Obeying the Gospel
New Guy

Morehead, KY

#21 Dec 31, 2012
_Randy_ wrote:
<quoted text>
Iím not looking for any Ďamen corner meníÖ LOL. I wasnít implying we ONLY listen and thus be saved. My point was those three passages are often used as BAPTISM verses AS IF BEING BAPTIZED IS OBEYING THE GOSPEL. NEW GUY explained it better than I can.
Hope you get feeling better. Long weekend for me too. Sounds like we do agree then though-simply being baptized simply isn't enough to obey the gospel. I think perhaps the coc emphasizes baptism so much because the religious world denies it so much. Thus, it appears we only know about baptism-and truthfully, in some places that is the case. And, in these kind of cases, many times we never bother to listen to the other side's views.
Barnsweb

Alliance, OH

#22 Dec 31, 2012
Bobby wrote:
<quoted text>
You keep contradicting yourself, on the one hand you say that water baptism is the promise of God (which it is not) then you say it includes our doing (I interpret that as obedience). Then you say that I do not have enough obedience.
I challenge you to prove that you are following the true gospel preached by Jesus. You have admitted that you sometimes disobey. Is perfection your goal or do you already have it?
My question is how much obedience is required for salvation and how much more is required to keep your salvation?
Abraham reckoned as righteous before any law was given back in gen 15:6.
Acts 2:38,39 IS identified as a promise - the promise to Abraham fulfilled. Also read Genesis 26:5, since you believe 15:6 - one is as true as the other.'The sum of Thy word is truth', not 'some of Thy word is truth.'
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#23 Dec 31, 2012
Barnsweb wrote:
<quoted text>
Acts 2:38,39 IS identified as a promise - the promise to Abraham fulfilled. Also read Genesis 26:5, since you believe 15:6 - one is as true as the other.'The sum of Thy word is truth', not 'some of Thy word is truth.'
If we are to use your position, Abraham was not justified until ch 26. However that is not what the word says, is it? In fact Abraham never saw the fulfillment of his promise and neither have we. We are still waiting for that new city of God-our home. We are still walking by faith, waiting for that glorious day. Justification, sanctification and finally glorification. There is a lot of human works involved in between but our justification is where the journey began.
Barnsweb

Alliance, OH

#24 Dec 31, 2012
Genesis 26:5 is truth, but it seems you don't believe so?

Since: Dec 12

Royse City, TX

#25 Dec 31, 2012
New Guy wrote:
<quoted text>
Hope you get feeling better.
Thanks, Dave. I am feeling somewhat better tonight. I need to start getting more sleep and things. Its pulling my immune system down, making me get sick too easily.I have ran for so many years from what I know inside of me to be true and its becoming increasingly harder to deal with.
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#26 Dec 31, 2012
Barnsweb wrote:
Genesis 26:5 is truth, but it seems you don't believe so?
It is absolutely true but this was not the point where he was reckoned as righteous.

Even marriages vows (promises) are made before any consummation takes place. Well, at least that is the way it is supposed be!

Gen 15:Abram believed the LORD, and he credited it to him as righteousness.
New Guy

Morehead, KY

#27 Dec 31, 2012
_Randy_ wrote:
<quoted text>
Thanks, Dave. I am feeling somewhat better tonight. I need to start getting more sleep and things. Its pulling my immune system down, making me get sick too easily.I have ran for so many years from what I know inside of me to be true and its becoming increasingly harder to deal with.
Take care of yourself Randy. For about an hour Saturday I thought I was gonna find out what the "other side" was like firsthand. That's what happens when stress and running all the time do for you.

Who knows? You take care of your "inside issues" and you might just feel better all the way around.
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#28 Jan 1, 2013
New Guy wrote:
<quoted text>
Take care of yourself Randy. For about an hour Saturday I thought I was gonna find out what the "other side" was like firsthand. That's what happens when stress and running all the time do for you.
Who knows? You take care of your "inside issues" and you might just feel better all the way around.
We could try the power of prayer...
Barnsweb

Alliance, OH

#29 Jan 1, 2013
Bobby wrote:
<quoted text>
It is absolutely true but this was not the point where he was reckoned as righteous.
Even marriages vows (promises) are made before any consummation takes place. Well, at least that is the way it is supposed be!
Gen 15:Abram believed the LORD, and he credited it to him as righteousness.
Paul was also fanciful to imagine such things and creat long human arguments to support his theories - and look how far these theories has brought you from the faith as taught by Y'shua.

