Scott

Toccoa, GA

#26811 Oct 10, 2013
By Thomas Sewell

When it comes to something as basic, and apparently as simple and straightforward, as the question of who shut down the federal government, there are diametrically opposite answers, depending on whether you talk to Democrats or to Republicans.

There is nothing complicated about the facts. The Republican-controlled House of Representatives voted all the money required to keep all government activities going — except for Obamacare. This is not a matter of opinion. You can check the Congressional Record.

As for the House of Representatives’ right to grant or withhold money, that is not a matter of opinion either. You can check the Constitution of the United States. All spending bills must originate in the House of Representatives, which means that congressmen there have a right to decide whether or not they want to spend money on a particular government activity.

Whether Obamacare is good, bad or indifferent is a matter of opinion. But it is a matter of fact that members of the House of Representatives have a right to make spending decisions based on their opinion.

Obamacare is indeed “the law of the land,” as its supporters keep saying, and the Supreme Court has upheld its constitutionality. But the whole point of having a division of powers within the federal government is that each branch can decide independently what it wants to do or not do, regardless of what the other branches do, when exercising the powers specifically granted to that branch by the Constitution.

The hundreds of thousands of government workers who have been laid off are not idle because the House of Representatives did not vote enough money to pay their salaries or the other expenses of their agencies — unless they are in an agency that would administer Obamacare.

Since we cannot read minds, we cannot say who — if anybody —“wants to shut down the government.” But we do know who had the option to keep the government running and chose not to.

The money voted by the House of Representatives covered everything that the government does, except for Obamacare. The Senate chose not to vote to authorize that money to be spent, because it did not include money for Obamacare.

Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid says that he wants a “clean” bill from the House of Representatives, and some in the media keep repeating the word “clean” like a mantra. But what is unclean about not giving Reid everything he wants?

If Reid and President Barack Obama refuse to accept the money required to run the government, because it leaves out the money they want to run Obamacare, that is their right. But that is also their responsibility. You cannot blame other people for not giving you everything you want. And it is a fraud to blame them when you refuse to use the money they did vote, even when it is ample to pay for everything else in the government.

When Obama claims that it is some new outrage for those who control the money to try to change government policy by granting or withholding money, that is simply a baldfaced lie. You can check the history of other examples of “legislation by appropriation,” as it used to be called.

Whether legislation by appropriation is a good idea or a bad idea is a matter of opinion. But whether it is both legal and not unprecedented is a matter of fact.

Perhaps the biggest of the big lies is that the government will not be able to pay what it owes on the national debt, creating a danger of default. Tax money keeps coming into the treasury during the shutdown, and it vastly exceeds the interest that has to be paid on the national debt.

Even if the debt ceiling is not lifted, that only means that government is not allowed to run up new debt. But that does not mean that it is unable to pay the interest on existing debt.

None of this is rocket science. But unless the Republicans get their side of the story out, the lies will win. More important, the whole country will lose.

Since: Nov 12

Location hidden

#26812 Oct 10, 2013
Now wrote:
This is what happens when global WARMING takes over.......
"As many as 75,000 cattle have perished since the storm slammed the western part of the state Thursday through Saturday with snowfall that set records for the entire month of October in just three days, state and industry officials said.
Across the state, snow totals averaged 30 inches, with some isolated areas recording almost 5 feet."
Maybe I should have said global COOLING.....
But what the heck, the name changes with the weather..........
Next up just might be global normalcy, or global flux, or global potpourri....
But with the Shutdown, maybe all things will be forgotten....Just maybe folks can get back to living their lives without gubmint in their face every minute of every day.
I say make gubmint so small that only true public servants want to work for it....
http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/10/08/20...
GASP!!! Mother Earth is fighting back!!! She knows those dastardly cows contribute up to 15% of that deadly greenhouse gas methane that is warming our planet so dramatically - especially in the last 15 years. ;)

Since: Jan 10

Location hidden

#26814 Oct 10, 2013
Synergy wrote:
<quoted text>
Two words explains IO's insanity: Makers Mark
Nah, more like K-Mart, even though I don't think they make bourbon...
Oh my

