Since: Sep 07

United States

#42 Nov 1, 2007
As with BioDiesel, any "alternative fuel" is going to be a compromise in MPG. That is a given, based on physics & chemistry.

The transportation cost does eat into the production. However, since agriculture now drives ethanol production facilities, I doubt the concept of a collective terminal to drive a pipeline is even practical due to the regional nature of agriculture. Also be aware that all alternative fuels are more sensitive to water contamination than diesel & that is particularly true of ethanol.

Coal is the most abundant resource we have in the US for energy. There is a process that can "gasify" coal, however, it too requires energy & lots more than ethanol. As this is applied toward the energy in/energy out debate, this is another trade off. As oil heads to $100/barrel, it is becoming economically feasible to gasify coal. There are also oil sands which is a working concept but mainly up in Canada. On the upside for coal & rail transport, Virginia Southern railroad operates to mainly supply coal to the cogen plant in Clarksville, since the demise of both Russell Stover & Burlington. I know that corn hoppers would be a new source of revenue for them & would preserve an efficient means of transportation in our region.

As Stephan has said, I too welcome anyone who wants to debate the facts as we discover them. My mind is not closed but I can only speak for me. As long as disinformation & emotion stay out of the debate, we all walk away the wiser. However, it seems to me that the only flourishing economy in this area right now is the underground economy of campaign signs for the NIMBYs & political hacks. Perhaps after the election, the paper & plastic recycling markets will rise in value?
native living in raleigh wrote:
<quoted text>ethanol delivers 30 percent fewer miles a gallon than gasoline. since the us has no major pipelines for ethanol,transportation by truck,rail,or barge drives up the price.most ethanol plants burn natural gas or,increasingly,coal to create the steam that drives the distillation.the amount of fossil energy used to make ethanol versus the energy it produces suggest that ethanol is a losers game.should i go on?
Stephen Hatcher Jr

Fort Mitchell, VA

#43 Nov 1, 2007
Native let me go on the record and say that i am agianst the use of corn as i fear it will rise food prices. It will cause our food prices to compete with fuel demand and that is VERY BAD. That being said we have talked with the individuals that are involved with the design of this plant. They have expressed intrest in the Hulless barley that VPI has developed as opposed to corn. They have also expressed using switch grass and not corn. They also may want to use the celulosic version once it becomes feasiable. Please see the novozymes site for more info on this. The plant just up the road from you in franklenton is the sole plant working on the enzymes needed for this process. I am glad you are open to this debate most agianst it here would not even listen this far. Please look into what i am saying and you will see it is the truth. As i stated before if you find anything to the contrary please provide it here and we WILL post on our site. Thanks agian

Since: Aug 07

Chase City, Va

#44 Nov 1, 2007
Well now let me barge in for a comment on the ethanol net energy balance. While ethanol does get less mpg than gas, gasoline supplies are almost to the tipping point as we speak. Actually, petroleum is but I'll say gas for short. To compare the two is really becoming a moot point. We already know it's almost $100.00 per barell but we also have to take in account the supply is diminishing. Let's add another fact as well, that from the distillation process of ethanol we gain DDG's to feed livestock. To say we are losing corn that would feed our livestock is untrue. We use the sugars and starches but the protein in the DDG's are actually better than the whole kernal because you have removed the fatty sugars and starches. Actually we only "borrow" the livestock grain. Let's set aside corn at any rate. Barley is the choice of this area and lots of work has been done to produce a high content sugar/starch hulless barley and it's paying off in the ethanol field. Just do the research on it, it's very informative.