What is recorded there about Abraham shows what faith actually is. It isn't an emotion, it isn't just a mental acceptance - it requires action and paying attention to doing what God said to do in the ways He said to do it. To do otherwise is not faith or faithfulness.
Barnsweb

Alliance, OH

#30 Jan 1, 2013
I'd love to see the epistle that Paul would have made from Genesis 26:5. History tells us he wasn't man enough.
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#31 Jan 2, 2013
Barnsweb wrote:
I'd love to see the epistle that Paul would have made from Genesis 26:5. History tells us he wasn't man enough.
Sorry you feel that way, maybe you should try the koran where they are obligated to cut someones hand off for stealing.
Barnsweb

Alliance, OH

#32 Jan 2, 2013
No need to be a jacka$$.

Even in the OT we can see that 'hand for a hand' and 'eye for an eye' didn't mean taking vengence, but was a system of restitution of value lost - not doing to others as they did to you.

You really need to pause for some prayer as ask God for the grace to speak the truth in love.
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#33 Jan 4, 2013
Barnsweb wrote:
No need to be a jacka$$.
Even in the OT we can see that 'hand for a hand' and 'eye for an eye' didn't mean taking vengence, but was a system of restitution of value lost - not doing to others as they did to you.
You really need to pause for some prayer as ask God for the grace to speak the truth in love.
You are the one rejecting God's apostle Paul's writings which most of us cling to as God's truth. As I said before, others on here may like/agree with your position on water baptism as a way of obeying the gospel. As long as you team up with them against me they are willing to overlook that part. I can almost bet you that most of them do not deny or reject Paul as a false apostle. That is not typical belief in churches of Christ...
New Guy

Morehead, KY

#34 Jan 4, 2013
Bobby wrote:
<quoted text>
You are the one rejecting God's apostle Paul's writings which most of us cling to as God's truth. As I said before, others on here may like/agree with your position on water baptism as a way of obeying the gospel. As long as you team up with them against me they are willing to overlook that part. I can almost bet you that most of them do not deny or reject Paul as a false apostle. That is not typical belief in churches of Christ...
Bobby don't think that I "overlook" BW's views on Paul. In fact, since I've had extra time this week I have been investigating many of the claims against Paul, and Aramaic primacy. Doing my homework so to speak. I have found nothing to change my view on Greek primacy, or on Paul.

That being said, I don't play divide and conquer. I try to be on God's side, on the side of the truth. And whoever that puts me with, so be it. I've even agreed with you a time or two :)
Barnsweb

Alliance, OH

#35 Jan 4, 2013
Yes, it's the truth that matters. On a side note, the translater of the AENT sides with Paul, and I only learned of the Netzarim who don't from another web site.

Facts are facts, truth is truth, and sometimes the facts don't match what the truth actually is. Therein is the difficulty. Taking what Jesus taught as truth to be the eternal and everlasting truth - if Paul disagreed with Jesus, he disagreed with the truth. Seems simple to me.
Bobby

Fort Worth, TX

#36 Jan 4, 2013
Baptismal regeneration reminds me of the slogan of Kentucky fried chicken (KFC). The slogan is "we do chicken right". Every time I hear that slogan I think of the coc.

Coc slogan "we do water baptism right":)
Barnsweb

Alliance, OH

#37 Jan 4, 2013
Bobby wrote:
Baptismal regeneration reminds me of the slogan of Kentucky fried chicken (KFC). The slogan is "we do chicken right". Every time I hear that slogan I think of the coc.
Coc slogan "we do water baptism right":)
Amen to that, they at least get a good start to do things right and believe the promises of God, rather than presume on His goodness and think He really doesn't mean what He said:-)
New Guy

Morehead, KY

#38 Jan 4, 2013
Don't make fun of the Colonel! LOL.
Jeff

Chalfont, PA

#39 Feb 28, 2013
1 Corinthians 15
1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
5 And that he was seen of Cephas, then of the twelve:
6 After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep.
7 After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles.
8 And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time.
9 For I am the least of the apostles, that am not meet to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God.
10 But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.
11 Therefore whether it were I or they, so we preach, and so ye believed.
Jeff

Chalfont, PA

#40 Feb 28, 2013
2 Peter 3
1 This second epistle, beloved, I now write unto you; in both which I stir up your pure minds by way of remembrance:
2 That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour:
3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,
4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.
5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:
6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:
7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men.
8 But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance.
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.
14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless.
15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;
16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest (wrest means twist in old English), as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.
17 Ye therefore, beloved, seeing ye know these things before, beware lest ye also, being led away with the error of the wicked, fall from your own stedfastness.
18 But grow in grace, and in the knowledge of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ. To him be glory both now and for ever. Amen.

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