"Discussing" with Church of Christ

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Since: Feb 13

Location hidden

#1 Jul 18, 2013
We don't need to discuss with Johnny Robertson, Shawn Paden, Mark McMinnis or anyone else with their Church of Christ.

We don't have to reach consensus with them. They have nothing we need. They don't have "truth" no matter what they cry about having it.

We don't owe them any of our time and attention.

Next time they come to the church you're at, tell them they have their beliefs about the Bible and you have your beliefs about the Bible and show them the door politely.

If they have "truth" let them preach it and attract people with it instead of their being ticks and mosquitoes sucking at others.
Mike Peterson

Birmingham, AL

#2 Jul 18, 2013
Olethros wrote:
We don't need to discuss with Johnny Robertson, Shawn Paden, Mark McMinnis or anyone else with their Church of Christ.
We don't have to reach consensus with them. They have nothing we need. They don't have "truth" no matter what they cry about having it.
We don't owe them any of our time and attention.
Next time they come to the church you're at, tell them they have their beliefs about the Bible and you have your beliefs about the Bible and show them the door politely.
If they have "truth" let them preach it and attract people with it instead of their being ticks and mosquitoes sucking at others.
You are a Protestant and they are Protestants.

You believe in SS and they believe in SS. According to the Doctrine of SS they are as right as you.

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#3 Jul 18, 2013
Olethros wrote:
We don't need to discuss with Johnny Robertson, Shawn Paden, Mark McMinnis or anyone else with their Church of Christ.
We don't have to reach consensus with them. They have nothing we need. They don't have "truth" no matter what they cry about having it.
We don't owe them any of our time and attention.
Next time they come to the church you're at, tell them they have their beliefs about the Bible and you have your beliefs about the Bible and show them the door politely.
If they have "truth" let them preach it and attract people with it instead of their being ticks and mosquitoes sucking at others.
So am I to assume you have the "truth?"

Since: Feb 13

Location hidden

#4 Jul 18, 2013
MarkEden wrote:
<quoted text>
So am I to assume you have the "truth?"
I have as much truth as you or any other person. Including the Church of Christ fakepreachers in Martinsville and Danville and Texas. Difference is I don't pretend to know all the truth. I don't lie to people and tell them I know all the truth. That is what Johnny Robertson and his friends do.
Mike Peterson

Birmingham, AL

#5 Jul 18, 2013
Olethros wrote:
<quoted text>
I have as much truth as you or any other person. Including the Church of Christ fakepreachers in Martinsville and Danville and Texas. Difference is I don't pretend to know all the truth. I don't lie to people and tell them I know all the truth. That is what Johnny Robertson and his friends do.
You have as much truth as any other Protestant.

The CC has the fullness of the Truth. The Bible tells us that history proves it.

Convert and then you can tell everybody you have the truth and not lie.

Since: Feb 13

Location hidden

#6 Jul 18, 2013
Mike I'm not a Protestant. I'm just a Christian.

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#7 Jul 18, 2013
Olethros wrote:
Mike I'm not a Protestant. I'm just a Christian.
If you are not a Roman Catholic or a member of a rite in communion with Rome or Greek Orthodox you are a protestant no matter what you may call yourself. If you are a member of a church that didn't appear until after 1517 you are a protestant no matter what you may call yourself. If you insist on calling yourself simply a Christian then you are just another victim of the Sola Scriptura protestant heresy.
Yolanda Xavier Yodel

Bellefonte, PA

#8 Jul 18, 2013
Mike, if I don't convert to Catholicism, but I love Jesus as the son of God, have repented for my sins (and do so ongoingly), and believe that his death on the cross was for my sins and the sins of the world, and accept his gift of grace, what will happen to me after I die?

Since: Feb 13

Location hidden

#9 Jul 18, 2013
Look at the yellow pages in the phone book.

Look at all those churches.

Look at Churches of Christ.

Look at how many other chuches there are besides Church of Christ.

Now explain why the Church of Christ is different from all those other churches. Tell us why the Church of Christ is true and the others not.

No one can do it.