Blairsville, GA

#26815 Oct 10, 2013
Synergy wrote:
<quoted text>
http://www.topix.com/forum/city/blairsville-g...
Is Michelle's site still up and running? I guess THAT is essential. Wonder why the Amber Alert site was shut down until there was so much backlash that it was brought back up? I guess that wasn't considered essential. If there are rules(as you posted), wonder how those rules can be indescriminately enforced( or unenforced)?????
There you go again. Defending theindefensible. You should be ashamed of youself, but you libroids don't have the "conscience" gene.
Dear Dipsy Doodle,

Regarding Michelle's website, if you knew anything about websites you would know that once they are setup and running their is very little on going interaction required from the creators.
..........
"Wonder why the Amber Alert site was shut down..."

http://www.snopes.com/inboxer/missing/shutdow...
The DoJ's AMBER Alert web site only provides background information and statistics about the AMBER Alert system; it doesn't create, disseminate, or list the alerts themselves. AMBER alerts are issued locally, and they are compiled and tracked on the web site of the National Center for Missing & Exploited Children (NCMEC), which is, and has been, available throughout the federal government shutdown...
..........
Take the time to goto the links provided in the original post and educate yourself...

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2...
53. Who decides which employees work and which go home? Each agency is responsible for coming up with its own contingency plan, based on guidance from the Office of Management and Budget and the Office of Personnel Management. Those plans are then sent to the White House for review.

guidance from the Office of Management and Budget
http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files...

guidance from the Office of Personnel Management
http://www.opm.gov/policy-data-oversight/pay-...

Those plans are then sent to the White House for review.
http://www.whitehouse.gov/omb/contingency-pla...
Oh my

Blairsville, GA

#26816 Oct 10, 2013
Bigdave1 wrote:
http://www.topix.com/forum/city/blairsville-g...
I was just wondering if Obama had given any thought to closing all Federal Highways, and closing all airports by removing all the air traffic controllers.
That should put the hurt on everyone and show them who the boss is.
It shows me that the Federal Government is too large and controls way too much of out everyday lives. We have let it happen little by little, and now the government can do almost anything it wishes to make us suffer by pure extortion.
Dear 1 Big Dumby,

Why would the Federal Highway need to be shutdown, please try and explain your reasoning.

Government shutdown impact: Mail, air travel, prisons
http://www.politico.com/story/2013/09/governm...
Federal air traffic controllers would remain on the job and airport screeners would keep funneling passengers through security checkpoints. Federal inspectors would continue enforcing safety rules.
Oh my

Blairsville, GA

#26817 Oct 10, 2013
Informed Opinion wrote:
<quoted text>
http://www.topix.com/forum/city/blairsville-g...
Sure.
The problem is Right Wingers have deluded themselves into thinking their "Conservatives", when they are a actually "Reactionaries."

It's not a new phenomena, throughout history as the previously powerful majority is relegated to the status of politically impotent minority, it's member a become vehemently reactionary, using increasingly anti-democratic tactics to try to overcome their declining political power.

That's why:
having lost the Senate,
lost the House,
lost the Presidency,
lost in the Supreme Court,
lost again in the Senate,
and lost again in the House,
the Right Wing is attempting to prevent the Law of the Land, democratically enacted, from being implemented.

As "Crazy Cruz" himself admits - if we don't stop implementation of ObamaCare now, Americans will come to love it - and we'll never get the Law overturned.
That is the definition of a "Reactionary" - a politically impotent minority using extortion and blackmail to prevent Law enacted by the majority.
..........
No. 1 Big Dummy replied
http://www.topix.com/forum/city/blairsville-g...
You are truely nuts!
Looks like No. 1 Big Dummy doesn't know what Reactionary means, no surprises there.
Oh my

Blairsville, GA

#26819 Oct 10, 2013
Bigdave1 wrote:
http://www.topix.com/forum/city/blairsville-g...
I don't know if this has been posted yet or not. If so I apologize.
I see President Obama's approval ratings have dropped to 37%. That is about as low as his ratings can go as about 37% of the population is socialist or communist.If his ratings drop much lower than he has lost his base of die hard supporters.
http://nation.foxnews.com/2013/10/09/obama-ap...
October 9, 2013
Republican Party Favorability Sinks to Record Low
http://www.gallup.com/poll/165317/republican-...