Since: Aug 07

Chase City, Va

#45 Nov 1, 2007
I forgot to metion in the last post that the owners of the proposed ethanol plant are working with VPI to bring local farmers up to speed in the hulless barley strains. Craig Sheely, president of Osage Bio Energy, made it clear he wants to use barley grown locally, a 60 mile radius of Chase City, to be the feedstock of the plant. This fact was re-stated by a representitive from the Va. Dept. of Agriculture at the August 8 meeting in Chase City. It was an open meeting and the facts can be checked by contacting any of the local media. So, let's just take corn out of the big picture and understand it will be a barley feedstock plant.
native living in raleigh

Durham, NC

#46 Nov 1, 2007
there is no magic-bullet fuel crop that can solve our energy woes without harming the environment,says virtually every scientist studying the issue.every biofuels also consumes crops that could be feeding a hungry globe.a recent un report concludes that although the potential benefits are large,the biofuels boom could reduce food security and drive up food prices in a world where 25,000 people die of hunger every day,most under the age of 5.just something else to take in consideration.
Stephen Hatcher Jr

Fort Mitchell, VA

#47 Nov 2, 2007
absolutlly but does these scientist have a solution to the problem then. At this point no. We are at the point of a crisis and need to come with a solution to hold us untill this magic bullet is found. I dont know about you. But 3.50 a gallon is going to be that magical number for me. At that point what ever gets me to work that i can afford is what i am going to be willing to do. Because if i cant afford to wrok then all the food crops in the world being scarce is not going to matter because i cant buy it. Another part of the equation to consider as well. Your points are very valid but the bottom line is we have to do something now. Is ethanol the permenent answer? In its current form no. The celulosic version holds lots of promise as we can use anything organic and not just food crops. Will that be the magic bullet? We will have to see once the technology is perfected. Hydrogen fuel cell is still atleast 15-20 years away. They are already saying that we are at peak oil. We are on the decline from here according to some. Of course we could all bite the magic bullet and start walking agian. dont think that will happen either. You can buy the plug in cars now.$50,000 plus. I cant afford that either. I guess what i am saying is if some one will provide me witht he info on a new technology that is a close to use as ethanol that is better i will entertain the debate. But as of now no one has been able to do that.

Since: Aug 07

Chase City, Va

#48 Nov 2, 2007
I agree there is no magic bullet crop but I think too, with a concentration on a multi fuel program including geothermal,wind,ethanol,hydro and solar the United States can decrease its reliance on mid eastern petroleum. It's a must do, not a should do. If the mid east decides to cut oil supplies and Venezuela follows suit where will we be? We all need to open our eyes to the next 20 years instead of the "now". America is at a turning point and we've got to start looking out for us before trying to feed the world. If the U.S. falls so follows the grains. We are at the mercy of the Saudis and I don't think I want to stake my kids future on them. I'm also of the opinion we may need to take a look at the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge as a source of domestic oil. I hate to say hate but it may come to it.
Not Nieve

Birmingham, AL

#49 Nov 2, 2007
So much concern for world peace and globel hunger. I agree with the concerns although at the same time I am concerned about our needs in the USA. We have become more relient on foriegn countries than they are of us. Just think about it, what is still made in this country? Not a whole lot other than food,a shinking automotive industry and very little furniture. The largest and most dependable products made in the USA today are largely manufactured from our natural resources. Ethanol in its present form is certainly not the ansewer but it sure is a step in the right direction. As far as the environment goes every postive impact has some negative results.The perfect world would be to have this country the way it was 500 years ago. I do'nt think thats going to happen! So if people are not willing to adapt to change and take chances then what is our chances of finding the magic bullet?
I think it's time to concentrate on the needs of the people in the USA and give support,thats how this nation was created to began with. If you are not willing to do this and continue thinking short term, I guess there will be no long term plan to worry about.
native living in raleigh

Durham, NC

#50 Nov 2, 2007
we all need to start looking towards the 08 election.the next president will have a big impact on how we procede with natural resources and its use.does anyone know which candidate is for or against bio- fuels?
sosueme

Annapolis, MD

#51 Nov 2, 2007
Why worry about the next president, now is the time to express your concerns and support what you actually believe in. Going along with the flow sometimes lands you in the drain.All candidates have pluses and minuses.If you do not have faith in any of the candidates why vote at
all. You do bring up a good point though!
native living in raleigh

