Mich. counties, businesses clash on s...

Mich. counties, businesses clash on smoking bans

There are 92 comments on the Battle Creek Enquirer story from Jan 27, 2009, titled Mich. counties, businesses clash on smoking bans. In it, Battle Creek Enquirer reports that:

Northern Michigan logger Roger Griffin got so upset about the anti-smoking restrictions Charlevoix County imposed on local businesses that he filed a lawsuit.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Battle Creek Enquirer.

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“SECOND HAND SMOKE IS A JOKE ”

Since: Dec 08

tobacco road

#1 Jan 27, 2009
A report published in the British Medical Journal last October was hailed by the anti-tobacco lobby as definitive proof when it claimed that non-smokers living with smokers had a 25 per cent risk of developing lung cancer. But yesterday, Dr Chris Proctor, head of science for BAT Industries, the tobacco group, said the findings had to be taken seriously. "If this study cannot find any statistically valid risk you have to ask if there can be any risk at all.

"It confirms what we and many other scientists have long believed, that while smoking in public may be annoying to some non-smokers, the science does not show that being around a smoker is a lung-cancer risk." The WHO study results come at a time when the British Government has made clear its intention to crack down on smoking in thousands of public places, including bars and restaurants.

“SECOND HAND SMOKE IS A JOKE ”

Since: Dec 08

tobacco road

#2 Jan 27, 2009
boy oh boy you guys will have fun with this jerk.
POOR GUY

Grand Rapids, MI

#4 Jan 28, 2009
Son, give it up already. Smoking needs to become illegal to save lives. That is the direction we are heading but it is a slow process because people like you are very addicted to tobacco. We will get there though and it will mean that many people will not die from diseases caused by smoking. Children will not weep by their parents and grandparents bedside because they are dying young due to smoking. You see son, nobody takes the pro-smokers seriously when it comes to science. Because, just about everyone has had a personal experience with the side effects of being around smokers. I am the first one in my family to have asthma. I grew up in a farm community, not a smoggy city. Every night, I ate dinner in a cumulonimbus smoke cloud because my parents smoked. I don't need science to tell that people are hacking up a lung and its because they live with smokers. Like a said, nobody takes your side serious except fellow addicts.
something to think about

Traverse City, MI

#5 Jan 28, 2009
What us non-smokers are not considering is the loss that will happen from banning smoking or making it illegal. Think about it, a pack of smokes costs almost $7 today. Most of that is TAXES. How much tax money will be lost if smoking is illegal? My guess is hundreds of millions of dollars. What about the farmers that grow tobacco? More farms to forclose on. Will the "break" in health insurance costs compensate for the loss in tax money, not even close. Yes, it will save lives, but it will destroy others. If they want to smoke, let them. If you don't like to breath second hand smoke, stay away from smokers or places they frequent.

“SECOND HAND SMOKE IS A JOKE ”

Since: Dec 08

tobacco road

#6 Jan 28, 2009
My guess is hundreds of millions of dollars
it will be in the 10s of billions.

“SECOND HAND SMOKE IS A JOKE ”

Since: Dec 08

tobacco road

#7 Jan 28, 2009
Higher tobacco taxes means basically the same thing as prohibition,both create a public need for a blackmarket for a cheaper product...hence get ready for al capones return.
Freedom

Niles, MI

#8 Jan 28, 2009
POOR GUY wrote:
Son, give it up already. Smoking needs to become illegal to save lives. That is the direction we are heading but it is a slow process because people like you are very addicted to tobacco. We will get there though and it will mean that many people will not die from diseases caused by smoking. Children will not weep by their parents and grandparents bedside because they are dying young due to smoking. You see son, nobody takes the pro-smokers seriously when it comes to science. Because, just about everyone has had a personal experience with the side effects of being around smokers. I am the first one in my family to have asthma. I grew up in a farm community, not a smoggy city. Every night, I ate dinner in a cumulonimbus smoke cloud because my parents smoked. I don't need science to tell that people are hacking up a lung and its because they live with smokers. Like a said, nobody takes your side serious except fellow addicts.
I take it this is the answer you give the non-smokers who oppose your new form of socialism? How well does that doublespeak work on them?

Tell us oh self righteous one....what form of government is most likely to declare private property "public space"?

What form of government is most likely to feel the need to "level the playing field"? Hhhhmmmm

While our constitution goes up in flames...we have those like yourself who seemingly come here to cheer.

“Invest in US!”

Since: Jan 09

West Central Michigan

#9 Jan 28, 2009
POOR GUY wrote:
Son, give it up already. Smoking needs to become illegal to save lives. That is the direction we are heading but it is a slow process because people like you are very addicted to tobacco. We will get there though and it will mean that many people will not die from diseases caused by smoking. Children will not weep by their parents and grandparents bedside because they are dying young due to smoking. You see son, nobody takes the pro-smokers seriously when it comes to science. Because, just about everyone has had a personal experience with the side effects of being around smokers. I am the first one in my family to have asthma. I grew up in a farm community, not a smoggy city. Every night, I ate dinner in a cumulonimbus smoke cloud because my parents smoked. I don't need science to tell that people are hacking up a lung and its because they live with smokers. Like a said, nobody takes your side serious except fellow addicts.
There must be something you do that I want to outlaw because of a health concern. Please submit your list of things you do that might pose a health risk to me. I will then scientifically prove that it should be outlawed for my benefit.

