Part 12 Guy Heinze Jr.
Out of State Reader

O Fallon, MO

#933 Sep 16, 2013
Caring wrote:
<quoted text>
Thanks for the compliment but I am no pro. lol I have been reading and researching true crime for over three decades and I have learned a lot about the justice system during that time. I love to read and true crime is my favorite subject. Then along came trial watching on CTV/IS in the early 90s and I have been hooked ever since...especially in the past four years since I am retired now.
If I find an on line site that is going to have the trial I will make sure I let you know. They did air the Elkins trial on line but this Judge may not be for cameras in the courtroom. He may think it is too gruesome since so many died the way they did.
During these thirty years though I have learned a lot about cases. defendants, their methods, their motives, profiles, and a lot about the laws. You too will learn more and more knowledgeable with each case you follow.
Do you remember Richard Speck the serial killer? He was able to not only contain 8 adult women at one time but he also killed them one by one. I have read other articles where someone was able to creep in a home and bludgeon everyone to death inside and those victims were found by LE still in the fetal sleeping position as if they never knew they were in grave danger. One case I remember involved 6 people so two more is not that hard for me to believe.
But maybe some of them did try to fight back but if they had no weapon they would be no match for a crazy man strung out on drugs who was crashing a shotgun butt down on their head as hard as he could time after time after time. People will bludgeon someone because it doesn't make sounds like a gun would. It is a silent weapon and very deadly.
I think LE suspected him immediately especially when they found the broken shotgun butt with blood on it in his trunk but they needed evidence to arrest. 8 days isn't that long either. Once they got results back from the lab he was arrested. Also the Police Chief mentioned something having a 'witness statement' too as part of the probable cause to arrest. I think he may have been seen leaving in the middle of the night and then returning early morning.
But we shall see.
I hope you can find out what is making your PC freeze up. I know you don't want to miss this trial since we have all waited for so long.:)
Caring after this trial I can erase lots of articles..lol but I never read where Jr. was strung out on drugs.
also has anyone ever wrote what the child's grandmother had to say?Byron I think his name is//////////
Caring

Leesburg, GA

#934 Sep 17, 2013
Out of State Reader wrote:
<quoted text>
Caring after this trial I can erase lots of articles..lol but I never read where Jr. was strung out on drugs.
also has anyone ever wrote what the child's grandmother had to say?Byron I think his name is//////////
Morning!

All I know is Byron is being raised by his grandmother and seems to be doing well.

Now about the drug usage that night by Heinz Jr. It looks to me they may have drug tested him when he was arrested on the other charges since his own lawyers believe it will be brought out at trial.

**********

Prosecutors and police have released few details of the slayings and have never given a motive. But a court brief filed by Heinze's LAWYERS says the defense expects witnesses may testify that there was "extensive drug use among members of the household," and jurors are likely to hear that HEINZ "consumed crack cocaine and other drugs" the night of the killings.

http://www.sfgate.com/news/crime/article/Mont...
Caring

Albany, GA

#935 Sep 30, 2013
It promises to be a long process that could take longer than two weeks. Of the 450 jurors summoned Monday, 256 appeared and the sheriff is looking for the rest. The idea is to qualify about 50 for a pool. If that many can’t be picked from those set for questioning this week, a second group of about 450 will be called.
From the 256 that responded to their jury summonses Monday, there are at least 15 panels of 14 to 16 potential jurors. One panel came to court at 9 a.m. and a second at 2 p.m. From those panels, potential jurors came into the courtroom one at a time where Scarlett advised them of the procedures of the trial and the role they would play in sentencing should they find Heinze guilty. He advised them on the three possible sentences of life with the possibility of parole, life without parole and death.
Read more at Jacksonville.com : http://jacksonville.com/news/crime/2013-09-17...
Caring

Albany, GA

#936 Sep 30, 2013
misplaced wrote:
I know many disagree with me, but I firmly think Jr is innocent. I have maintained that notion all long and unless Jr flat-out admits, will retain it.
I grew up with Rusty and Guy Sr. I met them in 4th grade. They considered each other brothers way back then and all through life, he remained the best of friends.
When they started having kids, the closeness of their family was such that unless you knew them well, you would not know which kid belonged to which parent.
Those kids, as they grew up, stayed just as close as their fathers did. There was normal childhood bickering, but in the end, no one messed with any of them because you would have to deal with ALL of them.
Also, like with a great deal many other kids, there were the normal bouts with drugs. But, none of them ever got involved with mass quantities or any really hard stuff- mostly some pot or a pain killer or two.
As for any violence in the family, nothing more than any other family dealt with.
My point is that despite the financial troubles they endured, the few recreational drugs and a few other small things I will not mention here, they were a very strong, very loving, very tight family living in a mobile home. Picture it, if you will, as a family life you would expect from the filthy rich, only without the money and instead of a mansion, they lived in a small, old, rented mobile home.
I am honored and proud to say that I knew that family. Rusty and Guy were the best friends anyone could ever hope to have. Their demise is beyond sad.
I often recall our camping trips together, fishing adventures and
Respectfully snipped

