Suicide common at shooting ranges

Suicide common at shooting ranges

There are 453 comments on the WOOD-TV Grand Rapids and Michigan story from Oct 14, 2008, titled Suicide common at shooting ranges. In it, WOOD-TV Grand Rapids and Michigan reports that:

A Grand Rapids woman took her own life at the Silver Bullet Firearms shooting range at 5121 S. Division Avenue in Wyoming.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at WOOD-TV Grand Rapids and Michigan.

“Tu ne cede malis”

Since: Dec 06

Lots of different places

#441 Nov 28, 2008
U.S. population = 305,746,000 (Nov. 2008)

Au. population = 21,493,500 (Nov. 2008)

Australia's population is 14 times LESS than that of the USA.

Australia's criminal assault crime rate is 800/100,000

See:
http://www.aic.gov.au/publications/facts/2004 ...

If Australia had the same population as the U.S., the crime rate would be:
14 x 800 = 11,200/100,000.

AUSTRALIA: A VERITABLE PARADISE FOR VIOLENT CRIMINALS!

———

THE GUNS FORUM

FORUM ISSUE: It's the Guns, Stupid

POST# 25590, 25591, 25592

BY: Rex (Canberra, Australia)

Why is Jack a FRAUD.

For starters he likes to use an Aus soldier as an avatar to mislead people into thinking he has army connections.

I have asked Jack on numerous times to tell me what ADFA stands for and where it is.

He has yet to reply.

Why?

The idiot doesn't know.

Any person who has served or knows people who have served in the armed forces know that ADFA stands for Australian Defence Force Academy, they also know that it is in Canberra.

Your a fraud JACK.

You have been busted.

Go sprout your lies and other sh!t somewhere else.

I won't let up on a so-called Aussie who denigrates others so as to think he is superiour to us.

F#ck off to a country that suits your views because i sure as hell know that a majority of the people i know would want the same.

—— 25591——

I'm sick of you Jack. You keep going off subject all the time.

2nd Ammendment gives Americans the right to bear arms.

Are you so jealous of them that you have to critise them all the time?

My blood boils when i see your posts.

Come to Canberra sometime and we'll go and see some of the boys.

Don't worry about packing an overnight bag, you won't need it.

If i shoot you will you defend yourself with a weapon?

HYPOCRITE.

——25592——

By the way JACK, the Australian Constitution has not been recognised on alot of occasions by the Australian Government.

When referendumns are ignored, you don't have one.

The ANTI GUNNERS are trying to f#ck the American constitution in the same way.

We have nothing when dickheads like yourself tear it to bits to suit yourself, a pissweak minority that gets in bed with socialist scumbags.

——25593——

Matter of fact, go to CUBA, you dog.

——25594——

Relevance is the word here JACKASS.

It is not relevant therefore it is not enforceable.

Just ask the many state and federal governments that have ignored it.

An Australian Constitution......ha, if you want to use the so called constitution see how far it gets you.

The American Constitution is a real one, not a mickey mouse one.

“Tu ne cede malis”

Since: Dec 06

Lots of different places

#442 Nov 28, 2008
THE GUNS FORUM

FORUM ISSUE: It's the Guns, Stupid

POST#'s 24605 & 24606

By: GunShowOnTheNet

Crime up Down Under

After Australian lawmakers passed widespread gun bans,.... In his most recent research, Lott noted a few examples of mass shootings in schools when ...
http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp...

The Australian Gun Ban
http://www.topix.com/forum/guns/TJ0BQG8MVPBE9...

"The overall trend in the incidence of homicide has remained stable over the 17-year period since the Australian Institute of Criminology began monitoring in 1989."
http://www.aic.gov.au/publications/rpp/77/

Over the past 17 years, the rate of homicide has fluctuated by 0.7 per 100,000 persons. In fact, in the last year's data there was a FOURTEEN PERCENT INCREASE
http://www.aic.gov.au/publications/rpp/77/

So only the method of murder has changed. And as a result, other crime has SKYROCKETED! Australian assaults have gone from 8500 to almost 16,000
http://www.aic.gov.au/stats/crime/assault.htm ...

And rapes have increased by a third
http://www.aic.gov.au/publications/cfi/cfi105...

