Judge overturns California's ban on same-sex marriage

Aug 4, 2010 | Posted by: Topix | Full story: www.cnn.com

A federal judge in California has knocked down the state's voter-approved ban on same-sex marriage, ruling Wednesday that the state's controversial Proposition 8 violates the U.S. Constitution.

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Since: Dec 09

Knoxville, TN

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#184363
Mar 24, 2013
 

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Pietro Armando wrote:
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The key here, is by their OWN married mother and father in a stable home. That's the gold standard. I was raised by mom and dad, my children are,......and you?
<quoted text>
True.....but who doesn't want their own Mom and Dad, absent abuse of course?
<quoted text>
Ask the kids. Seriously.....that's not the point. We all have mothers and fathers, even you. Married mom and dad in a stable home is still the hold standard.
Well, if we used your standard, my parents did a horrible job because I turned out gay.

And I'm not trying to argue that children don't want their biological parents. I'm just saying it's unrealistic to believe that every single biological parent makes a good parent.

The "Gold Standard" is a stable, supportive, loving home. Whether it's parented by biological parents or not.

Kids can hope for a good biological parents, but it's just not always available.

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

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#184364
Mar 24, 2013
 

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veryvermilion wrote:
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The Supreme Court decision in Lawrence v. Texas,(2003),
That decision was based on sexual privacy. It made no assertion of " a normal, legal, expression of human sexuality."

Nor has science. In fact, the opposite is true. Obviously.

The basis of your assertions crumbles without #1.

Smile.

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

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#184365
Mar 24, 2013
 

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veryvermilion wrote:
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Do you really believe that all children raised by their biological parents fair better than all children raised by someone else?
I've worked for many years in the field of social work. And I've got to tell you, that simply isn't the case.
Two parents who are physically/emotionally abusive to their children and who have serious drug/alcohol problems DO NOT do better than children raised in a loving, stable, supportive household headed by non-biological parents--regardless of the parent's orientation.
The key to raising successful children has less to do with the biological connection to the parents and more to do with the skills of the parents.
It's not "who" raises the kids, but "how" the kids are raised.
That is the case 100% of the time.
It hardly takes an advanced degree to know this is true.
Do you really think twisting his statement to make the question 'all children' isn't obviously a ridiculous extreme?

It simply exposes your inability to provide a reasoned defense.

The fact is, biological parents are by far the best option most often.

Your claim that 'how' is best has already been disproved. Adoptive parents spend more time and attention than typical biological parents, yet the child outcome still remains severely diminished.

Like I have said many times, a social worker making the obviously silly claim of 100% success only shows the ignorant bigotry of a gay 'social worker'.

A real parent knows that no matter how good a parent is, the child holds the ultimate key.

You fail in so many ways once again VV...

Smile.

“Vita e' Bella.”

Since: May 12

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#184367
Mar 24, 2013
 

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veryvermilion wrote:
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Well, if we used your standard, my parents did a horrible job because I turned out gay.
So being raised by your own married mother and father in a stable home was not what you wanted? The fact that you're gay doesn't change the standard. You're still created and born the old fashioned way just like everybody else.
And I'm not trying to argue that children don't want their biological parents. I'm just saying it's unrealistic to believe that every single biological parent makes a good parent.
C'mon VV, I never said that, nor is that realistic.
The "Gold Standard" is a stable, supportive, loving home. Whether it's parented by biological parents or not.
Its still the "gold standard", perhaps the next one, non bio married parents in a stable home, would be the "silver", after that the "bronze".
Kids can hope for a good biological parents, but it's just not always available.
Agreed, sad but true.

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

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#184368
Mar 24, 2013
 

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veryvermilion wrote:
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The "point" of my comment was in response to the post which stated "The thing is, children raised by married mother and father have better outcomes, spend less time in prison and more time in school, for instance, than children raised by only one of their parents."
And this clearly is not the case.
Children can be raised by anyone as long at the parent(s) provide(s) the proper financial support,, discipline, stable environment, exposure to education, and love.
You guys act as though child-rearing is some deep mystery that only a married man and woman are capable of doing. And that simply is not the case.
Once again, you lie.

According to the latest, largest and most scientific study to date, out of seven family types, lesbian couples rate last. AFTER single parents. Biological parents rate first, by far.

Every culture has a version of 'blood is thicker than water'. In equal situations, every child wants the one and only real mother and father they can ever have. And in most cases, that is always best in spite of unequal parenting skills.

But perhaps you would like to post a valid study that proves otherwise?

Smile.

Since: Nov 12

Elk Grove, CA

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#184369
Mar 24, 2013
 

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endocannabanoid system wrote:
<quoted text>
ive admitted in the past these people were wrong...
how could they nOT be?? IT WAS WRONG!! many of us new it, like myself.
77 senators voted for it, and many of them were democrats.
THEY were wrong.
many of them have recanted. Bush, cheney, rumsy and wolfy have not.
im glad you have.
Now admit that you were wrong to blame it all on Bush.

“Vita e' Bella.”