Thank you for your thoughtful post. In the past concerning other cases I have read many posts over the years by those who knew either the victim or the defendant or both. They are always heartbreaking to read. It is human nature to want to disbelieve that anyone they know is capable of such heinous acts like in this case. So I respect your opinion and find it a common opinion held by friends or family members. I see no reason why Heinz Jr. would ever admit to something so horrible. Why would he? Most just like him continue to deny even after the trial and evidence comes forth showing them guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. But what Jr. IS willing to do is sent in jail for four years instead of opting for a speedy trial like an innocent man would do and demand. So while not vocally saying he did it.......subliminally he does say it because no innocent man would stay in jail for four years if he truly was innocent but would want the case to go forward fast so he could prove he is innocent and go home.

These were crimes of out of control rage against these victims. Brutal does even begin to cover it. Strangers or drug dealers don't have that emotional connection attachment to victims but family members do especially when there is a fine line between love and hate.

Unfortunately, violent history is not an indicator or anything and is often missing when something like this happens. We have seen murderers who lived moral impeccable lives before they heinously murdered someone. Not one blemish on their record before they did the unspeakable. Men/women and close family ties.

I do believe you that Rusty and Sr. were honorable men who loved their family and tried to do the very best they could even when it was financially difficult. I wish Sr. had lived to be able to collect his 25K award settlement from the manufactured home builder. It would have given them a much needed boost to maybe buy another used trailer of their own to give them more security. I wish it had happened for Rusty and Sr. who were like brothers and died together like brothers in the end.

I want this case proven so justice can be served because these victims deserve no less and each and everyone of their lives mattered. The truth can often be brutal to comprehend but with truth comes justice and that is what is paramount in the end.
Caring

Albany, GA

#937 Sep 30, 2013
Oops........sorry for the duplicate posts. I don't know why it posted twice.
Out of State Reader

O Fallon, MO

#938 Sep 30, 2013
Caring wrote:
<quoted text>
Respectfully snipped
Thank you for your thoughtful post. In the past concerning other cases I have read many posts over the years by those who knew either the victim or the defendant or both. They are always heartbreaking to read. It is human nature to want to disbelieve that anyone they know is capable of such heinous acts like in this case. So I respect your opinion and find it a common opinion held by friends or family members. I see no reason why Heinz Jr. would ever admit to something so horrible. Why would he? Most just like him continue to deny even after the trial and evidence comes forth showing them guilty beyond a reasonable doubt. But what Jr. IS willing to do is sent in jail for four years instead of opting for a speedy trial like an innocent man would do and demand. So while not vocally saying he did it.......subliminally he does say it because no innocent man would stay in jail for four years if he truly was innocent but would want the case to go forward fast so he could prove he is innocent and go home.
These were crimes of out of control rage against these victims. Brutal does even begin to cover it. Strangers or drug dealers don't have that emotional connection attachment to victims but family members do especially when there is a fine line between love and hate.
Unfortunately, violent history is not an indicator or anything and is often missing when something like this happens. We have seen murderers who lived moral impeccable lives before they heinously murdered someone. Not one blemish on their record before they did the unspeakable. Men/women and close family ties.
I do believe you that Rusty and Sr. were honorable men who loved their family and tried to do the very best they could even when it was financially difficult. I wish Sr. had lived to be able to collect his 25K award settlement from the manufactured home builder. It would have given them a much needed boost to maybe buy another used trailer of their own to give them more security. I wish it had happened for Rusty and Sr. who were like brothers and died together like brothers in the end.
I want this case proven so justice can be served because these victims deserve no less and each and everyone of their lives mattered. The truth can often be brutal to comprehend but with truth comes justice and that is what is paramount in the end.
Very well wrote Caring your posts are as always touching.
Caring wonder what happened to the lady that used to post with us called ? think it was Sunshine....I am going to look that up.
Caring

Albany, GA

#939 Oct 10, 2013
Out of State Reader wrote:
<quoted text>
Very well wrote Caring your posts are as always touching.
Caring wonder what happened to the lady that used to post with us called ? think it was Sunshine....I am going to look that up.
Good Morning and thank you.

I believe it was Sunshine and she was from Alabama iirc. Maybe she is waiting for the trial to begin....which will be next Tuesday the 15th. I sure hope she is ok.

So we are finally almost to the trial after many years of waiting.

