Who do you support for U.S. Senate in Georgia in 2010?

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Calling Your Bluff

Dallas, GA

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#1792
Dec 25, 2012
 
Sheltered, deducted, credited, subsidized, it all hits a balance sheet. Revenue and costs (taxes and fees, etc.)are forecasted on a never ending basis. All costs are passed on to the consumers. Corporations do not pay taxes.

Fairtax.org

Since: Nov 12

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#1794
Dec 25, 2012
 
you should know wrote:
<quoted text>
Fact is GE does pay corporate income tax, fact is they pay very little. Yes GE pays other types of taxes and so does the average American. The problem is that a corporation making millions of dollars can avoid tax due to the fact they have the money to influence Republican congressmen and women to do as they ask. GE chief spokesman Gary Sheffer told Pro Publica in early 2011 “We expect to have a small U.S. income tax liability for 2010.” How much? The company wouldn’t say. You can guess why. You can also check to see how little they paid in 2011.
It's rather amusing that you blame Republicans for GE's low tax burden. GE's Chairman and CEO Jeffrey Immelt sits as head of Obama's Council on Jobs and Competitiveness. When Obama announced $100 Billion in direct subsidies and tax credits for green energy, lo and behold GE announces its plans to open the largest solar panel production facility in the US - it was already the largest producer of wind turbines. Writing in the Examiner in July 2011, Tim Carney states "Obama wants cap-and-trade, GE wants cap-and-trade. Obama subsidizes embryonic stem cell research, GE launches an embryonic stem-cell business. Obama calls for rail subsidies, GE hires Linda Daschle (wife of former ...[Democratic} Senator... Tom Daschle) as a rail lobbyist. It goes on and on. Immelt is cosy with the Dems, so if you have a problem with their taxes (which are all legal, by the way), go talk to Democrats.
Oh, and that council that Obama talked about being "laser focused" on job creation, has met four whole times since its inception in January of 2011, the last time being in Jan 2012.
Informed Opinion

Naples, FL

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#1795
Dec 25, 2012
 
Gun Runner wrote:
<quoted text>Those receiving Social Security pay federal taxes if they income slightly above the poverty level. Please post facts, not fabrications.
If, if, if...

Please avoid creating "straw men" to attack. It's too obvious an attempt to distract from reality.
Informed Opinion

Naples, FL

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#1796
Dec 25, 2012
 

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Bill in Dville wrote:
One would think (if one was logical, or informed) that GE also pays franchise fees, state taxes (if they don't have credits and NOLs to offset them like they do federal income taxes), local taxes, payroll taxes, excise taxes and property taxes, too.

But why let the facts get in the way of a good story?
Sounds good - so of course you won't attack the poor for not paying federal income taxes.

We all appreciate intellectual consistency.
Informed Opinion

Naples, FL

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#1797
Dec 25, 2012
 

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Calling Your Bluff wrote:
<quoted text>One who knows, that every cost, including taxes and fees,is passed on to the consumer.

Corporations do not pay taxes.

Fairtax.org
That proposition is so wrong that nothing could be further from the truth.

Businesses have told that lie for years and it's still as untrue as it ever was.

People, companies, and corporations sell their products for the highest price they can get. Period.

If I can sell you my ink pen that coast me $10.00 for $1,000.00- I will sell it to you for $1,000.00.

If my price of my ink pen is raised to $15.00 - I will still sell it to you for $1,000.00 if that's the highest price I can get.

Costs are never passed directly along to customers because the seller always charges the highest price he can get. Since the customer is paying the highest price he's willing to pay, the cost to the producer is not diapositive.

Informed Opinion

Naples, FL

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#1798
Dec 25, 2012
 

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Synergy wrote:
<quoted text>You should know that taxing those corporations will help "some" but not stop the problem. The problem is SPENDING. YOU should know that. Is YOUR solutlon to tax, tax, tax the corporations and keep spending, spending, spending????? How will THAT save us????
The ready solution is to:
- cut the spending wasted on the war department by 50%;
- do away with capital gains tax limits of 15% and instead charge the same tax rate as workers pay on their incomes;
- cut corporate welfare by eliminating subsidies to agribusiness and oil companies;
and let the Bush tax cuts to anyone making over $1,000.000 a year expire.