Since: May 12

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#184370
Mar 24, 2013
 

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veryvermilion wrote:
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State sponsored segregation was legal throughout most of the country; particularly in the south, until the judicial branch of the federal government (i.e. The Supreme Court) found these laws unconstitutional.
As well they should.
If left up to the individual states and their legislators, who knows how long, if ever, these laws would have remained in place.
This is why the Fourteenth Amendment is so important in determining the rights of U.S. citizens. States and their residents CANNOT determine the rights of U.S. citizens.
Yesssss...however other matters such as licensing of marriage, drivers, gun owners, etc. are left to the states to decide. Simply because states have generally honored marriages performed in other states in the past, doesn't mean they are constitutionally bound to do so.

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

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#184371
Mar 24, 2013
 

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veryvermilion wrote:
<quoted text>
The "Gold Standard" is a stable, supportive, loving home. Whether it's parented by biological parents or not.
Kids can hope for a good biological parents, but it's just not always available.
What a crock of BS.

The gold standard is stable, supportive, loving biological parents. They will trump any other default situation every time.

When that gold standard is not available, the results are always severely diminished.

Over the years, my wife and I fostered over 10 children. In every case, our goal was to restore them to their mother and father. That was the desire of the children and their parents.

How many children have you fostered VV?

Smile.

“Vita e' Bella.”

Since: May 12

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#184372
Mar 24, 2013
 

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veryvermilion wrote:
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Here is the compelling reason...
1.) Scientists and the Supreme Court have determined that homosexuality is a normal, legal, expression of human sexuality. It is no worse than heterosexual behavior and no better than heterosexual behavior. It is equal. Like it or not, those are the facts based on scientific findings and legal findings in this country.
The fact that homosexuality, along with bisexuality, "...is a normal, legal, expression of human sexuality.", doesn't mean it equal to, or performs the same function as, heterosexuality. Therein lies the difference.
2.) Heterosexual relationships are granted the right, protection, and privileges of marriage. Homosexual relationships are not granted these things.
Opposite sex relationships are granted te rights, protections, and privileges of marriage. Same sex, except in a few states, relationships, are not.
3.) The Fourteenth Amendment to the Constitution states, "no state shall ... deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."
Marriage is a province of the state.
4.) So, if homosexual and heterosexual relationships are both supposed to be equal under the law; and heterosexual relationships are given more rights and protections via marriage than homosexual relationships; and the Fourteenth Amendment states clearly that no state shall deny any person the equal protection of law; then THERE IS A COMPELLING reason to give homosexual relationships THE SAME RIGHTS as heterosexual relationships.
As long as both relationships are of the opposite sex, the same rights will be granted.

“Vita e' Bella.”

Since: May 12

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#184373
Mar 24, 2013
 

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KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
What a crock of BS.
The gold standard is stable, supportive, loving biological parents. They will trump any other default situation every time.
When that gold standard is not available, the results are always severely diminished.
Over the years, my wife and I fostered over 10 children. In every case, our goal was to restore them to their mother and father. That was the desire of the children and their parents.
How many children have you fostered VV?
Smile.
I like the way you put that KM, "our goal was to restore them to their mother and father". Puts things in perspective.Thanks
Some Never Came Home

Tempe, AZ

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#184374
Mar 24, 2013
 

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Pietro Armando wrote:
<quoted text>
The fact that homosexuality, along with bisexuality, "...is a normal, legal, expression of human sexuality.", doesn't mean it equal to, or performs the same function as, heterosexuality. Therein lies the difference.
<quoted text>
Opposite sex relationships are granted te rights, protections, and privileges of marriage. Same sex, except in a few states, relationships, are not.
<quoted text>
Marriage is a province of the state.
<quoted text>
As long as both relationships are of the opposite sex, the same rights will be granted.
Marriage is a Provence of the state? Well then perhaps you should inform the Supreme court of that fact! LOL,Write them a letter or better yet call and let them know! I'm sure they will stop their deliberations on the subject as soon as you let them know!
Fritz

Bixby, OK

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Mar 24, 2013
 

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Peer reviewed studies have concluded the average life expectancy of a male queer is a mere 42 years, just one more reason to say NO to homosex!!!
Randy -Rock- Hudson