“SECOND HAND SMOKE IS A JOKE ”

Since: Dec 08

tobacco road

#10 Jan 28, 2009
POOR GUY wrote:
Son, give it up already. Smoking needs to become illegal to save lives. That is the direction we are heading but it is a slow process because people like you are very addicted to tobacco. We will get there though and it will mean that many people will not die from diseases caused by smoking. Children will not weep by their parents and grandparents bedside because they are dying young due to smoking. You see son, nobody takes the pro-smokers seriously when it comes to science. Because, just about everyone has had a personal experience with the side effects of being around smokers. I am the first one in my family to have asthma. I grew up in a farm community, not a smoggy city. Every night, I ate dinner in a cumulonimbus smoke cloud because my parents smoked. I don't need science to tell that people are hacking up a lung and its because they live with smokers. Like a said, nobody takes your side serious except fellow addicts.
What you fail to see my prohibitionist opponent is america is for freedom to go and do as we please.....not to be restricted or prohibitied by the likes of you and your socialist buddies.
Your entire shs/ets scam is a bunch of lies and you see I provide the public with the truth.......and the best you can come up with is another horror story..........sorry but your kind is whats on the way out as more and more americans see you for what you are........
POOR GUY

Grand Rapids, MI

#11 Jan 28, 2009
Freedom, sheridan and confederate:

Sometimes, things need to be changed. Just like cocaine is outlawed, so to should be tobacco. In your way of thinking - once something is made legal it is a right never to be taken away. I would suggest that you start thinking about how precious life is before you cling to your socialist comments as a rebuttle to a legitimate health issue. We will lose tax dollars, its worth it if it saves one life.

“SECOND HAND SMOKE IS A JOKE ”

Since: Dec 08

tobacco road

#12 Jan 28, 2009
POOR GUY wrote:
Freedom, sheridan and confederate:
Sometimes, things need to be changed. Just like cocaine is outlawed, so to should be tobacco. In your way of thinking - once something is made legal it is a right never to be taken away. I would suggest that you start thinking about how precious life is before you cling to your socialist comments as a rebuttle to a legitimate health issue. We will lose tax dollars, its worth it if it saves one life.
dip chit,you really dont know much about tobacco,its always been here,you think we are the first..........you think tobacco prohibition hasnr been tried befor. The first currency of the new nation was tobacco and whiskey because we had no currency worth anything,you never heard the old adage its not worth a greenback....with the current economic mess and the govmnts bailout backfires our currency wont be worth anything again and will end up creating another great depression as it did in 1933......43 states had tobacco prohibition during alcohol prohibition.nothings changed about your kind except the dates,the same scare tactics were tried then as now..........you rerepeat history and yet again it will FAIL.
Freedom

Niles, MI

#13 Jan 28, 2009
POOR GUY wrote:
Freedom, sheridan and confederate:
Sometimes, things need to be changed. Just like cocaine is outlawed, so to should be tobacco. In your way of thinking - once something is made legal it is a right never to be taken away. I would suggest that you start thinking about how precious life is before you cling to your socialist comments as a rebuttle to a legitimate health issue. We will lose tax dollars, its worth it if it saves one life.
How about providing us with a list of things you do that some may consider unhealthy... that you are willing to be stripped of by force by a bunch of self righteous moral busybodies.

It's for your own good...you know.

Seems you have also forgotten that prohibition fails everywhere it is tried. You do know even Popes have tried to ban tobacco...right?

Do you really think your latest group of self righteous moral busybodies will fair any better?

Those who forget the past will repeat it. Those who deny the past should be feared.
POOR GUY

Grand Rapids, MI

#14 Jan 28, 2009
Freedom -I like a guy who can get his point across without being too disrespectful-good job!
I chew tobacco, I have for 30 years. I quit for two years after my brother in law died young and left his wife with 3 little kids. They cut off half his face. Ive never heard of that happening with a non-tobacco user. Ya, I chew and I wish it was illegal! You think its all about rights and I think its about national health-we won't agree, keep it real though, you seem like a good guy.
Confederate - WTF?

“Invest in US!”

Since: Jan 09

West Central Michigan

#15 Jan 28, 2009
POOR GUY wrote:
Freedom, sheridan and confederate:
Sometimes, things need to be changed. Just like cocaine is outlawed, so to should be tobacco. In your way of thinking - once something is made legal it is a right never to be taken away. I would suggest that you start thinking about how precious life is before you cling to your socialist comments as a rebuttle to a legitimate health issue. We will lose tax dollars, its worth it if it saves one life.
Do you drive? You know cars can be hazardous, I now think that it should be outlawed....why don't you worry about your life, don't try to save mine. I can handle myself just fine in this free land, but when you want to take away things from me, It will only lead to retaliation...your opinions are respected but to legislate them against me is unethical...it aint to save lives if they did want that they would not tax the hell outta them. Are you willing to ante up when that tax money is gone. What do you use that is so harshly taxed..it would be much more fair to tax bathroom tissue...say 2.25 a roll it would spread the burden across everybody not just what I choose to do.