Durham, NC

#52 Nov 3, 2007
just look at whats going on with Iran right now.If the president signs a bill to sanction them from exporting we are going to be in a trouble.this bill is making its way through congress right now,and if it is signed, say hello to another cold war crisis with Russia because they are backing them. its not going to really matter what alternate fuels we use because they just might try to blow us off the map.i agree we need to become a more self sufficient country and not rely on the oil providers that are all wack jobs.i am worried that window is closed and now we need to turn our attention on survival as a nation.now some may say that my statements are a little pre- mature,that we are strong and they are weak but i think we have already learned our lesson about underestimating our enemy in iraq.

Since: Aug 07

Chase City, Va

#53 Nov 3, 2007
I agree entirely about being self sufficient. I also agree on the underestimating of the Iraqi situation. As for who supports alternative energy, a very good question native in raleigh. I have to admit I was suprised when Bush actually endorsed it last year and was equally pleased that he diverted 14 billion in from "Big Oil" subsidies to the ethanol industry. But in the big picture most of the republican party have dismissed global warming as non-sense and greenhouse gasses as a cuplrit as bogus. On the other hand the democrats and independants
(Al Gore,Ralph Nader) have believed it for years. I know Obama has always endorsed ethanol, Clinton has come around to it but only recently. Edwards was pushing for it 4 years ago so I assume he still he still does. I'm not sure on the individual republicans but I will find out.
Practice What They Preach

Gloucester, VA

#54 Nov 3, 2007
I have heard on the news over the past few months who supports and who doesnt.....would be realy nice if the supporters like Gore who actually won an award for a film based on this issue PRACTICED what they preach in real life! All the hypocrits who claim to be all for it while owning nice gas guzzling cars, planes and high energy eating homes! Oh but wait, they carry burlap bags instead of plastic to the grocery store so that makes it OK! They need to stop traveling by plane, buy a better vehicle and stop with the 1,000 electric bills, then they can say they support it! Actually they need to live like we do...lol. own one modest home, have a car/truck thats got great gas milage and yell at the kids to keep the door shut, what do they live in a barn?

I think ethonal is good thing, for Chase City and as a begining to finding an alternative to energy. and YES, I do live in Chase City.

Since: Aug 07

Chase City, Va

#55 Nov 4, 2007
You have a point about Gore and his big house and huge electric bills and such. But still, he has managed to help bring attention to the problem. He's a hypocrit but atleast he admits it's a problem and that's more than most politicians do. I own 2 vehicles myself. A 4 cylender pickup that gets 26 mpg and a 4 cylender car that gets 33+mpg. I keep my thermostat to 66 in winter, wear warm clothes in the house. In the summer my thermostat is set to 78. We recycle all paper, plastic, and glass. I've replaced all bulbs in my house with the low energy CFLs. I do practice what I preach. I wish I could afford solar panels for water heating but it's too expensive now. I'm keeping my eyes peeled though. Right now ther's a 30% gov't. rebate on solar panels, if it goes to 50% I'll buy. Hmmmm, I don't have a burlap bag yet though. I ain't that devoted yet. Just kidding. Practice What They Preach, the group that's been supporting the ethanol plant has a web site, if interested it's www.ccprogress.com and I'm glad you're a supporter of the plant.