Here is the latest link about the case.

Judge denies Guy Heinze Jr.'s motion to not sequester jurors in his murder trial

Read more at Jacksonville.com : http://jacksonville.com/news/georgia/2013-10-...

Will you be here everyday of the trial? I am going to try to come to the forum at least once a day if possible. The first Judge did say she was going to allow cameras in the courtroom but since there is a new Judge I don't know if that still holds true. I hope so because I would like to follow the actual trial on line somewhere.

Have a blessed day!
out of town

Olive Branch, MS

#940 Oct 15, 2013
dose anyone know were can you follow the trial?
Caring

Albany, GA

#941 Oct 15, 2013
out of town wrote:
dose anyone know were can you follow the trial?
I don't think they will be showing the trial on line anywhere.

But this news station is keeping up with it and has a reporter inside the courtroom.

I read today that most all of the victims died where they were sleeping. Only the 15 year old had defensive wounds (broken hand).

"In his opening statement Assistant District Attorney John B. Johnson said that the person Heinze identified as a cousin, Michael Toler, 19, had been most savagely beaten and there was blood all over his bed and the room.

When asked what he had done after walking through the mobile home, Heinze said he had gone outside “smoked a marijuana cigarette,’’ and then asked a neighbor to call 911, Stalvey testified.

Also in his opening statement, Johnson referred to the 911 call and something Heinze said to a neighbor.

Before police arrived, Heinze said his family had been beaten to death and that statement showed he knew how everyone had died, Johnson said.

The first police on the scene thought the victims had been shot, Johnson said. Stalvey testified his first impression was that everyone had been shot.

Heinze told officers he checked the victims for life by placing his fingers on their wrists, Johnson said.

“One of the things we’re going to see is there was an awful lot of blood in this house,’’ Johnson said.

In spite of that, Heinze had no blood on his hands, Johnson said.

He also told police that he had walked throughout the house, but the blood of only two victims, that of his father and West, was on the sandals Heinze wore, Johnson said.

Also, police found Michelle Toler’s cell phone in the car Heinze was driving: It had the blood of West who was beaten to death in the same room as Michelle, Johnson said."

Johnson asserted that only one victim, Michelle Toler ,who had a broken hand, had defended themselves. Johnson said that Russell Toler Jr., had also been stabbed several times after he died of a brutal beating.

Read more at Jacksonville.com : http://jacksonville.com/news/georgia/2013-10-...
nellie

Saint Augustine, FL

#942 Oct 16, 2013
All I know is, this is a horrific murder of 8 people..all family members...they must have been asleep when this happened..The person that did this sure has intense anger problems......The devil was on the loose on that night...I hope justice will be served in this case....
Caring

Albany, GA

#943 Oct 16, 2013
Nellie, the devil sure was down in Georgia the night these people were murdered.

I am more convinced that ever before that GHjr did all of these murders right by himself. Imo, there will be no forensic evidence entered from either side showing someone else was involved.

The positioning of the bodies when found will be KEY in this case, imo.

It is obvious to me most all of them died where they lay sleeping, whether in a bed in a bedroom or on a pallet on the floor, they were very unaware of their impending doom to each and every one of them.

The only one out of the nine attacked that seem to have a second to react was 15 year old Michelle Tolar. The body positions when found proves none of them knew that someone was in their home killing everyone in sight.:(

The only one that may have seen the face of her murderer before death was Michelle, the 15 year old daughter of Rusty Tolar.

God bless this family and may justice prevail.
Caring

Albany, GA

#944 Oct 16, 2013
out of town wrote:
dose anyone know were can you follow the trial?
You can link on this site and the reporter is reporting on it as the evidence is being entered. Just keep refreshing your screen for updates.

The evidence being entered is horrific.

http://jacksonville.com/news/georgia/2013-10-...
Caring

Albany, GA

#945 Oct 18, 2013
Is NO ONE following this case at all?

The evidence against Heinz Jr. is overwhelming and horrific.
Caring

Albany, GA

#946 Oct 18, 2013
This part is going to be his waterloo:

Asked when he put on black gym shorts, Heinze said, "I had them on all the time under what I had on.''
Police have testified that, beneath a pair of khaki shorts, Heinze had on black and gray reversible gym shorts and that blood spatters were visible on the lighter gray side of the shorts. A DNA analyst testified the blood was that of some of the victims.
**********
When he took them off he had the darker side showing but when they reversed them there was blood of the victims found on them. Victims he said he never touched.

Imo, the reason he did not pay West for the drugs the last time was because West was dead along with the rest he had murdered.

