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Darwin

Clearfield, PA

#1 Jan 24, 2013
Which is better, and why? Why do our schools preach logic instead of religion? Is there any reason society finds "logic" better than religion?

But is religion logical? Not necessarily. You see, through deductive reasoning, I can not say God exists. There is no real method to deduce the fact God is a being in this Universe. Further, inductive reasoning involving generalized facts does not apply either. There are no facts.

Generally speaking, reasoning suggests that if you should follow anything, it should be philosophy and science. Yet, many theologians think religion is rational? Explain to me how rational it is to think God exists and will hand you everything you ever need in life? Finally, religion cannot be "rational," because rationalization involves facts, which are deduced or induced through reasoning. Just because you believe and feel God is real actually means nothing to the world.

For example, this would be rational thought. The Earth rotates around the sun once per year, or 365 days on the Gregorian Calendar. Therefore, since the orbit is an oval, one could say the earth travels approximately 1 degree on its orbital path per day. This is true, too. Science has also proven this, using telescopes, and measuring devices. You can't really argue about that. Why does religion cause argument then? The answer: It lacks logic.
niwraD

United States

#2 Jan 25, 2013
This is not very logical!
Darwin

Clearfield, PA

#3 Jan 25, 2013
Do explain how this is not logical.
Dan

Clearfield, PA

#4 Feb 2, 2013
Science states that nothing can create something, so they are proving that the "big bang" is false. And if evolution is true and we came from apes, why are there still apes since evolution says the weak species will disappear.

It is science that is not logical. The fact is man is a rebellious creature and "need to prove" the absence of God and then argue when proven the facts, and Biblical facts are being unearthed daily through archeological digs.
The Prisoner

Altoona, PA

#5 Feb 2, 2013
Reason and logic applied to our world really took root in the Enlightenment Age, leading to such things as American government. Voltaire, leader of the Enlightenment led the way for toleration of all religions by a state, even though he himself was not. Don't worry about your neighbors beliefs unless they do YOU harm.
Darwin

Clearfield, PA

#6 Feb 2, 2013
I just want to do my neighbor. He's pretty hot.
Reverend Irreverent

State College, PA

#7 Feb 2, 2013
Dan wrote:
Science states that nothing can create something, so they are proving that the "big bang" is false. And if evolution is true and we came from apes, why are there still apes since evolution says the weak species will disappear.
It is science that is not logical. The fact is man is a rebellious creature and "need to prove" the absence of God and then argue when proven the facts, and Biblical facts are being unearthed daily through archeological digs.
We didn't evolve from apes. Just a common ancestor.

Also, quantum physics would like a word with you.

If you don't have a grasp of even the most basic elements of science you're attempting to argue, kindly just refrain.
Homo Erectus

Tyrone, PA

#8 Feb 2, 2013
I'd like to know where I came from then, since A) The Big bang is bogus bullshit. B) We didn't evolve from apes, they're only our ancestors. And C) Apparently there is no God that created us.

What choices are left??
Giorgio A Tsoukalos

Clearfield, PA

#9 Feb 2, 2013
Homo Erectus wrote:
What choices are left??
Aliens, silly!
Homo Erectus

Tyrone, PA

#10 Feb 2, 2013
Aliens?? Hmmm ... why of course.
Reverend Irreverent

State College, PA

#11 Feb 2, 2013
Homo Erectus wrote:
I'd like to know where I came from then, since A) The Big bang is bogus bullshit. B) We didn't evolve from apes, they're only our ancestors. And C) Apparently there is no God that created us.
What choices are left??
Why is the Big Bang bogus? Please enlighten us, noble scientific mind.

Also, correct. We likely were not created by an all-powerful God figure. No evidence suggests we were, only archaic writings by superstitious and story-loving people. The idea that human beings in the 21st century believe tales about millenia-old people and talking animals and the like supports just how far we have to go as a species.

