Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it ...
Barnsweb

Alliance, OH

#23 Nov 11, 2012
Bobby, are you saying that because I believe Jesus and what He taught that I love the cross of Jesus and accept His mercy? What evidence do you have for that?
Barnsweb

Alliance, OH

#24 Nov 11, 2012
Or are you saying that I DON'T love the cross and accept His mercy?
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#25 Nov 11, 2012
Barnsweb wrote:
Or are you saying that I DON'T love the cross and accept His mercy?
Is that all you saw in my message? Did you read Rolaant McKenzie letter of resignation from the Seventh day Adventist church?

For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures. I cannot ignore Paul's words because some deny his apostleship.

What is more important than the cross in the life of a christian? I realize that there is a lot more to living for Christ than the knowledge of the cross, but nothing can compare to his sacrificial work on the cross-his righteousness for our unrighteousness.

In the coc's water baptism is of first importance. In the sabbath keeping churches, the sabbath is of most importance. Many churches define themselves by what they consider to be of utmost importance but none of it trumps the mercy found at the cross. If there was no cross and no resurrection I would not even be here discussing anything with you guys.
Barnsweb

Alliance, OH

#26 Nov 12, 2012
I'm not saying it's impossible, since what you speak of the coC is unknown to me, but your mind has been poisend against many people who love the Lord and accept His true grace - I've never heard of any CoC that believe as you paint them, and that includes many - from NJ to California and points between.

You speak of a few verses Paul wrote and hang you faith hat on them to the exclusion of verses written by the same man.

Yes the corss is elemental to the faith, even in the coC, SDA, Baptist, LDS and even Catholic. Every denomination, every group of Christians believe the verse you quote from Paul, yet they believe more about Paul and what he taught that you seem to grasp. But in your failure to grasp and understand what they DO believe, you put them down for their faith and brand it deficient because they don't ONLY believe the few selected verses you readily accept.

'Most' important?'Why do you call Me 'Lord,' and not do as I say?''Depart from Me, ye workers of iniquity - I never knew you.' And in His prayer from John 14-17, where do we find the 'most important' thing is the cross? I'd venture a guess that if Jesus didn't resurrect from the dead that we would have no knowledge of His work on the cross - and even Paul acknowledges that if He didn't that we would of all men be most pitied.

His death on the cross for the sins of the world is the most difficult thing He did, and He did it that we might be saved and adopted as His brethren, children of the Most High God, but you will not be saved if you reject His words that lead to eternal life, and it is by His words that each of us will be judged.

Grace? The grace He gives was not free for Him, and it's not free for us either. We don't earn it, but we have to believe Him and do something with His word and example. And regarding over focusing on the cross - the Aramaic says whoever doesn't take up his staff and follow Him is not worthy of Him - not His cross. But the point is submission because of faith, and faith is to trust your life into His hands because He is who He is, and ever will be true - for those who are 'in Him', but you can't be in Him unless He is in you, and that goes right back to that prayer in John that you need to re read and figure out what He said is most important for us to believe and do.

Paul also said that keeping the commandments of God is what matters most.(I Cor. 7:19). Even Romans finalizes with the preaching of Jesus Christ 'according to the commandment of the everlasting God, for obedience to the faith.'

Luke wrote Luke and Acts as a record of the truth as taught by the Lord, so that there would be record of what Jesus taught, so that those who came after him would have record of what He taught, as this is the sole stated purpose of the books. Paul and Luke were close associates, and I'm possitive if they were alive today that they'd be amazed at what people have devolved to from the records we have available.

And the SDA thing was hardly worth the read and the man spoke from much ignorance - sorry.
Barnsweb

Alliance, OH

#27 Nov 12, 2012
There is NO Scriptural evidence that the Sabbath was ever changed to Sunday - it's a total fabrication of the Paganism of the RCC, which denies the word of God and replaces it for man made doctrines to some degree. The Sabbath existed for Adam as much as Abraham and it was evidently forgotten by Israel in Egypt after 400 years of paganism and idolity - but God called them out of Egypt to go to the land He had promised Abraham, and God also called them to return to Him and do what He said - not what Satan had deceived the world to believe and do.

It's no harder to worship God on the day He decreed, so why fault find those who at least recognise the fact that Jesus also upheld the Sabbath and didn't eliminate it?:-) Because you have chosen to believe man, rather than the eternal God, whose word is forever true and good.