With the Republican-controlled House of Representatives engaged in a tense, government-shuttering budgetary standoff against a Democratic president and Senate, the Republican Party is now viewed favorably by 28% of Americans, down from 38% in September. This is the lowest favorable rating measured for either party since Gallup began asking this question in 1992.

...The Democratic Party also has a public image problem -- although not on the same elephantine scale as that of the Republican Party -- with 43% viewing the Democratic Party favorably, down four percentage points from last month.

...More than six in 10 Americans (62%) now view the GOP unfavorably, a record high. By comparison, nearly half of Americans (49%) view the Democratic Party unfavorably. Roughly one in four Americans see both parties unfavorably.

...As the two major political parties are locked in a high-stakes political imbroglio that has resulted in a government shutdown and may cause the first-ever default on the national debt, Americans are more likely to view both parties negatively than positively. The Republican Party is clearly taking a bigger political hit from Americans thus far in the unfolding saga, with 28% rating the GOP favorably -- a loss of 10 points from only a month ago. This contrasts with previous Gallup findings from just before the government shutdown showing the Republican Party making up ground on a few key issues. Thus, the Republican Party's current strategy in the fiscal debates may not be paying dividends.
Informed Opinion

Fort Myers, FL

#26820 Oct 10, 2013
Scott wrote:
By Thomas Sewell

When it comes to something as basic, and apparently as simple and straightforward, as the question of who shut down the federal government, there are diametrically opposite answers, depending on whether you talk to Democrats or to Republicans.

There is nothing complicated about the facts. The Republican-controlled House of Representatives voted all the money required to keep all government activities going — except for Obamacare. This is not a matter of opinion. You can check the Congressional Record.

As for the House of RepresentativesÂ’ right to grant or withhold money, that is not a matter of opinion either. You can check the Constitution of the United States. All spending bills must originate in the House
Whether legislation
None of this is rocket science. But unless the Republicans get their side of the story out, the lies will win. More important, the whole country will lose.
What a concept !

Forget elections.
Forget bills having been passed.
Forget bills having been signed into law.
Forget Supreme Court decisions.
Forget election confirming the laws.

Right Wingers, having lost at all levels, now want the the three branches of government to engage in hostage taking, blackmail, and extortion as the proper method of government.

Either the House or the Senate can now simply change the results of the elections, the decisions of the Supreme Court, and the following confirming elections confirming, by simply holding the American government hostage.

That, my friend, is the definition of extortion and blackmail, and what every loser would like to do.

Of course, since the Senate wants Immigration Reform, and the House failed to approve it, you'd fully support the Senate holding America hostage, extorting and blackmailing the House, refusing to pass any budget, or deal with the country's debt, until the House caves and passes Immigration Reform.

After all, they don't "have to" approve the House's resolutions.

And of course, as the President has to approve the Congressional bills to cause them to become law, you'd fully support Obama holding America hostage, refusing to sign any budget or deal with the Country's debt, unless the House Republicans did as he demanded.

After all, he doesn't "have to" sign bills into law.

Yep.. Right Wingers... Now that they are forever in the minority, suddenly determine extortion, blackmail, hostage taking, and terrorism are far better than submitting to the will of the people.

Forget Al Queda, they can only kill a few thousand people with places.

Right Wingers, having become a permanent minority, have announced they want to kill the democratic process and destroy America's government.

Obviously the Right Wingers are far more dangerous to America's Constitution and government that Al Queda ever dreamed of being.

Informed Opinion

Fort Myers, FL

#26821 Oct 10, 2013
Now wrote:
"Contrary to Obama’s promises, it turns out: You can’t keep your doctor, you can’t keep your insurance — you can’t even keep your job. In other words, it’s a typical government program, but this one wrecks your health care."