Since: Jul 07

Crewe, VA

#56 Nov 4, 2007
I want to say that it is nice to have all of you that have recenty added to this post. It am glad to see people still showing concern for this issue in what ever possition the hold on it. I agree about the practice what they preach thing. I to am hoping to buy a home here soon and i am already looking into the solar panels along with some other technologies. I drive a vehicle that gets 36 miles to the gallon as well as have one of thoes gas guzzling Pickups that get about 21 MPG. Use it only for hauling now. PWTP you tell the truth. If you are going to preach on about this crap you had better be backing it yourself. If our leaders would do this i think the public would follow a lot better then they are. However, we dont need them to do that. We are adults and can take that resposiblity upon ourselves. Then they can follow us :):)
Practice What They Preach

Gloucester, VA

#57 Nov 4, 2007
chasecityrez thanx for the link to the web site I will definetly check it out. I will give kudos to Gore for making us more aware, but thats as far as I will go! LOL! This board is much nicer than the sheriff board! I have read all the post over there but I refuse to get sucked in and I have not written one thing. I realy hope we get the ethonal plant for many reasons, we need to do something to keep our familys HERE and stop living with our heads in the sand and letting everyone else get what we had a shot at but refused. If we dont take the plant someone else will.

Since: Jul 07

Crewe, VA

#58 Nov 4, 2007
Practice what you preach i agree with you completely on the sherrif board. I am ashamed that some of thoes people live in this area the way they act. Like you i have refused to get involved with that post. I have wanted to say things but refuse to get into the name calling thing. If you like the Concerned Citizens for progress mission and would lke to help us please come by and see what we are about. At this point we are starting to shift some away from the ethanol debate until something new develops in it. Now we are looking to other ways to help the area grow. New people and ideas would be more than welcomed and would help greatly. We hold meetings every wednesday. If intrested please let us know and we will provide you with the information on where and when we meet. Or you can look thru these postings and find it as well.

Since: Aug 07

Chase City, Va

#59 Nov 5, 2007
To elaborate on what Stephen said we want to do more for our community and not just be a group who is a "for or against" organization. It's really up to the people of the community to make or break a community. It may sound a bit corny to some but I believe a town or a community are a refelection of the people who live in it and how they care for it. If we want to attract industry and business we have to project a positive environment. That takes more than nice flags and clean streets. We need people who care. Memerbership fees in Corncerned Citizens for Progress are a little time and desire for a better community. If you can give that, then you've paid the dues.
native living in raleigh

United States

#60 Nov 5, 2007
Stephen Hatcher Jr wrote:
Practice what you preach i agree with you completely on the sherrif board. I am ashamed that some of thoes people live in this area the way they act. Like you i have refused to get involved with that post. I have wanted to say things but refuse to get into the name calling thing. If you like the Concerned Citizens for progress mission and would lke to help us please come by and see what we are about. At this point we are starting to shift some away from the ethanol debate until something new develops in it. Now we are looking to other ways to help the area grow. New people and ideas would be more than welcomed and would help greatly. We hold meetings every wednesday. If intrested please let us know and we will provide you with the information on where and when we meet. Or you can look thru these postings and find it as well.
thats what i talking about""'kudos mr. hatcher
Golden Fleece

United States

#61 Dec 5, 2007
There are any number of industries that would provide more jobs with less environmental impact. Ethanol seems to be the "Golden Fleece" of the decade but it is already beginning to lose it's lustre due to the enviromental impact and the rising cost of food.

I don't live in Mecklenburg county but close enough to Chase City where I will be impacted one way or another by this plant.

Cindy
http://www.southsideliving.blogspot.com

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Chase City Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
where do i go to get a free background check? (Nov '13) Dec '13 Will 2
How do you look up someone's Work History? (Dec '13) Dec '13 voxovalorehy 2
Does anyone know a better downloading source th... (Dec '13) Dec '13 lamobusibev 2
men (Mar '13) Mar '13 goo goo girl 1
Mecklenburg County School Board (Mar '13) Mar '13 Judy Lewis 2
Only in Mecklenburg County (Jan '13) Jan '13 WhoReallyCares 1
Comcast availabilty in chase city (Jun '12) Jun '12 Jess 1
Chase City Dating
Find my Match
More from around the web

Chase City People Search

Addresses and phone numbers for FREE

Chase City News, Events & Info

Click for news, events and info in Chase City

Personal Finance

Mortgages [ See current mortgage rates ]

NFL Latest News

Updated 12:56 pm PST