Budget balanced and $250 Billion a year available to pay down the national debt.

Hey, you asked.
Calling Your Bluff

Dallas, GA

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#1799
Dec 25, 2012
 

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Informed Opinion wrote:
<quoted text>
That proposition is so wrong that nothing could be further from the truth.
Businesses have told that lie for years and it's still as untrue as it ever was.
People, companies, and corporations sell their products for the highest price they can get. Period.
If I can sell you my ink pen that coast me $10.00 for $1,000.00- I will sell it to you for $1,000.00.
If my price of my ink pen is raised to $15.00 - I will still sell it to you for $1,000.00 if that's the highest price I can get.
Costs are never passed directly along to customers because the seller always charges the highest price he can get. Since the customer is paying the highest price he's willing to pay, the cost to the producer is not diapositive.
I never said a business would not sell its product for as much as it can. They most certainly do, and they do not pay taxes.

Fairtax.org .
Calling Your Bluff

Dallas, GA

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#1800
Dec 25, 2012
 

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Informed Opinion wrote:
<quoted text>
The ready solution is to:
- cut the spending wasted on the war department by 50%;
- do away with capital gains tax limits of 15% and instead charge the same tax rate as workers pay on their incomes;
- cut corporate welfare by eliminating subsidies to agribusiness and oil companies;
and let the Bush tax cuts to anyone making over $1,000.000 a year expire.
Budget balanced and $250 Billion a year available to pay down the national debt.
Hey, you asked.
Abolish the IRS, save 11 billion dollars+.

Get "ALL ENTITIES" paying taxes.

Fairtax.org
Informed Opinion

Naples, FL

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#1801
Dec 25, 2012
 
Calling Your Bluff wrote:
<quoted text>Abolish the IRS, save 11 billion dollars+.

Get "ALL ENTITIES" paying taxes.

Fairtax.org
Sounds good.

Since: Jan 10

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#1802
Dec 25, 2012
 
Informed Opinion wrote:
<quoted text>
...
People, companies, and corporations sell their products for the highest price they can get. Period.
...
I won't get into a back and forth debate with an unregistered poster (who else are you today?), but you are wrong.

Simple (uninformed opinion) logic would make one believe what you say is true, however there's so much marketing, pricing analysis (what's our competition doing?), contracts, government regulations, general economics (ever have an economics class?) and the like...

BTW, why would a company ever have a reduction in price sale? Perhaps to get people into the store? Loss leaders?

Since: Jan 10

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#1803
Dec 25, 2012
 
Informed Opinion wrote:
<quoted text>
The ready solution is to:
...
- do away with capital gains tax limits of 15% and instead charge the same tax rate as workers pay on their incomes;
...
and let the Bush tax cuts to anyone making over $1,000.000 a year expire.
Budget balanced and $250 Billion a year available to pay down the national debt.
Hey, you asked.
Why is the capital gains rate 15%? Specifically, what is the rational for different treatment of capital gains (which, BTW, is available to all tax payers)?

Seems you've put a "." where you may have intended a ","...How/why did you pick $1 million (even though you typed $1 thousand)?

$250 billion a year to pay down the national debt? Gee, how many years will it take to pay down over $16 trillion? Will you be around that long? I won't...
Informed Opinion

Naples, FL

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#1804
Dec 25, 2012
 
Bill in Dville wrote:
<quoted text>Why is the capital gains rate 15%? Specifically, what is the rational for different treatment of capital gains (which, BTW, is available to all tax payers)?

Seems you've put a "." where you may have intended a ","...How/why did you pick $1 million (even though you typed $1 thousand)?

$250 billion a year to pay down the national debt? Gee, how many years will it take to pay down over $16 trillion? Will you be around that long? I won't...
Good points.

Allowing "Hedge Fund" billionaires to pay at a tax rate of 15% is ludicrous. Hedge Funds used to be for highly speculative "gambling" investments that only very affluent were permitted to invest in. Now, Hedge Funds are just rich people's investment clubs. If you are rich enough to meet the legal requirements to invest through a Hedge Fund, you get a tax break. If you are not rich enough - you don't get a tax break. Talk about welfare for the rich.

