maine thought this was important enough to mount a people's veto except the church. They took out the papers and paid the signature gatherers.

I find it disgusting we have to fight a church for our civil rights. If a mere citizen had taken out the papers, I would be angry but not feel the way I do, as if the system has let us down. How can a tax exempt church be allowed to do this?

I'm hoping the libertarian spirit in Maine holds out. I read a quote by someone who claims to be conservative saying he is extremely mad at the anti-equality crowd for being dishonest in their ads. He is going to vote against them, with us, simply because he doesn't like being misled. I hope this sentiment prevails.

Nobody has to be accepting...like I always say, I don't accept vinyl siding. It is tacky. But I'm not working to deny people the right to use it!

[religion kills]

TRICK FLOWER wrote:

<quoted text> Error forgiven! I didn't even have the sense to check it out. LOL Now, what we have to deal with is whether and when our President/glorious leader of our military will do as he has promised, and actually do away with DADT! That has to be the silliest rule ever brought about in this country. You can be gay and enlist, just don't mention it to anyone. How on God's green planet does that give added protection to the U.S.?! Anyone who wants to enlist (even if I don't get it) ought to be able to enlist "as is" and merely obey the same rules and laws everyone else does. Kinda like people! Geez!

Trick, thanks again for your support. DADT can be baffling. I was on the mall in DC when Clinton signed that and we couldn't understand it. If you are anti-gay why not let them die in combat? The most cynical thing to say, I know, but doesn't that get at it?

I have a friend in the military. He says everyone knows and he is constantly propositioned. He says the sauna at the Pentagon is famous as a place for quick pick-ups. It seems the closet cases in the pentagon are more interested in being "immoral" on the side than those that want to serve openly. I big part of this is protecting hidden sex amongst the boys, I'm convinced.

Its horrible..it makes us look bad. Gay servicemen aren't trying to hide anything like the men I describe above. One person at the march this weekend is about to be discharged....he was reported by a minister who didn't want him in the military. The "don't ask" part was blatantly ignored since a 3rd party reported him.

Makes no sense.

[Peppy]

TRICK FLOWER wrote:

<quoted text> Error forgiven! I didn't even have the sense to check it out. LOL Now, what we have to deal with is whether and when our President/glorious leader of our military will do as he has promised, and actually do away with DADT! That has to be the silliest rule ever brought about in this country. You can be gay and enlist, just don't mention it to anyone. How on God's green planet does that give added protection to the U.S.?! Anyone who wants to enlist (even if I don't get it) ought to be able to enlist "as is" and merely obey the same rules and laws everyone else does. Kinda like people! Geez!

Well the logic is flawed, but it was obvious that Clinton could not pass a complete reversal at the time without a major battle. So he took a half of step forward. I am sure he knew at the time there would come a day when the other half of step would be taken. Battles are rarely won in a single day.

[SAL]

What a shame-- civil unions have been so happy, kind & loving to all men and women-- but this gays & lesbians new group is so sad-- what a way to hurt our children.

[eric]

Interesting, how are the children of North Carolina hurt because New Hampshire has marriage equality for same sex couples?

[George]

SAL wrote:

What a shame-- civil unions have been so happy, kind & loving to all men and women-- but this gays & lesbians new group is so sad-- what a way to hurt our children.

Gays and lesbians getting married has no effect on my child. How does it effect your children?

[TRICK FLOWER]

SAL wrote:

What a shame-- civil unions have been so happy, kind & loving to all men and women-- but this gays & lesbians new group is so sad-- what a way to hurt our children.

Sal, could you please explain what you mean here. If str8 people were told they could not marry, but must be joined in a civil union, and not have the same benefits marriage would bestow on their partners, there would be such an uproar! How does a same-sex marriage hurt children? Please explain this, because I truly do not understand. I know many people involved in same-sex marriages, who have children, and nobody is hurt. If anything, the children benefit from having another person to love, teach and laugh with them. BTW, it's not a "new group," it's the same group; people who have been long attempting to acquire the same rights you and I have, granted by the Constitution so very long ago.

[Bullet proof]

What if everyone turned gay? Then there would be no more babies. Same sex marriage has no place in the church. God says so him self. You're all going to hell.

[Just H3r3]

Bullet proof wrote:

What if everyone turned gay? Then there would be no more babies. Same sex marriage has no place in the church. God says so him self. You're all going to hell.

Civil marriage and religious marriage is different bimbo.

[Quest]

Bullet proof wrote:

What if everyone turned gay? Then there would be no more babies. Same sex marriage has no place in the church. God says so him self. You're all going to hell.

Don't worry, Sweetheart, it's not a choice, it's a natural innate sexual orientation. Not a single heterosexual will ever "turn gay".

And guess what? Gay folks still have reproductive organs and are capably of having children, and can legally adopt children cast of by straight folks!

Now, about your claim to hear God directly ...

[Bullet proof]

So I can't catch it? Whew, I was worried there for a second.