Science continues to work on exactly the questions you asked. The answers are not entirely filled out. Many are content just to be told to believe in the Bible, though over time that book has been falsified more and more.'Dan' is incorrect; if anything, the Bible's stories are further undone regularly as we learn more about reality.

There is no romantic creation story, no glorious and otherworldly support for any Bible tales. As Neil deGrasse Tyson once said, the great thing about science is that it is true whether you want to believe in it or not.

Do you also want some fine reading selections that support all I've just said or shall we refrain?
Homo Erectus

Tyrone, PA

#12 Feb 3, 2013
I'm very much down the middle on this was, but I was under the impression that you don't need a noble scientific mind to understand that something can't come from nothing. That's the bogus part i was referring to.

And Dan is wrong?? What makes him wrong and you right?
Giants of Science

Tyrone, PA

#13 Feb 3, 2013
Here's a few tidbits you can chew on, people.

http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/science...
Proof Positive

Tyrone, PA

#14 Feb 3, 2013
Science you want, Rev? Evidence you crave??

http://www.youtube.com/v/3PSZNYdfawQ&hl=e...

Pretty compelling stuff for something you say is just fairy tales and hoaxes!

http://www.6000years.org/frame.php...
Cheese Fries

Novi, MI

#15 Feb 3, 2013
Darwin wrote:
Which is better, and why? Why do our schools preach logic instead of religion? Is there any reason society finds "logic" better than religion?
But is religion logical? Not necessarily. You see, through deductive reasoning, I can not say God exists. There is no real method to deduce the fact God is a being in this Universe. Further, inductive reasoning involving generalized facts does not apply either. There are no facts.
Generally speaking, reasoning suggests that if you should follow anything, it should be philosophy and science. Yet, many theologians think religion is rational? Explain to me how rational it is to think God exists and will hand you everything you ever need in life? Finally, religion cannot be "rational," because rationalization involves facts, which are deduced or induced through reasoning. Just because you believe and feel God is real actually means nothing to the world.
For example, this would be rational thought. The Earth rotates around the sun once per year, or 365 days on the Gregorian Calendar. Therefore, since the orbit is an oval, one could say the earth travels approximately 1 degree on its orbital path per day. This is true, too. Science has also proven this, using telescopes, and measuring devices. You can't really argue about that. Why does religion cause argument then? The answer: It lacks logic.
Christy Fulton has spoken.
Reverend Irreverent

State College, PA

#16 Feb 3, 2013
Proof Positive wrote:
Science you want, Rev? Evidence you crave??
http://www.youtube.com/v/3PSZNYdfawQ&hl=e...
Pretty compelling stuff for something you say is just fairy tales and hoaxes!
http://www.6000years.org/frame.php...
Ron Wyatt was brought up in another thread. The 'atheists' one. His 'discoveries' have all been debunked and falsified by actual experts. He was a dedicated amateur who just happened to be involved in a field without the actual skills one needs to do so. There's a good reason comments are disabled for those videos, and I'm guessing it's exactly for the reason I mentioned. None of the things he claimed to have found are real.

The latter link is similar. Vague implications based off of very broad and open-to-interpretation Bible verses coupled with poor science. Besides, this is a site that contains this quote:

"Have you ever wondered about all of the UFO sightings? Most Christians know that it is Satan who is behind these to deceive the people of the World. But these satanic apparitions have not been done without a purpose. This has been a carefully executed plan. But what plan? To explain the Rapture! "They were abducted by aliens" will be the excuse the media latches onto. It is my opinion that most people will readily believe alien abduction over a "God abduction"."

Yeah. Wow.

So yes, I crave evidence. You've failed to provide it. Ditto for all creationists and "Christian science" advocates.
Reverend Irreverent

State College, PA

#17 Feb 3, 2013
Giants of Science wrote:
Here's a few tidbits you can chew on, people.
http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/science...
Very intellectually dishonest website. Little to no actual science, instead full of allusion and very liberal interpretation of already-vague verses. It reads like someone already preaching to the choir with disjointed assumptions, and it won't convince anyone that doesn't already believe in what it claims. At least it tries harder than the other one that claims UFO abductions are the work of Satan, I'll give it credit there.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_the...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Science_and_the_...