As Warren Buffet said - no intelligent investor ever declined to make a smart investment because if the tax rate applied to the profits achieved, because regardless of the tax rate, any profit is preferable to none.

I picked $1,000,000.00 a year just because I can't believe anyone can possible claim that someone making over a $1,000,000.00 a year should get a tax break for the portion of his income over $1,000,000.00 a year.

It's fine with me if you believe a lower amount is more reasonable - I'll be on your team.

If you want to cut the war department or corporate welfare even more, sounds good to me too.

Heck, you lead, we reasonable folks will follow.

Since: Jan 10

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#1805
Dec 25, 2012
 

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Informed Opinion wrote:
<quoted text>
Good points.
Allowing "Hedge Fund" billionaires to pay at a tax rate of 15% is ludicrous. Hedge Funds used to be for highly speculative "gambling" investments that only very affluent were permitted to invest in. Now, Hedge Funds are just rich people's investment clubs. If you are rich enough to meet the legal requirements to invest through a Hedge Fund, you get a tax break. If you are not rich enough - you don't get a tax break. Talk about welfare for the rich.
As Warren Buffet said - no intelligent investor ever declined to make a smart investment because if the tax rate applied to the profits achieved, because regardless of the tax rate, any profit is preferable to none.
I picked $1,000,000.00 a year just because I can't believe anyone can possible claim that someone making over a $1,000,000.00 a year should get a tax break for the portion of his income over $1,000,000.00 a year.
It's fine with me if you believe a lower amount is more reasonable - I'll be on your team.
If you want to cut the war department or corporate welfare even more, sounds good to me too.
Heck, you lead, we reasonable folks will follow.
"Hedge fund billionaires" are not the only ones that utilize the 15% capital gains rate. I would imagine there's many more of us utilizing the 15% capital gains rate than there are "hedge fund billionaires".

As previously asked, are you aware of what the rationale is for having a lower capital gains rate (which is available to all tax payers)?
ex-welder

Americus, GA

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#1806
Dec 25, 2012
 

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how come we still go here please explain
average joe

Smyrna, GA

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#1807
Dec 25, 2012
 

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Columbus Native wrote:
<quoted text>republicans suck more and lost the presidential election by a landslide. We independents are'rt on our knees to the wealthy and come january your gods will cough up alot of money that they have been dodging for the past 11 years. Over the cliff we go and it will be a GOOD thing! Automatic large tax increases for the 1% who don't invest in America but the stock market where companies based in China and Mexico make Walmart stock go up.
two more words=INDEPENDANT'S SUCK!!!!
Informed Opinion

Fort Myers, FL

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#1808
Dec 26, 2012
 
Bill in Dville wrote:
<quoted text>"Hedge fund billionaires" are not the only ones that utilize the 15% capital gains rate. I would imagine there's many more of us utilizing the 15% capital gains rate than there are "hedge fund billionaires".

As previously asked, are you aware of what the rationale is for having a lower capital gains rate (which is available to all tax payers)?
I enjoy the conversation and respect your opinion s please, while awaiting the French Toast, let me respond thoroughly.

The claimed rationales has been:

"Incentivizing Investment"

- that unless you "incentivize" people to invest their funds by allowing them to pay a lowered tax on "risky" investments, they won't invest their money in such "risky" investments, thereby denying otherwise available funding.

This is not a defensible rationale because investments are made to maximize return, and avoid loss, and an investment so risky as to require a tax incentive is doomed from the start.

As Warren Buffet said - Investors pick better investments than the tax man, and even if you allow your funds to sit idly in a bank, the bank is investing those same funds, so the funds are always invested in any event.

Allowing the rich to pay 15% on their incomes, just because that income results from clipping coupons, cashing CDs, or selling stock, as opposed to working for a living, doesn't increase the available investment funds, because these funds are always invested, either by the "Investor", or by the bank where the "Investor" parks his money.

"Investment Stability"

- Unless you "Incentivize" entities not to move investment monies rapidly they will move their money from one investment to another too rapidly,(less than a year), thereby adding instability to the system.

This is also defeated because it simply adds another factor to our overwhelming goal - to accumulate profits. We all schedule our sales of stock to coincide with our losses, so that in the end, whether it not we sell Stock A depends on whether we have a loss on Stock B that allows us to avoid taxes, and whether we are paying long term CG or short term, helps determine which stock we sell.

