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Barnweb

Canton, OH

#1 Jul 27, 2013
Who has vetted the NT books to have passed the directions to Moses from Deut. chapters 12, 13 and 18? If Evangelicals use these tests to disprove Joseph Smith Jr., will the writings of Paul withstand the same tests for authenticity? Is everyone counting on the gospel of Paul and not the gospel of Jesus? Is what Jesus said to uncomfortable to them?
William

Alexander City, AL

#2 Jul 27, 2013
The gospel given to Paul is the gospel of Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ died for our sins, was buried, and resurrected for our justification.

That is not the gospel given to the 11 in Matthew 28/Mark 16/Luke 24, nor is it the gospel that Peter preached in Acts 2.

Sorry, but it just isn't.
Barnweb

Canton, OH

#3 Jul 28, 2013
Yes. It is sad. So God comes down teaching men, telling them to repent to do the will of God and be careful to do what He said (being hearers and doers of the word), leaves instructions to make disciples of Him, that He alone is Teacher, and instructing them to see that the disciples they make of Him keep the same commandments that He had first given them - the original 12.

Then along comes a man saying he's an apostle, who saw a light he claims was Jesus, and then preaches a gospel that is not according to what Jesus (God) taught. And people suck it up!

We'll do well to know God better than this if we have any hope to not be deceived away from doing His will. Perhaps He used this murdering Jew to see who would believe His Son instead? Rome would also be delighted, just as Satan, to lead people away from the only words that can lead to eternal life. Paul said 'My gospel', not the gospel of God - and then pompously declared a curse on anyone not believing his gospel! Good luck Paul.
Mike Peterson

Jackson, MS

#4 Jul 28, 2013
Barnweb wrote:
Yes. It is sad. So God comes down teaching men, telling them to repent to do the will of God and be careful to do what He said (being hearers and doers of the word), leaves instructions to make disciples of Him, that He alone is Teacher, and instructing them to see that the disciples they make of Him keep the same commandments that He had first given them - the original 12.
Then along comes a man saying he's an apostle, who saw a light he claims was Jesus, and then preaches a gospel that is not according to what Jesus (God) taught. And people suck it up!
We'll do well to know God better than this if we have any hope to not be deceived away from doing His will. Perhaps He used this murdering Jew to see who would believe His Son instead? Rome would also be delighted, just as Satan, to lead people away from the only words that can lead to eternal life. Paul said 'My gospel', not the gospel of God - and then pompously declared a curse on anyone not believing his gospel! Good luck Paul.
Amazing: Pitting Paul against Jesus... That comes from SS which comes from Satan.
Willam

Birmingham, AL

#5 Jul 28, 2013
"Then along comes a man saying he's an apostle, who saw a light he claims was Jesus, and then preaches a gospel that is not according to what Jesus (God) taught. And people suck it up!"

To hear you tell it, Paul is a complete fraud and all of us, be we Jew or Gentile, are really bound to keep those 613 laws and commandments found in the old testament.

Good luck finding even one person other than Christ who was able to keep the law. It certainly isn't me, and I absolutely guarantee that it isn't you.

The law wasn't given to show you how to be righteous. It was given to show you that you CANNOT be righteous by the law, or anything other than the faith of Jesus. God will only accept the righteousness of his Son, imputed to you for what his son did. Period.

You can repent of your sins until hell freezes over and be water baptized until your skin turns white and falls off, but you will NEVER do anything to become righteous with your flesh.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#6 Jul 29, 2013
Willam wrote:
"Then along comes a man saying he's an apostle, who saw a light he claims was Jesus, and then preaches a gospel that is not according to what Jesus (God) taught. And people suck it up!"
To hear you tell it, Paul is a complete fraud and all of us, be we Jew or Gentile, are really bound to keep those 613 laws and commandments found in the old testament.
Good luck finding even one person other than Christ who was able to keep the law. It certainly isn't me, and I absolutely guarantee that it isn't you.
The law wasn't given to show you how to be righteous. It was given to show you that you CANNOT be righteous by the law, or anything other than the faith of Jesus. God will only accept the righteousness of his Son, imputed to you for what his son did. Period.
You can repent of your sins until hell freezes over and be water baptized until your skin turns white and falls off, but you will NEVER do anything to become righteous with your flesh.
so Is obedience to any commanded need to become a child of God?
killedjoe

Lindenhurst, NY

#7 Jul 29, 2013
Mike Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
Amazing: Pitting Paul against Jesus... That comes from SS which comes from Satan.
Ask this question. Who was Paul. Where did he come from
Barnweb

Canton, OH

#8 Jul 30, 2013
Tares and wheat. Those who included Paul as Scripture failed to test the words of Paul to what was taught by the Christ. It's that simple. False doctrines have their root in Paul, not the teachings of Jesus Christ or the rest of the true word of God.

