The Silence of Scripture

Shawn, you cant make up your mind.

Ok, back to the two brethren who disagreed over this doctrine you are sea-sawing on.

Which brother was teaching TRUTH in the debate? One is wrong Shawn as evidenced by a debate even occurring. The propositions were opposing. They ended up agreeing to disagree, which is unity in diversity. You took both mens side, thus agreeing to disagree. hhhhhmmmmmmm

Bobby

HEATH wrote:

John 17:22I have given them the glory that you gave me, that they may be one as we are one: 23I in them and you in me. May they be brought to complete unity to let the world know that you sent me and have loved them even as you have loved me.
Romans 8:10
But if Christ is in you, your body is dead because of sin, yet your spirit is alive because of righteousness.
John 6:63The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and they are life. 64Yet there are some of you who do not believe.
AMEN!
The Holy Spirit is in us, not of the flesh but of the spirit.
www.roysecitycoc.org

Maybe you are making some progress. However the flesh body is what houses the spirit. Our old man (body) is our way of operating in this fallen world. Without the live flesh and blood body we are no longer here. To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord.

Why did the legion of demons request that Jesus send them into the herd of swine? It is because they are spirit without bodies. The best way to operate in this world to have a physical body. Jesus needed a physical body to come into this world and become our Savior, thus the virgin birth.

I do not mean to elevate the physical man, only to say we need him while we are here as citizens from an alien land. The only thing that scripture says needs to be renewed is our minds. Rom 12 says we need to renew the mind to the things of God. We are to learn how to control the flesh, rather than allow it to be our master.

In essence, we live in a flesh body and Christ in us along with HS dwelling in us, does occupy the flesh as a tent or meeting place, but what counts is the new creation.

Bill

I believe that is reading into the verse a different meaning than was intended. We often speak, even today, of doing something with all our heart, or that someone put his heart into it, or someone spoke from the heart. These are expressions of a person's sincerity. To me, it has nothing to do with meaning the heart is a musical instrument and that we are barred from using a musical instrument. That, IMO, is just not what that verse is saying. It is saying sing with sincerity of the heart. It is a description of the sincerity or deep feelings we are to sing with and has no reference at all to singing or not singing to a musical instrument. It is how we approach God with our singing type of worship---with sincerity from the heart. Whether with instruments or or without, that sincerity is strictly under your control, and no one elses. The instrument cannot change the sincerity that comes from the heart. Of course, these are just my views on the subject.

Bill

Judged:

If God is silent, isn't it just that--silence? How can someone interrupt that silence and act as if there is some sort of law in there?

If God allowed instruments in the Old Testament, and actually liked them (Psalms 150:3-5), and tells us in the Bible that instruments will be used in Heaven; wouldn't it be a "dirty trick" to condemn instruments in the New Testament by NOT SAYING ANYTHING at all? It seems kind of silly to me.

IF using instruments in worship is a sin (which I think the idea is extremely obsurd) then why do those who think it is act as if it is a greater sin than other sins. They act as if one or two hours a week spent in a building that uses an instrument to sing "Jesus Loves Me" is going to send someone to hell and then go out to eat and feed their fat bellys and don't even consider gluttony EVERY DAY to endanger their souls.

Beautiful Feet

When you go to order an cheeseburger, do you tell them you do not want a hot dog, you do not want a corny dog, you do not want a pizza?

There is a law of silence about us every day. Silence means do not go beyond what I have told you.

Basically just exactly what (1Cor.4:6)(Deut.4:2) and (Rev.22:18,19) says.

...that ye might learn in us not to think of men above that which is written...(1Cor.4:6)

2 Ye shall not add unto the word which I command you, neither shall ye diminish ought from it, that ye may keep the commandments of the LORD your God which I command you.(Deut.4:2)

18 For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book:
19 And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book.(Rev.22:18,19)

The Egyptians learned about the silence when they tried to follow the Israelites across the dry ground of the Red Sea.(Ex.14) The Egyptians were not commanded to do so.

The Egyptians ended up fish bait.

http://missionprinting.us/mp_newindex.html

Click on Publications

I highly recommend the booklet entitled -

"A Reply To A Denominational Preacher"

and

"How Can I Find the Right Church?"

Bill

Tomato with my cheese burger, please. If you added lettuce, does it then become a hotdog?

Come sing me a song BF, if you played the piano as you sang, it still is a song being sung.

There are a “few” verses in the Old Testament that ONLY state the word SING or SINGING – do you conclude no music was there?

Beautiful Feet

Bill wrote:

Tomato with my cheese burger, please. If you added lettuce, does it then become a hotdog?
Come sing me a song BF, if you played the piano as you sang, it still is a song being sung.
There are a “few” verses in the Old Testament that ONLY state the word SING or SINGING – do you conclude no music was there?

Diversion

I am concerned with the NT. All people today are living under the NT (not the OT). We are not singing to bill either. God wants things done His way or you may end up fish bait like the Egyptians in (Ex.14) or worse.