"Can't even keep your job," is typically what happens when Libroids get their way, along with higher taxes.....

http://dailycaller.com/2013/10/09/democrats-t...
Since the rest of us are paying for your doctor, we should get to pick the doctor.

Here's an idea - buy some damn insurance and stop whining.
OMTE

Tifton, GA

#26822 Oct 10, 2013
Michele Bachmann is hott.:)
http://personalliberty.com/2013/10/10/the-dem...
Impeach Obama Today!

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OMTE

Tifton, GA

#26823 Oct 10, 2013
Bill in Dville wrote:
<quoted text>
Nah, more like K-Mart, even though I don't think they make bourbon...
Nah, more like "nighttrain" at your local arab store.

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OMTE

Tifton, GA

#26824 Oct 10, 2013
Amber Alert! Amber Alert!
http://personalliberty.com/2013/10/10/amber-a...
Impeach Obama Today!

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OMTE

Tifton, GA

#26825 Oct 10, 2013
Boehner, Cantor, McConnell, and Cornyn are Obama's buddies. They are about roll-over and piss themselves like cowardly mutts.
http://www.redstate.com/2013/10/10/house-gop-...
Impeach Obama and Buddies Today!

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OMTE

Tifton, GA

#26826 Oct 10, 2013
Aggie23 wrote:
<quoted text>
GASP!!! Mother Earth is fighting back!!! She knows those dastardly cows contribute up to 15% of that deadly greenhouse gas methane that is warming our planet so dramatically - especially in the last 15 years. ;)
Post of the Day! LoL.

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Billy Bob

Dahlonega, GA

#26829 Oct 10, 2013
Synergy wrote:
<quoted text>
Spoken like a TRUE Obamabot. He's proud of you.
If you think for a minute that the democrats aren't picking and choosing whom is going to be shut down, you need to take the blinders off. If Obama were honest about ANYTHING, a lot of problems we are having right now probably could have been avoided. This country is in a horrendous mess and it's his lack of leadership that has lead to this. If he had acted like a mature individual from the get go, the republicans might have been williing to work with him. He passed a healthcare law without one republican vote of support. Not one. He has NEVER reached across the aisle. His arrogant self has never felt the need. How can you possibly look at our country today and think we are better due to his presidency?
Personally, I think those government programs you posted should be handled on the state level. OBVIOUSLY, the government doesn't do a very good job. Now, it will be handling our healthcare. How can an intelligent person support that???? Are you THAT satisfied with our government? You know, I was thinking earlier today. The government threatens to run out of social security, but I've never heard the government threaten to run out of food stamp money. We worked and paid into social security and THAT'S the program that the government is always threatening us with. Any thoughts on that?
I am far from satisfied with our government, or for that matter Obama. Its the Tea Party that's what I am 100% against. Its nuts like you and the Tea Party who seems to have taken control of the Republican Party. Since that time government has ceased to govern. The Tea Party was actually a good idea in the beginning, but the idea has been hijacked by whackos with no real idea of the ramifications of what they want, plus they don't care about anyone but themselves. The deficit is actually going down, the Dems for the first time in a while are willing to talk about changes to social programs and other cost cuts. They are not will to dismantle them or to shove the burden on future generations. The idea that current recipients and those close to receiving Social Security benefits should see no change while younger generations pay for the programs they will see little benefit from is ridiculous. Especially since that generation is the major cause of the problems we now have. A generation that wanted to control the world, a greedy, generation, a buy it on credit generation. A generation fathered by the greatest generation is now the generation that caused the second great depression.

And they claim its all Obamas fault, give me a break.