Did Paul ever teach false doctrine? Can you justify Paul saying the Torah was nailed to the cross? Jesus said it would be binding so long as there are a heavens and an earth. Both cannot be true. Pharisees put their words over the commandments of God, just as Paul put his words above the truth taught by Jesus Christ. There isn't a more stark and contrasting message that is found between what Jesus said is the truth VS what Paul identified as 'my gospel' that he cursed anyone who didn't accept it - Pharisee to the core.
I believe perhaps God sent Paul to see if we really love Him and want to do as His Son said...to test us.
Mike Peterson

Jackson, MS

#9 Jul 30, 2013
Barnweb wrote:
Tares and wheat. Those who included Paul as Scripture failed to test the words of Paul to what was taught by the Christ. It's that simple. False doctrines have their root in Paul, not the teachings of Jesus Christ or the rest of the true word of God.
Did Paul ever teach false doctrine? Can you justify Paul saying the Torah was nailed to the cross? Jesus said it would be binding so long as there are a heavens and an earth. Both cannot be true. Pharisees put their words over the commandments of God, just as Paul put his words above the truth taught by Jesus Christ. There isn't a more stark and contrasting message that is found between what Jesus said is the truth VS what Paul identified as 'my gospel' that he cursed anyone who didn't accept it - Pharisee to the core.
I believe perhaps God sent Paul to see if we really love Him and want to do as His Son said...to test us.
Have you started keeping Kosher yet? I saw some Kosher Coca-Cola the other day. Just wanted you to know.
Barnweb

Canton, OH

#11 Jul 30, 2013
I have some Kosher food and have been considering it. Looking at Peter's vision in Acts, his telling of the meaning is the acceptance of Gentiles into the kingdom of God is the meaning, rather than that the standards God have about food was done away with. Is there any evidence from Peter otherwise? But I'm not totally convinced or convicted yet, as Jesus said it isn't that which goes into the man that defiles him, but that which proceeds from his heart that is evil and defiles him. So I'm not going to make the kingdom about meat and drink except where He said it matters - such as not eating meat sacrificed to idols - that one seems to be a sure thing - again though, Paul nullified that in his gospel.
Barnweb

Canton, OH

#12 Jul 30, 2013
Willam wrote:
"Then along comes a man saying he's an apostle, who saw a light he claims was Jesus, and then preaches a gospel that is not according to what Jesus (God) taught. And people suck it up!"
To hear you tell it, Paul is a complete fraud and all of us, be we Jew or Gentile, are really bound to keep those 613 laws and commandments found in the old testament.
Good luck finding even one person other than Christ who was able to keep the law. It certainly isn't me, and I absolutely guarantee that it isn't you.
The law wasn't given to show you how to be righteous. It was given to show you that you CANNOT be righteous by the law, or anything other than the faith of Jesus. God will only accept the righteousness of his Son, imputed to you for what his son did. Period.
You can repent of your sins until hell freezes over and be water baptized until your skin turns white and falls off, but you will NEVER do anything to become righteous with your flesh.
Anyone who repents to do the will of God does a good thing, so your last charge is nullified by the truth of the Christ and all the holy prophets of God from the beginning. Secondly, Ezekiel 36:26,27 says the Spirit of God is given to write His law on our hearts, that we do His will from our hearts - it is He who enables us to keep His words - it isn't of ourselves. But we deny the Spirit when we deny the Torah of righteousness that the Spirit was given to write it on our hearts.

So much for your Pauline doctrines standing up to the truth and testing whether it be according to the law and prophets and accounting that the Son of God gave as the gospel and covenant.

'Torahless' is lawless. Dare we establish what we think right and bind God to say we are right and He is wrong? Paul did. Paul also died in prison for appealing to Rome rather than facing the charges brought against him at Jerusalem. Paul knew he would not win his case in the full light of Scripture and what God said about those who call God untrue.
Barnweb

Canton, OH

#13 Jul 30, 2013
What was done away with are the ordinances of the Aaronic priesthood that served to offer animal sacrifices to atone for sins.

Has God called Christians a kingdom of priests? What is a priests primary duty but to be holy to God? And how can we be holy to God and reject His directions and standards of righteousness? If we have His Spirit within us, we will seek out His word to carefully observe what we are to do...according to God, His holy prophets, the Psalms and His only begotten Son. If Paul says otherwise - we are called by Gods' standards of truth to reject Paul and not listen to him. This is by the standards given through Moses, the prophets and the Son.