I will gladly agree with you on the IM issue if you will just show me one place in the NT which commands us to "PLAY" an instrument in worship. That is all you have to do. I would think since we are talking about eternity you would be asking for the very same evidence. But instead you go back to the OT and try to bring a portion of it into the NT. If I am not mistaken (Gal.5:4) says when you do that you have fallen from grace.

3 For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law.
4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.(Gal.5:3,4)

You still want to go back and get a portion of the OT Law?

http://thebiblespeaks.com/

HEATH

Dallas, TX

Judged:

Bill wrote:

Tomato with my cheese burger, please. If you added lettuce, does it then become a hotdog?
Come sing me a song BF, if you played the piano as you sang, it still is a song being sung.
There are a “few” verses in the Old Testament that ONLY state the word SING or SINGING – do you conclude no music was there?

When hyper-libs like Bill order from a menu of 10 items they say-

"I'd like a # 5.
Don't give me a #1
Don't give me a #2
Don't give me a #3
Don't give me a #4
Don't give me a #6
Don't give me a #7
Don't give me a #8
Don't give me a #9
Don't give me a #10"

If you were silent about the other 9 items the waiter would think you wanted them, right? lol

www.roysecitycoc.org

Bill

Yours is a better example ;) Still doesn't explain away what God already approved and never condemned - and the fact that the words SONG and SINGING are used in the OT without mention to music and they didn't come to your conclusions.

Bill

Judged:

If I told you to get me a number 10 and you got me a number 10 and three cookies because you knew I had enjoyed them in the past, I would still have my number 10 and not condemn you for doing something you know from the past I enjoyed.

Beautiful Feet

Judged:

9 Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.(Heb.10:9,10)

What men done under the OT was removed,taken out of the way,abolished.

Now Christians follow the NT law. Nowhere does the NT say to "PLAY" an instrument in NT worship. When I think of Nadab and Abihu in (Lev 10:1-3) something tells me to follow what the Lord commanded or pay the price for departing from truth.(Jn 12:48)

(Jer.10:23)(Prov 3:6)(Prov.14:12)

http://missionprinting.us/mp_newindex.html

Click on Publications

I highly recommend the booklet entitled -

"A Reply To A Denominational Preacher"

and

"How Can I Find the Right Church?"

Bill

Twisting Scripture

http://answeringthechurchesofchrist.wordpress...

HEATH

Dallas, TX

Judged:

Hyper-prog Bill already said that the early church did not use instruments.

All hyper-progs are Baptist want-to-bes.

www.roysecitycoc.org

HEATH

Dallas, TX

Judged:

Bill wrote:

If I told you to get me a number 10 and you got me a number 10 and three cookies because you knew I had enjoyed them in the past, I would still have my number 10 and not condemn you for doing something you know from the past I enjoyed.

Why do you not say list to the waiter everything on the menu you don't want?

hhhmmmm????

www.roysecitycoc.org

Beautiful Feet

HEATH wrote:

<quoted text>
Why do you not say list to the waiter everything on the menu you don't want?
hhhmmmm????
www.roysecitycoc.org

Heath, it is only when one is taught that there is no law today that people decide that there are no boundaries in religion 9no regulations or rules). This notion that people today are not under any law is not taught anywhere in the bible. But preachers continue to preach this false doctrine b/c it allows people to feel good about themselves (while living in sin). They claim they are free. You are free alright when you claim there is no law, but actually you are free from Christ.

searchingfortruth.org

Bobby

You are dead wrong as usual. We all know there are rules and boundaries. All Christians are expected to obey because we were created for good works.

The gospel is what separates us from the world and now we are free to be about the fathers business. Do you think that an un-regenerated person can please God?????

How do you always seem to get things backwards? A child is not a child unless there is a seed planted and then a birth.

Bobby

15 And I will put enmity
between you and the woman,
and between your offspring [a] and hers;
he will crush [b] your head,
and you will strike his heel."

16 To the woman he said,
"I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing;
with pain you will give birth to children.
Your desire will be for your husband,
and he will rule over you."

God promised an offspring of Eve who would crush the head of the serpent (enemy).

Bobby

God carefully orchestrated the seed of Adam to come into the world at just the right time.

There shall come forth a Rod from the stem of Jesse, And a Branch shall grow out of his roots... And in that day there shall be a Root of Jesse, Who shall stand as a banner to the people; For the Gentiles shall seek Him, And His resting place shall be glorious." (Isaiah 11:1-10)

Bobby

And when He had removed him, He raised up for them David as king, to whom also He gave testimony and said, "I have found David the son of Jesse, a man after My own heart, who will do all My will." From this man’s seed, according to the promise, God raised up for Israel a Saviour -- Jesus.(Acts 13:22-23)

I, Jesus, have sent My angel to testify to you these things in the churches. I am the Root and the Offspring of David, the Bright and Morning Star.(Revelation 22:16)

Bobby