Jesus calls all men to repent and turn to do whatever God said we are to do, but with higher knowledge of the ways of God, higher levels of His grace and mercy are also needed. The words of Jesus Christ are spirit and life - but only to those who believe.
SinfulSaint

Axton, VA

#28 Nov 12, 2012
SinfulSaint wrote:
Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. Sin is the transgression of the Law. Thus, to not keep the Sabbath, is to sin.
Can anyone show when God removed the 4th commandment?
I have looked hard and yet to see anyone on here provide proof that the 4th Commandment was erased from the Law of God.
SinfulSaint

Axton, VA

#29 Nov 12, 2012
Barnsweb wrote:
There is NO Scriptural evidence that the Sabbath was ever changed to Sunday .
Amen to that
SinfulSaint

Axton, VA

#30 Nov 12, 2012
Here is the issue: God states that the Sabbath is forever; thus, it is not temporal. It also is included in His Commandments; Jesus states very clearly that anyone who teaches men to break the least of the commandments, is, in error. If we can remove the Fourth Commandment, we can remove them all. Jesus did not come to do away with them as many falsely teach; He came to make them TRUTH.
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#31 Nov 12, 2012
SinfulSaint wrote:
<quoted text>
Amen to that
The covenant has changed from law to grace.

http://www.letusreason.org/Doct31.htm

Since: Nov 12

Location hidden

#32 Nov 12, 2012
Bobby wrote:
<quoted text>
The covenant has changed from law to grace.
http://www.letusreason.org/Doct31.htm
Shall we continue in sin that GRACE abounds?

Since: Nov 12

Location hidden

#33 Nov 12, 2012
Granted, the law was given by Moses; grace and truth came by Jesus Christ (John 1:17).

Romans 6:14, 15. "For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

"Shall we sin because we are not under the law but under grace? God forbid." Paul states that being under grace does not give a license to break the law. Yet this is exactly what you and others believe today, and totally ignore Paul's warning.

"Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law." Romans 3:31. Paul asks if the law is nullified for us just because we have had faith in Christ's saving grace. His answer is that the law is established and reinforced in the life the Christian.

"If ye love me," Jesus said, "keep my commandments." John 14:15.

Side Note: Christians are to abide in the Law of God even though they do not earn grace by Law keeping. Love demands that one walk in the paths of righteousness. The Law was NOT set aside as if it has no value; it was lifted up by the new standard of love. IF YOU “LOVE” ME, Jesus said, "keep my commandments. These Commandments include keeping the Sabbath.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#34 Nov 12, 2012
SinfulSaint wrote:
Granted, the law was given by Moses; grace and truth came by Jesus Christ (John 1:17).
Romans 6:14, 15. "For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
"Shall we sin because we are not under the law but under grace? God forbid." Paul states that being under grace does not give a license to break the law. Yet this is exactly what you and others believe today, and totally ignore Paul's warning.
"Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law." Romans 3:31. Paul asks if the law is nullified for us just because we have had faith in Christ's saving grace. His answer is that the law is established and reinforced in the life the Christian.
"If ye love me," Jesus said, "keep my commandments." John 14:15.
Side Note: Christians are to abide in the Law of God even though they do not earn grace by Law keeping. Love demands that one walk in the paths of righteousness. The Law was NOT set aside as if it has no value; it was lifted up by the new standard of love. IF YOU “LOVE” ME, Jesus said, "keep my commandments. These Commandments include keeping the Sabbath.
Are you still sacrificing since that was also the Law.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#35 Nov 12, 2012
“Think not that I came to destroy the law or the prophets; I came not to destroy, but to fulfill. For verily I say unto you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass away from the law, till all things be accomplished”(Mt. 5:17-18).

This is what Christ said.

Now the question is, Is the law still binding?

remember
"If the law of Moses was not fulfilled by Christ, and thus remains as an obligatory legal system for today, then it is not a partially binding regime; rather, it is totally compelling system." WJackson

Since: Nov 12

Location hidden

#36 Nov 12, 2012
JustChristian wrote:
<quoted text>
Are you still sacrificing since that was also the Law.
What an idiotic comment.

You think because Jesus took the place of animal sacrifices that now you are not required to obey the Commandments of God. How about the First Commandment? Is this one okay to discard? You hate the Fourth Commandment. You cannot find justification to do away with the it thus you resort to apples to oranges comments. Pathetic!

Since: Nov 12

Location hidden

#37 Nov 12, 2012
JustChristian wrote:
“Think not that I came to destroy the law or the prophets; I came not to destroy, but to fulfill. For verily I say unto you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass away from the law, till all things be accomplished”(Mt. 5:17-18).
This is what Christ said.
Now the question is, Is the law still binding?
remember
"If the law of Moses was not fulfilled by Christ, and thus remains as an obligatory legal system for today, then it is not a partially binding regime; rather, it is totally compelling system." WJackson
Rather than cite one of your superheroes of your faith ( WJackson ), I will cite the Bible.