Your crime has increased so much that there are travel warnings about visiting your country now. "Australia's High Crime Rates Prompt Travel Warning"
http://www.cdnn.info/news/travel/t050417.html

“FSM is His Noodliness”

Since: Jul 07

venganza.org

#443 Nov 28, 2008
<quoted text>
The Australian Gun Ban
"The overall trend in the incidence of homicide has remained stable over the 17-year period since the Australian Institute of Criminology began monitoring in 1989."
http://www.aic.gov.au/publications/rpp/77/
Over the past 17 years, the rate of homicide has fluctuated by 0.7 per 100,000 persons. In fact, in the last year's data there was a FOURTEEN PERCENT INCREASE
http://www.aic.gov.au/publications/rpp/77/
So only the method of murder has changed.
No,,the murder rate has been stable [no wild swings] but trending down a 1/3 from 1.85 to 1.2
Last year didn’t go up 14%..it went down,,,,,1.4 to 1.2
Murder, rate per 100k persons 1993 to 2006
1993 " 1.64
1994 " 1.61
1995 " 1.78
1996 " 1.85 The gun buy-back scheme started October 1996 with a 12mth grace period
1997 " 1.7 September 1997 the guncontrol was in effect
1998 " 1.5
1999 " 1.8
2000 " 1.6
2001 " 1.6
2002 " 1.6
2003 " 1.5
2004 " 1.3
2005 " 1.3
2006 " 1.4
2007 “ 1.2
<quoted text>
, other crime has SKYROCKETED! Australian assaults have gone from 8500 to almost 16,000
http://www.aic.gov.au/stats/crime/assault.htm ...
And rapes have increased by a third
http://www.aic.gov.au/publications/cfi/cfi105...
no…there is greater police reporting of assault and sexual assault because of our change to our court system to be user friendly
our actual victimisation From 1998 to 2005 assault increased slightly from 3% to 5%. In 2005
All sexual assault remained relatively stable during the same period (less than 1%).
http://www.aic.gov.au/publications/facts/2007...

you should have used this one…
pre gun control, the rate of assault recorded by the police increased 452 % between
1974 and 1992,
http://www.aic.gov.au/publications/tandi/ti61...
<quoted text>
Your crime has increased so much that there are travel warnings about visiting your country now. "Australia's High Crime Rates Prompt Travel Warning"
http://www.cdnn.info/news/travel/t050417.html
Since the gun control
gun death down 40%
murder down 25%
robbery down 30%
theft down 15%
car theft down 50%
burglary down 40%

re travel: a newspaper beatup..
aust is a safe and popular tourist destination for the japanese, after all, we are the world's number one chosen destination usa has aus as its top destination too
http://www.smh.com.au/news/news/sydney-ranked...

we have been awarded 4 of the top 10 cities in the world
10 best cities
http://economist.com/markets/rankings/display...

“Tu ne cede malis”

Since: Dec 06

Lots of different places

#444 Nov 28, 2008
THE GUNS FORUM

FORUM ISSUE: It's the Guns, Stupid

POST# 25590, 25591, 25592

BY: Rex (Canberra, Australia)

Why is Jack a FRAUD.

For starters he likes to use an Aus soldier as an avatar to mislead people into thinking he has army connections.

I have asked Jack on numerous times to tell me what ADFA stands for and where it is.

He has yet to reply.

Why?

The idiot doesn't know.

Any person who has served or knows people who have served in the armed forces know that ADFA stands for Australian Defence Force Academy, they also know that it is in Canberra.

Your a fraud JACK.

You have been busted.

Go sprout your lies and other sh!t somewhere else.

I won't let up on a so-called Aussie who denigrates others so as to think he is superiour to us.

F#ck off to a country that suits your views because i sure as hell know that a majority of the people i know would want the same.

—— 25591——

I'm sick of you Jack. You keep going off subject all the time.

2nd Ammendment gives Americans the right to bear arms.

Are you so jealous of them that you have to critise them all the time?

My blood boils when i see your posts.

Come to Canberra sometime and we'll go and see some of the boys.

Don't worry about packing an overnight bag, you won't need it.

If i shoot you will you defend yourself with a weapon?

HYPOCRITE.

——25592——

By the way JACK, the Australian Constitution has not been recognised on alot of occasions by the Australian Government.

When referendumns are ignored, you don't have one.

The ANTI GUNNERS are trying to f#ck the American constitution in the same way.

We have nothing when dickheads like yourself tear it to bits to suit yourself, a pissweak minority that gets in bed with socialist scumbags.

——25593——

Matter of fact, go to CUBA, you dog.

——25594——

Relevance is the word here JACKASS.

It is not relevant therefore it is not enforceable.

Just ask the many state and federal governments that have ignored it.

An Australian Constitution......ha, if you want to use the so called constitution see how far it gets you.

The American Constitution is a real one, not a mickey mouse one.

“FSM is His Noodliness”

Since: Jul 07

venganza.org

#445 Nov 29, 2008
gunnuts are funny with their dribble, aussie/american immigrants are even funnier, how did he slip though the screening process
he doesnt even know 3rd grade australian constitution

“Tu ne cede malis”

Since: Dec 06

Lots of different places

#446 Nov 29, 2008
THE GUNS FORUM

FORUM ISSUE: It's the guns stupid

POST# 15716

BY: The Bald Guy

Is this your first time dealing with Jack412?

