Paul – The False Apostle

Paul – The False Apostle

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Truth

Martinsville, VA

#1 Oct 17, 2012
To Timothy Paul said, "This you know, that all those in Asia have turned away from me." - 2 Timothy 1:15

Paul says, "This you know", as if it were common knowledge at that time that all of Asia had turned away from him. Hhmm, I do wonder why. Maybe they tested the spirit and determined Paul was a false Apostle.

Notice too, the place was Asia. The very place that Jesus told John to write, where his seven churches were! Wait a minute. What does John say about the Ephesian Church.

Revelation 2:2 I know thy works, and thy labor, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are evil: and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars.

Obviously they hadn't rejected Jesus if there were thriving churches there that Jesus wanted to address through John. Paul said that all Asia had rejected him personally! Asia accused Paul of teaching against the Law, and bringing an Ephesian friend into the temple - Acts 21:27-29.

And when the seven days were almost ended, the Jews from Asia, seeing him in the temple, stirred up the whole crowd and laid hands on him. crying out, "Men of Israel, help! This is the man who teaches all men everywhere against the people, the Law, and this place: and furthermore he also brought Greeks into the temple and has defiled this holy place." (For they had previously seen Trophimus the Ephesian with him in the city, whom they supposed that Paul had brought into the temple.) Acts 21:27-29

Try to grasp the profound significance of all this. Here we have in the book of Revelation the words of Jesus Christ commending the Ephesian church for rejecting someone who claimed to be his apostle, while Paul is the only person other than the twelve original apostles to have claimed to be an apostle... and we know he has made this very claim to this same Ephesian church.

Paul to the Ephesians: "I am an apostle of Jesus" Oh really? Then why did all Asia turn away from you, Paul? Jesus commended the Ephesian church for trying those who claimed to be Apostles. Paul says they turned away from him. Yeah, and Jesus commends the church for trying those who claim to be Apostles.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#2 Oct 17, 2012
Truth wrote:
To Timothy Paul said, "This you know, that all those in Asia have turned away from me." - 2 Timothy 1:15
Paul says, "This you know", as if it were common knowledge at that time that all of Asia had turned away from him. Hhmm, I do wonder why. Maybe they tested the spirit and determined Paul was a false Apostle.
Notice too, the place was Asia. The very place that Jesus told John to write, where his seven churches were! Wait a minute. What does John say about the Ephesian Church.
Revelation 2:2 I know thy works, and thy labor, and thy patience, and how thou canst not bear them which are evil: and thou hast tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and hast found them liars.
Obviously they hadn't rejected Jesus if there were thriving churches there that Jesus wanted to address through John. Paul said that all Asia had rejected him personally! Asia accused Paul of teaching against the Law, and bringing an Ephesian friend into the temple - Acts 21:27-29.
And when the seven days were almost ended, the Jews from Asia, seeing him in the temple, stirred up the whole crowd and laid hands on him. crying out, "Men of Israel, help! This is the man who teaches all men everywhere against the people, the Law, and this place: and furthermore he also brought Greeks into the temple and has defiled this holy place." (For they had previously seen Trophimus the Ephesian with him in the city, whom they supposed that Paul had brought into the temple.) Acts 21:27-29
Try to grasp the profound significance of all this. Here we have in the book of Revelation the words of Jesus Christ commending the Ephesian church for rejecting someone who claimed to be his apostle, while Paul is the only person other than the twelve original apostles to have claimed to be an apostle... and we know he has made this very claim to this same Ephesian church.
Paul to the Ephesians: "I am an apostle of Jesus" Oh really? Then why did all Asia turn away from you, Paul? Jesus commended the Ephesian church for trying those who claimed to be Apostles. Paul says they turned away from him. Yeah, and Jesus commends the church for trying those who claim to be Apostles.
Peter considers Paul different than you. Why?

4 Therefore, beloved, since you look for these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, spotless and blameless, 15 and regard the patience of our Lord as salvation; just as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given him, wrote to you, 16 as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which the untaught and unstable distort, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.

