#82 Aug 21, 2013
What is it about the grace of God that offends so many???
#83 Aug 21, 2013
But you threw out 7 from the OT.
BW is no more wrong than you. With SS, everybody is right.
#84 Aug 21, 2013
Even the catholics often use the word grace and then when the rubber meets the road they deny it in favor of their own works.
#85 Aug 21, 2013
You destroy Peter. Whats the difference? And the Mother of Jesus.
#86 Aug 21, 2013
"Heck, I guess we could just find us someone who has re-written the new covenant to fit his own doctrine, someone like the guy who wrote the AENT."
Wonder what hi$ motivation actually i$?
#87 Aug 21, 2013
You're absolutely wrong. God imputed/counted it righteousness when people obey the Law - do what He said. He also said it wasn't too hard to understand or to do. Paul testified against this quite starkly. Paul understood Moses to be the liar? Or God Himself? No. God is true. Moses is true. Paul is the liar. Paul nullified the very instruction of God to man - both what was received by Moses and that which was sent through the Messiah. Law and grace flow hand in hand according to God, but not according to Paul.
I know in Whom I have believed. You, on the other hand, don't!:-) You still think Paul told the truth of God and the gospel of Jesus Christ and reject the testimony of Jesus Christ from heaven itself on the topic - Paul lied, and all liars will have their abode.
#88 Aug 21, 2013
To give us a more original to the truth translation of the Set Apart Scriptures of the renewed covenant of God. Roth isn't making the fortunes other major publishers are.
This latest stuff I have been discussing is largely from my studies of the teachings of Jesus from the NKJV and more recently, the book "Jesus' Words Only" - it's confirming by suspicions about Paul and how wrong he actually was...
Why anyone would want to uphold Paul as true and find God or Moses or Jesus to be liars is a mystery to me. People heap up teachers to pay them well to tell them what they want to hear instead of what God actually said = sound doctrine.
#89 Aug 21, 2013
What Paul taught about it makes God, Moses, Jesus, the Twelve disciples/apostles and James out to be liars. That's what offends those who believe God is good and true and forever the same and that every word He speaks is eternal and true.
#90 Aug 21, 2013
"Why anyone would want to uphold Paul as true and find God or Moses or Jesus to be liars is a mystery to me."
Who is making God, Moses, and Jesus out to be "liars?"
#91 Aug 21, 2013
"God imputed/counted it righteousness when people obey the Law - do what He said."
613 laws and commandments. Now show us someone who "obeyed" the Law and was made righteous by it. It certainly isn't you.
You are completely missing the entire point about the Law. It was not given so that someone could BE righteous, it was given to show people that they CANNOT be righteous by it. Christ himself accentuated this further by telling the 12 that if a man even looks and thinks about a woman in lust he has already committed adultery.
There is NO WAY that any human being can ever hope to keep that Law. God will only accept the righteousness of his son imputed to the sinner who trusts the death, burial, and resurrection of his son on their behalf. This can only happen when a person realizes their absolute need for a savior, apart from anything they could ever do.
#92 Aug 21, 2013
"What Paul taught about it makes God, Moses, Jesus, the Twelve disciples/apostles and James out to be liars."
Oh really? Let's see what Paul told the Corinthians:
1 Corinthians 15
1 Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2 By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3 For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
5 And that he was seen of Cephas (i.e., Peter), then of the twelve:
6 After that, he was seen of above five hundred brethren at once; of whom the greater part remain unto this present, but some are fallen asleep.
7 After that, he was seen of James; then of all the apostles.
8 And last of all he was seen of me also, as of one born out of due time.
9 For I am the least of the apostles, that am not meet to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God.
10 But by the grace of God I am what I am: and his grace which was bestowed upon me was not in vain; but I laboured more abundantly than they all: yet not I, but the grace of God which was with me.
11 Therefore whether it were I or they, so we preach, and so ye believed.
12 Now if Christ be preached that he rose from the dead, how say some among you that there is no resurrection of the dead?
13 But if there be no resurrection of the dead, then is Christ not risen:
14 And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain.
15 Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ: whom he raised not up, if so be that the dead rise not.
16 For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised:
17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins.
Yeah, he totally makes everyone who came before him out to be liars with statements like these. Written with the Holy Spirit guiding his pen, no less.
#93 Aug 21, 2013
There is no such thing as a renewed covenant!
At the Last Supper Jesus held up the bread and the wine and said,This is my Body and my blood, do this in remembrance of me.(Luke 22:14-20) Jesus says in Luke 22:20,This cup is the new covenant in my blood, which is poured out for you.
To say that that is not enough, or to say that one does not realize the full meaning of all God has done UNLESS one observes the Torah, or that one is not pleasing to or loving God enough if one is not observing the Torah is to say that the shed Blood of Christ is really not enough. That is ground I would not care to tread upon. And make no mistake, that is where you are treading if you feel we all should be Torah observant.
#94 Aug 21, 2013
2 pet 3:14 So then, dear friends, since you are looking forward to this, make every effort to be found spotless, blameless and at peace with him. 15 Bear in mind that our Lords patience( means salvation, just as our dear brother Paul also wrote you with the wisdom that God gave him. 16 He writes the same way in all his letters, speaking in them of these matters. His letters contain some things that are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, as they do the other Scriptures, to their own destruction.
#95 Aug 21, 2013
"That is ground I would not care to tread upon. And make no mistake, that is where you are treading if you feel we all should be Torah observant."
The people that the Law was given to couldn't live up to it, but somehow we are expected to.
Just never gonna learn.
#96 Aug 21, 2013
So now Peter's second letter is spurious, so his affirmation of Paul is irrelevant? Come on man. Matthew, John, James, Jude and Revelation is it huh?
Last I checked, apostle is a general term meaning one who is sent. Paul never claimed to be one of the "12". Barnabas is also called an apostle. Did Luke lie, or did Paul force him to lie?
PS- you have dodged the idea of Stephen, Deuteronomy and the Psalms stating that angels were indeed at Sinai. Plus, if Paul was the Balaam of Revelation, why didn't Jesus expressly tell us it was him?
I also noticed you called Paul a liar and said he was in hell. You should tread carefully. Jesus never gave us any authority to declare such.
#97 Aug 21, 2013
"So now Peter's second letter is spurious, so his affirmation of Paul is irrelevant? Come on man. Matthew, John, James, Jude and Revelation is it huh?"
Pretty soon it'll just be the second chapter of Acts, and the rest of the NT will get tossed.
#98 Aug 21, 2013
Paul was convicted of being a false apostle and a liar in Revelation 2. James may well have been written to the Church as his guidelines for the very trial of Paul for heresy.
James was written before any of Paul's letters were written. Now you're making historical blunders and assumptions. Paul on trial before any of his letters were written? Come on sir, you're digging a deep hole.
#99 Aug 21, 2013
Many prefer bondage over freedom. It's a shame.
PS- really missed talking to you Bobby. Glad things are settling down for me now. A little more time to post now.
#100 Aug 21, 2013
"James was written before any of Paul's letters were written."
The first of Paul's letters was Galatians, and it looks like it was written in Acts 15/16. James who wrote the epistle was killed by Herod in Acts 12.
The "other" James is the half-brother of Jesus, whom Paul met in Galatians 2 with Peter and John.
#101 Aug 21, 2013
"Many prefer bondage over freedom. It's a shame."
Are you talking about freedom in Politics or being a member of the "Kingdom" of God.
Protestants in American get all confused about that.
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