If so, get used to him ignoring you when you prove his claims wrong.

In a week or two he'll be making the same, tired arguments you've already refuted time and time again....

He and I have also gotten into it over his misrepresentation of statistics repeatedly.

I'm not sure whether he is deliberately being misleading, or just simply doesn't know how to interpret statistics....

You'll notice that we provide facts, reason, and logic.

You'll also notice that, with the exception of the occasional cooked, falsified statistics, the gun ban advocates simply make fun of us and accuse us of being paranoid.

They can't actually support their arguments, and this seems to make them angry...

Unfortunately, that actually is somewhat effective at getting certain others to disregard what we have to say...

“Tu ne cede malis”

Since: Dec 06

Lots of different places

#447 Nov 29, 2008
THE GUNS FORUM

FORUM ISSUE: Its the guns stupid

POST# 15967

By: The Bald Guy

Speaking of spinning crap, I noticed you dropped your "gun ban lowered DC crime rates" argument like a bad habit.

You just seemed to completely ignore my last response. Which is something I would like to call everyone's attention to:
First Jack tries to claim that Washington DC has low crime rates thanks to the gun ban using crime stats from Washington state.

Then, when corrected, Jack continues to make his argument by only pulling out a section of the stats, without regard to all of the stats.

When I bring the rest of the stats into the discussion, showing a relationship between them, he accuses me of twisting the facts.

When asked why the gun ban would have taken approx 20 years to lower crime rates (they raised during that 20 year period) and contrasting DCs high crime rates to the very low crime rates of states with far less strict firearm laws, Jack drops the argument like a hot potato.

Now, if memory serves me, this is the second time I've had a conversation with Jack about DC.(Unfortunately for Jack, he apparently doesn't remember that I'm the one who blew his claims out of the water last time)

This is what he does. When his claims are shot down by irrefutable facts, he simply ignores the topic entirely.

After a while, perhaps in another thread, he will attempt to make the exact same argument again using the exact same refuted "evidence" to support his claims, even though he knows it to be false.

Jack has absolutely no interest in the truth.

He simply wants to win an argument.

As illustrated earlier with his misquoting Guns to try to prove his point, he has absolutely no reservations of twisting things to support his claims, all the while accusing us of twisting facts...

All of you who are not sure which side of the debate you are on should ask yourselves now: Do I really want to be on the side that must lie to prove their point?

Do I really want to be on th side that must resort to ridiculing the opposition in a futile effort to win an argument?

Do I really want to be on the side that has absolutely no regard for what is true?

And do you really like being lied to? I, for one, do not...

Since: Jun 07

Indiana

#448 Nov 29, 2008
Richard_Head wrote:
<quoted text>Regarding .308 caliber main battle rifles, the C.E.T.M.E., the HK91/G3 and the FN FAL charging handles do not allow the operator to "struck to force the bolt forward".
To carry it even further to other weapons, neither do the Uzi submachine gun or the HK submachine guns. The relevenance of mentioning submachine guns is that the M16/AR15 also comes in pistol calibers. I'm going to step out on a limb and make an assumption, but I'd bet that factory 9mm Colt M16 submachine guns don't come from the factory with the forward assist feature.
The only AR style rifles that I am aware of that do not have a forward assist are the Armalite AR-10s.
In reference to the G3, unless I'm mistaken, the charging handle is much easier to reach with the support hand than the AR charging handle, so it can be more easily manipulated. Most firearms, the bolt can be shoved into place using the charging handle in a pinch.

Since: Jun 07

Indiana

#449 Nov 29, 2008
Richard_Head wrote:
http://www.colt.com/mil/downlo ads/smg_01.jpg
Direct from Colt, their 9mm submachine gun with no forward assist.
That kind of surprises me. Still, I don't like the idea of an AR that doesn't have a forward assist.

Since: Jun 07

Indiana

#450 Nov 29, 2008
Richard_Head wrote:
Bald guy, maybe what you should get is a nice DSARms STG58 version of the FN FAL, if you like .308.
I have a SAR48 Springfield version on an Embel reciever and behind me on the work bench is a beautiful Austrian STG58 parts kit I want to assemble on a DSArms reciever if I ever get the cash to get started.
I'd recomend the FN FAL type rifle if you were going to buy only one main battle rifle type rifle. Of course, those M-1A Springfields are supreme as well and you can hit that charging handle to get the bolt to go forward if you want...but I don't think you'll ever need to.
The only thing with those is that you'll have to use your trigger hand to get to it. With the FAL/STG48, the charging handle is on the left side as well as all the other bells and whistles.
Honestly, if I were looking for a rifle to use defensively, I'd probably go with an AK. I do own an AR-15, but it's more of a toy than anything. ARs require too much maintenance and the reliability of the average AR just isn't good enough for me to consider them reliable. I have heard that replacing the gas tube with a gas piston helps reliability out drastically...