A false apostle is called a brother???
Truth

Martinsville, VA

#3 Oct 17, 2012
Casting lots was a biblically-allowed method of making a decision (Proverbs 16:33). The requirements for apostleship were that the man had to have been with them the entire time of Jesus’ ministry, and to have been a witness of the resurrection and ascension (Acts 1:21-22). The 11 disciples prayed for the Lord’s direction (Acts 1:24-25), and then cast lots, and the lot fell to Matthias (Acts 1:26). Their prayers were answered making Matthias the 12th apostles, not Paul. Paul doesn’t meet the qualifications to be an apostle. (Acts 1:24-25)
Truth

Martinsville, VA

#4 Oct 18, 2012
JustChristian wrote:
<quoted text>
Peter considers Paul different than you. Why?
4 Therefore, beloved, since you look for these things, be diligent to be found by Him in peace, spotless and blameless, 15 and regard the patience of our Lord as salvation; just as also our beloved brother Paul, according to the wisdom given him, wrote to you, 16 as also in all his letters, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which the untaught and unstable distort, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures, to their own destruction.
A false apostle is called a brother???
Who was the 12th Apostle?

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#5 Oct 18, 2012
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Who was the 12th Apostle?
You simply cant answer that question can you? Why do you reject Paul and Peter calls him a brother. You said he was a false Apostle, does that mean you consider him a brother?
Friend

United States

#6 Oct 18, 2012
The term "Brother" was a term used much like friend, or anyone else who wasn't an enemy. It was very common address for any man. Also, Peter was following Yashua's commandments as much as he could so as not to offend. "Love they neighbor!" was a very powerful command, more so then today.
Truth

Martinsville, VA

#7 Oct 18, 2012
JustChristian wrote:
<quoted text>
You simply cant answer that question can you? Why do you reject Paul and Peter calls him a brother. You said he was a false Apostle, does that mean you consider him a brother?
It is very telling that you will not name the 12th Apostle. Here is a hint. The 11 prayed to God then cast lots. Paul wasn’t even on the list. In fact, all Asia ends up turning from Paul; why? As I pointed out already Jesus commends those of Asia who tried men who professed to be an Apostle. If the bible speaks only with regard to 12 Apostles, obviously Paul was not an Apostle as he claimed thus making him a liar. All liars have their part in __________ Are you going to accept Paul’s Apostleship in spite of Jesus saying there are just 12 Apostles?

I also pointed out other things regarding Paul which I see you still have not found time to address. I find it odd that you have time to comment several times but lack time to set me straight on the ‘wrong’ things I said about Paul. And let’s not forget you said ‘most’ which indicates that ‘some’ of what I stated was true. If Paul be found ‘wrong’ just one time that should suffice. One time would cause one to question his credibility

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#8 Oct 18, 2012
Friend wrote:
The term "Brother" was a term used much like friend, or anyone else who wasn't an enemy. It was very common address for any man. Also, Peter was following Yashua's commandments as much as he could so as not to offend. "Love they neighbor!" was a very powerful command, more so then today.
Of course in context since Peter had just condemmed false teaching he now would not call a false teacher a brother so your thought process is wrong.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#9 Oct 18, 2012
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
It is very telling that you will not name the 12th Apostle. Here is a hint. The 11 prayed to God then cast lots. Paul wasn’t even on the list. In fact, all Asia ends up turning from Paul; why? As I pointed out already Jesus commends those of Asia who tried men who professed to be an Apostle. If the bible speaks only with regard to 12 Apostles, obviously Paul was not an Apostle as he claimed thus making him a liar. All liars have their part in __________ Are you going to accept Paul’s Apostleship in spite of Jesus saying there are just 12 Apostles?
I also pointed out other things regarding Paul which I see you still have not found time to address. I find it odd that you have time to comment several times but lack time to set me straight on the ‘wrong’ things I said about Paul. And let’s not forget you said ‘most’ which indicates that ‘some’ of what I stated was true. If Paul be found ‘wrong’ just one time that should suffice. One time would cause one to question his credibility
Say all you want, but until you answer why Peter right after addressing false teacher now calls Paul a brother your thoughts are meaniningless.

Since: Oct 12

United States

#10 Oct 18, 2012
Followers of Paul I AsK you to explain this verse to me. 1 Timothy 6:15-16 NKJV

which He will manifest in His own time, He who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings and Lord of lords, who alone has immortality, dwelling in unapproachable light, whom no man has seen or can see, to whom be honor and everlasting power. Amen.

Paul is talking about God here right which no man has seen, not Jesus because all sorts of people have seen Jesus. Paul was supposedly a experts in the old testament, so why did he forget about Jacob and Moses, did they not both see God?
Truth

Martinsville, VA

#11 Oct 18, 2012
“Bother”, you still have failed to provide evidence for Paul’s Apostleship. Are you contending there are more than 12? I notice you continually dodge this. It hurts, doesn’t it. All these years you thought Paul was an Apostle and now you know that cannot be true since Jesus said there were just 12. Now you are left to try to explain this yet you cannot. You’d think someone by now would have come on this site and set me straight on this.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#12 Oct 18, 2012
Truth wrote:
“Bother”, you still have failed to provide evidence for Paul’s Apostleship. Are you contending there are more than 12? I notice you continually dodge this. It hurts, doesn’t it. All these years you thought Paul was an Apostle and now you know that cannot be true since Jesus said there were just 12. Now you are left to try to explain this yet you cannot. You’d think someone by now would have come on this site and set me straight on this.
You consider Paul a false apostle unlike Peter did who considered him a brother. That fact will not be changed no matter what I say about your question. A simple diversion to dismiss your error.

