Messianic Jews say they are persecute...

Messianic Jews say they are persecuted in Israel

There are 71943 comments on the Newsday story from Jun 21, 2008, titled Messianic Jews say they are persecuted in Israel. In it, Newsday reports that:

Safety pins and screws are still lodged in 15-year-old Ami Ortiz's body three months after he opened a booby-trapped gift basket sent to his family.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Newsday.

Since: Aug 11

Location hidden

#41522 Oct 5, 2012
former res wrote:
<quoted text>
True that, in that there will be an advantage for Obama going into the next debate as the (debate) underdog.
At least this time, I hope the gloves will be off.
I've got to wonder how many undecided voters actually take the time to watch the debates. For those not specifically interested in politics, the debates can be pretty boring. I suspect TV ads will have far more of an impact on the undecided, uninterested voters, and with the gafs Romney's been making, there is plenty of ammunition to use against him. I can just see it now. A SuperPac ad showing Romney chasing Big Bird with a cleaver in front of a Chick-Fil-A.
SeasideSoon

Fortson, GA

#41523 Oct 5, 2012
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
1. Since we all admit that govt funding of NPR isnt really a significant issue, why are the Conservatives making it into such an issue? Obviously, b/c of social political reasons - the inability to accept a noncommercial media
2. I see you ARE able to apply the constitutionality test to ss and public media. I dont know about you, but I expect quality of life and a social net out of my govt as well- I dont buy this govt as business argument. We have public parks - they are not specified in the Constitution either yet I would never advocate privatizing those. There are whole aspects of govt that reasonable people expect.
3. Relying on State govt for the safety net is a recipe for disaster. You think the fed govt is bad? At worst it is cloggy and semicompetent. State govts on the other hand, tend to be out right corrupt. We live in a nation - there is nothing inherently wrong for expecting us to act as a nation.
I'll have to leave these till this evening as I've completely lost two replies with some pertinent links. For now,

From Benjamin Franklin..
Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote.

When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic.

They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither safety nor liberty.
former res

Broomall, PA

#41524 Oct 5, 2012
Cult of Reason wrote:
<quoted text>
I've got to wonder how many undecided voters actually take the time to watch the debates. For those not specifically interested in politics, the debates can be pretty boring. I suspect TV ads will have far more of an impact on the undecided, uninterested voters, and with the gafs Romney's been making, there is plenty of ammunition to use against him. I can just see it now. A SuperPac ad showing Romney chasing Big Bird with a cleaver in front of a Chick-Fil-A.
Yeah...can't wait for the Big Bird ads! Already seen a few clips that are pretty funny. One with BB wearing a sign that says "Looking for Work."

Sure don't understand the thinking of anyone who's undecided at this point. "Low information voters" perhaps. Maybe these ARE folks who are primarily influenced by advertaising. One can hope.

Around 130 million of us voted in '08 (60% participation). Roughly half that number watched the debate. For what that's worth.
Cult of Reason wrote:
<quoted text>
I've got to wonder how many undecided voters actually take the time to watch the debates. For those not specifically interested in politics, the debates can be pretty boring. I suspect TV ads will have far more of an impact on the undecided, uninterested voters, and with the gafs Romney's been making, there is plenty of ammunition to use against him. I can just see it now. A SuperPac ad showing Romney chasing Big Bird with a cleaver in front of a Chick-Fil-A.
Yeah...can't wait for the Big Bird ads! Already seen a few clips that are pretty funny. One with BB wearing a sign that says "Looking for Work."

Sure don't understand the thinking of anyone who's undecided at this point. "Low information voters" perhaps. Maybe these ARE folks who are primarily influenced by advertaising. One can hope.

http://elections.gmu.edu/Turnout_2008G.html
former res

Broomall, PA

#41525 Oct 5, 2012
Wow! screed that one up.

you get the idea
Frijoles

Bristol, CT

#41526 Oct 5, 2012
former res wrote:
Wow! screed that one up.
you get the idea
Thats it. You are fired!