Since: Jun 07

Indiana

#451 Nov 29, 2008
jack412 wrote:
<quoted text>
pick a site you like...
australia has a more diverse population
http://www.google.com.au/search...
I already picked a site. It got it's info from Australia's government's website. Are you saying that the Australian government is completely clueless as to the make-up of it's population?
I'm not playing your games Jack. I cited the information, and your screeching that it is a "yankee" site simply does not refute the information contained in the site. Grow up.

“Disgruntled ”

Since: Apr 08

Wyoming MI

#452 Nov 29, 2008
The Bald Guy wrote:
<quoted text>
Honestly, if I were looking for a rifle to use defensively, I'd probably go with an AK. I do own an AR-15, but it's more of a toy than anything. ARs require too much maintenance and the reliability of the average AR just isn't good enough for me to consider them reliable. I have heard that replacing the gas tube with a gas piston helps reliability out drastically...
I saw on youtube a video of the all time top ten rifles (I don't recall the tv station) but the AK 47 was the No 1 rated! It is an awesome rifle. I've seen 1st hand what it can do.
But that being said I am still seriously considering a DPMS in 308 a sport hunting model. But I will look at the AK 47 if they have one. The price is $200.00 less for the AK 47 in the models I am considering.
I saw on the web Pelosi and her comrades will be looking to put a ban on assault style weapons in the future. I hope it is wrong.

GunShowOnTheNet

“Shall NOT be infringed.”

Since: Dec 06

Phoenix, AZ.

#453 Nov 29, 2008
jack412 wrote:
so you still dont know what per 100,000 or per capita means
More like >you< have no conception of REALITY roo-humper.

“Uzi Does It”

Since: Nov 08

UZILAND

#454 Nov 29, 2008
The Bald Guy wrote:
<quoted text>
That kind of surprises me. Still, I don't like the idea of an AR that doesn't have a forward assist.
The 9MM bolt doesn't utilize a system of rotation and lugs to lock the bolt to the chamber as is done in .223 and other rifle calibers of the AR15/M16

Here's a picture that compares the .223 bolt carrier and rotating bolt and the 9MM bolt of an AR15/M16.

There are several reasons why it doesn't need a forward assist:

1) The locking mechanism of the 9MM is spring tension pushing the weight of the bolt home against the chamber mouth, just like is done in semi-auto handguns. Therefore when the bolt scoops up the next round to be fired, the bolt simply has to move forward, it doesn't have to rotate and lock it's lugs into the lugs in the chamber, which requires more momentum to complete successfully.

2) Since the 9MM Colt AR15/M16 is not gas operated, there is no dirty gases being deposited back in the bolt area as is done in the typical Colt AR15/M16 gas system. Therefore fouling from resdiue from firing does not wind up in the bolt area which can lead to more friction.

“Uzi Does It”

Since: Nov 08

UZILAND

#455 Nov 29, 2008
here's the bolt compairison picture:

http://tinypic.com/1pjssh

“Uzi Does It”

Since: Nov 08

UZILAND

#456 Nov 29, 2008
If I'm not mistaken, those bolts are from full auto M16's, you can tell because the bottom rear of the bolt is not cut off as is in semi versions (at least I think that is what is appearing there). The lower rear portion of the bolt is used to trip the sear to signal the hammer to let go for the next rap of the firing pin.

“Uzi Does It”

Since: Nov 08

UZILAND

#457 Nov 29, 2008
I just popped open my AR15 and the bolt has material there on the back lower end of the bolt, so I might be mistaken...time to do more research.

“Uzi Does It”

Since: Nov 08

UZILAND

#458 Nov 29, 2008
http://www.olyarms.com/index.php...

Seek and ye shall find. My bolt is semi-auto, it is Colt that machines off the full bottom of the rear of the carrier, others just mill out part, full auto bolts have a larger mass of material there.
Why Not

Amityville, NY

#459 Nov 29, 2008
Let me ask you this?

Are these Vulcan 9mm conversion kits worth the time? My G/F and all the kids handle the recoil (or lack)of .223 very well, but 9mm I can get for dirt cheap prices.

I bought one conversion kits for a friend to make his 1911 a .22 for his grandkids and he loves it.

Since: Nov 08

Rickman Tn.

#460 Nov 29, 2008
Those that choose safety over freedom deserve neither...or something like that

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