At murder trial, witnesses say Seabee...

At murder trial, witnesses say Seabee spoke of harming man

There are 52 comments on the Los Angeles Times story from Apr 17, 2007, titled At murder trial, witnesses say Seabee spoke of harming man. In it, Los Angeles Times reports that:

A Ventura County sailor, on trial for murder, spoke to numerous co-workers and friends on different occasions at the Navy's Seabee base about her desire to harm or kill the former husband of her roommate in the ...

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Los Angeles Times.

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Overwhelmed

Santa Clarita, CA

#1 May 2, 2007
Public record, to release names without permission legally. Now that people can google my name, see my picture and read these articles I'm overwhelmed. Thank you public record for ruining my name and my fellow Seabees that I work with's reputation. We fight for this country, for freedoms you have, and you use your freedom of speech and do nothing but disgrace us. How about a ,"Thank you young men and women for coming forward in a very hard time. Thank you for your honor,courage and commitment."

“No News is No News”

Since: Jan 07

Camarillo, CA

#2 May 3, 2007
Overwhelmed wrote:
Public record, to release names without permission legally. Now that people can google my name, see my picture and read these articles I'm overwhelmed. Thank you public record for ruining my name and my fellow Seabees that I work with's reputation. We fight for this country, for freedoms you have, and you use your freedom of speech and do nothing but disgrace us. How about a ,"Thank you young men and women for coming forward in a very hard time. Thank you for your honor,courage and commitment."
It does seem that after people came forward and gave the prosecutors the testimony and evidence needed to build a good case, they could have offered anonymity to the witnesses. They could just as easily said in the article, a reliable source, and leave all else alone. The approach of putting people on front-street is actually causing long-term problems for law enforcement and prosecutors. The real problem is going to be when the prosecutors have to work even harder to build their cases because no one will want to aid in their investigations that currently put the witnesses under a microscope and disrupt their lives in the process. If it is any consolation to those people that the press betrayed, if the worse thing that people can say is that you helped bring a killer(s) to justice, then be proud, be strong, and be relieved. You will not carry the burden and the guilt of knowing vital information that could have helped heal a family and community and most important helped justice prevail. I applaud you.
Chill

Laguna Beach, CA

#3 May 3, 2007
Overwhelmed wrote:
Public record, to release names without permission legally. Now that people can google my name, see my picture and read these articles I'm overwhelmed. Thank you public record for ruining my name and my fellow Seabees that I work with's reputation. We fight for this country, for freedoms you have, and you use your freedom of speech and do nothing but disgrace us. How about a ,"Thank you young men and women for coming forward in a very hard time. Thank you for your honor,courage and commitment."
I am so sorry you feel overwhelmed by all of this. You shouldn't though. You did the right thing by talking to the authorities. John Marmo and his family deserve justice and if your statements help give them that, then you should be proud of yourself. It doesn't matter if you are in the military or not, as a person you did right by the Marmo family and society. I have relatives in the Navy and I am proud of all serviceman who serve our country. It's unfortunate these Seabees disgraced the Navy, but believe me most people know they are the exception. I think what people are having a hard time with is the fact there were quite a few people who were approached by Butler and didn't do anything...I think only 1 guys went to his commanding officer. It could be one of those situations where you had to be there to understand why no one took Butler more seriously. I bet they wish they did now; I don't blame anyone but Toerner, Butler, Braswell, and Hardy. They are a disgrace to the Navy! THANK YOU FOR YOU COMMITMENT TO THE U.S.A. God Bless the USA!
whatsit toyou

Bronx, NY

#4 May 8, 2007
Overwhelmed, I just have a question. Did you go to the authorities before OR after the murder? Neither your name nor reputation of fellow seabees is ruined, just these individuals involved.
Chill

Laguna Beach, CA

#5 May 8, 2007
whatsit toyou wrote:
Overwhelmed, I just have a question. Did you go to the authorities before OR after the murder? Neither your name nor reputation of fellow seabees is ruined, just these individuals involved.
I agree with you; "Overwhelmed" should worry about their reputation. The 4 people who plotted to kill Marmo it's their reputation and life that is ruined. I would hope "Overwhelmed" had the support of his/her friends and co-worker whether they are in the Navy or not. "Overwhelmed", you did the right thing by talking to the authorities. If your friends don't see that, then they're not too good of friends to begin with.
Chill