I am now going to do my thinking on my own.
Frijoles

Bristol, CT

#41527 Oct 5, 2012
SeasideSoon wrote:
<quoted text>They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither safety nor liberty.
I think those Conservatives who believe in the Hobbesian contract might have a little heartburn over that one.
Frijoles

Bristol, CT

#41528 Oct 5, 2012
Cult of Reason wrote:
<quoted text>
I've got to wonder how many undecided voters actually take the time to watch the debates. For those not specifically interested in politics, the debates can be pretty boring. I suspect TV ads will have far more of an impact on the undecided, uninterested voters, and with the gafs Romney's been making, there is plenty of ammunition to use against him. I can just see it now. A SuperPac ad showing Romney chasing Big Bird with a cleaver in front of a Chick-Fil-A.
Those werent gafs. They were insights into Romneys thought process.

I wouldnt think debates matter. But I do wonder that with the 24 hr news cycle frenzy that a lot of the old rules regarding media impact are no longer relevent. Therefore, debate appearances might matter in ways that we can no longer predict.

But I still think that unless you live in an igloo your mind was already made up, and at best the debate was like going to a sports event and rooting for your team.
Frijoles

Bristol, CT

#41529 Oct 5, 2012
Interesting accusations from some republicans...Our own Jack Welch in particular

----------
http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/10/05...

....The unemployment rate dropped sharply, to 7.8 percent from 8.1 percent, because the Labor Department’s survey of households showed a large gain in the number of employed people in September. The survey of businesses showed a smaller gain, but the survey also showed that hiring gains in July and August were larger than expected.....

......The surprisingly strong report led to suggestions from some Republicans on Friday morning that Labor Department economists were manipulating the numbers for Mr. Obama’s benefit.

On Twitter, Jack Welch, a Romney supporter and the former chief executive of General Electric, wrote:“Unbelievable jobs numbers … these Chicago guys will do anything … can’t debate so change numbers.”

Many economists of both parties believe such accusations are false. The Labor Department economists who compile the jobs report are not political appointees.

“Most economic data are nonsense” from month to month, Ian Shepherdson, an independent economist, wrote on Twitter, meaning that they contain a large amount of statistical noise.“But that does not mean it is rigged. We aren’t talking about Soviet tractor output here.”

.
former res

Broomall, PA

#41530 Oct 5, 2012
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
Those werent gafs. They were insights into Romneys thought process.
Often the same thing:

"A Kinsley gaffe is when a political gaffe reveals some truth that a politician didn't intend to admit.[7][8] The term comes from journalist Michael Kinsley, who said, "A gaffe is when a politician tells the truth - some obvious truth he isn't supposed to say."[9][10]"
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
I wouldnt think debates matter.
Do you think Richard Nixon would agree? He was the main reason there were no debates for 16 years.
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
But I still think that unless you live in an igloo your mind was already made up, and at best the debate was like going to a sports event and rooting for your team.
Right. It's the mythical undecideds. Where is Ross Perrot when you need him?
former res

Broomall, PA

#41531 Oct 5, 2012
Frijoles wrote:
“Unbelievable jobs numbers … these Chicago guys will do anything … can’t debate so change numbers.”
Clearly it's a black, Muslim, gay, abortion-loving, Socialist, dog-inside-the-car, pro-Big-Bird, truth-telling, tax-loving-but-not-paying, Kenyan conspiracy.

:))
Frijoles

Bristol, CT

#41532 Oct 5, 2012
former res wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you think Richard Nixon would agree? He was the main reason there were no debates for 16 years.
Yeah, but that was in the early years of TV. But you have a point about the 16 year legacy.
Frijoles

Bristol, CT

#41533 Oct 5, 2012
former res wrote:
<quoted text>
Clearly it's a black, Muslim, gay, abortion-loving, Socialist, dog-inside-the-car, pro-Big-Bird, truth-telling, tax-loving-but-not-paying, Kenyan conspiracy.
:))
I should note that Jack Welch lost a considerable amount of his wealth in the most ugliest of divorces not so long ago. It had significance for divorce law in CT - something about how much you could shelter your money from your spouse as a CEO - and if memory serves me correctly he lost big time. So he doesnt strike me as a happy camper.
Frijoles