On thing we in the end will be thankful for is your attempts, they will be the building blocks of your demise. The frustrating standoff in Washington is weighing on each side's poll numbers, but Republicans are taking the worst drubbing. A Gallup poll put the approval rating for the Republican Party at a record-low 28 percent. Polls have consistently said the Republicans deserve the greater share of blame for the shutdown. Your side can't seem to play by the rules. In states such as Ga. and most southern states they have used redistricting in a way to make it hard for anything but Republican's to win office. They have changed campaign laws making it OK for rich Republicans to back a single candidate for President. They can't live with a law passed, they hold the whole country hostage till they get their way, it ain't gonna happen this time.
Doo

Chatsworth, GA

#26830 Oct 10, 2013
Now wrote:
<quoted text>
doo-doo, that's just your opinion...
My opinion is, you are wrong as usual....
BTW- The corner no longer exists, so the ugly of obamacare can no longer be hidden. The ugliness is out there for all to see now, except for the blind, lame, and dumb....
So you deny that fact that we had two wars that cost trillions and over 6,000 Americans lost their lives. Didn't happen? Oh yes it surly did. Are you blind or just crazy? Obamacare is the law of he land and will be funded like it or not. This is the Republicans last ditch effort to kill it for their rich buddies that got them elected. Everyone should pay in so everyone can have coverage and doo away with the leaches that are too sorry to buy insurance and put their hospital bills on my tab and yours too. Blinc, lame, and dumb sounds like you friend.
Doo

Chatsworth, GA

#26831 Oct 10, 2013
OMTE wrote:
Boehner, Cantor, McConnell, and Cornyn are Obama's buddies. They are about roll-over and piss themselves like cowardly mutts.
http://www.redstate.com/2013/10/10/house-gop-...
Impeach Obama and Buddies Today!
You sure don't know much about Politcs doo you? Get off the dope!
Doo

Chatsworth, GA

#26832 Oct 10, 2013
Billy Bob wrote:
<quoted text>
I am far from satisfied with our government, or for that matter Obama. Its the Tea Party that's what I am 100% against. Its nuts like you and the Tea Party who seems to have taken control of the Republican Party. Since that time government has ceased to govern. The Tea Party was actually a good idea in the beginning, but the idea has been hijacked by whackos with no real idea of the ramifications of what they want, plus they don't care about anyone but themselves. The deficit is actually going down, the Dems for the first time in a while are willing to talk about changes to social programs and other cost cuts. They are not will to dismantle them or to shove the burden on future generations. The idea that current recipients and those close to receiving Social Security benefits should see no change while younger generations pay for the programs they will see little benefit from is ridiculous. Especially since that generation is the major cause of the problems we now have. A generation that wanted to control the world, a greedy, generation, a buy it on credit generation. A generation fathered by the greatest generation is now the generation that caused the second great depression.
And they claim its all Obamas fault, give me a break.
On thing we in the end will be thankful for is your attempts, they will be the building blocks of your demise. The frustrating standoff in Washington is weighing on each side's poll numbers, but Republicans are taking the worst drubbing. A Gallup poll put the approval rating for the Republican Party at a record-low 28 percent. Polls have consistently said the Republicans deserve the greater share of blame for the shutdown. Your side can't seem to play by the rules. In states such as Ga. and most southern states they have used redistricting in a way to make it hard for anything but Republican's to win office. They have changed campaign laws making it OK for rich Republicans to back a single candidate for President. They can't live with a law passed, they hold the whole country hostage till they get their way, it ain't gonna happen this time.
Great Post and I agree completely. The Tea Party poops will soon be sent home and a lot of Moderates will loos the election in 2014 and the Democrats will again run the Senate, House and Presidency. They don't all this damage to themselves.
OMTE

Tifton, GA

#26833 Oct 10, 2013
Doo wrote:
<quoted text>
You sure don't know much about Politcs doo you? Get off the dope!
This comin from aperson that doesn't even know how to spell the word "do". LoL. Now that's irony for ya! Dang, you a dummy.:)

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Doo

Chatsworth, GA

#26834 Oct 10, 2013
OMTE wrote:
<quoted text>This comin from aperson that doesn't even know how to spell the word "do". LoL. Now that's irony for ya! Dang, you a dummy.:)
I doo use doo a lot because my trade name is Doo. You are slow to catch on. It is making an impact on your tiny brain. What is (aperson)? You are so smart aren't you? Republicans are like that. Get back on the banana boat friend.

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