Laguna Beach, CA

#6 May 8, 2007
Correction..."Overwhelmed " should NOT worry about their reputation. Sorry about that, left out an important word.
overwhelmed

San Diego, CA

#7 Sep 8, 2007
whatsit toyou wrote:
Overwhelmed, I just have a question. Did you go to the authorities before OR after the murder? Neither your name nor reputation of fellow seabees is ruined, just these individuals involved.
To your question, in the military there is a system called the chain of command. We have to go to the person above us then they turn to the person above them and so forth. NO jumping to the top. Don't for one second think that we involved, E-3 and below, didn't go to the person above us. In fact there were even E-6 and E-5 personell who heard directly from the mouth of butler, daily! It's funny how the only one's called to witness were the lowest on the chain of command. If I had more rank maybe I could have weasled out and said nothing as some did. So did I go to the authorities? Yes, as I was taught to utilize my chain of command. I bet next time it'll be taken seriously. In fact there won't be a next time. To all who replied thank you for the support. Your words really do help.
overwhelmed

San Diego, CA

#8 Sep 8, 2007
BEFORE

“No News is No News”

Since: Jan 07

Camarillo, CA

#9 Sep 9, 2007
whatsit toyou wrote:
Overwhelmed, I just have a question. Did you go to the authorities before OR after the murder? Neither your name nor reputation of fellow seabees is ruined, just these individuals involved.
I think the real question needs to be, why the police agency didn't do their job when the bombs were reported? They are the ones who need to be under scrutiny and they are the ones who should feel like they failed in our community. What more can people do...they report criminal activity or possible criminal activity and everyone who "can" do something just sits on their ass and does nothing.
Sarah

Laguna Beach, CA

#10 Sep 10, 2007
Allison Briley wrote:
<quoted text>
I think the real question needs to be, why the police agency didn't do their job when the bombs were reported? They are the ones who need to be under scrutiny and they are the ones who should feel like they failed in our community. What more can people do...they report criminal activity or possible criminal activity and everyone who "can" do something just sits on their ass and does nothing.
I agree with you; I think the police came up short on their actions to help John Marmo and his family. I also think Matt Toerner is the ultimate person responsible for John Marmo's death. Matt didn't have to pull the trigger; he didn't have to shoot John Marmo in the back. The police didn't put the bullet in the victims back...Matt Toerner did!! I'm just saying the police failed John Marmo, but it was Matt Toerner who actually took John Marmo's life from him and his family. I know Matt Toerner; we went to Laguna Hills High School together. Matt isn't stupid or crazy; he just did a stupid and crazy thing. Now, he should pay for it behind bars. The whole thing sucks!
Intrigued

San Dimas, CA

#11 Sep 10, 2007
Allison Briley wrote:
<quoted text>
I think the real question needs to be, why the police agency didn't do their job when the bombs were reported? They are the ones who need to be under scrutiny and they are the ones who should feel like they failed in our community. What more can people do...they report criminal activity or possible criminal activity and everyone who "can" do something just sits on their ass and does nothing.
NCIS and the Military should have stepped up to the plate and done a better job since this criminal activity was going on LONG before the bombs were ever found on John Marmo's car.
Intrigued

San Dimas, CA

#12 Sep 10, 2007
overwhelmed wrote:
<quoted text>
To your question, in the military there is a system called the chain of command. We have to go to the person above us then they turn to the person above them and so forth. NO jumping to the top. Don't for one second think that we involved, E-3 and below, didn't go to the person above us. In fact there were even E-6 and E-5 personell who heard directly from the mouth of butler, daily! It's funny how the only one's called to witness were the lowest on the chain of command. If I had more rank maybe I could have weasled out and said nothing as some did. So did I go to the authorities? Yes, as I was taught to utilize my chain of command. I bet next time it'll be taken seriously. In fact there won't be a next time. To all who replied thank you for the support. Your words really do help.
Your actions are commendable. You are right, the superiors should be called to testify as well, not just the lowest on the chain of command. I pray heads roll over on that base. I believe "whatsit toyou" really wants to know is why those who were aware of the murder plot didn't do more to save John Marmo's life. The plot apparently was not kept a secret at the base. The chain of command wasn't doing their jobs. Why didn't anyone then go to civilian law enforcement? If military personnel reported it to the Sheriff's, maybe they would have taken Mr. Marmo a little more seriously when he found the bombs on his car and this poor man's life would have been saved. You are absolutely correct, there won't be a next time. Unfortunately for John Marmo and his family, the Military and Civilian Law Enforcement learned ther lesson at the expense of his life.
Beverly