The jury is seeing the exact location where the bloody palm print was found belonging to Guy Heinz Jr along with the blood of one of the victims that was already long dead when LE arrived at the scene. This means to make a bloody palm print the blood of the victim had to be wet at the time he made the imprint. Not only was this is hot as hell August but they had no air conditioner either. But they did have large box fans in the window which would dry the deceased victims' blood even faster.

IIRC, the state wanted to introduce drawings the younger children had made and had put up on the refrigerator that had blood on them. If so it means the blood was going up that high as he attacked in order to land on the drawings. Then he may have leaned against the refrig for support and that is where the bloody palm print comes from.

And the blood found on his clothing was 'BLOOD SPATTER" and not transference blood meaning the blood was being flung at a high velocity at the time when it landed on his clothing and shoes. That can only mean he was the one striking these poor people over and over again making the blood spatter backwards onto him.
Caring

Albany, GA

#947 Oct 20, 2013
Ga. trial flashes back to 1887 mass slaying of 9

----------

There are eerie parallels between the murders that Guy Heinze Jr. is currently on trial for in Georgia and a notorious 126-year-old murder case in the same state.

The medical examiner said he knew of two crimes. One was the infamous case of Richard Speck, who stabbed and strangled eight student nurses after holding them captive for hours at a Chicago townhouse in July 1966. The second was a lesser-known case from middle Georgia: the 19th century ax murders attributed to Thomas G. Woolfolk.

Woolfolk was the 27-year-old son of a businessman and landowner. He lived with his father, stepmother and several half-siblings in Bibb County at a rural farmhouse outside Macon. On the morning of Aug. 6, 1887, Woolfolk came running to neighbors for help. He said an attacker had broken into the house in the middle of the night and killed the rest of his family. Woolfolk said he escaped by jumping from a window.

Nine people in all were found dead, each of them killed with an ax. The victims were Woolfolk's father and stepmother, Richard and Mattie Woolfolk, as well as their six children, ages 20, 17, 10, 7, 5 and 18 months. Also killed was the 84-year-old aunt of Woolfolk's stepmother.

Investigators discovered specks of blood on Woolfolk's ears and a bloody handprint on his leg. His blood-stained clothes were found at the bottom of a well.

http://news.msn.com/crime-justice/ga-trial-fl...
Ssilocal

Savannah, GA

#948 Oct 20, 2013
I have just been catching up on this case & wanted some opinions out there if this would be relevant to the case. I never mentioned it to le before but now that I see the motive may have been arguing with his dad & drugs...here it is. Guy rented an apartment from me on st. Simons beginning march 2009 with another male. By the end of may 2009 they were over a month behind so filed eviction. We had the sheriff meet us at the property to regain legal possession around mid June 2009. That would make him having to move back in the crowded mobile home about 8 weeks prior to the killings. If he was evicted & had to go back would this cause friction that would build up to this? I even saw testimony from the tape where he told le he had moved out for several months but then moved back in. Well that was the reason...I evicted him!
Caring

Albany, GA

#949 Oct 20, 2013
Ssilocal wrote:
I have just been catching up on this case & wanted some opinions out there if this would be relevant to the case. I never mentioned it to le before but now that I see the motive may have been arguing with his dad & drugs...here it is. Guy rented an apartment from me on st. Simons beginning march 2009 with another male. By the end of may 2009 they were over a month behind so filed eviction. We had the sheriff meet us at the property to regain legal possession around mid June 2009. That would make him having to move back in the crowded mobile home about 8 weeks prior to the killings. If he was evicted & had to go back would this cause friction that would build up to this? I even saw testimony from the tape where he told le he had moved out for several months but then moved back in. Well that was the reason...I evicted him!
Interesting and thanks for sharing.

I don't really think this was the trigger though. Were you aware of his crack habit when he rented from you?

I really think this was fueled by wanting it all. He wanted Michael's drugs, he wanted all the money the victims had, and he wanted to drive Rusty Jr's vehicle to the crack party. He wouldn't be able to do any of those things if they were alive. No one was allowed to drive Rusty Jr's vehicle but Rusty Jr.

Once he had murdered the first one he knew he had to murder them all.
Who knows

Pembroke, GA

#950 Oct 20, 2013
Caring this question is for you since you say he wanted all the money the victims had? How many of the victims were employed?
ssilocal

Savannah, GA

#951 Oct 20, 2013
I wasn't aware of it at the time but the time we got possession back from the condo I knew it was a party pad. it was completely destroyed. carpets ruined, walls destroyed. they left furniture and trash everywhere there were even maggots from all the trash and filth left in the condo.
it was so disgusting!
Out of State Reader

O Fallon, MO

#952 Oct 20, 2013
Caring just wanted to update you been very sick with Flu... just catching up will read and start posting one day this week. Don't think I forgot about everyone....

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