Wooster, OH

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#184376
Mar 24, 2013
 

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endocannabanoid system wrote:
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if you choose to ignore mainstream polls from the likes of "ABC news and the washington post??
mabey you could produce other information that backs up your claim that america is actually WAY more bigoted about gay marraige than ALL these recent mainstream polls suggest.
you dont have to accept anything......
but the rest of the society around you is on its way accepting gay marraige.
ps: let me guess?? you were railing against all those polls that complealt NAILED the results(state by state) of the 2012 presidential election.
you and mitt and rove were dead wrong...
Railing? Good lord, no. I already knew who was going to win. As I know who will be our next president, after we are done with Obammy. We will get another 8 years of Bush. Jeb Bush. the same one that foisted his faulty brother on us, in the election that signaled the end of America, as we had known it. The election that showed us that our election process was controlled and owned. The Bushes have been running this country for almost a century, now. If you wish to learn about our true masters, Google "Bush Crime Family" and read about the war criminal Prescott Bush, who actually financed the Third Reich. Read about who it was that actually shot President Reagan(Old family friend of the Bushes, none other than the Hinckley family, of Lubbock, Texas). Who stood to benefit from his death? Old Papa Bush...Too bad for him that it failed...Never mind, he got what he wanted later on.
I have tested the theory that the majority of Americans are behind SSM by utilizing real world testing methods, namely, using my CB radio in my semi, and by actually asking people on the street. Field testing has shown me the truth of the matter, and the truth is that most Americans do not care, one way or the other. Of those that DO care, most are against it. And I have been scoffed at, by your crowd for actually testing these claims of yours. Silly me, for putting it to the test, I have been asked about: Documentation, Peer Reviews, Error Ratios, Etc... Silly things that we all know aren't in existence from my field study. All in the attempt to poo-poo my results. ABC News and The Washington Post are all part of the media propaganda circuit that is used to feed us with the drivel that they want to shove down our throats. I believe what I see, and hear, out in the world.
Randy -Rock- Hudson

Wooster, OH

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#184377
Mar 24, 2013
 

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endocannabanoid system wrote:
<quoted text>
there is no "RIGHT" to deny others their rights.....
that is why we dont vote on minorty rights...
why dont you look it up??
or are you like riccardo??
who wont venture out of the right wing media drome to use adult search engines to do adult like research...
Neither is there a requirement to extend rights to an invalid group.
Randy -Rock- Hudson

Wooster, OH

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#184378
Mar 24, 2013
 

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endocannabanoid system wrote:
<quoted text>
I just feel sorry for them, because the ENTIRE world is going the other way in SO many ways.
most of them dont realize just how much they owe to this capitalist society and all the socialist type infrastructure paid for, by progressive taxation on the rich(up to 90%)
most of them dont know what socialist, they actaully are!!
in truth?? AS SOON as anyone leaves their property, they are using socialism..
I've already taught Chongo that we are a Socialist country.

Since: Dec 09

Knoxville, TN

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#184379
Mar 24, 2013
 

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KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
That decision was based on sexual privacy. It made no assertion of " a normal, legal, expression of human sexuality."
Nor has science. In fact, the opposite is true. Obviously.
The basis of your assertions crumbles without #1.
Smile.
Can you name one professional scientific organization, one medical organization, or one legal organization that has determined that homosexuality is a medical disorder or that is in any way unequal to a heterosexual relationship?

Waiting...
Randy -Rock- Hudson

Wooster, OH

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#184380
Mar 24, 2013
 

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Xavier Breath wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, that's it..... all the polling businesses are frauds. Mass mailings are the only valid form of gathering statistics. Yeah, you went to college..... sure you did.
I'm glad that you have finally seen things my way.
Randy -Rock- Hudson

Wooster, OH

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#184381
Mar 24, 2013
 

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veryvermilion wrote:
<quoted text>
Here is the compelling reason...
1.) Scientists and the Supreme Court have determined that homosexuality is a normal, legal, expression of human sexuality. It is no worse than heterosexual behavior and no better than heterosexual behavior. It is equal. Like it or not, those are the facts based on scientific findings and legal findings in this country.
2.) Heterosexual relationships are granted the right, protection, and privileges of marriage. Homosexual relationships are not granted these things.
3.) The Fourteenth Amendment to the Constitution states, "no state shall ... deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws."
4.) So, if homosexual and heterosexual relationships are both supposed to be equal under the law; and heterosexual relationships are given more rights and protections via marriage than homosexual relationships; and the Fourteenth Amendment states clearly that no state shall deny any person the equal protection of law; then THERE IS A COMPELLING reason to give homosexual relationships THE SAME RIGHTS as heterosexual relationships.
Word games. It may very well be that homosexuality is considered "normal and legal", but it is not equal to heterosexuality.
"...the Fourteenth Amendment states clearly that no state shall deny any person the equal protection of law;..." protection of rights that guarantee that the government shall not interfere with our abilities to function as free citizens. It does not have any authority to decree that we view homosexuality as normal and acceptable. You are attempting to use the 14th Amendment to legislate morality.
Randy -Rock- Hudson

Wooster, OH

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#184382
Mar 24, 2013
 

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Pietro Armando wrote:
<quoted text>
Of course not. There will always be situations where the bio parents cannot, or choose not, to care for their children. So what's your point?
<quoted text>
True, but children will do better in any other stable home environment .
<quoted text>
The biological connection should not be severed unless there is legitimate reason for doing so. Even gay people have a mom and dad.
<quoted text>
True
His point is to use a heavily biased comparison to show how gays can viewed as superior. However, if both groups of parents are shown to be equal in their care and affection, then the natural, biological parents will raise a happier, more stable child.
Charles

Bixby, OK

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#184383
Mar 24, 2013
 

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Fritz wrote:
Peer reviewed studies have concluded the average life expectancy of a male queer is a mere 42 years, just one more reason to say NO to homosex!!!
My cousin, who is a doctor and used to be gay, told me the same thing...that's why he decided to stop being gay.

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