United States

#13 Sep 11, 2007
When is the trial? I have a friend who is a seabee and deployed and I know how hard this hit my friend. This murder has caused a great shock all through the military and civilian community here in Ventura County. My full support is behind the Marmo family and friends!
FYI

Santa Monica, CA

#14 Sep 11, 2007
Beverly wrote:
When is the trial? I have a friend who is a seabee and deployed and I know how hard this hit my friend. This murder has caused a great shock all through the military and civilian community here in Ventura County. My full support is behind the Marmo family and friends!
Trial Dates:

Matthew Toerner 09/20/2007
Rebecca Braswell 09/26/2007
Shannon Butler 11/26/2007

However, Rebecca Braswell is due back in court also on 09/20/2007 for a Motion that was just filed on 09/10/2007.

Prayers are with the Marmo family throughout this ordeal.
Howard

Mission Viejo, CA

#15 Sep 11, 2007
FYI wrote:
<quoted text>
Trial Dates:
Matthew Toerner 09/20/2007
Rebecca Braswell 09/26/2007
Shannon Butler 11/26/2007
However, Rebecca Braswell is due back in court also on 09/20/2007 for a Motion that was just filed on 09/10/2007.
Prayers are with the Marmo family throughout this ordeal.
What motion was just filed? Do you know? God Bless the Marmo family
Howard

Mission Viejo, CA

#16 Sep 13, 2007
After reading public court documents regarding this case, I find this crime very disturbing. The way John Marmo was killed is just cold blooded murder. Waiting for him to leave his condo and shooting him as he enters his car sounds sounds like a cold blooded murder to me. Who cares if Mr. Marmo had threatened Butler before...that doesn't mean you shoot him. From the evil these suspects have within them, I doubt Mr. Marmo ever threatened Butler. She sounds like a total bitch and looks like one too. On the Riley, KS. forum a person who has read the trial brief states sexual favors were offered along with money to someone if they kill Mr. Marmo. I hope the sex was worth it Toerner...hopefully he had his eyes closed. Prayers to the Marmo family
Jan

Yucaipa, CA

#17 Dec 3, 2007
Howard wrote:
After reading public court documents regarding this case, I find this crime very disturbing. The way John Marmo was killed is just cold blooded murder. Waiting for him to leave his condo and shooting him as he enters his car sounds sounds like a cold blooded murder to me. Who cares if Mr. Marmo had threatened Butler before...that doesn't mean you shoot him. From the evil these suspects have within them, I doubt Mr. Marmo ever threatened Butler. She sounds like a total bitch and looks like one too. On the Riley, KS. forum a person who has read the trial brief states sexual favors were offered along with money to someone if they kill Mr. Marmo. I hope the sex was worth it Toerner...hopefully he had his eyes closed. Prayers to the Marmo family
Ho did you find the public court documents, on line or did you have to go down to the courthouse?
Jan

Yucaipa, CA

#18 Dec 3, 2007
oops :) "How"
Lost

Yucaipa, CA

#19 Dec 4, 2007
Allison Briley wrote:
<quoted text>
I think the real question needs to be, why the police agency didn't do their job when the bombs were reported? They are the ones who need to be under scrutiny and they are the ones who should feel like they failed in our community. What more can people do...they report criminal activity or possible criminal activity and everyone who "can" do something just sits on their ass and does nothing.
I have read in other areas/blogs of people reading the "public court documents" and also the "released trial briefs." Is this something online I can do. I can't imagine the people who have talked about this driving all the way to Ventura, they live farther than me. You seem like you are on top of this story and are the pefect person to ask.
Insider Information

Temecula, CA

#20 Dec 5, 2007
Lost wrote:
<quoted text>I have read in other areas/blogs of people reading the "public court documents" and also the "released trial briefs." Is this something online I can do. I can't imagine the people who have talked about this driving all the way to Ventura, they live farther than me. You seem like you are on top of this story and are the pefect person to ask.
The Trial Briefs can only be obtained from the courthouse. Other court documents, such as the arrest warrant, have links on the Ventura County Star website.

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