Bristol, CT

#41534 Oct 5, 2012
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jack_Welch

Welch's income and assets came under scrutiny during his divorce from his second wife Jane in 2001, after she included details in divorce papers of what she said he received as benefits from GE. Welch's contracts with GE were subsequently investigated by the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC).[11][12] The retention package, worth $2.5 million, agreed upon by Welch and GE in 1996 promised him continued access after his retirement to benefits he received as CEO including an apartment in New York, baseball tickets and use of a private jet and chauffeured car.[11][13] These benefits were agreed upon in lieu of a more traditional stock package because, according to Welch, he did not want more money, preferring instead to retain the lifestyle he had enjoyed as CEO once he retired. According to an interview with Welch in 2009 this agreement was filed with the SEC. As a result of the media attention his divorce proceedings brought to his retention package, particularly claims that such a package made him look "greedy", Welch chose to renounce the benefits.[13]
former res

Broomall, PA

#41535 Oct 5, 2012
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
I should note that Jack Welch lost a considerable amount of his wealth in the most ugliest of divorces not so long ago. It had significance for divorce law in CT - something about how much you could shelter your money from your spouse as a CEO - and if memory serves me correctly he lost big time. So he doesnt strike me as a happy camper.
I think it was Johnny Carson who said to skip the whole marriage and divorce thing and just find a woman you don't like and give her a house.

But seriously, is there a connection between Jack Welch losing money in a divorce and suggesting that government workers are cooking the books to help Obama?

Sounds like the Twinkie defense.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twinkie_defense
former res

Broomall, PA

#41536 Oct 5, 2012
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
Yeah, but that was in the early years of TV. But you have a point about the 16 year legacy.
We're still in the tv years.(Not to belabor the....)

No one can prove conclusively the effect but there are a few notable moments. Even Mondale had an inkling.

1 of 10 moments:

"In the first debate between Reagan and Mondale, Reagan had appeared old. He was the oldest candidate in history at that time. He seemed confused by some of the questions, his answers had wandered, and the issue of age really became a large question among the press. So when he comes back in the second debate, and they ask him,'Do you think age is a problem?' He had that answer prepared, and boy did he nail it. It was subtle, it was humorous, and Mondale knew, he said right then, that he had not only lost the debate, but probably the election."

http://www.cnn.com/2012/10/02/politics/debate...

All that said, I agree that debates don't generally have a big effect, these handful of moments possibly aside. And even then, only on the undecideds. An unexact science for sure.
Frijoles

Bristol, CT

#41537 Oct 5, 2012
former res wrote:
<quoted text>
I think it was Johnny Carson who said to skip the whole marriage and divorce thing and just find a woman you don't like and give her a house.
But seriously, is there a connection between Jack Welch losing money in a divorce and suggesting that government workers are cooking the books to help Obama?
Sounds like the Twinkie defense.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Twinkie_defense
Actually, I do. Its not cause and effect though, its effect and effect.

I think the guys a loon, and the stupidity of his divorce and his comments reflect his essential looniness.
Frijoles

Bristol, CT

#41538 Oct 5, 2012
former res wrote:
I stay away from Twinkies for just that reason.
former res

Broomall, PA

#41539 Oct 5, 2012
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
I stay away from Twinkies for just that reason.
Archie yelled at Edith when she forgot to put one in his lunch box. He looked forward to hit. The loading dock was hard work.
former res

Broomall, PA

#41540 Oct 5, 2012
Frijoles wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually, I do. Its not cause and effect though, its effect and effect.
I think the guys a loon, and the stupidity of his divorce and his comments reflect his essential looniness.
Trump trumps him. FWIW.
Frijoles

Bristol, CT

#41541 Oct 5, 2012
former res wrote:
<quoted text>
Archie yelled at Edith when she forgot to put one in his lunch box. He looked forward to hit. The loading dock was hard work.


"Twinkies, there a kind of wasp soul food..."

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