In the end, we often pay no taxes at all.

"Fairness"

A third, less often professed rationale, is that it is unfair to tax people at an ordinary income rate when they are investing money that is the residual of income on which they have already been taxes.

This of course ignores the fact that the inheritance tax is set now such that 98.5% of the population need never worry about paying it, and the remaining 1.5% are provided so many avoidance mechanisms that the tax liability must be so minimal, otherwise the would use such mechanisms to avoid it completely.

"Capital Gains Availability"

The capital gains tax rate, for all practical purposes, is available to only a small number of taxpayers.
Those earning minimum wage, the working poor, and most middle class family with children and/or aging parents, simply do not have discretionary funds sitting idly, awaiting an investment opportunity. Their discretionary funds are totally consumed by the necessities of living.

Anyway, history has spoken louder than any of us.

When that Crazed Liberal Socialist Commie Republican President Eisenhower was in charge we had tax rates on the wealthiest of 91%, and the richest actually paid over 49%.
Since then we an average economic growth of 3.5% and low unemployment.

Seems that if cutting taxes on the rich worked to benefit anyone but the rich, we'd all be billionaires, smoking Arturo Fuentes, drinking Hirsch bourbon, and enjoying how great a life it is when only working folks pay high tax rates.

Instead, we are actually debating whether someone making a million a year should pay a lower effective tax rate than his secretary, and why it's great that billion dollar entities pay almost nothing,( or nothing at all).
RWC

Dallas, TX

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#1809
Dec 26, 2012
 
you should know

Blairsville, GA

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#1810
Dec 26, 2012
 

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Synergy wrote:
<quoted text>
You should know that taxing those corporations will help "some" but not stop the problem. The problem is SPENDING. YOU should know that. Is YOUR solutlon to tax, tax, tax the corporations and keep spending, spending, spending????? How will THAT save us????
No my solution is to cut entitlements, Social Security & Medicare. Just not the way Republicans want to do and that’s to kick the can down the road to the younger generation. I think the retirement age should be raised by one year, then in 5 years another year and in 5 more another. I think ALL security benefits should be trimmed today by 10% and cost of living increases based on true cost to live less the rise and fall of fuel and housing. I think Medicare and Medicaid should not fund any expensive procedure for anyone over the age of 75 just to prolong life or just to make them feel better, everybody dies.

I would also cap the length of time unemployment insurance can be paid to 6 months, except in times of high unemployment.

I would trim defense spending back to a point that actually reflects the world we live in today, not the world that existed during the cold war or ww2.
Informed Opinion

United States

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#1811
Dec 26, 2012
 

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you should know wrote:
<quoted text>No my solution is to cut entitlements, Social Security & Medicare. Just not the way Republicans want to do and thatÂ’s to kick the can down the road to the younger generation. I think the retirement age should be raised by one year, then in 5 years another year and in 5 more another. I think ALL security benefits should be trimmed today by 10% and cost of living increases based on true cost to live less the rise and fall of fuel and housing. I think Medicare and Medicaid should not fund any expensive procedure for anyone over the age of 75 just to prolong life or just to make them feel better, everybody dies.

I would also cap the length of time unemployment insurance can be paid to 6 months, except in times of high unemployment.

I would trim defense spending back to a point that actually reflects the world we live in today, not the world that existed during the cold war or ww2.
Tough, but fair.

They have already raised my Social Security retirement age past age 65.

I also agree it makes little sense to spend $1,000,000.00 to prolong a life from age 86 to age 87, when children and others die every day because of an absence of medical care.

And cutting the War Department - long, long overdue.

This kind of rational discussion gives hope that the whole world is not crazy.
Columbus Native

Oklahoma City, OK

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#1813
Dec 26, 2012
 

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Over the cliff we are going come january. Result? Massive spending cuts to the mlitary and justice department which is long overdue. The wealthy will be made to pay up, after all Bush sheltered his chosen ones for 10 years now they will HAVE to pay up. Middle income workers will have to pay a little more but over 50% of them suported their Circus Freak Bush and his deceitful war so PAY UP! Even entitlements will be cut. So what is everybody worrying about? The national debt will be cut in half automtically by this time next year. Everybody sacrifices.

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