Romans 6:14, 15. "For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.

"Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law." Romans 3:31.

"If ye love me," Jesus said, "keep my commandments." John 14:15.

It’s laughable that you cite WJackson - a man who binds manmade Laws on people.“Thou shalt have the Lord’s Supper only on Sunday”– WJackson.“As often as you partake”– Jesus. WJackson will post an article against the very Commandment of God to keep the Sabbath and then make a Commandment where God has not. Perhaps you should find another superhero of the faith :-)
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#38 Nov 12, 2012
SinfulSaint wrote:
<quoted text>
Rather than cite one of your superheroes of your faith ( WJackson ), I will cite the Bible.
Romans 6:14, 15. "For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
"Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law." Romans 3:31.
"If ye love me," Jesus said, "keep my commandments." John 14:15.
It’s laughable that you cite WJackson - a man who binds manmade Laws on people.“Thou shalt have the Lord’s Supper only on Sunday”– WJackson.“As often as you partake”– Jesus. WJackson will post an article against the very Commandment of God to keep the Sabbath and then make a Commandment where God has not. Perhaps you should find another superhero of the faith :-)
Wayne Jackson is a coc go to guy for their doctrine, but I often agree with him. These words are true:

"If the law of Moses was not fulfilled by Christ, and thus remains as an obligatory legal system for today, then it is not a partially binding regime; rather, it is totally compelling system." WJackson

Jc makes a valid point here: Are you still sacrificing since that was also the Law?
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#39 Nov 12, 2012
SinfulSaint wrote:
<quoted text>
Rather than cite one of your superheroes of your faith ( WJackson ), I will cite the Bible.
Romans 6:14, 15. "For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
"Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law." Romans 3:31.
"If ye love me," Jesus said, "keep my commandments." John 14:15.
It’s laughable that you cite WJackson - a man who binds manmade Laws on people.“Thou shalt have the Lord’s Supper only on Sunday”– WJackson.“As often as you partake”– Jesus. WJackson will post an article against the very Commandment of God to keep the Sabbath and then make a Commandment where God has not. Perhaps you should find another superhero of the faith :-)
There is nothing wrong with the law it was given for the purpose of a schoolmaster to bring us to Christ.

Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

21 Is the law, therefore, opposed to the promises of God? Absolutely not!

*For if a law had been given that could impart life, then righteousness would certainly have come by the law*.

22 But Scripture has locked up everything under the control of sin, so that what was promised, being given through faith in Jesus Christ, might be given to those who believe.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#40 Nov 12, 2012
SinfulSaint wrote:
<quoted text>
What an idiotic comment.
You think because Jesus took the place of animal sacrifices that now you are not required to obey the Commandments of God. How about the First Commandment? Is this one okay to discard? You hate the Fourth Commandment. You cannot find justification to do away with the it thus you resort to apples to oranges comments. Pathetic!
That was a question no a comment.:)

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#41 Nov 12, 2012
SinfulSaint wrote:
<quoted text>
Rather than cite one of your superheroes of your faith ( WJackson ), I will cite the Bible.
Romans 6:14, 15. "For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
"Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law." Romans 3:31.
"If ye love me," Jesus said, "keep my commandments." John 14:15.
It’s laughable that you cite WJackson - a man who binds manmade Laws on people.“Thou shalt have the Lord’s Supper only on Sunday”– WJackson.“As often as you partake”– Jesus. WJackson will post an article against the very Commandment of God to keep the Sabbath and then make a Commandment where God has not. Perhaps you should find another superhero of the faith :-)
Whats laughable is you skipped the scripture I posted prior to WJacksons comment.

So I quess you would I site you instead of Wayne and that would be different.:)
My give me some of your writings to consider and maybe i would post them and put up your name. probably not.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#42 Nov 12, 2012
SinfulSaint wrote:
<quoted text>
Rather than cite one of your superheroes of your faith ( WJackson ), I will cite the Bible.
Romans 6:14, 15. "For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace. What then? shall we sin, because we are not under the law, but under grace? God forbid.
"Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law." Romans 3:31.
"If ye love me," Jesus said, "keep my commandments." John 14:15.
It’s laughable that you cite WJackson - a man who binds manmade Laws on people.“Thou shalt have the Lord’s Supper only on Sunday”– WJackson.“As often as you partake”– Jesus. WJackson will post an article against the very Commandment of God to keep the Sabbath and then make a Commandment where God has not. Perhaps you should find another superhero of the faith :-)
How bout your trips to Jerusalem, How they been going?

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