Paul would desire greatly that the standards to test him would be done away with. That one is almost as good as Joseph Smith Jr. adding a chapter to Genesis to prophecy of himself:-) Smith claimed to be a prophet and we judge him false by the same standards that we need to equally use on Paul. Because someone long ago left the door of false doctrine open doesn't mean we can't shut that door and repent of the false doctrines Paul taught.
killedjoe

Lindenhurst, NY

#14 Jul 30, 2013
Mike Peterson wrote:
<quoted text>
Have you started keeping Kosher yet? I saw some Kosher Coca-Cola the other day. Just wanted you to know.
Do you know what Kosher food is? Again, if you research this, maybe you might eat it.
Mike Peterson

Birmingham, AL

#15 Jul 30, 2013
Barnweb wrote:
I have some Kosher food and have been considering it. Looking at Peter's vision in Acts, his telling of the meaning is the acceptance of Gentiles into the kingdom of God is the meaning, rather than that the standards God have about food was done away with. Is there any evidence from Peter otherwise? But I'm not totally convinced or convicted yet, as Jesus said it isn't that which goes into the man that defiles him, but that which proceeds from his heart that is evil and defiles him. So I'm not going to make the kingdom about meat and drink except where He said it matters - such as not eating meat sacrificed to idols - that one seems to be a sure thing - again though, Paul nullified that in his gospel.
I am in the food industry. If you know what to look for on label, most national foods are kosher.

To get Kosher certified, you pay a Rabbi $4,000 a quarter and he comes to the plant and signs a paper and goes home.
killedjoe

Lindenhurst, NY

#16 Jul 30, 2013
Barnweb wrote:
I have some Kosher food and have been considering it. Looking at Peter's vision in Acts, his telling of the meaning is the acceptance of Gentiles into the kingdom of God is the meaning, rather than that the standards God have about food was done away with. Is there any evidence from Peter otherwise? But I'm not totally convinced or convicted yet, as Jesus said it isn't that which goes into the man that defiles him, but that which proceeds from his heart that is evil and defiles him. So I'm not going to make the kingdom about meat and drink except where He said it matters - such as not eating meat sacrificed to idols - that one seems to be a sure thing - again though, Paul nullified that in his gospel.
Question is, the "miracle" of Saul to Paul. Did it really come from The vision of Jesus. Remember, Jesus came to fulfill the prophecy and confirm the laws of Moses. He did not change anything.
William

Birmingham, AL

#17 Jul 30, 2013
"Anyone who repents to do the will of God does a good thing, so your last charge is nullified by the truth of the Christ and all the holy prophets of God from the beginning."

There isn't the first person who ever got to heaven by keeping those laws. And it certainly isn't going to be you.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#18 Jul 30, 2013
killedjoe wrote:
<quoted text> Question is, the "miracle" of Saul to Paul. Did it really come from The vision of Jesus. Remember, Jesus came to fulfill the prophecy and confirm the laws of Moses. He did not change anything.
Christ changed everything most assuredly.
killedjoe

Lindenhurst, NY

#19 Jul 30, 2013
JustChristian wrote:
<quoted text>
Christ changed everything most assuredly.
I really think you need to go back and reread the book again. What your saying he change the laws of Moses? WOW. Please go back and research.
killedjoe

Lindenhurst, NY

#20 Jul 30, 2013
JustChristian wrote:
<quoted text>
Christ changed everything most assuredly.
He change the laws, what the prophets said. Please you don't really believe this. If he change the laws of what was said, then what did he come for. What the prophets said have no meaning. If that the case, then maybe you should be thinking that Jesus was not the Anointed One. If he change everything, does that mean that Jesus change God's laws and the prophets were all wrong in what they said? You really the ball on this comment. BIG TIMES.

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#21 Jul 30, 2013
killedjoe wrote:
<quoted text> He change the laws, what the prophets said. Please you don't really believe this. If he change the laws of what was said, then what did he come for. What the prophets said have no meaning. If that the case, then maybe you should be thinking that Jesus was not the Anointed One. If he change everything, does that mean that Jesus change God's laws and the prophets were all wrong in what they said? You really the ball on this comment. BIG TIMES.
Christ changed mans thinking, An eye for an eye became turn the other cheek, Do good to those that harm you, Care for the poor, Become humble, put others above yourself, Christ changed the sacrifice from many to only ONE, Himself, Christ brought the man back to a relationship with the Father. Christ gave a picture of Grace that man had not understood. He changed Everything in mans thinking. Thats bible not history.

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