“Invest in US!”

Since: Jan 09

West Central Michigan

#16 Jan 28, 2009
POOR GUY wrote:
Freedom -I like a guy who can get his point across without being too disrespectful-good job!
I chew tobacco, I have for 30 years. I quit for two years after my brother in law died young and left his wife with 3 little kids. They cut off half his face. Ive never heard of that happening with a non-tobacco user. Ya, I chew and I wish it was illegal! You think its all about rights and I think its about national health-we won't agree, keep it real though, you seem like a good guy.
Confederate - WTF?
I also think you should stop chewing tobacco, I hear it's not good for you.
Sneaky Pete

Traverse City, MI

#17 Jan 28, 2009
Our wonderful new liberal mayor is trying to get smoking outlawed in every bar and resturaunt in the city. This is another example of government going nuts. Second hand smoke is a nusisance, not a health risk. My 90 year old grandma will tell you. She's never smoked, but has been around smokers her whole life and is healthier than I am. I'm a non-smoker and think government needs to butt out for a change. It all falls into this liberal agenda of having everyone in this county living in a fantasy world where if we all wear bike helmets, nobody will get hurt; if we take the grading system out of school, nobody will get their feelings hurt if they get a bad grade; if we be nice to terrorists and criminals, they'll be nice to us; if we ban smoking then everyone will be healthier because that's what they do in California and we all know that everyone in California knows better than we do.

The nutty libs and they're weird lifestyles only make up a fraction of this population, but the good honest folk that make up the rest of this country are getting tired of these goofballs telling us how we need to live our lives.

Smoke, drink, don't wear helmets, don't wear seatbelts, drive a gas guzzler, refuse to acknowledge spanish as having a legitimate use in this country. Do whatever makes you happy as long as it's within reason and doesn't break any "current" laws. After all, this is America.

“SECOND HAND SMOKE IS A JOKE ”

Since: Dec 08

tobacco road

#18 Jan 28, 2009
POOR GUY wrote:
Freedom -I like a guy who can get his point across without being too disrespectful-good job!
I chew tobacco, I have for 30 years. I quit for two years after my brother in law died young and left his wife with 3 little kids. They cut off half his face. Ive never heard of that happening with a non-tobacco user. Ya, I chew and I wish it was illegal! You think its all about rights and I think its about national health-we won't agree, keep it real though, you seem like a good guy.
Confederate - WTF?
Your a nazi in disguise, read what ya wrote typical ACS propaganda, start with A SOB STORY then work in your a tobacco user thats for smoking bans and all that horse shit..........yes your a NAZI.

“SECOND HAND SMOKE IS A JOKE ”

Since: Dec 08

tobacco road

#19 Jan 28, 2009
Smoke, drink, don't wear helmets, don't wear seatbelts, drive a gas guzzler, refuse to acknowledge spanish as having a legitimate use in this country. Do whatever makes you happy as long as it's within reason and doesn't break any "current" laws. After all, this is America.

TO HELL WITH THEIR LAWS,live as you see fit and break every social law they make.........we are defiant because they have become king george the 3rd all over again..........freedom baby thats what its all about,for what is life without it but a dismal world of obeying puppet master.
I refuse to submit.

“Come and get it! ”

Since: Jan 09

Traverse City

#20 Jan 28, 2009
CONFEDERATE_1978 wrote:
TO HELL WITH THEIR LAWS,live as you see fit and break every social law they make.........we are defiant because they have become king george the 3rd all over again..........freedom baby thats what its all about,for what is life without it but a dismal world of obeying puppet master.
I refuse to submit.
Boy...that's deep.
Jen

Charlotte, NC

#21 Jan 28, 2009
Sneaky Pete wrote:
Our wonderful new liberal mayor is trying to get smoking outlawed in every bar and resturaunt in the city. This is another example of government going nuts. Second hand smoke is a nusisance, not a health risk. My 90 year old grandma will tell you. She's never smoked, but has been around smokers her whole life and is healthier than I am. I'm a non-smoker and think government needs to butt out for a change. It all falls into this liberal agenda of having everyone in this county living in a fantasy world where if we all wear bike helmets, nobody will get hurt; if we take the grading system out of school, nobody will get their feelings hurt if they get a bad grade; if we be nice to terrorists and criminals, they'll be nice to us; if we ban smoking then everyone will be healthier because that's what they do in California and we all know that everyone in California knows better than we do.
The nutty libs and they're weird lifestyles only make up a fraction of this population, but the good honest folk that make up the rest of this country are getting tired of these goofballs telling us how we need to live our lives.
Smoke, drink, don't wear helmets, don't wear seatbelts, drive a gas guzzler, refuse to acknowledge spanish as having a legitimate use in this country. Do whatever makes you happy as long as it's within reason and doesn't break any "current" laws. After all, this is America.
Yes Sir...I like the way you think!

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