That's just basic Wikipedia stuff. Our modern knowledge regarding things like biology, physics, cosmology, etc. debunk any idea of the Bible having scientific validity. The Bible didn't even get many of its own prophecies right.
Proof Positive

Tyrone, PA

#18 Feb 3, 2013
Ron Wyatt had "actual experts" with him and involved for the entire expedition. None of the information that was provided through the links has been debunked or falsified by ANYONE! And you have nothing but your sad, dark, living in a closet view on the subject, to try and rebuttal and pervert it. It's people like you who refuse to and can't see the nose on your face that are crying hoax, no one else.

You always want evidence and proof and you got it ... but as predicted, you and the atheists dismiss it because it doesn't jive with your distorted way of thinking. That's all it is. You just don't want to believe. And that's fine. Like you're always saying, you can't argue the facts! And these are undisputed facts that you can't dispute.

Sorry, but the only one that has failed, Rev, is YOU!! Because as usual, you're on here babbling big words and fancy explanations that are completely riddled with half baked ideas and opinions that have no merit what so ever. Tell you what .. How about you provide some evidence for once?? You're always on here begging for some, now it's your turn... Oh wait - the reason you haven't yet is because you don't have any. Just your typical atheist crap and outlook!
Giants of Science

Tyrone, PA

#19 Feb 3, 2013
Reverend Irreverent wrote:
<quoted text>
Very intellectually dishonest website.
According to who, YOU? Is this based on an opinion? Well of course it is.

Our modern knowledge regarding things like biology, physics, cosmology, etc. debunk any idea of the Bible having scientific validity. The Bible didn't even get many of its own prophecies right.
And again, according to who, you??? Well of course. You have not provided one stitch of evidence that debunks anything. You have not in one instance shown ANY physics or biology that disproves even a single account in the bible. You just keep referring and wanting to use these things as tools and yet you keep coming up empty in grand style. No surprise there.
Reverend Irreverent

State College, PA

#20 Feb 3, 2013
Proof Positive wrote:
Ron Wyatt had "actual experts" with him and involved for the entire expedition. None of the information that was provided through the links has been debunked or falsified by ANYONE! And you have nothing but your sad, dark, living in a closet view on the subject, to try and rebuttal and pervert it. It's people like you who refuse to and can't see the nose on your face that are crying hoax, no one else.
You always want evidence and proof and you got it ... but as predicted, you and the atheists dismiss it because it doesn't jive with your distorted way of thinking. That's all it is. You just don't want to believe. And that's fine. Like you're always saying, you can't argue the facts! And these are undisputed facts that you can't dispute.
Sorry, but the only one that has failed, Rev, is YOU!! Because as usual, you're on here babbling big words and fancy explanations that are completely riddled with half baked ideas and opinions that have no merit what so ever. Tell you what .. How about you provide some evidence for once?? You're always on here begging for some, now it's your turn... Oh wait - the reason you haven't yet is because you don't have any. Just your typical atheist crap and outlook!
Wyatt's claims have been dismissed not only by credible scientists, archaeologists and biblical scholars, but even by other Christians and organizations like Answers In Genesis. If his finds were legitimate, AIG would be among the first groups to embrace them and spread the word. They're not, and these groups even stated so. He was called a fraud even by other evangelicals, to say nothing of how actual experts shrugged off his nonsense.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ron_Wyatt
Jump to Reception.

I was right. Whether you like it or not doesn't bother me in the slightest. Nor am I troubled over you refusing to look elsewhere to see exactly why. You're going to stubbornly believe in nonsense no matter what you're told, because you need it. Faith allows those with a lack of knowledge and certainty to believe they hold the ultimate in knowledge and certainty. It appeals to emotion and need, not rationale. And it works remarkably well, especially for the powerful as a way of control.

Nice try, but yet another failure. That's become a specialty for the posters on this board it seems.

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