The Church of Christ is the same as all the other denominations in the yellow pages.
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#10 Jul 19, 2013
No, they aren't. At least they believe in the need to be immersed by the commandment and promise of God. But that won't save them alone, as Acts 3:22,23 say if we don't hear Him in whatever He said, that such will be 'cut off from the brethren.'

And we who believe and have studied His doctrine know He said nothing about communion every Sunday, abandoning the Fourth Commandment, or anything remotely saying using an instrument with singing praises to God is a sin...

He desires that we have true justice and standards according to His word.

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#11 Jul 19, 2013
Yolanda Xavier Yodel wrote:
Mike, if I don't convert to Catholicism, but I love Jesus as the son of God, have repented for my sins (and do so ongoingly), and believe that his death on the cross was for my sins and the sins of the world, and accept his gift of grace, what will happen to me after I die?
What you have listed is a common Sola Scriptura deception. So basically you have your very own made up church...just one of 40,000 protestant denominations! No one knows what will happen to you after you die and neither can you be certain but the Roman Catholic Church and the Orthodox Church offer you the witness of centuries.
"Remember those who take part in this offering, those here present and all your people, and all who seek you with a sincere heart. Remember those who have died in the peace of Christ and all the dead whose faith is known to you alone."
from St. Basil's Eucharistic Prayer IV
Mike Peterson

Birmingham, AL

#12 Jul 19, 2013
Yolanda Xavier Yodel wrote:
Mike, if I don't convert to Catholicism, but I love Jesus as the son of God, have repented for my sins (and do so ongoingly), and believe that his death on the cross was for my sins and the sins of the world, and accept his gift of grace, what will happen to me after I die?
Only God knows that.

But he created a Church. The Bible confirms that. According to the Church which is the pillar and foundation of truth, binds and loosens , forgive sins or not, and whoever hears the Church hears him, that unless you are baptized and don't die in a state of un-confessed mortal sin, your chances are not that great.

God set up the sacraments to follow to gain eternal life. Since you don't have the sacrament of reconciliation, you may be in a bad place.

He told us that you unless you eat his flesh and drink his blood , you have no life in you.

But hey, you may be perfect.
Mike Peterson

Birmingham, AL

#13 Jul 19, 2013
Olethros wrote:
Mike I'm not a Protestant. I'm just a Christian.
You have reached the bottom rung on the SS ladder.

"The Bible and Me".

You are the ultimate Protestant. You Protest against all Churches.

Most Protestants protest every Church but their's.

What is your Authority? A Catholic book? The Church is the pillar and foundation of Truth, not a book.

The Bible was created by the Church to help teach. Who teaches you?
Mike Peterson

Birmingham, AL

#14 Jul 19, 2013
Olethros wrote:
Look at the yellow pages in the phone book.
Look at all those churches.
Look at Churches of Christ.
Look at how many other chuches there are besides Church of Christ.
Now explain why the Church of Christ is different from all those other churches. Tell us why the Church of Christ is true and the others not.
No one can do it.
The Church of Christ is the same as all the other denominations in the yellow pages.
All Protestant Churches are the same except some are low Prots and some are high Prots.

If you went into any town in the World before 1500 and asked where the Church was, anybody could tell you. There was only one for 1500 years.

That Church was the center of life for that town. For saving souls, for education, for feeding the hungry , and for helping the sick.

The government did none of this.
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#15 Jul 19, 2013
You are surely joking, as the government and Church were nearly one and the same. Different nations had national religions, and early on in the Colonies, they also supported one religion in one that was not the religion of the other, and you had to belong to the Church of the government choice to even be able to vote.