Since: Oct 12

United States

#13 Oct 18, 2012
.
JustChristian wrote:
<quoted text>
Say all you want, but until you answer why Peter right after addressing false teacher now calls Paul a brother your thoughts are meaniningless.
O my dear brother I was just like you I clung to that verse for almost a year before I realized that I was baseing my entire faith of Paul on one verse now lets read the verse slowly

2 Peter 3:15-16 NKJV

and consider that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation—as also our beloved brother Paul,(brother not apostle) according to the wisdom given to him(does not say who the wisdom is given by), has written to you, as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things(Pauline doctrine), in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures( tell me if we sit here and argue and struggle to make pauls teachings fit with Jesus's, are we not twisting pauls writtings as well as the rest of the scriptures ? To are own destruction?)
Truth

Martinsville, VA

#14 Oct 18, 2012
readiness wrote:
Followers of Paul I AsK you to explain this verse to me. 1 Timothy 6:15-16 NKJV
which He will manifest in His own time, He who is the blessed and only Potentate, the King of kings and Lord of lords, who alone has immortality, dwelling in unapproachable light, whom no man has seen or can see, to whom be honor and everlasting power. Amen.
Paul is talking about God here right which no man has seen, not Jesus because all sorts of people have seen Jesus. Paul was supposedly a experts in the old testament, so why did he forget about Jacob and Moses, did they not both see God?
Some will say that seeing God in the OT was seeing Jesus. I have heard this explained this way. They say that when God was seen in the OT it was Jesus not the Father God. Yeah, I know, Jesus wasn’t born in flesh yet but that’s how they explain Paul’s comment to Timothy.
Truth

Martinsville, VA

#15 Oct 18, 2012
JustChristian wrote:
<quoted text>
You consider Paul a false apostle unlike Peter did who considered him a brother. That fact will not be changed no matter what I say about your question. A simple diversion to dismiss your error.
Bother”, you still have failed to provide evidence for Paul’s Apostleship. Are you contending there are more than 12? I notice you continually dodge this. It hurts, doesn’t it. All these years you thought Paul was an Apostle and now you know that cannot be true since Jesus said there were just 12. Now you are left to try to explain this yet you cannot. You’d think someone by now would have come on this site and set me straight on this.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#16 Oct 18, 2012
Truth wrote:
<quoted text>
Bother”, you still have failed to provide evidence for Paul’s Apostleship. Are you contending there are more than 12? I notice you continually dodge this. It hurts, doesn’t it. All these years you thought Paul was an Apostle and now you know that cannot be true since Jesus said there were just 12. Now you are left to try to explain this yet you cannot. You’d think someone by now would have come on this site and set me straight on this.
Done with it.
Truth

Martinsville, VA

#17 Oct 18, 2012
JustChristian wrote:
<quoted text>
Done with it.
Bother”, you still have failed to provide evidence for Paul’s Apostleship. Are you contending there are more than 12? I notice you continually dodge this. It hurts, doesn’t it. All these years you thought Paul was an Apostle and now you know that cannot be true since Jesus said there were just 12. Now you are left to try to explain this yet you cannot. You’d think someone by now would have come on this site and set me straight on this.
walkinginlove

Danville, VA

#18 Oct 18, 2012
If Paul is a false apostle then God is a false God since Peter clearly wrote of his acceptance of Paul and Peter was given the Holy Spirit, thus had a direct contact with God who managed to never tell Peter oh by the way Paul is a liar.

So God was fooled by Paul so much so that he never told Peter about it? Really?????????? LOLOLOLOLOL

Since: Oct 12

United States

#19 Oct 18, 2012
Their is a site that discuses this very subject www.theproblemswithapostlepaul.com it has good info and disscusion. I encourage everyone yo visit it

Since: Oct 12

United States

#20 Oct 18, 2012
readiness wrote:
Their is a site that discuses this very subject www.theproblemswithapostlepaul.com it has good info and disscusion. I encourage everyone yo visit it
www.problemswithapostlepaul.com sorry bout that.

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