'The government did not of this'- now we know you have no knowledge based upon fact, but merely propaganda that only tells you what they think you should believe and then foist upon others. Not any better than a CoC telling you they are the only 'true' Church and can trace themselves to AD 33 by their own imaginations.
Barnsweb

Canton, OH

#16 Jul 19, 2013
Not to mention the King of England and coming up with a 'new' Bible translation.
Mike Peterson

Birmingham, AL

#17 Jul 19, 2013
Barnsweb wrote:
You are surely joking, as the government and Church were nearly one and the same. Different nations had national religions, and early on in the Colonies, they also supported one religion in one that was not the religion of the other, and you had to belong to the Church of the government choice to even be able to vote.
'The government did not of this'- now we know you have no knowledge based upon fact, but merely propaganda that only tells you what they think you should believe and then foist upon others. Not any better than a CoC telling you they are the only 'true' Church and can trace themselves to AD 33 by their own imaginations.
Ignorance of history.

Since: Jun 11

Location hidden

#18 Jul 19, 2013
Mike Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
Ignorance of history.
You are absolutely correct. Hospitals, infirmaries, almshouses, leper colonies, orphanages, schools, universities...all Catholic works of charity through the centuries.

Anyone ever heard of a Barnsweb hospital???
Yolanda Xavier Yodel

Bellefonte, PA

#19 Jul 20, 2013
Thanks for the answer. I'm really trying to understand the Catholic position, not be snarky, btw.

You said that the Catholic church "forgive sins or not"... where does this idea come from , in the Scriptures?

Also, the thing I have a real problem with re: Catholicism is the idea that "whoever hears the Church hears him", which ignores all the bad decisions and choices made by church leaders from the beginning to now. Does that mean if a pope makes a bad decision that hurts a lot of people, then God made that decision? This is one of the reasons why Protestantism makes more sense to me - Christ is Christ, the church is the church - and she's his bride, but not Him. She does her best to speak for Him, according to His word, but she is fallible, constantly in need of His grace.

And yes, we do need to confess, but not to a man. We confess to the one who paid the price on our behalf on the cross, because that man didn't die for us.

Regarding the need to eat and drink Him, John Piper has a good explanation here: http://www.desiringgod.org/blog/posts/what-je...

And while I am most definitely not perfect, the one who is my Lord is, thank goodness!
Mike Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
Only God knows that.
But he created a Church. The Bible confirms that. According to the Church which is the pillar and foundation of truth, binds and loosens , forgive sins or not, and whoever hears the Church hears him, that unless you are baptized and don't die in a state of un-confessed mortal sin, your chances are not that great.
God set up the sacraments to follow to gain eternal life. Since you don't have the sacrament of reconciliation, you may be in a bad place.
He told us that you unless you eat his flesh and drink his blood , you have no life in you.
But hey, you may be perfect.
Mike Peterson

Jackson, MS

#20 Jul 20, 2013
Yolanda Xavier Yodel wrote:
Thanks for the answer. I'm really trying to understand the Catholic position, not be snarky, btw.
You said that the Catholic church "forgive sins or not"... where does this idea come from , in the Scriptures?
Also, the thing I have a real problem with re: Catholicism is the idea that "whoever hears the Church hears him", which ignores all the bad decisions and choices made by church leaders from the beginning to now. Does that mean if a pope makes a bad decision that hurts a lot of people, then God made that decision? This is one of the reasons why Protestantism makes more sense to me - Christ is Christ, the church is the church - and she's his bride, but not Him. She does her best to speak for Him, according to His word, but she is fallible, constantly in need of His grace.
And yes, we do need to confess, but not to a man. We confess to the one who paid the price on our behalf on the cross, because that man didn't die for us.
Regarding the need to eat and drink Him, John Piper has a good explanation here: http://www.desiringgod.org/blog/posts/what-je...
And while I am most definitely not perfect, the one who is my Lord is, thank goodness!
<quoted text>
On Confession, Jesus disagrees with you.

This sacrament is rooted in the mission God gave to Christ in his capacity as the Son of man on earth to go and forgive sins (cf. Matt. 9:6). Thus, the crowds who witnessed this new power "glorified God, who had given such authority to men" (Matt. 9:8; note the plural "men"). After his resurrection, Jesus passed on his mission to forgive sins to his ministers, telling them, "As the Father has sent me, even so I send you.... Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained" (John 20:2123).

How could the disciples forgive sins if the new Christians did not tell the disciples what they were?

Are you the Church (the community of believers) or a member of a Church?

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